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Offlinebeam
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Registered: 05/25/03
Posts: 153
Last seen: 20 years, 1 month
difference b/w P Cyanescens and P Subaeruginosa?
    #1580566 - 05/27/03 02:08 AM (21 years, 2 months ago)

I had a look at this web page

with pics of the cyansnens and some look exactly like what i thought were P.Subs, i have quite a few with wavy caps.

Just a few questions

Do they grow in melbourne?

is there noticable difference? and would these two species grow together/near each other?

sorry but i cant provide a spore print. no scanner or didgital camera.

thanks for all your help

ps, i had about 5 2-3 cm ones last friday and got pretty damn fucked with p subs and someone who doesn't trip much would this be right?


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Offlineganesh
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Re: difference b/w P Cyanescens and P Subaeruginosa? [Re: beam]
    #1580704 - 05/27/03 04:07 AM (21 years, 2 months ago)


I am pretty sure that subs are a relative of p. cyanescens - i haven't seen any reports of p. cyans in australia at all - all the melbourne/southern nsw/SA varieties are all subaeruginosa and its variants. It's true they are very similar - I think bluemeanie explained it a bit better in one the subaeruginosa threads only a few days ago...

But yes - they are quite similar mushrooms and both species are very potent - see the thread on subaeruginosa - for someone who doesnt trip often that does sound about right...

cheers,

ganesh.

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Offlinebeam
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Re: difference b/w P Cyanescens and P Subaeruginosa? [Re: ganesh]
    #1580744 - 05/27/03 04:49 AM (21 years, 2 months ago)

Thanks ganesh

i couldn't find it but i didn't look overly hard, i'll look againj

anyways if you break the stem when picking, instead of pulling the whole thing out do they regrow faster?

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Offlineganesh
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Re: difference b/w P Cyanescens and P Subaeruginosa? [Re: beam]
    #1580748 - 05/27/03 04:52 AM (21 years, 2 months ago)

Yup. Make sure you don't rip them out as that will wreck everything underground and they may not grow for a while. I usually either use scissors or pinch them off just above the surface.

Edited by ganesh (05/27/03 04:59 AM)

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Offlinebeam
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Re: difference b/w P Cyanescens and P Subaeruginosa? [Re: ganesh]
    #1580753 - 05/27/03 04:57 AM (21 years, 2 months ago)

Quote from blue meanie in a P Cyanescens in New Nealand thread.
Quote:

The identification of Ps.Cyanescens in Australia and New Zealand is a common mistake. The inrolled cap margins during development, the substrate and the microscopic characteristics of many of the Psilocybes found in Australia and New Zealand that resemble Cyanescens actaully match Ps.Subaeruginosa.
Buchanan believes that Ps.Subaeruginosa is actually an adapted regional version of Ps.Cyanescens, and certainly Subaeruginosa and allies are part of the Cyanescens family which explains the similarities




pretty interesting, the spot where i am pickeng them from has some old rotted wavy capps about 10 of them about 8-12 cm's across the head, they were some big mofo's, just wich i got to them earlier.

Also do you know how long p. Subs take to grow from when picked and also the life cycle in days.

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Offlineganesh
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Re: difference b/w P Cyanescens and P Subaeruginosa? [Re: beam]
    #1580754 - 05/27/03 04:58 AM (21 years, 2 months ago)


Not too sure beam - it varies i guess depending on the conditions - I usually check my patches once a week - and that seems like plenty of time.

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Offlinebeam
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Re: difference b/w P Cyanescens and P Subaeruginosa? [Re: ganesh]
    #1580757 - 05/27/03 05:01 AM (21 years, 2 months ago)

Yeah i could record if i could be bothered as i can check easly everyday.

and by plenty of time do you mean theres new ones?

-thanks

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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Re: difference b/w P Cyanescens and P Subaeruginosa? [Re: beam]
    #1580805 - 05/27/03 06:14 AM (21 years, 2 months ago)

I have photos of several different species of psilocybian mushrooms with wavy caps including P. cubensis. That is one of the characteristics of P. cyanescens. P. maire is also similar, as is P. suuaeruginosa and other similar Psilocybes.

mj ANd even A pictuee of P. caerulescens grown in vitro.


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Offlineganesh
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Re: difference b/w P Cyanescens and P Subaeruginosa? [Re: mjshroomer]
    #1584014 - 05/28/03 02:55 AM (21 years, 2 months ago)


hey mj where do cyanescens grow around the world?

and beam - I usually find a few new ones have grown each week - its best to go regularly and after a while you will just develop a feel for it - each patch is different - I never reallly worked it out until i started going a bit regularly.

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Offlinebeam
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Re: difference b/w P Cyanescens and P Subaeruginosa? [Re: ganesh]
    #1584056 - 05/28/03 03:21 AM (21 years, 2 months ago)

as i said before i can check everyday quite easly, and with no effort involved.

The little ones that i left to grow on monday are now (wednesday) good to pick to i will get them pretty soon.

also i heard the smaller ones are more potent is this true?
and if i get a few of them mush them into the ground at certain spots, they should grow right?

Would anyone know how long they take to fruit? i think the word is

--Thanks

ps. there should be a subaeruginosa faq section on sticky or something as i have seen quite a few posts lately and also over the years, it would save people time from posting all these questions like me :smile:

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InvisibleZen Peddler
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Re: difference b/w P Cyanescens and P Subaeruginosa? [Re: beam]
    #1584105 - 05/28/03 03:57 AM (21 years, 2 months ago)

Ps.Cyanescens grows in Europe (without Pluerocystidia) and in the US (with pluerocystidia). The differences between ps.Cyanescens and Ps.Subaeruginosa in its wavy form are really microscopic, the inrolled margin and the chosen substrate.
Experiments with Ps.Cyanescens from Europe and US demonstrated that it refuses to fruit of native Australian woods, which suggests that Subaeruginosa is in the process of delineating away from cyanescens (or already has i should say)


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InvisibleZen Peddler
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Re: difference b/w P Cyanescens and P Subaeruginosa? [Re: Zen Peddler]
    #1584106 - 05/28/03 03:59 AM (21 years, 2 months ago)

Depending on the moisture content in the substrate - two days to ten from primordia


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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Re: difference b/w P Cyanescens and P Subaeruginosa? [Re: beam]
    #1584307 - 05/28/03 07:57 AM (21 years, 2 months ago)

P. cyanescens grow s in Russia, China, Baltic countries, Europe (Including most of Scotland and England and the Pacific Northwwest United States, and in parts of Northern ALgeria and possibly Moroco and in in Northern Climates. In the USA from Noth of San Francisco to British Colombia but not west of the Cascades.

It is a cold weather species.

mj

Edited by mjshroomer (05/28/03 08:00 AM)

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Offlinefatasaurus
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Re: difference b/w P Cyanescens and P Subaeruginosa? [Re: mjshroomer]
    #1584350 - 05/28/03 08:45 AM (21 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:


the spot where i am pickeng them from has some old rotted wavy capps about 10 of them about 8-12 cm's across the head, they were some big mofo's, just wich i got to them earlier.




8-12 cm...those are huge  :shocked: .....

Quote:


Also do you know how long p. Subs take to grow from when picked and also the life cycle in days.




As you noticed, if I leave some small mushies at my patch, and the conditions are good, they are pick able in just over 24 hours. Again, if conditions are good, when we leave no mushies at the patch the patch needs about 3-4 days to re grow enough to worth a harvest..........but as ganesh said "after a while you will just develop a feel for it - each patch is different - I never reallly worked it out until i started going a bit regularly."


--------------------
"You can't make the scene, if you don't have the green"

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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Re: difference b/w P Cyanescens and P Subaeruginosa? [Re: fatasaurus]
    #1584387 - 05/28/03 09:01 AM (21 years, 1 month ago)

In Seattle one has to pick allthe shrooms in the patches because of shroom thieves. If you leave a patch for several days to grow to full sizze and then come back and whoops they are all mysteriously gone. Disappeared, etc.

I found a large crop of Morels this spring. Went hoe to get my camera and came back an hour later and they were all gone.

Hm. ERven caught friends picking my patches out a few times int he last few years. People I took picking, gave them a few patches and told them the other ones were my privated patches and then saw them intheir picking a few weeks later where they said they wouldn/t

This has happened to me every years since I firt learned how to pick them. However, as a field I do not mind people going back again and agian. But I do asked people not to invade certain areas I show them and then they are gone.

mj

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Offlinefatasaurus
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Re: difference b/w P Cyanescens and P Subaeruginosa? [Re: mjshroomer]
    #1584399 - 05/28/03 09:09 AM (21 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:


ERven caught friends picking my patches out a few times




hahahaha, funny stuff.

Me and my friends have the same problem with thieves but it ain't to bad for us because our 'patch' is actually a series of spots all in the same reserve. Every time we go we find spots fruiting in different places and different places have been picked dry =(.

mj, to protect 'private' patches just don't show anyone! Me and my friends have one spot we are sure no one but us know about, and the best thing about this spot if it tends to start fruiting about 2-3 weeks before the rest of Melbourne = D.


--------------------
"You can't make the scene, if you don't have the green"

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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Re: difference b/w P Cyanescens and P Subaeruginosa? [Re: fatasaurus]
    #1585013 - 05/28/03 12:43 PM (21 years, 1 month ago)

WEll a few years ago someone who knowns me followed me and found a privat home of friends of mine who allowed me to plant a patch intheir yard. Their backyard.

A person was caught by my friends atr two in the morning. He told them he learned of the spot fromt he mushroom man who told him to come at night and pick this special shroom because it only greww int he light of the moon.

He left before police arrived.
Then when I brought the subject up here at the shroomery, the fucker came and posted that it was he. I responded with my friends now have a dog because he scarred them and if he came back the dog would most likely get him. Then he responded back that he would poison and or kill the dog.

How do you stop someone like that.

He obviously saw me one day and followed me around to see where I was going. I nver found out who it was, but he raided several places where he had no business being.

mj

I do not really want to get into that situation by writing about it but it happened.
My friends had me redo their garden with no shrooms.

mj

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Offlineganesh
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Re: difference b/w P Cyanescens and P Subaeruginosa? [Re: mjshroomer]
    #1587960 - 05/29/03 04:51 AM (21 years, 1 month ago)


I think the thieves must be everywhere in Melbourne at the moment! :smile:
All my damn patches are dry and bare... and everytime i go all I find is a few ripped up Stropharia's and crap like that... dammit...
Oh well... back to the good ol Melways and days of hiking for hours to find shit-all....
What signs do you guys usually find that tells you someone else has been picking?

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Offlinebeam
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Re: difference b/w P Cyanescens and P Subaeruginosa? [Re: ganesh]
    #1588054 - 05/29/03 05:32 AM (21 years, 1 month ago)

my spot has several patches all 15 second walking distance i can probably get about 50-100 each week, the only problem is i find that something has been eating away at them, only a few luckely enough, (i have been picking these, is that alright?). The second problem is foot traffic.

Theives are everywhere, it's exactly the same with weed, if you grow it, dont trust anyone even your mates, cause they can a) tell people or b) rip it themselves.

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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Re: difference b/w P Cyanescens and P Subaeruginosa? [Re: beam]
    #1588148 - 05/29/03 07:05 AM (21 years, 1 month ago)

See I knew this was a problem with many people. But do not get me wrong. I have taken professional people and showed them giant patches of shrooms and they never came back to rip me off, yet some people i discreetly meet through friends, usually AFOAF are the ones who steal.

And as you mentioned if you grow pot or shroomms at home, then do not tell anyone because your freedonm is not worth other peoples shit.

mj
Hope you have a successful hunt inthe futyre without any thieves.

Againthe other problem is that sooner or laer the mlch runs out of nutrients and then yo have to fine new locations. So since the internet, more and more people willbe looking. And most gardens like crops always change mulch with whatever the current bark is and/or logged form and manufactured.

Sooner or later the spots will become more or become less. Especially with more people looking.
The only real constant mushrooms are the Cubensis, Copelandia and liberty caps. They will fruit every years because of the cattle. Thank god for the cow.



mj

Edited by mjshroomer (05/29/03 07:06 AM)

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InvisibleStymee
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Re: difference b/w P Cyanescens and P Subaeruginosa? [Re: mjshroomer]
    #1591300 - 05/29/03 09:45 PM (21 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:


I found a large crop of Morels this spring. Went hoe to get my camera and came back an hour later and they were all gone.






Hello MJ, I didn't think that morels grew in Seattle. I thought they all grew east of the Cascades. Here in Seattle, we don't have many pine trees which morels love. What was the habitat you found these in?

Thanks, Stymee

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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Re: difference b/w P Cyanescens and P Subaeruginosa? [Re: Stymee]
    #1592103 - 05/30/03 03:14 AM (21 years, 1 month ago)

Morels pop up in apple orchards in Watnachee and other areas. In the city they pop up in gardens in public places.

A friend of mine will soon be selling a CD-ROM of morels in Washingoton.

mj

I'll keep you posted.

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Re: difference b/w P Cyanescens and P Subaeruginosa? [Re: mjshroomer]
    #1592385 - 05/30/03 07:42 AM (21 years, 1 month ago)

Ganesh - you need better spots!!


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Offlineganesh
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Re: difference b/w P Cyanescens and P Subaeruginosa? [Re: Zen Peddler]
    #1597277 - 05/31/03 11:28 PM (21 years, 1 month ago)


i know i know i know.... I'm on a new mission this winter to find new 'secret' patches. I still have a couple that are fruiting quite regularly.. I think that there has been a huge increase in mushroom hunters and general mushroom awareness this season though - just from talking to various friends... which is good and bad.

I'm just getting so sick of constantly checking out new places and finding absolutely shit-all. At the moment I think about 1 in every 5 new places I check may have a few.
oh well - back to the drawing board!


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Invisiblegdowg
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Re: difference b/w P Cyanescens and P Subaeruginosa? [Re: ganesh]
    #4394623 - 07/12/05 12:54 AM (19 years, 16 days ago)

I'd agree ganesh, i found it very hard to find any spots with more than one or two around melbourne, and i've come across a few other fellow hunters a number of times on my missions, think between the lines, and persistance is the key.. Theres plenty out there going soggy and old as well, just gotta find them first :smile:


--------------------
From little things, big things grow.

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InvisibleDepthToTheCore
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Re: difference b/w P Cyanescens and P Subaeruginosa? [Re: gdowg]
    #4394706 - 07/12/05 01:22 AM (19 years, 16 days ago)

WHats with the 2 year old thread?  :smirk:


--------------------


"Those who dance are considered insane by those who cannot hear the music." - George Carlin

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OfflinebizzaroSquirrel
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Re: difference b/w P Cyanescens and P Subaeruginosa? [Re: DepthToTheCore]
    #4395004 - 07/12/05 04:23 AM (19 years, 16 days ago)

^^ heh, its a good thread tho...

for the people who were posting 2 years ago (or hunting 2 years ago), have you noticed any differences since 2003?  more/less patches?  more/less hunters?

damn, makes me appreciate the one patch i found a hell of a lot more  :grin:


--------------------
Hello Friends.
I am a perfectly normal human worm baby.
You have nothing, absolutely nothing to fear from me, just pay no attention to me and we will get along fine.

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OfflineCymbaline
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Re: difference b/w P Cyanescens and P Subaeruginosa? [Re: bizzaroSquirrel]
    #4395128 - 07/12/05 06:39 AM (19 years, 16 days ago)

Been hunting the same area for around 20 years. More mushies this year than in the last few. Peak times for this area in my experience would have been 10 - 13 years ago. Still plenty to go around this year though. The last couple of years have been dismal....just another thing to blame on the drought, eh?

Numbers of hunters come and go, some years a lot, others a few. This may just be a matter of timing though - who can tell how many people come and go when you are not around. There are the odd two or three I have seen nearly every year.

I must say the concept of a private patch (as mentioned earlier in this thread) is a new one to me.

The people I know, and the those I have met just the once or twice while hunting appear, much like myself, to be gathering enough for a trip that day. I have never run into anyone taking everything they can get their hands on. This, I think, is the issue, more so than people stealing from your patch. Where I hunt there is usually enough to go around.

Take it easy.

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Invisiblepsiclops
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Re: difference b/w P Cyanescens and P Subaeruginosa? [Re: Cymbaline]
    #4397762 - 07/12/05 09:34 PM (19 years, 15 days ago)

I would just keep slowly adding alder mulch or mix mulch, with no cedar. And maybe even some extra rich soil, too. That way, they will continue to fruit, annually, after the first fruit. I found one good patch, last year, in Snohomish County, and took a buddy to see it. I kinda knew he would be so stupid to fuck it all up. And he did. But it's cool, cause the greatest feeling is finding Ps. Cyan patches. So, I'll find some more this Fall. If anyone wants to go with me, you can always steal my patches, after I'm gone. I live in OLY now.

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