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OfflineSheepish
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Re: kiwi mushrooms [Re: mjshroomer]
    #1584301 - 05/28/03 07:51 AM (20 years, 9 months ago)

That's pretty shitty.

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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Registered: 07/21/99
Posts: 13,774
Loc: gone with my shrooms
Re: kiwi mushrooms [Re: Mitchnast]
    #1584303 - 05/28/03 07:52 AM (20 years, 9 months ago)

Mitchnast, the stems of P. sphinctrinus are not purple they are a reddish brown. Even in your picture they are a reddish brown.

And again this species is not a psychoactive muishroom.

And you P sphinctrinus look like they are the bell-shaped campanulatus variation of P. sphinctrinus. THis is becasue of the campanulate capo shape of the shrooms in your image.


mjshroomer

Edited by mjshroomer (05/28/03 07:55 AM)

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OfflineMitchnast
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Re: kiwi mushrooms [Re: mjshroomer]
    #1585086 - 05/28/03 01:09 PM (20 years, 9 months ago)

but the mushrooms i posted are NOT pan sphinctrinus, nor do they resemble, they are all the bluing hallucinogenic mushrooms grown on bulk substrate in my front lawn that you yourself identified as "Panaeolus microsporus" about 2 years ago. i have picked many Panaeolus sphinctrinus and the stipes (unless under strange paramaters, ie from under something) grow very straight and brittle stipes, and are much darker than these here which look much less brittle and far lighter than any pan sphinctrinus ive ever seen. therefore, the mushrooms I posted are hallucinogenic, and i see no reason to beleive his mushrooms aren't untill i see some fresh specimines showing more specific traits.
because they look to me like evry other generic panaeolus (other than subbaltaetus) ive found.

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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Re: kiwi mushrooms [Re: Mitchnast]
    #1585232 - 05/28/03 02:08 PM (20 years, 9 months ago)

MItchnast, you wrote the following in your post

Quote:

i disagree, pan sphinctrinus has a brittle, dark (often purple) stipe. also, these mushroom have different gills, id say they look more like psychoactives ive grown on my lawn




Then yuou showed the picture of this photo below witht he words under it saying like these.

Hereis your image and comment below th3e image:


Quote:

Like these




Now I looked at the image and thought I saw teeth. However Pan sphinctrinus has teeth and a reddish brown stem.

So do the shrooms in your picture.

If I before said that those particular ones were P. microsporus then that is probably what they are.

But I was only going by your comments and the image you posted whoich has no purple in it whatsoever.

If it does then you probably also need glasses.

mj

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OfflineMagmaManiac
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Re: kiwi mushrooms [Re: mjshroomer]
    #1585591 - 05/28/03 04:11 PM (20 years, 9 months ago)

isnt Panaeolus sphinctrinus nearly identical or is it (=Panaeolus papilionaceus)? according to California Fungi they are synonyms. I've found hundreds of P. papilionaceus on horse ranches and a few on cow manure here in central florida. for me, this is a beatiful picture of Pan. pap/shpinct

http://www.323800.com/mushroom/caf/species/Panaeolus_papilionaceus.html

the mushrooms in the first post dont match any of the descripitions/pictures or any of my personal experience with P. pap. i disagree that they are Panaeolus sphinctrinus if that is a synonym to P. pap, unless:

As said in Psil. Mushroom of the World, there has been considerable confusion between Panaeolus papilionaceus, Panaeolus sphinctrinus, Panaeolus campanulatus, and Panaeolus retirugis. It also mentions that Gernhardt noticed that P. pap often may have a cracked cap when aging. Therefore what grows down in florida may be a very close related specie.

macroscopically all or these spieces look the same, just variating in morphology because of habitat and location. However, perhaps there are microscopic characteristics that may set them apart. although in the above mentioned book, they are listed as synonomous species.

i conclude my uneducated rambling.

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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Registered: 07/21/99
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Re: kiwi mushrooms [Re: MagmaManiac]
    #1585633 - 05/28/03 04:26 PM (20 years, 9 months ago)

I have mycological journals and articles on accidental ingestions of P. papilionaceus. Most photos and sketches in these journals resemble either Copelandia cyanescens and or Panaeolus subbalteatus. Three early mycological ID's in shroom Guides from the late 1890s to 1940ws describe the shroom as becoming flat in age. Something Panaeolus subbalteatus does bit never happens in P. papillionaceus.

Only four chemists have claimed to have found psilocine/psilocybine in P. papillionaceus yet hundreds of other analysis report it as negative. That leads one to believe that many collections are misdentified.

For instance in Paul's first book, he identifies P. strictipes as like P. baeocystis. Now he finds out twenty yeasrs later that it is actually Similar to P. semilanceata and looks nothing like P. baeocystis. There are other minor errors in Pauls book in regards to certain ids of species and in id of some.

For instance my mushroom Psilocybe samuiensis on page 140 reads as :

Psilocybe samuiensis Guzman, Allen and Merlin when in fact it is:

Psilocybe samuiensis Guzman Bandala and Allen.

Also to put in many non psychoactive species as the newly renamed Stropharia's such as Cyanea, Caerulea and aeruginosa is confusing to those who collect magic shrooms. There are other non-active shrooms in his guide.

I am not knocking Paul, he is my friend but I should publlish a paper ont he P. papilionaceus confusion.

It was I who found out that Schultes original collection of the3 Mexican shrooms also contained some specimens of P. mexicana although they were originally described as Panaelous sphinctrinus, leading many field guides to list the mushroom as a sacred Mexican species and also as one having halucnogenic properties. Something it does not.

Anyway. good points.

mj

P. returgis is similar to Pn. subbalteatus. So is P. olivaceus and then P. microsporus is similar to some of the P. sphinctrinus and to the Panaeolinas in drying.

The oinly real Panaeolus which is definitely psychoactive in all collections is Pn. subbalteatus.

P. africanus is but is rare in America although Stamets claimed to have found one specimens in Elephant Dung at the Seatle zoo, although that species is a troopical species and should not be present int he PNW, and if it was would only last for one fruiting or maybe to during the summer months, but another problem there is that the elephants at the Seattle zoo are all from here for many years.

Even I have misidentified species on the internet which were usually psychoactive species.

The Subbalteatus complex is intense.

many people pick and eat Panaeolina foenisecii and clainm they blue, or they turned purple, something they do not do or I got high smoking shrooms. etc.

I have shown people pictures of deadly poisonous shrooms and they have in turn told me they ate that kind before and had a good trip. Something I know to be impossible.

Have a shroomy day,

mj

Edited by mjshroomer (05/28/03 04:32 PM)

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Offlineruskifile
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Registered: 05/11/02
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Re: kiwi mushrooms [Re: Reverend_Jim_Jones]
    #1586412 - 05/28/03 08:25 PM (20 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

That deal with the books is a real worry - a guy got done importing a book on speed synthesis, they went through his bookshelf and retroactivly banned some of the books he had owned for years including 'psilocybin mushrooms of the world' then prosecuted him for owning those aswell!
Police state alert!
Jim 




that's it....:shocked:
....I'm not complaining about Aust customs again...


I never realised you were being so persecuted over there :mad:



oh yeah those bloody red things - aurantiaca - are everywhere! 


--------------------
(zhukov in a previous life....)

2SER FM underground radio

Edited by ruskifile (05/28/03 08:26 PM)

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OfflineMitchnast
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Re: kiwi mushrooms [Re: mjshroomer]
    #1586650 - 05/28/03 09:50 PM (20 years, 9 months ago)

silly, mushrooms dont have teeth :smile:

i diddnt mean literally purple, i meant darker and cooler than just "reddish" more like mauve, like red with a purple tint.  case in point


when i said "like these" i was refering to the aformentioned mushrooms posted and how they were like the psychoactives ive found.  not using them to illustrate purple or anything like purple, actually i was tryng to show how they are anything but purple (which i now have corrected with an example of the color trend in the brittle stipes of panaeolus sphinctrinus i MEANT to describe)
see, not what id call reddish, more of a dull dark violet.
iv seen them red too, but its a dull violet red,
when i say purple. i mean purple when compaired to other pans, and certainly darker than the mushrooms in question originally posted here by the original poster

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Invisiblezee_werp
a fractalcreature
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Registered: 03/24/03
Posts: 1,026
Loc: Aotearoa
Re: kiwi mushrooms [Re: mjshroomer]
    #1588184 - 05/29/03 07:55 AM (20 years, 9 months ago)

Heh....gotta love these huge in-depth arguments :wink: I'm sure starfungi is good and confused...don't worry dude, you just keep lookin for your subaeruginosa! They're by far the easiest to find and the safest to identify too...

Oh, and MJ...
Quote:

A strictly totaletarian government5 in NZ, polus 400 or more tremors a year HUh.



lets not turn this into the 'lets diss NZ with exaggerated comments post'...I REALLY don't want to have to start listing America's imperfections...hehehehe...I don't think the shroomery server would have enough space! Nah just kidding guys...may the shrooms be with you :wink:
Oh and by the way that was pretty shit how they didnt let you in...does that mean you can't come to NZ at all anymore? Not that you'd want to, I mean with our tremors and all...

Edited by zee_werp (05/29/03 08:03 AM)

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Invisiblemjshroomer
Sage
Registered: 07/21/99
Posts: 13,774
Loc: gone with my shrooms
Re: kiwi mushrooms [Re: zee_werp]
    #1589206 - 05/29/03 03:08 PM (20 years, 9 months ago)

I like NZ when I wa there int he early 198os for ten days ro so. However, I am currenly persona non grata in NZ because I have writtena book which is lillegal in your country. Shit they woudl probably throw me in Gaol if I went there without a visa or even with one. That would be just like the fuzz. Give me a visa, let me think everything is cook and then when I land they grabn me going Hahaha!

mj

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Offlinestarfungi
daydreamer

Registered: 04/30/03
Posts: 133
Loc: south pacific
Last seen: 18 years, 30 days
Re: kiwi mushrooms [Re: zee_werp]
    #1589357 - 05/29/03 03:48 PM (20 years, 9 months ago)

heh...not too confused. It's all good! Thanks everyone!
I was so looking forward for a hunt this weekend, but I'm afraid it's all to dry... It's autumn, it should be raining, lots. It's been like 3 proper rainfalls since january from what I can recall. What's up with that?
:mad: 

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OfflineSheepish
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Re: kiwi mushrooms [Re: starfungi]
    #1590931 - 05/29/03 08:36 PM (20 years, 9 months ago)

NZ weather is pretty bizarre. Being dry shouldn't be a problem, as I've heard of people finding Subaeruginosa even though the conditions weren't very wet. It's meant to rain again this weekend though, so here's hoping.

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InvisibleZen Peddler
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Re: kiwi mushrooms [Re: Sheepish]
    #1592359 - 05/30/03 07:24 AM (20 years, 9 months ago)

Bad luck MJ - teh NZ authorities take mushrooms very seriously becuase they are so much more prevalent in terms of use over there. I spent a year over there with my ex-girlfriend when i was a wee-lad (very young) and was introduced to the wonders of Semilanceata in Nelson - if only it was so prolific in Victoria Australia...


--------------------

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Offlinestarfungi
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Re: kiwi mushrooms [Re: Zen Peddler]
    #1608415 - 06/04/03 03:26 PM (20 years, 8 months ago)

Hm, I went for a subaeruginosa hunt in town parks, looking among woodchips. I saw a lot of Stropharia Aurantiaca (the middle mushroom in my photo) but no subaeruginosa whatsoever :frown: These stropharias had a more orange cap and closely resembled the subs at a first glance, but none were bruising blue...
I have looked quite a lot by now, and one day i *will* find them... but right now I'm friggin frustrated!!!   

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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Registered: 07/21/99
Posts: 13,774
Loc: gone with my shrooms
Re: kiwi mushrooms [Re: starfungi]
    #1609149 - 06/04/03 07:44 PM (20 years, 8 months ago)

IF one learns to recognize the particular wood chips and bark mulch where their many Patches are then one wshould be able to find them anywherew by loking at the wood chips and/or muclch in any given location. Some llandscapers supply whole areas and even many homes witht he same products. LEarn the substrates of thehabitats and then you learn the secrets of where the shrooms are.

mj

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Offlinestarfungi
daydreamer

Registered: 04/30/03
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Loc: south pacific
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Re: kiwi mushrooms [Re: mjshroomer]
    #1609728 - 06/04/03 11:09 PM (20 years, 8 months ago)

Maybe one could even get those very same wood chips and grow the subs in the back yard!!!  :laugh: Wouldn't even look suspicious!

 

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Invisiblemjshroomer
Sage
Registered: 07/21/99
Posts: 13,774
Loc: gone with my shrooms
Re: kiwi mushrooms [Re: starfungi]
    #1609753 - 06/04/03 11:17 PM (20 years, 8 months ago)

You could get the chips but that does not mean the shrooms will appear in your batch of chips.

A lot of times the spores are int he stacks of chips at a logging mill and they pile the chips. later a landscapper comes and buys many tons of these chips. While the chips are at the logging mill the spores inthe woodchips end up producing mycelium which spreads throughout the pile and then the landscapper takles the chips and mulches homes or gardens or park and ride areas or new condos or office buildings and such and the shrooms grow froa few years and then disappear if the chips are not renewed or if they stop using the liquid fertilizers.

.

mj

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Offlinestarfungi
daydreamer

Registered: 04/30/03
Posts: 133
Loc: south pacific
Last seen: 18 years, 30 days
Re: kiwi mushrooms [Re: mjshroomer]
    #1612548 - 06/05/03 06:21 PM (20 years, 8 months ago)

no, ofcourse. but if you find some subs you could let them spore in the chips?

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Invisiblezee_werp
a fractalcreature
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Registered: 03/24/03
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Re: kiwi mushrooms [Re: starfungi]
    #1614198 - 06/06/03 08:16 AM (20 years, 8 months ago)

Yeah,
Or you could take a handful of colonised woodchips from the patch where you pick them, that would have a lot better chance at colonising your own woodchips than spores. But remember only take a little bit of mycelium so that you don't kill the entire patch.
A good thing to do is to take maybe a handfull of colonised chips, and add them to about a bucket of uncolonised woodchips. Then, when that bucket is colonised, you can use that to spawn more buckets or to spawn a big pile of woodchips.
Subaeruginosa likes pine, eucalyptus and I think most other 'blonde' wood chips too.

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Offlinestarfungi
daydreamer

Registered: 04/30/03
Posts: 133
Loc: south pacific
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Re: kiwi mushrooms [Re: zee_werp]
    #1619164 - 06/08/03 08:11 PM (20 years, 8 months ago)

Ok, just an update of the wellington subareuginosa deal...
I went for a 7 hour hike in town this weekend. Turning upside down and inside out on every woodchip in town. Walking though parks and through the bush, up and down countless hills. And mostly what I found was the red Stropharias, thousands of them! They are bleedin' everywhere! But not a single sub to be seen.
Someone wrote here that subs have been spotted in wellington, but I believe that they have been mistaken for the red stropharias, since some of them are rather orange and can easily be taken for subs at a quick glance.

So, unless someone proves me wrong (please do!), for the record - There are NO Ps. Subareuginosa in Wellington.

:frown:
 

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