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OfflineMadtowntripper
Sun-Beams out of Cucumbers
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Registered: 03/06/03
Posts: 21,287
Loc: The Ocean of Notions
Last seen: 7 months, 21 days
Re: Are you Un-American? [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1560935 - 05/19/03 05:46 PM (20 years, 10 months ago)

Now, tell me if I'm wrong here, but I was under the impression that with the healthcare system in Canada, everyone was covered, but the level of treatment wasnt very high.

Like, say some treatments that are extremely expensive, they wouldnt do in Canada, or it would take a long time to wait in the queue to get said treatment.

So, the access pool is bigger, but the level of care is lower. Am I wrong?


--------------------
After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action.  If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it.  - Ernest Hemingway

If it is life that you feel you are missing I can tell you where to find it.  In the law courts, in business, in government.  There is nothing occurring in the streets. Nothing but a dumbshow composed of the helpless and the impotent.    -Cormac MacCarthy

He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God.  - Aeschylus

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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?
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Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,247
Loc: Lost In Space
Re: Are you Un-American? [Re: Madtowntripper]
    #1560989 - 05/19/03 06:03 PM (20 years, 10 months ago)

You're not wrong.

Canadians with money cross the border to the US for serious medical needs.


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You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers

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Invisiblesilversoul7
Chill the FuckOut!
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Registered: 10/10/02
Posts: 27,301
Loc: mndfreeze's puppet army
Re: Are you Un-American? [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1560999 - 05/19/03 06:06 PM (20 years, 10 months ago)

I wouldn't say we have the richest poor in the world. They're much better off than in Ethopia for sure, but if you compare their situation to what they would have in Denmark or Iceland or even Canada, they have a long way to go. My family once took in a foreign exchange student from Denmark, and we used to joke about the fact that he came from the "Danish ghetto," because in Denmark, even the low-income housing is pretty damn nice.


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

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InvisibleEvolving
Resident Cynic

Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 5,385
Loc: Apt #6, The Village
Re: Are you Un-American? [Re: Rono]
    #1561043 - 05/19/03 06:21 PM (20 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Meaning that if I break my arm and go to the hospital I don't have to a pay a dime. If I like I can go to the doctor every single day for a checkup and not pay a cent out of pocket..besides my employer pays the taxes for healthcare...I don't. Even if they didn't, 34$ a month is not unreasonable for "free" healthcare.



How does your employer handle the costs of health care? There are several things he can do, hold down wages, refrain from hiring more people, raise prices, or try to cut costs in other areas. There is no 'free' about it, the costs are only hidden. You probably pay a lot more than a dime, you are just not able to see how the costs of the health care are hidden in every product and service you buy. What is the per capita income tax in Canada, what are the total per capita sales taxes paid in Canada? What is the unemployment rate? There are also other costs such as rationing of certain services and waiting for medical care that you could get immediately in the states. Hence, TANSTAAFL.


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To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.

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InvisibleInnvertigo
Vote Libertarian!!
Male

Registered: 02/08/01
Posts: 16,296
Loc: Crackerville, Michigan U...
Re: Are you Un-American? [Re: Madtowntripper]
    #1561063 - 05/19/03 06:29 PM (20 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

everyone was covered, but the level of treatment wasnt very high




You're correct, we have many Canooks that come over the bridge everyday to seek complicated or competant Doctors. This isn't a slam on Canadian doctors because there are some that are good but there is no incentive to improve in socialized medicine.

Quote:

or it would take a long time to wait in the queue to get said treatment.




Correct again. I don't know aboot you but i don't want to wait in any line if i don't have to when i'm dying.

Quote:

So, the access pool is bigger, but the level of care is lower. Am I wrong?




We have a winner. You are correct. The idea of socialized medicine is nice, very nice, but has to be paid by EVERYONE through taxes which are quite high. Now i'd be all for socialized medicine in the US if they would cut programs like welfare and other useless programs like the mating habit of a friggin' butterfly.


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson

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OfflineMadtowntripper
Sun-Beams out of Cucumbers
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Registered: 03/06/03
Posts: 21,287
Loc: The Ocean of Notions
Last seen: 7 months, 21 days
Re: Are you Un-American? [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1561658 - 05/19/03 09:25 PM (20 years, 10 months ago)

Aww...Inny said I was right...

How....Special....


--------------------
After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action.  If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it.  - Ernest Hemingway

If it is life that you feel you are missing I can tell you where to find it.  In the law courts, in business, in government.  There is nothing occurring in the streets. Nothing but a dumbshow composed of the helpless and the impotent.    -Cormac MacCarthy

He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God.  - Aeschylus

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OfflineMurex
Reality Hacker

Registered: 07/28/02
Posts: 3,599
Loc: Traped in a shell.
Last seen: 16 years, 6 months
Re: Are you Un-American? [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1562279 - 05/20/03 02:15 AM (20 years, 10 months ago)


Are you Un-American?

Yes with a but, No with a maybe. I'm a strange one I guess. In ways I'm for Amerika, but I'm also against it in others. I suppose I just want to see how it could be better while being aware of its goodness.

I'm a Zen anarchist/neo punk type. I'm not patriotic, that's for sure.  :tongue:


--------------------
What if everything around you
Isn't quite as it seems?
What if all the world you think you know,
Is an elaborate dream?
And if you look at your reflection,
Is it all you want it to be?


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InvisibleInnvertigo
Vote Libertarian!!
Male

Registered: 02/08/01
Posts: 16,296
Loc: Crackerville, Michigan U...
Re: Are you Un-American? [Re: Madtowntripper]
    #1562366 - 05/20/03 04:51 AM (20 years, 10 months ago)

you asked didn't you?


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson

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Offlinejimsuzo
I am the Eggman

Registered: 08/14/02
Posts: 269
Loc: Land of the not-so-free
Last seen: 14 years, 4 months
Re: Are you Un-American? [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1562623 - 05/20/03 09:57 AM (20 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Ok i think it needs to be said by someone on the right side of the political spectrum. I'm getting pretty sick and tired of everyone who is against the war or Bush being called unamerican . The idea that they are able to spout their opinions is in itself being a great american. I'm not talking aboot those spoting any sort of violence or the numbnut protesters that think it is their right to incorporate violence in their civil disobediance.




That's cool of you to say that. Seriously.



--------------------
There are roughly nine galaxies for every person alive on the planet today. Each of these galaxies has a billion suns, give or take the odd hundred million

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Invisiblechodamunky
Cheers!

Registered: 02/28/02
Posts: 2,030
Loc: sailing the seas of chees...
Re: Are you Un-American? [Re: ]
    #1565773 - 05/21/03 12:13 PM (20 years, 10 months ago)

patriotism does not make any sense to me. i consider myself a human being, and that is in direct contrast with being an "american", "canadian", "french".. or any other form of fake allegiance to a country you happen to be born in. try analyzing the logic behind your patriotism... you can't, because there is none.

I completely agree. Patriotism breeds conflict, it's a form of control.

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OfflineAzmodeus
Seeker

Registered: 11/27/02
Posts: 3,392
Loc: Lotus Land!! B.C.
Last seen: 19 years, 2 months
Re: Are you Un-American? [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1565874 - 05/21/03 12:36 PM (20 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

You're correct, we have many Canooks that come over the bridge everyday to seek complicated or competant Doctors.  This isn't a slam on Canadian doctors because there are some that are good but there is no incentive to improve in socialized medicine. 




Actually most canadian doctors work in the USA...something about money.  If they worked here for less, our system would be great! :wink:


--------------------
"Know your Body - Know your Mind - Know your Substance - Know your Source.

Lest we forget. "

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OfflineAzmodeus
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Registered: 11/27/02
Posts: 3,392
Loc: Lotus Land!! B.C.
Last seen: 19 years, 2 months
Re: Are you Un-American? [Re: chodamunky]
    #1565881 - 05/21/03 12:39 PM (20 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

patriotism does not make any sense to me. i consider myself a human being, and that is in direct contrast with being an "american", "canadian", "french".. or any other form of fake allegiance to a country you happen to be born in. try analyzing the logic behind your patriotism... you can't, because there is none.

I completely agree. Patriotism breeds conflict, it's a form of control. 




I also agree.  It seems patriotism is very low in canada, and acceptance for other cultures high.... :tongue:


--------------------
"Know your Body - Know your Mind - Know your Substance - Know your Source.

Lest we forget. "

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InvisibleEvolving
Resident Cynic

Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 5,385
Loc: Apt #6, The Village
Re: Are you Un-American? [Re: chodamunky]
    #1566013 - 05/21/03 01:09 PM (20 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

patriotism does not make any sense to me. i consider myself a human being, and that is in direct contrast with being an "american", "canadian", "french".. or any other form of fake allegiance to a country you happen to be born in. try analyzing the logic behind your patriotism... you can't, because there is none.

I completely agree. Patriotism breeds conflict, it's a form of control.



It seems the meaning of patriotism has changed. In my understanding, what you are referring to is NATIONALISM. Of course for the propogandists it is quite handy to conflate the two concepts to serve their purposes.


--------------------
To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.

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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?
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Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,247
Loc: Lost In Space
Re: Are you Un-American? [Re: Azmodeus]
    #1566420 - 05/21/03 03:24 PM (20 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Actually most canadian doctors work in the USA...something about money. If they worked here for less, our system would be great!



No it wouldn't. You'd still have the worthless feeding off the public teat and doing nothing to earn it.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers

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OfflineAzmodeus
Seeker

Registered: 11/27/02
Posts: 3,392
Loc: Lotus Land!! B.C.
Last seen: 19 years, 2 months
Re: Are you Un-American? [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1566479 - 05/21/03 03:42 PM (20 years, 10 months ago)

Good fucking point! :mad:
Health care is for the unhealthy and i hate paying for everyone elses problems.  Health is a personal matter, and concerns the persons family and friends.

Nothing is free, and im sick of paying for a service which is pretty much useless to me now, yet eventually when i really need some health care the "system" will cheap out on me like everyone else, giving me faulty equimpment, and service, leading to nothing more than me taking the money required and paying for proper service...(not necessarily the US...but probably)

Its really a stupid system when you think about it....i am still for CHEAP proper medical care however!


--------------------
"Know your Body - Know your Mind - Know your Substance - Know your Source.

Lest we forget. "

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Offlineatomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!

Registered: 04/07/03
Posts: 1,500
Loc: a human-infested anthill
Last seen: 20 years, 6 months
Re: Are you Un-American? [Re: Azmodeus]
    #1567473 - 05/21/03 09:23 PM (20 years, 10 months ago)

"patriotism is very low in canada"

wow, you must be living in a different part of bc than me. allthough.....i guess it all depends on how you define patriotism.

patriotism can be a good thing. especially if you live in a country that imports culture from another country, and you dont want to be absorbed by that countries culture....patriotism can help you stay soveriegn.


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enjoy the entertaining indentity i have constructed for you while you can.

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InvisibleXlea321
Stranger
Registered: 02/25/01
Posts: 9,134
Re: Are you Un-American? [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1567864 - 05/21/03 11:36 PM (20 years, 10 months ago)

You'd still have the worthless feeding off the public teat

Seig Heil!


--------------------
Don't worry, B. Caapi

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Offlinegrib
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Registered: 03/01/03
Posts: 550
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Re: Are you Un-American? [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1568784 - 05/22/03 09:36 AM (20 years, 10 months ago)

I was born at Walter Reed Army Medical Center in Washington D.C., raised in Texas, Colorado, etc. as well as in Europe. I am American as far as believing in the ideals upon which the United States was founded. I am, however, culturally un-American. That probably has a lot to do with living, studying and working in other countries.

It is a good thing to have the ability to see the world through other cultures and points-of-view. It is frustrating encountering so many people who were born in the United States and who are clueless about the world because their perspective of the world is gained by watching Hollywood movies or worse, CNN.


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<~>Our truest life is when we are in dreams awake <~>

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OfflineRonoS
DSYSB since '01
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Registered: 01/25/01
Posts: 16,259
Loc: Calgary, Alberta
Last seen: 1 year, 29 days
Re: Are you Un-American? [Re: grib]
    #1568797 - 05/22/03 09:42 AM (20 years, 10 months ago)

Well stated Grib...


--------------------
"Life has never been weird enough for my liking"

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