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Anonymous #1
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Women-folk
#15330715 - 11/06/11 11:50 AM (12 years, 3 months ago) |
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I'm inexperienced with women. I had kind of a sheltered upbringing and it's made me achingly shy towards people who aren't naturally outgoing. I have no problem talking to a girl if I think there might be something there—I've gotten over that part. The issue lies in my inability to make anything out of it. I feel like I've never made it past the “friends” stage with any girl and I'm not getting any younger and it just feels like it's getting harder the older I get.
But that's not even the problem. I know I have to be more assertive and manly. or whatever.
My problem is the way my body reacts. I can't fucking stand it
I loose my appetite. I loose sleep. I'm ornery and preoccupied with these stupid hypothetical and what-if daydreams. I get horrible pains in my stomach and I throw up if I try to force myself to eat. It's gotten to the point that I almost don't even want to bother with trying to date or find a relationship because I feel so fucking ill every time I try. I hate it and I hate that I associate trying to find a gf with feeling so completely disjointed.
I don't know if anybody has ever seen the brit-com Spaced but there is a great speech that I'll paraphrase that really hits the nail on the head:
it's like masturbation. It feels good and you enjoy it but there is something innately false about the situation. You're lying on the couch, you're sweaty and hot and turned on by these impossibly graphic images and having a good time but then you wake up or have a moment of clarity and realize that none of it is real and you're just playing with yourself.
It's like walking in on yourself and saying what the fuck are you doing?
Everytime a girl shows even the slightest bit of interest, I'm gone away into a world of fantasy. How can I control this?
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Simms
Fuckwit


Registered: 11/17/08
Posts: 1,109
Loc: Somewhere in Europe
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
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Breathe.
Breathe.
And occupy yourself with somehing else other than lieing on your bed and thinking.
You sound desperate.
Breathe.
Breathe again. Its a new day, sun is shining, whatever happens, happens and there is no need to feel fuzzy about it.
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Joolz


Registered: 09/19/10
Posts: 3,614
Last seen: 11 years, 3 months
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Re: Women-folk [Re: Simms]
#15331356 - 11/06/11 02:04 PM (12 years, 3 months ago) |
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I don't get quite so sick OP, but I'm definitely on the same level of social retardedness with women.
Nothing to it but to do it.
I too have trouble with the uhh, being assertive and having "game" part.
-------------------- Prohibition didn't work for God; Eve ate the fruit.
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Anonymous #1
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Re: Women-folk [Re: Joolz]
#15331629 - 11/06/11 03:05 PM (12 years, 3 months ago) |
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I just went for a jog and I feel a little better. I think my appetite might be making a pathetic attempt at resurgence.
But I've had physical manifestations of my anxiety almost as long as I can remember.
I'll break it down for you--
It all goes back to middle school. In sixth grade, when all the other guys' voices were dropping, mine didn't. I don't know why, it just didn't. By seventh grade, I was the only guy in school who still sounded like a little kid (ie a girl) and so people teased me mercilessly about it. I became incessantly self-conscious about my voice and the way I sounded.
I hated going out to eat, having to order, trying to talk loud enough that the waitress could hear if I wanted lettuce or not.
Forget talking in front of the class or reading a loud. In reading class I would break out in cold sweats and beg to go to the bathroom to get out of reading in front of everyone.
It finally got to the point that I was faking being sick all the time so I could stay home. In eighth grade, my parents pulled me out of public school and home-schooled me.
And for the next three or so years everything was peachy keane.
Little did I know that while I read in my pajamas all afternoon, the rest of my generation was learning to deal with each other in new and exciting ways.
When college rolled around, my voice still hadn't changed. I sounded different now, not so much like a kid, just different. I started smoking weed and that caused my voice to drop a little but not much. I was still terrified of giving presentations or saying anything in class because I was so self conscious of my voice.
Somewhere during this time, I came to realize how socially undeveloped I was.
So I did it again--I dropped out of school. I told my parents it was because it was too expensive and it partially was but the real reason was because it was too hard to take school seriously when I was afraid of speaking.
The efforts that I went through to avoid giving oral presentations would shock you. Lies about termite infestations that I peddled to my incredulous professors. I dropped so many classes because of the words "presentation" and "participation grade" that get thrown around so much in college.
So, I left school and went to work and tried to solve my problems. I did voice exercises and managed to get my voice stronger and deeper. I went on prozac for a two years and then kicked it (hardest thing I've ever done was quitting that shit). I started meditating and being honest with myself (shrooms helped with that).
But still my body reacts to fear and stress and anxiety the same way it did when I was younger--I run and hide in my thoughts. I physically feel sick: nausea, vomiting (even if I've only had water sometimes), sweating, cramps, diarrhea, light-headedness, confusion...the list goes on.
I'm trying to live a normal life. People keep telling me how smart I am and that I should be more confident in myself so I try. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.
And it feels like the thing that I just can't tackle, the thing I just can't figure out is women. I literally missed that class because I was too afraid of my own fears.
It really all boils down to my thoughts. There are certain things I can control. If I'm upset, I know it and I try to deal with it. But being lonely and alone is all I've ever known so I have no idea how to control those thoughts.
And yet I know I can control them. I can give a presentation like a boss now, even though it still freaks me the fuck out. And I feel like I could figure out my issues with a bit of work.
But then I try with a woman again and I get friend-zoned and I decide, to protect myself from any more physical harm to give up any hope for a relationship yet again--beginning the cycle of depression and despondence all over again.
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SARAtonin
Violent Dreams



Registered: 09/28/11
Posts: 15,961
Loc: Deutschland
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Don't worry, I haven't made it past the friend stage with any girls either. Or at least when I was sober.
But really, Don't get stuck in a hedgehog's dilemma, it's only going to bring more hurt then it's worth.
Just get a solid group of friends, then go from there, they will help out, trust me.
-------------------- God kills indiscriminately and so shall we. For no creatures under God are as we are none so like him as ourselves. Want to join a cult? Click for details…
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cateyes


Registered: 12/16/03
Posts: 2,754
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i give this information out alot here and i'm probably beginning to annoy some people but i figure it's more important to provide solid information to someone in need then worry about pissing some people off...
although i never had problems with female/male relationships, i understand what you're going through from an anxiety point of view... the advice i'm going to give you may seem unrelated but i promise you, it will pay off in spades...
seriously consider altering your diet: eliminate all(or as much as possible) processed foods, eliminate ALL sugar(including alcohol, you can drink wine on occasions), eliminate coffee and tea(use an herbal tea instead), drink at least 8 or more glasses of water everyday, eat as much fruits and vegetables as possible and take a good high potency vitamin twice a day...
if you decide to implement this diet you will feel under the weather the first week or two but this will pass and by the end of the month you should see some significant changes... i sure as hell did...
very important...exercise is important for everyone, especially someone with anxiety... aerobic is the best for both the body and the mind... do at least 15-30 minutes daily... this is excellent for the lymph system and brain among other things...
there are many other supplements/herbs you could use but i'll let you talk with someone at your local health food store for that advice... i do recommend that you take:
5-HTP 100mg-200mg one hour before bedtime~~~this will boost serotonin levels which will aid in sleep, if you're having that problem... it will also help you deal with periods of anxiety and depression... low serotonin levels bring on anxiety and depression among other things... by using 5-HTP you'll experience a sense of PeaCe through your day...
valerian root in capsule form in the day(don't overdo it) and drink valerian tea 1-2 cups in the evening~~~valerian is excellent for anxiety and sleep issues... it effectively calms the mind,a very high percentage of people who use it find it's very effective...
consider reprogramming your subconscious mind... it can take between one to three months before you begin realizing results but the results can be profound depending what your goals are... it's similar to meditation or mindfulness training... it requires daily practice, if you miss one day you have to start all over again... that's just the way the brain works... your subconscious mind is telling you who you are, how to react under specific situations and how to perceive your world among other things... do a google search "reprogram subconscious mind" you'll come up with a number of hits, they're pretty much the same... select one that suits you and apply it... your subconscious mind is telling you how to react when a girl/woman shows an interest to you... it caused you to freak when you have to give presentations in school and brought on avoidant behavior... it will remind you of lessons/habits you learned in an over protective household and developed hangups(not saying there were any problems in the household, but if there were issues that you didn't bring up, you can address them)... at first when someone suggested i try it i thought it sounded too weird and out there but she convinced me to give it a shot so i did... it took 3 months to finally kick in my case but the results were amazing... it's why i'm so passionate about it...
whatever your decision is, i wish you the best of luck...
Kensho
Edited by cateyes (11/06/11 05:21 PM)
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fngbronco
Monkey Man



Registered: 09/26/10
Posts: 2,877
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Re: Women-folk [Re: cateyes]
#15333734 - 11/06/11 11:42 PM (12 years, 3 months ago) |
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Dude, get over the fact you don't sound like James Earl Jones, Justin beiber is making hit records lol. You'll be good. I get all giddy around chicks and I'm almost 30 lol I love women and hate the feeling, I can't say shit without either pissing them off or coming off too strong. Luckily I've got a good gf. If someone isn't willing to get to know you, do ya really want that person in your life or do you think their opinion of you should matter? This is one of those things you just gotta man up and move on. You seem like a good intelligent kid. If you wanna make an awkward situation easier, imagine how weird it would be if you farted, then just don't fart and it won't be that bad. Get the fuck back in school too, you need to learn social skills, and even though they're unnerving you'll learn to cope and you will develop mannerisms to help.
-------------------- I challenge you to challenge yourself more! When you feel complacent and ready to hang it up, challenge yourself to get over it! If you fail, don't look at it as you didn't succeed, look at it as you would a rock face you're trying to climb. Stand back, wayyyy back, and look at it and plot another path. If you can't find one, shuffle down the way a little, a little change of scenery or a view from a different angle may give you the insight you need. Anything I state is relayed information from a friend of a friend and should be viewed as completely fictitious. I do not partake in any illegal or grey-area-of-the-law activities, but do have lots of friends who may or may not. -fngbronco Pill Divider Agar Tek
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Anonymous #2
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Quote:
Anonymous said: It's gotten to the point that I almost don't even want to bother with trying to date or find a relationship because I feel so fucking ill every time I try.
This.
A couple months ago a woman who I had been interested in for years told a mutual friend she was interested in me. We were invited to the same party. I really wanted to go but the anxiety about it was so bad I was feeling sick. I couldn't make myself do it. I wanted to so bad but I just couldn't. I thought maybe I could go and get a little tipsy to talk easier but the anxiety about sounding stupid when I was drunk was so strong that I couldn't even do that. It's frustrating.
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Anonymous #1
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I like the idea of reprogramming the subconscious mind. I did a little research on it and I realized I've already been trying to do it for some time now but, like cateyes said, when you backtrack and start thinking negatively again, it takes effort to get back to where you are. The other day was definitely a back track but it helped remind me of all the things I've learned about myself so far.
There is good advice from everyone here and I thank you all for taking the time to address the problems that I think a lot of people have to deal with.
To anon #2, when using something like alcohol, there is a fine line between being buzzed and peppy and being drunk and slow. There was a time in my life when I turned to alcohol for some of my problems and it never helped. There again though my problem was never so much talking to women as it was coming on to them, if that makes sense. I can make a girl laugh pretty easily and I've been told that I'm attractive but when it comes to trying to be romantic or sexual, I just don't know how. The idea, as I said, makes me ill with anticipation and jitters. I think what SARAtonin said about friends is applicable here. Introverts at parties is a recipe for disaster so make sure you have at least two friends there to talk to and help you get your nerve up. I can attest that this helps.
Quote:
fngbronco said: If you wanna make an awkward situation easier, imagine how weird it would be if you farted, then just don't fart and it won't be that bad.
Also, this is secretly genius.
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Anonymous #3
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Look - everyone thinks that they missed out because of their childhood, or they didn't experiment in school and everyone else did, etc. Guess what? Not everyone did that stuff. And these people grow up and handle social dating just fine.
Look - you know what you should do, you know what the problems are. It sounds like even if you had a girl who was perfect for you, you'd still have a physical reaction. All you can do is work through it. Admitting you have this problem with a girl is the first step, and you two can take it slow from there. There isn't some magical pill for anxiety (okay, there are, if you want to try benzos). If you don't want to take pills then just be honest, find someone who will help you with it (counselor, supportive partner). Since it sounds like you can't even get near women to even explain your issue, maybe temporarily taking benzos would help, or talking to a counselor/psychologist/psychiatrist.
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shimishimiman
Jaded Optimist


Registered: 03/21/09
Posts: 469
Loc: Shmexas, Texas
Last seen: 2 months, 20 days
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This is all just a matter of getting out there and making shit happen. Really, you may need some drug to help you get over your anxiety, at least until you can prove to yourself that situations CAN work out in your favor.
I was always an outgoing person, but once I left high school and all of my friends and comfort zones were blasted into oblivion, I had no idea what to do with myself and I slowly became filled with paralyzing social anxiety.
MDMA helped me more than anything: after the first time I rolled, I realized that there is nothing to be afraid of. NOTHING. I was doing and saying insanely stupid shit that I would never have even DREAMED of doing sober at that rave, and it was ok. Nothing went wrong, people may have been laughing with me or at me, it didn't matter. What mattered was that I fucking did it. I fucking did it over and over and over and over, and every single time, it felt awesome.
The point is, you shouldn't make your endgame fucking a girl, because so long as you aren't confident in your social skills, there is no goddamn way you are going to bone some random bitch unless she is completely wasted. You need to focus on establishing comfort around people, and discovering confidence in yourself. Drugs can help, but they can also hurt too. Figure out what works for you, then get the fuck out there and start making everyone's business your business. People won't like you very much, but they will deal with you, and you will discover just how easy it is to get people to do what you want when you are confident/assertive enough.
For me, my understanding of human psychology is what gives me confidence. I have several theories about exactly how and why socializing works, and for the most part, I haven't been proven wrong.
Like I said earlier, find what works for you.
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sadspacemonkey
!universe!



Registered: 11/01/06
Posts: 376
Last seen: 7 years, 3 days
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I used to go through something somewhat similar ... When I was interested in a guy I would be so terrified I couldn't speak, couldn't think, would literally run away when he would come around.. I was bullied somewhat so this image of myself as a gross loser would not leave no matter how many people told me I was cute, likeable, etc... The fantasies about the object of my affection took on a life of their own... What helped was a change in perspective .. I tried to imagine how this person felt talking to me- a person with their own insecurities, wants, needs... How could I make his day a little brighter? Easier? I started connecting with guys on a friendship level.. When that annoying littlle voice came around I tried my best to ignore it you seem like a thoughtful and kind person. I'm sure a lot of girls would love to get to know you. Realize it's not a big deal, they don't see the story of the dude who's nervous, they see a nice, intelligent man. Re-write your own self image and release the old habits. Connect on a human level, try and see from her perspective a little- then real connection happens. best of luck! <3
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"I can't be told by anyone how to live. If I said to the minister 'Move from your home' he would think I was mad." Bushman : Botswana
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indraclee
friend



Registered: 09/28/11
Posts: 306
Last seen: 10 years, 15 days
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Yo brother, you gotta remember to trust. Trust that other people aren't there to hurt or make fun of you, cuz they're not. If you have that feeling, it's coming from yourself. Love yourself enough to know you're good enough for a good woman. They love really well man--it's worth it to learn to love yourself enough to gain theirs. When you have a thought about how you could fuck up, remember there's nothing to fuck up. There's no one there tallying right and wrong. Just go with it and have confidence that you can remain in the moment and not wander down the roads in your mind that have already led you to failure.
Blaze a new trail today my friend.
And good luck!
-------------------- Wake up to find out that you are the eyes of the world.
 
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Anonymous #1
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To anon 3: Thanks for your help but I won't go down the benzo road. I have an extremely addictive personality and I can only imagine what a train wreck that would be. I agree that admitting the problem is the first step. I've admitted it to myself, now I just have to find a girl who is still interested after she sees what a mess I am.
Shimishimiman: I've been thinking a lot about what you said about getting out there. Trying to forget my hang-ups is probably one of the hardest things I've ever had to do, just because it's so ingrained in my subconscious. I would never be able to locate MDMA in my small little circle, but I'm glad it worked for you. I've heard a lot of people say similar things happened to them. I also agree that fucking shouldn't be my endgame. If I were to meet a girl that I liked and felt comfortable around and who I thought liked me in the same way, it would still take me some time and effort before I was comfortable with myself enough to sleep with her...or even kiss her or hold her hand for that matter.
Sadspacemonkey: I really like your perspective. I've had some success with being empathetic towards people before (who doesn't like a little sympathy?) but it is still an effort to gather interest in someone else when I'm so wrapped up in my own world. I guess I have a lot of work to do. Anyways, thanks for your sweet words, I appreciate it.
indraclee: trust is a big step...I've been hurt a few times in the past but mostly because of things I did or didn't do for myself. I just need to accept my past failure for what they are and move on. It's a challenging process but your encouraging words have been ringing in my head.
In fact, everyone's encouragement has really, really helped over the past few days. Thank you all so much for taking the time to offer advice.
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northwest_ginger
Urban Hunter



Registered: 10/19/11
Posts: 78
Loc: PDX, Oregon
Last seen: 10 years, 5 months
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If your shy try online dating it may help you open up by typing rather than talking. Then when you meet the person try to focus day by day and not the future. I know it's hard to do but I think it'll help you in the long run.
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