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OfflineRonoS
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Re: 9/11: The Smoking Gun? [Re: Madtowntripper]
    #1585652 - 05/28/03 06:31 PM (17 years, 2 months ago)

***sigh*** yeah...anyone that questions the blatant corruption of the U.S. government MUST be an America hater...

What part doesn't make sense to you?...Maybe I can clarify it for your blinded eyes...


--------------------
"Life has never been weird enough for my liking"


Edited by Rono (05/28/03 06:32 PM)


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OfflineRonoS
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Re: 9/11: The Smoking Gun? [Re: Madtowntripper]
    #1585676 - 05/28/03 06:39 PM (17 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Roosevelt knew about Pearl Harbor? Thats a new one by me...How do you figure? I've heard the whole "America MADE Japan Attack" arguement. And there's evidence that the Navy in Pearl Harbor had some advance warning, (A few hours) of the attack. But I've never heard that Roosevelt knew. Prove it?




You got it... http://www.globalresearch.ca/articles/WOO203A.html


--------------------
"Life has never been weird enough for my liking"


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OfflineAzmodeus
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Re: 9/11: The Smoking Gun? [Re: Madtowntripper]
    #1585719 - 05/28/03 06:55 PM (17 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Figures....Right. But really, run it by me again. What's Bush's justification for 9/11?
His popularity? Hmph...Its almost down to pre-9/11.

Oh, he wanted a pretext to invade Iraq for oil money? Oh...wait...The Economy has lost more in the last 2 years than we'll possibly recoup in Iraq.

What are the others....

Oh! Right! ISRAEL did it! So we would crack down on the Palesin...Oh...Wait...The new peace plan favors Palestine? Drat...Another argument down the tubes...






Sit back relax and read all you can about it. Why do you feel you need to be decided on the issue?! Theres not enough facts either way. When it first happened and even a year later i wouldn't have thought bush knew, but alot of what i read poses questions that can't be answered. It makes me wonder....but who can say?


--------------------
"Know your Body - Know your Mind - Know your Substance - Know your Source.

Lest we forget. "


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InvisibleEdame
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Re: 9/11: The Smoking Gun? [Re: Madtowntripper]
    #1586199 - 05/28/03 09:10 PM (17 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:


Oh, he wanted a pretext to invade Iraq for oil money? Oh...wait...The Economy has lost more in the last 2 years than we'll possibly recoup in Iraq.





Who do you mean by 'we'? The only people seeing that money (not that the US/UK has a right to it anyway) will be Bush and Blair's 'friends' in the oil industry as it goes through their companies and into their bank accounts. Why would they care about the (US) economy when their pockets are getting filled elsewhere?

The war cost billions, where does that money come from? Taxpayers (eventually). Who does it go to? Bush's 'defence contractor' friends. Iraq gets demolished, it's going to cost more to re-build it. Who's going to get paid to re-build it? More of Bush's friends. Where will the money come from to pay for construction? Iraq's oil (pumped and processed by Bush's friends). It's like a gigantic money funnel, all going straight to those in power.

What's Bush's motivation? Same as all of the despots and tyrants throughout history, more power, and more money.


--------------------
The above is an extract from my fictional novel, "The random postings of Edame".
:tongue:

In the beginning was the word. And man could not handle the word, and the hearing of the word, and he asked God to take away his ears so that he might live in peace without having to hear words which might upset his equinamity or corrupt the unblemished purity of his conscience.

And God, hearing this desperate plea from His creation, wrinkled His mighty brow for a moment and then leaned down toward man, beckoning that he should come close so as to hear all that was about to be revealed to him.

"Fuck you," He whispered, and frowned upon the pathetic supplicant before retreating to His heavens.


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OfflineMadtowntripper
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Re: 9/11: The Smoking Gun? [Re: Rono]
    #1586708 - 05/29/03 12:02 AM (17 years, 2 months ago)

Good Read...Actually...Rono constantly suprises me by being one of the few people who make outlandish claims...And then back it up. I'll hafta look over this and see if it makes any sense at all, like it appears to...

And Azomdeus..Its not like I'm a big fan of Bush, ya know? I mean, I'd like to see a commision to investigate 9/11, not because I think he did it, but because I think nobody is really clear on what happened that day. But SOMEONE needs to be the voice of disension, because unlike me and, I dont know, maybe you, 95% of the people posting here are 100% SURE that Bush KNEW! You hear them yelling it ALL the time.

And yeah, I dont think he did, so granted, I'm going to say that just as loud as the rest of you are saying he DID. But I'll agree with you...Who REALLY knows? Nobody, well, outside of Bush.

And on a side note...Say there was a Commission, a Congressional one or Supreme Court one, or whatever...And they studied the shit, and wrote a big long paper that said "President Bush had no fore-knowledge of the 9/11 attacks." Period. End of Story. Would you believe him? Of COURSE not. So why are you all calling for one? Not that I'm opposed to it, again. But why would you want one, if you only want them to tell you what you want to hear?


--------------------
After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action.  If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it.  - Ernest Hemingway

If it is life that you feel you are missing I can tell you where to find it.  In the law courts, in business, in government.  There is nothing occurring in the streets. Nothing but a dumbshow composed of the helpless and the impotent.    -Cormac MacCarthy

He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God.  - Aeschylus


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Anonymous

Re: 9/11: The Smoking Gun? [Re: Edame]
    #1586761 - 05/29/03 12:16 AM (17 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Quote:


Oh, he wanted a pretext to invade Iraq for oil money? Oh...wait...The Economy has lost more in the last 2 years than we'll possibly recoup in Iraq.





Who do you mean by 'we'? The only people seeing that money (not that the US/UK has a right to it anyway) will be Bush and Blair's 'friends' in the oil industry as it goes through their companies and into their bank accounts. Why would they care about the (US) economy when their pockets are getting filled elsewhere?

The war cost billions, where does that money come from? Taxpayers (eventually). Who does it go to? Bush's 'defence contractor' friends. Iraq gets demolished, it's going to cost more to re-build it. Who's going to get paid to re-build it? More of Bush's friends. Where will the money come from to pay for construction? Iraq's oil (pumped and processed by Bush's friends). It's like a gigantic money funnel, all going straight to those in power.

What's Bush's motivation? Same as all of the despots and tyrants throughout history, more power, and more money.




You liberals are so stupid. Bush is an honest, hardworking man. He represents America's good intentions like homemade apple pie. He did this whole war to free the good people of Iraq. Didn't you watch fox news? They showed them take down the statue. This is a victory for everyone who wants freedom and liberty to all. God bless George W. Bush. The man is a true modern day American hero. I want everyone out there to spend the next minute praying for George W. Bush.


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OfflinePhred
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Re: 9/11: The Smoking Gun? [Re: Rono]
    #1586893 - 05/29/03 12:53 AM (17 years, 2 months ago)

There are links purporting to "prove" Roosevelt's prior knowledge; there are also links disproving it. I came across a good one a few months ago, but regrettably failed to bookmark it. I should have known better, since it is a topic that pops up here regularly. Too tired to search for it again tonight. Some other time.

The thing is, if one's natural inclination is to believe the worst of the US, one will post links such as the above. If the reverse is true, one will post links such as the one I read. Which version is the truth?

pinky


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OfflinePhred
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Re: 9/11: The Smoking Gun? [Re: Rono]
    #1586900 - 05/29/03 12:57 AM (17 years, 2 months ago)

Rono writes:

It's not like there isn't precedent for this kind of behaviour from a world leader....Churchill knew about the London bombing before it came...

What is your point? That Churchill somehow engineered the bombing? That Churchill could have prevented the bombing?

pinky


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OfflineJohnnyRespect
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Re: 9/11: The Smoking Gun? [Re: Madtowntripper]
    #1586903 - 05/29/03 12:57 AM (17 years, 2 months ago)

Another point - What would be Gee Dubs motive? Even if you belive that he is making America into a "police state" via reduction in personal freedoms, you'd have to concede that, even with a reelection, he'll be gone in 6 years. thats unchangable. That was part of the reason we have term limits, no dictator can take place for just 4 years.


--------------------
As I felt the soft cool mud squish between my toes, I thought, Man, these are not very good shoes!


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InvisibleEdame
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Re: 9/11: The Smoking Gun? [Re: JohnnyRespect]
    #1587318 - 05/29/03 03:40 AM (17 years, 2 months ago)

6 years is a long time, a lot can happen. Just look at how much the world has changed since 9/11/01. Considering the farce of the 2000 elections, can you really be so sure that the next guy is going to be any better (or that he's even going to be the one with the most votes)?


--------------------
The above is an extract from my fictional novel, "The random postings of Edame".
:tongue:

In the beginning was the word. And man could not handle the word, and the hearing of the word, and he asked God to take away his ears so that he might live in peace without having to hear words which might upset his equinamity or corrupt the unblemished purity of his conscience.

And God, hearing this desperate plea from His creation, wrinkled His mighty brow for a moment and then leaned down toward man, beckoning that he should come close so as to hear all that was about to be revealed to him.

"Fuck you," He whispered, and frowned upon the pathetic supplicant before retreating to His heavens.


Edited by Edame (05/29/03 03:53 AM)


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OfflineStrumpling
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Re: 9/11: The Smoking Gun? [Re: Edame]
    #1587343 - 05/29/03 03:47 AM (17 years, 2 months ago)

"The war cost billions, where does that money come from? Taxpayers (eventually). Who does it go to? Bush's 'defence contractor' friends."

Yeah this is what really pisses me off man! We're supposed to be in charge of the government..... I just don't see that as a reality


--------------------
Insert an "I think" mentally in front of eveything I say that seems sketchy, because I certainly don't KNOW much. Also; feel free to yell at me.
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InvisibleAnnapurna1
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Re: 9/11: The Smoking Gun? [Re: JohnnyRespect]
    #1588876 - 05/29/03 03:26 PM (17 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Another point - What would be Gee Dubs motive? Even if you belive that he is making America into a "police state" via reduction in personal freedoms, you'd have to concede that, even with a reelection, he'll be gone in 6 years. thats unchangable. That was part of the reason we have term limits, no dictator can take place for just 4 years.




All that means is that Dick Cheney or someone just as demented and evil (from whatever party) will take the oath of office in 2009.


--------------------


"anchor blocks counteract the process of pontiprobation..while omalean globes regulize the pressure"...


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OfflineRonoS
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Re: 9/11: The Smoking Gun? [Re: Phred]
    #1588959 - 05/29/03 03:50 PM (17 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

There are links purporting to "prove" Roosevelt's prior knowledge; there are also links disproving it. I came across a good one a few months ago, but regrettably failed to bookmark it. I should have known better, since it is a topic that pops up here regularly. Too tired to search for it again tonight. Some other time.

The thing is, if one's natural inclination is to believe the worst of the US, one will post links such as the above. If the reverse is true, one will post links such as the one I read. Which version is the truth?

pinky




Valid point...but if all I have seen is the corruption, lies and secrecy of the U.S. government then what other standard do I have to judge them? Frankly I'm truly amazed that the general populace is so apathetic and blind to it all...


--------------------
"Life has never been weird enough for my liking"


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OfflineRonoS
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Re: 9/11: The Smoking Gun? [Re: Phred]
    #1588994 - 05/29/03 04:00 PM (17 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Rono writes:

It's not like there isn't precedent for this kind of behaviour from a world leader....Churchill knew about the London bombing before it came...

What is your point? That Churchill somehow engineered the bombing? That Churchill could have prevented the bombing?

pinky




My point was that there is precedent for a world leader allowing attacks to happen. I never even came close to claiming that Churchill engineered the bombing, nor did I ever say that Bush engineered 9/11...I am saying that they allowed them to happen...for very different reasons. The point is that governments are not above allowing their own civilians to die to further an agenda...history has shown us this, yet people still refuse to believe that their government would let that happen.


--------------------
"Life has never been weird enough for my liking"


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OfflineAzmodeus
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Re: 9/11: The Smoking Gun? [Re: Rono]
    #1589226 - 05/29/03 05:14 PM (17 years, 2 months ago)

The point is that governments are not above allowing their own civilians to die to further an agenda...history has shown us this, yet people still refuse to believe that their government would let that happen.

Is there anything they wouldn't do to further thier own interests?  History shows alot worse than "allowing its citizens to die". :tongue:


--------------------
"Know your Body - Know your Mind - Know your Substance - Know your Source.

Lest we forget. "


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OfflinePhred
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Re: 9/11: The Smoking Gun? [Re: Rono]
    #1589446 - 05/29/03 06:06 PM (17 years, 2 months ago)

Rono writes:

My point was that there is precedent for a world leader allowing attacks to happen. I never even came close to claiming that Churchill engineered the bombing, nor did I ever say that Bush engineered 9/11...I am saying that they allowed them to happen...for very different reasons.

Rono, Rono, Rono.... *shakes head wearily*

Do us a favor and re-read what you wrote there. Does it not strike you as just a tad naive?

Your claim is that Churchill allowed the Blitz to take place? Have you ever bothered to read any of the history of World War II? Does the phrase "Battle of Britain" mean anything to you? What was Churchill supposed to do? Send a telegram to Adolf reading "Look here, old chap. I know we are at war and all that, but it would be ever so much nicer if you were to refrain from bombing London. Thank you for your co-operation"?

We all await with bated breath your explanation of precisely how Churchill could have prevented the Luftwaffe (in September of 1940, remember) from bombing pretty much wherever the fuck they felt like bombing.

pinky


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OfflineAzmodeus
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Re: 9/11: The Smoking Gun? [Re: Phred]
    #1589456 - 05/29/03 06:08 PM (17 years, 2 months ago)

Well we do know jets should have been scrambled and that bush shoud have done more than he did. :smirk:


--------------------
"Know your Body - Know your Mind - Know your Substance - Know your Source.

Lest we forget. "


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OfflineRonoS
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Re: 9/11: The Smoking Gun? [Re: Phred]
    #1589458 - 05/29/03 06:09 PM (17 years, 2 months ago)

Good lord pinky...quit trying to read so much into it. My point was simply that he allowed it to happen...would you agree with that point? Yes or No? There was no other point trying to be made.

The Brits had broken the Nazi code and were well aware of the forthcoming attack on London. But Churchill decided not to warn the public otherwise the Nazi's would have known that their code HAD been broken. I'm not judging his actions...simply stating that there is precedent.


--------------------
"Life has never been weird enough for my liking"


Edited by Rono (05/29/03 06:15 PM)


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OfflinePhred
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Re: 9/11: The Smoking Gun? [Re: Azmodeus]
    #1589486 - 05/29/03 06:15 PM (17 years, 2 months ago)

Azmodeus writes:

Well we do know jets should have been scrambled....

We do, do we?

Please provide us a single instance (any one will do) where the US has ever shot down a hijacked commercial airliner over US soil. Or anywhere, for that matter. Or even where any nation has ever shot down a hijacked commercial airliner. Or even a single instance where any hijacked commercial airliner has ever failed to land safely at an airport somewhere.

Face facts, dude -- if US warplanes had shot down those four airliners before they hit their intended targets, the howls of outrage would be far louder than the ones we are still hearing today over the failure of the US government to shoot them down. You can bet on it.

pinky


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OfflineRonoS
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Re: 9/11: The Smoking Gun? [Re: Phred]
    #1589500 - 05/29/03 06:17 PM (17 years, 2 months ago)

Yes...it is required that fighter jets be scrambled in EVERY highjacking...it is standard procedure...where were they in this instance? When golfer Payne Stewart flew into restricted airspace a little while ago his plane was intercepted within minutes...


--------------------
"Life has never been weird enough for my liking"


Edited by Rono (05/29/03 06:18 PM)


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