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Anonymous

Re: Study: Meditation produces brain changes [Re: MountainMist]
    #1569416 - 05/22/03 03:46 PM (17 years, 4 months ago)

Can I call you Swami too?


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InvisibleMountainMist
Stranger

Registered: 01/01/03
Posts: 53
Loc: Seattle, Washington
Re: Study: Meditation produces brain changes [Re: ]
    #1569435 - 05/22/03 03:50 PM (17 years, 4 months ago)

Thank you for your kind words.


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OfflineMurex
Reality Hacker

Registered: 07/28/02
Posts: 3,599
Loc: Traped in a shell.
Last seen: 13 years, 20 days
Re: Study: Meditation produces brain changes [Re: MountainMist]
    #1569508 - 05/22/03 04:10 PM (17 years, 4 months ago)


You kick ass MountainMist! :laugh:


--------------------
What if everything around you
Isn't quite as it seems?
What if all the world you think you know,
Is an elaborate dream?
And if you look at your reflection,
Is it all you want it to be?



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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Study: Meditation produces brain changes [Re: MountainMist]
    #1569542 - 05/22/03 04:20 PM (17 years, 4 months ago)

Since you enjoy using your own experiences as proof for your arguments, may I indulge in a little amateur analysis of you?
This type or personalization is strictly verboten by the high-command. But - OK.

At some point in your life you were taken in by a charlatan and this soured you on meditation, yoga, Buddhism, whatever for ever after.
Wrong. My lack of spiritual insight following said techniques with diligence turned me from them. Not with bitterness, but more of a "Hey, that was a waste of time meditating that I could have better spent making money and chasing skirts."

You have the crusading mentality of a former cultee who has sworn never to let it happen again, and who wants to help others avoid the same fate.
Was never a cultee. Never gave away my life savings, wore funny clothes, chanted at the airport or adopted a Sanskrit name. I knew of a cultee who tooks his life in the Heaven's Gate cult. (Note to moderator: Can I start a Swami's life story F.A.Q. so I don't have to endlessly repeat my autobiography to every new poster?)

Hey, I'm fine with that. I believe your motives are noble.
Not just my motives. Everything about me is noble. *Raises head proudly*.

But you have yet to produce a convincing argument that meditation is a not good thing for many people, much of the time.
I have no real opinion (except that I got very little from it other than an ability to read people's minds) and am just playing with ya.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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Offlinelucid
Jack's AlteredConsciousness

Registered: 03/29/03
Posts: 6,319
Loc: up on the bidet
Last seen: 6 years, 10 months
Re: Study: Meditation produces brain changes [Re: MountainMist]
    #1569555 - 05/22/03 04:24 PM (17 years, 4 months ago)

I would have to agree with MountainMist's conjecture on Swami's personality. I realize I'm jumping to conclusions here, but Swami it really does seem like you're bitter about the whole idea of Buddhism/Yoga/Mediation. I could use a terrifying shroom trip, which has me in the throes of anxiety/depression even 3 months later, as "proof" that shrooms are bad, and crusade against em, but I know that it would be invalid.


--------------------
"no-mind un-thinks no-thought..."


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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
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Re: Study: Meditation produces brain changes [Re: lucid]
    #1569560 - 05/22/03 04:25 PM (17 years, 4 months ago)

There is NO crusade. I think everyone should try meditating then report back.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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Offlinelucid
Jack's AlteredConsciousness

Registered: 03/29/03
Posts: 6,319
Loc: up on the bidet
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Re: Study: Meditation produces brain changes [Re: lucid]
    #1569563 - 05/22/03 04:27 PM (17 years, 4 months ago)

What kind of spiritual insight were u looking for ? peace/fulfillment/happiness ?


--------------------
"no-mind un-thinks no-thought..."


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Offlinelucid
Jack's AlteredConsciousness

Registered: 03/29/03
Posts: 6,319
Loc: up on the bidet
Last seen: 6 years, 10 months
Re: Study: Meditation produces brain changes [Re: lucid]
    #1569571 - 05/22/03 04:30 PM (17 years, 4 months ago)

I've been meditating for about 10 years... there were times that I could abide in very euphoric/blissful states. After my shroom trip however mediating often makes me feel even more depressed and frightened. Not sure what to make of it or whether to continue to be honest. Perhaps I'm a closed minded stubborn nut, but I've choosen to continue... promise to report back if I ever find peace :-)


--------------------
"no-mind un-thinks no-thought..."


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InvisibleXlea321
Stranger
Registered: 02/26/01
Posts: 9,134
Re: Study: Meditation produces brain changes [Re: MountainMist]
    #1569572 - 05/22/03 04:30 PM (17 years, 4 months ago)

Gardening, playing a musical instrument, various hobbies all have certain aspects similar to meditation.

Maybe. But I don't think playing a musical instrument makes you happy either. Hendrix, Clapton, Richards, Bolin, Lennon, Coltrane, Davies, Parker. Not too many happy people there.

Did he say every single conscientious Buddhist is that way?

Well, yes actually he did. His opening line says "Buddhists are happy calm serene people". He didn't say "some buddhists".

The researchers have presented evidence.

Of a sort. Even the researcher himself says his findings would need to be confirmed.

Maybe you should tell that to all of the bored, neurotic retirees who live peaceful lifestyles

I've met plenty of happy retired people.

btw, do you think spending your life in a monastery, avoiding women and devoting yourself to a religion might not show a slight hint of neurosis?

If all you're saying is that buddhism might help some people cope with their lives a bit better then fair enough.







--------------------
Don't worry, B. Caapi


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Anonymous

Re: Study: Meditation produces brain changes [Re: Swami]
    #1569573 - 05/22/03 04:30 PM (17 years, 4 months ago)

You are conflating spiritual insight with inner peace. Meditation may not give spiritual insight, especially if man doesn't have a spiritual nature. But studies have shown that meditation techniques can lower blood pressure, relieve stress, etc.

Mountain Mist's argument is a valid one.

It is always a poor form of argument to argue from one's own experience.

Example:

Skiing isn't fun for me.
Therefore, skiing isn't fun.

I can't start my car.
Therefore, my car doesn't run.

Meditation doesn't work for me.
Therefore, meditation doesn't work.

Et Cetera


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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Study: Meditation produces brain changes [Re: ]
    #1569598 - 05/22/03 04:38 PM (17 years, 4 months ago)

It is always a poor form of argument to argue from one's own experience.

Ah. Then it is better to argue from someone else's experience. Well, I had a buddy who also found meditation to be lacking...


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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Anonymous

Re: Study: Meditation produces brain changes [Re: Swami]
    #1569602 - 05/22/03 04:40 PM (17 years, 4 months ago)

And we both know where anecdotal evidence gets us.

I had a buddy that knows a guy who can bend spoons with his mind.

And my other friend is convinced he talks to God.

Et Cetera


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Offlinelucid
Jack's AlteredConsciousness

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Posts: 6,319
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Re: Study: Meditation produces brain changes [Re: Swami]
    #1569607 - 05/22/03 04:41 PM (17 years, 4 months ago)

let me guess... the guy who assulted the UK backpacker ?
guess he found everlasting peace in fast cars, wine and women ;-)


--------------------
"no-mind un-thinks no-thought..."


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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Study: Meditation produces brain changes [Re: ]
    #1569617 - 05/22/03 04:44 PM (17 years, 4 months ago)

I had a buddy that knows a guy who can bend spoons with his mind.

That is way cool! Sign me up. I want to learn to Gellerize cutlery.


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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Anonymous

Re: Study: Meditation produces brain changes [Re: Swami]
    #1569649 - 05/22/03 04:56 PM (17 years, 4 months ago)

Ok, I just called him and he said he could teach you. He also said something about "no one can be in the room when he does it".

I have no idea what he meant.


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Offlinelucid
Jack's AlteredConsciousness

Registered: 03/29/03
Posts: 6,319
Loc: up on the bidet
Last seen: 6 years, 10 months
Re: Study: Meditation produces brain changes [Re: ]
    #1569722 - 05/22/03 05:28 PM (17 years, 4 months ago)

Meditations works ! garunteed !
DISCLAIMER: results might take 2 or more reincarnations


--------------------
"no-mind un-thinks no-thought..."


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Offlinelucid
Jack's AlteredConsciousness

Registered: 03/29/03
Posts: 6,319
Loc: up on the bidet
Last seen: 6 years, 10 months
Re: Study: Meditation produces brain changes [Re: lucid]
    #1571740 - 05/23/03 11:03 AM (17 years, 4 months ago)

awww... this was a fun thread, don't stop now... that means I'll have to go back to work ;-)


--------------------
"no-mind un-thinks no-thought..."


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