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Invisiblechuptoo
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Registered: 11/07/11
Posts: 523
why is this happening...?
    #15617006 - 01/04/12 07:34 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

sgfc is made properly...holes drilled on all 6 sides, 4+ inches of wet perlite...humidty is fine i would assume because everyone says if its made right the humidity should be fine...i mist and fan regularly...my mister has an ultra fine mist and ive been careful not to saturate the cakes. 

i hear conflicting reports about misting pins...some say it causes aborts others say its perfectly fine to mist pins (ie. it rains on them in their natural environment.) 

so what the hell is going on here...everything was going too smooth i knew it was too good to be true.  i really didnt want to have to come to you guys with questions. i just wanted to post pics of my fully fruited cakes and ya know...get the normal pats on the back, etc.  but now this...maybe its normal but i dont think so...





thanks for looking...

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OfflineSpookyCupid
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: chuptoo]
    #15617148 - 01/04/12 08:00 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

How long have they been in there?


--------------------
Disclaimer: Any and all statements are purely fictional, and for educational purposes only.

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Invisiblechuptoo
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: SpookyCupid]
    #15617152 - 01/04/12 08:01 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

since the 30th 28th.  dunked and rolled and got em in there.  misted.  fanned.  etc...

Edited by chuptoo (01/04/12 08:03 PM)

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Offlineboommer
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: chuptoo]
    #15617277 - 01/04/12 08:24 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

looks fine to me... what do you think is wrong with it?


--------------------
"Great minds have purposes, little minds have wishes"
Dont have patience? BUILD A TIME MACHINE...
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Invisiblechuptoo
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: boommer]
    #15617289 - 01/04/12 08:29 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

it doesnt look like pins ive seen in other pictures.  it looks like the veil is breaking...?  maybe im wrong.

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Invisible404
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: boommer]
    #15617313 - 01/04/12 08:36 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Yeah, mind if i ask what the problem is too?

also, whatcha growin', strain wise?

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Offlineboommer
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: chuptoo]
    #15617320 - 01/04/12 08:38 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

chuptoo said:
it doesnt look like pins ive seen in other pictures.  it looks like the veil is breaking...?  maybe im wrong.



no ur good everythings gonna b just fine. looks healthy


--------------------
"Great minds have purposes, little minds have wishes"
Dont have patience? BUILD A TIME MACHINE...
:pinkshroom: :supershroom: :regularshroom: :mushroomtwirl: :shroomeryhead: :scaryshroom:

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Invisiblechuptoo
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: 404]
    #15617324 - 01/04/12 08:39 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

ok...well i guess im starting to feel pretty dumb.  if you two say its ok, then i guess i have to believe you.

they are mazatapecs.

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Offlineboommer
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: chuptoo]
    #15617331 - 01/04/12 08:40 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

dont feel dumb everyone looks for faults with thier first grow... its because so much shit FUCKS you in life so it makes you think wow it cant be this easy to grow shrooms..


--------------------
"Great minds have purposes, little minds have wishes"
Dont have patience? BUILD A TIME MACHINE...
:pinkshroom: :supershroom: :regularshroom: :mushroomtwirl: :shroomeryhead: :scaryshroom:

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Invisible404
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: chuptoo]
    #15617336 - 01/04/12 08:43 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

chuptoo said:
ok...well i guess im starting to feel pretty dumb.  if you two say its ok, then i guess i have to believe you.

they are mazatapecs.





be glad you don't have PE right now, I'm still waiting for fruitz

I dunno shit about mazas, they shouldn't be any slower than PE.

Cultivation, as I'm sure you're finding out just like me, takes a LOT of patience. Be easy!

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Invisiblechuptoo
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: 404]
    #15617365 - 01/04/12 08:49 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

thanks guys. 

so a few more questions. 

first...is misting pins ok, or no?  the cakes require misting every day i thought...but then i just read a few things about not misting once pins form.  so im confused about that.

second...in the first pic you can see myc growing down outta the cake out onto the foil...reaching out kinda...is that normal myc growth?  or a result of something...lack of fae, too low humidty, etc...?

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Offlineboommer
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: chuptoo]
    #15617383 - 01/04/12 08:52 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

1. mist but try and avoid the pins(you dont want to rot your shrooms)
2. what is that on top of the foil? verm? i also heard that mycelium can eat threw foil so i never use it.


--------------------
"Great minds have purposes, little minds have wishes"
Dont have patience? BUILD A TIME MACHINE...
:pinkshroom: :supershroom: :regularshroom: :mushroomtwirl: :shroomeryhead: :scaryshroom:

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Invisiblechuptoo
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: boommer]
    #15617394 - 01/04/12 08:54 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

yeah its just verm that either fell off when i first placed the cakes in the FC or has become loosened a bit and flopped off the cake over the last week.

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Invisible404
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: chuptoo]
    #15617399 - 01/04/12 08:55 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

chuptoo said:
thanks guys. 

so a few more questions. 

first...is misting pins ok, or no?  the cakes require misting every day i thought...but then i just read a few things about not misting once pins form.  so im confused about that.

second...in the first pic you can see myc growing down outta the cake out onto the foil...reaching out kinda...is that normal myc growth?  or a result of something...lack of fae, too low humidty, etc...?





The mushrooms can catch disseases if they /stay/ wet. you want to make sure the water is evapping

you wanna fan like 5- ten times a day, keep the humidity up by spraying the walls and the perlite or whatever else you got down there. should be good to go, but FAE is crux.

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Offlineboommer
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: chuptoo]
    #15617409 - 01/04/12 08:56 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

thats why that verm has ur substrate on it so its just growing on top of it u should just cut it off and throw it out. or keep it for shits and gigs


--------------------
"Great minds have purposes, little minds have wishes"
Dont have patience? BUILD A TIME MACHINE...
:pinkshroom: :supershroom: :regularshroom: :mushroomtwirl: :shroomeryhead: :scaryshroom:

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Invisibleambargh
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: chuptoo]
    #15617419 - 01/04/12 08:58 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Pic #1 is an abort, and as far as pic #3 goes, it does look like the veils are breaking too soon, could be caused by a few things like a contaminant or too wet/dry substrate. It's hard to tell without a pic of your entire sub... you can mist your pins directly but you want to make sure the water can evaporate in a timely manner. I would hold off on misting for a day or so, then spray your bottle.up and let it fall down so you don't oversaturate.


--------------------
"The fact that we live at the bottom of a deep gravity well, on the surface of a gas covered planet going around a nuclear fireball 90 million miles away and think this to be normal is obviously some indication of how skewed our perspective tends to be.." - Douglas Adams

ambargh's easy agar

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OfflineSpookyCupid
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: boommer]
    #15617425 - 01/04/12 09:00 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Don't spray directly on the cake, but spray on the inside walls and on the perlite. After that I usually ran vigorously with the lid for like 10 seconds or so. As far as the mycelium eating tin foil. I know it'll eat through a tin disposable cooking tray, but I've read that takes as long as 4 flushes to see it happen. They'll shoot up when they're ready. How deep is the perlite?


--------------------
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Invisiblechuptoo
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: SpookyCupid]
    #15617483 - 01/04/12 09:14 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

heres the setup....i know i know the cakes are kinda close to eachother...i have a larger bin that i just got yesterday and will employ it in the near future. 








ps the perlite is at least four inches.  i think over tbh.

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Invisibleambargh
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: chuptoo]
    #15617546 - 01/04/12 09:27 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Well it looks like it may be too early to tell if it's just one little cluster that's doing that, just one cake, or your entire thing. you can hold off on misting for a day or two just to be sure you're not over-saturating. I would suggest using spring water because sometimes has all sorts of weird minerals in it, which can cause bruising and sometimes aborts, esp if you spray your cakes directly, IME.


--------------------
"The fact that we live at the bottom of a deep gravity well, on the surface of a gas covered planet going around a nuclear fireball 90 million miles away and think this to be normal is obviously some indication of how skewed our perspective tends to be.." - Douglas Adams

ambargh's easy agar

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Invisiblechuptoo
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: ambargh]
    #15617571 - 01/04/12 09:33 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

it seems to be the oldest pins...the ones that formed first...the largest ones. 

its not just consolidated to one cake...the veil thing is happening on a few of them.

i will hold of on misting the cakes directly for a day or two and see where it goes from here. 

also the water i use is from the great lakes...we.re known to have good water for the most part.  the ppms out of the tap hovers around 100 or so and the ph hovers around 6.8-7.1ish.

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Invisibleambargh
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: chuptoo]
    #15617598 - 01/04/12 09:39 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

yeah sometimes it's hard to tell. I've had that happen before and I couldn't figure out why, then I broke one in half one time and it was just contamed all throghout the middle. :lol: Those last pics are kinda blurry right where the pins are so I can't get a good look at them, sometimes it can be just awful genetics too


--------------------
"The fact that we live at the bottom of a deep gravity well, on the surface of a gas covered planet going around a nuclear fireball 90 million miles away and think this to be normal is obviously some indication of how skewed our perspective tends to be.." - Douglas Adams

ambargh's easy agar

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Invisiblechuptoo
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: ambargh]
    #15617688 - 01/04/12 09:57 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

my camera is being a bitch right now...the things i want to be in focus are not coming out how i want them to.  i will try again in a sec here.  thanks for the help everyone.

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Invisibleambargh
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: chuptoo]
    #15617705 - 01/04/12 10:00 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

It's probably because of the angle you're shooting it from, try stepping back a little farther and zooming in, or change your centering and press the shutter button down halfway and you'll be able to see what it auto-focuses on


--------------------
"The fact that we live at the bottom of a deep gravity well, on the surface of a gas covered planet going around a nuclear fireball 90 million miles away and think this to be normal is obviously some indication of how skewed our perspective tends to be.." - Douglas Adams

ambargh's easy agar

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Invisiblechuptoo
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: chuptoo]
    #15617759 - 01/04/12 10:11 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)







this is the mister i use.  super fine mist.


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OfflineKizzle
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: chuptoo]
    #15617879 - 01/04/12 10:33 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

They don't look too bad. Maybe just mist a little less.


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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: chuptoo]
    #15617932 - 01/04/12 10:42 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

chuptoo said:
they are mazatapecs.




I have grown Mazatapecs and found them to be a very slow fruiter.

I think that you are fine.

Good luck,

JD


--------------------
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Invisiblechuptoo
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: Javadog]
    #15618367 - 01/05/12 12:30 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

kizzle and JD you saw the pics on the first page? 

some of the bigger pins arent lookin too hott.

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InvisibleJavadog
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: chuptoo]
    #15618418 - 01/05/12 12:43 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Well, honestly, it is hard to say with certainty, but while a few of those
pins look like they might be aborting, this is not a sign of failure.

Aborts are part of the process...a few anyway.  I find that when I get a
ton of pins that some just fail. 

Most of those pins look very typical.

I gave my $0.02 worth.  I hope that I am right.  ;0)

Take care,

JD


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Invisiblechuptoo
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: Javadog]
    #15618579 - 01/05/12 01:37 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

thank you, jd...i appreciate it. 

we.ll know in a few days...

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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: chuptoo]
    #15618652 - 01/05/12 02:06 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

You are most welcome, and we will know, soon.

I expect good things!

JD


--------------------
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Invisiblechuptoo
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: Javadog]
    #15637028 - 01/08/12 09:15 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

so since my last post...I've pulled off tons of aborts...harvested one cake of miniature fruits...and by mini I mean MINI! I've thrown out a cake for various reasons. and now here i am.  lol.

so im not sure what the overall issue here is but the little booms on these cakes are so tiny...the veils started breaking on one cake so i harvested them and put that cake in for a good soak.

well here's some pics...the first is a cake that is going to be ready tomorrow whether i like it or not.  I've already pulled a few off of it and the rest im sure are not far behind. second pic is a few more of the cakes that will be shortly behind it...all bearing miniature mushies.  and the third pic is of some of the LARGEST from the already harvested cake.







so what do you think the issue is here?  the temps are right...they hover from 70 - 75...maybe you all can shed some light on the sitch. 

to reiterate these are mazatapecs from a MS syringe.

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InvisibleShroom_Goon
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: chuptoo]
    #15637728 - 01/08/12 11:52 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Don't know if anybody has said this but it could just be bad genetics?


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Invisiblechuptoo
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: Shroom_Goon]
    #15637849 - 01/09/12 12:20 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

yes ambargh mentioned that above...i guess we.ll see if anything rad happens on flush two...lol...although im not holding my breath.

i had a bunch of mutants as well...well not a bunch but 10-20.  i think its called rose cone or something of the like.  only on a couple of the cakes though. 

im not sure what to think at this point...but i have another batch of jars going, of a different "strain," so if anything i.ll just give it another go in a bit here.

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OfflineKizzle
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: chuptoo]
    #15638058 - 01/09/12 01:19 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

How much did they end up weighing? Sometime those small mushrooms are more massive than they look.


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Invisiblechuptoo
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: Kizzle]
    #15638067 - 01/09/12 01:21 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

still drying....i will report back with that info tomorrow if they are dry.

so far ive harvested fruits from three cakes.  man, they are so tiny.  lol.

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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: SpookyCupid]
    #15638830 - 01/09/12 07:14 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

SpookyCupid said:
Don't spray directly on the cake, but spray on the inside walls and on the perlite.




Bad advice.

The perlite provides humidity.  Misting is to replace lost moisture in the cake itself due to evaporation.  You should mist cakes daily, and then fan.

If veils are tearing when the fruits are small, gently lift the cake to judge moisture content by weight.  If the cake is light from too dry, or heavy from too wet, you'll get the same problem of slow growth and early cap opening.

If pins are turning white from mycelium on the surface, you need to allow more drying time between misting, or increase fresh air exchange.


When you get a lot of pins on a cake, it can dry out fast, resulting in tiny fruits.  Next time, try setting the cake in a saucer of water overnight mid-flush to rehydrate it.  An alternative is to pile up some verm on top of the cake, and pour water directly on it to saturate the verm.
RR


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OfflineSomeGuy
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #15638862 - 01/09/12 07:25 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

I'm suprised no one said anything, but the problem, way back in the first post, is vermicillium, a contaminant that caused the early breaking of the veil, tilted caps, and excess mycelium.
http://www.shroomery.org/5276/What-are-common-contaminants-of-the-mushroom-culture
read this

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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: SomeGuy]
    #15638970 - 01/09/12 08:01 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

The word is verticillium, but I don't see it.  Only the first pic with a white mushroom looked bad.  The rest do not.
RR


--------------------
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semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat

"I've never had a failed experiment.  I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
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OfflineSomeGuy
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #15638977 - 01/09/12 08:06 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

http://i.imgur.com/dNAt8l.jpg
in the last pic...small cap, tilted head premature veil breakage, excess white stuff....

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Invisiblechuptoo
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: SomeGuy]
    #15640008 - 01/09/12 01:20 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

the ones in the pic linked in the above post ended up being aborts.

overall the mushrooms seemed to develop ok, just super small.  i will take the advice of R. rabbit and, if they feel light mid-flush, will put them in a shallow saucer of water.  i dont think moisture was an issue because as ive been harvesting each cake they all seem to have some weight to them...not dried up prunes. 

two have been dunked and placed back in the FC...and three more are in the dunk now because i just harvested the TINY fruits off of them.  as i said before i wont hold my breath but one can HOPE that something a little larger or more substantial will happen. 

dont get me wrong...im glad it wasnt a complete failure but its definitely not what i was hoping for.  but in the end i achieved fruits...so i suppose that is a good thing.

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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: chuptoo]
    #15640049 - 01/09/12 01:29 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

I JUST noticed the tops of those cakes, especially around the edges... there is some slight discoloration, i hope it to be blue and not green for you...

waterwaterwater

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OfflineSpookyCupid
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: 404]
    #15643524 - 01/10/12 01:49 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Sorry for the bad advice, and thank you for correcting me RR. I was pretty sure I had read that spraying directly on the cake can cause aborts, so I've avoided doing so. After reading what you've just written I can see I've been misguided. I'm going to try the saturated verm on a couple of my cakes in the morning. Thanks for that tip.


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Invisiblechuptoo
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Re: why is this happening...? [Re: SpookyCupid]
    #15671750 - 01/15/12 11:18 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

hello all...thanks for all the advice throughout the thread here...

first flush gave me about an ounce and a half of TEEEEENY tiny mushrooms.  a few grams of that is aborts.  LOL.

i increased temp a bit in the room as i thought perhaps it was too cold...the weight of the cakes seems to be fairly hefty...so on this second flush i tried to mist half of the cakes as much as i thought i should and i held back on some of the others to see if it was an issue of too much spraying/misting.  they all seemed to perform pretty equally regardless of how much i misted them.  so im not sure what the issue is.

second flush yielded less fruits, still tiny, but larger than the first flush's mushrooms. 

someone previously mentioned perhaps it was just crappy genetics...which i would love to blame it on but i cant really make an educated decision on the matter as this was my first grow. 

ive started some more cakes and 5 jars of wbs...this first attempt has me worried about the wbs jars...im not sure im ready to make the leap to bulk but ive read plenty of people say that they jumped right to mono's and bypassed the pftek altogether. 

so lets hope that it was a syringe full of crappy spores and not something that im doing.  because as far as i can tell im doing everything correctly.  so we shall see how my next batch of cakes turns out along with these wbs jars. 

thanks all...hopefully the next pics i post will be mushrooms of epic size and proportion...and not some little tiny bastards.  lol.

peace.

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