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The Lightning
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Psilocybe pelliculosa hunters please comment
#15366309 - 11/13/11 07:39 PM (12 years, 4 months ago) |
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Nov 13, 2011 Thurston/WA
Clear cut (previous logging site)
Found in clusters with a few others a little spaced out here and there.
Cap Notes: Gelatinous, separable pellicle and hygrophanous cap. Consistently umbonate, conical caps. Caps form vertical line formation while fresh. The margin is jagged versus smooth-edged.
Medium brown to light brown gills.
Gills (very technically speaking) are attached to the stipe.
No blue-bruising observed before, during, or after harvest on any of the specimens. I will go back tomorrow to investigate a new collection. Updated: Very, very minimal bluing observed in only 2 of about 40 specimens in very, very small areas near the base of the stem. Little chunks of the stems were fractured off for this to occur.
Spore print: Light in deposit. Difficult to be confident in. I would say brown at first but not solid brown. After taking almost a dozen prints, I would say brown.
Spores: Eliptical (maybe lemon-shaped)
What makes matters more confusing is the presence of pleurocystidia.
Edited by The Lightning (11/14/11 03:49 AM)
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elprawn
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Re: Psilocybe pelliculosa hunters please comment [Re: The Lightning]
#15366337 - 11/13/11 07:48 PM (12 years, 4 months ago) |
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Look scarily like Galerina to my untrained eyes. Obv the print is purple-brown, though...
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HarryL
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Re: Psilocybe pelliculosa hunters please comment [Re: elprawn]
#15366357 - 11/13/11 07:53 PM (12 years, 4 months ago) |
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some of those look like mycena to me
did you do spore prints?
-------------------- Mushroom hunting: One bad mushroom can ruin your day! Know it or throw it.
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The Lightning
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Re: Psilocybe pelliculosa hunters please comment [Re: HarryL]
#15366420 - 11/13/11 08:11 PM (12 years, 4 months ago) |
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I'm doing additional spore prints right now on glass so I can see if the color shows up better. So far I'd say its somewhat brown (Its honestly difficult to distinguish).
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maynardjameskeenan
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Re: Psilocybe pelliculosa hunters please comment [Re: The Lightning]
#15366545 - 11/13/11 08:33 PM (12 years, 4 months ago) |
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Maybe hunting for pelliculosa isn't such a good idea seeing as how much they look like galerina.
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psylosymonreturns
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Re: Psilocybe pelliculosa hunters please comment [Re: The Lightning]
#15366548 - 11/13/11 08:33 PM (12 years, 4 months ago) |
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you really need to work on your printing. you never seem to get good prints for some reason .
where do you do your prints ?
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elprawn
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Quote:
psylosymonreturns said: where do you do your prints ?
On the way home, in the car wash. He keeps the windows open to stop the mushroom from drying out.
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The Lightning
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I agree. I'm going to get colored paper to try this in the future for new collections.
Usually, I just put them on white typing paper or on a glass slide - sometimes on tinfoil. The mushrooms I've been hunting recently have rather small caps, thus small spore prints.
I have a cap on a smooth black surface and about ten more caps on a glass dish - hopefully this will give us a definitive answer. I'll try to include a photograph soon.
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novictimnocrime
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Looks like an exact lookalike of pelliculosa to me. but the margin is usaually not jagged. and the spores are too brown. could you post a pic of the print?
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The Lightning
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Quote:
maynardjameskeenan said: Maybe hunting for pelliculosa isn't such a good idea seeing as how much they look like galerina.
Maybe this thread and others will prevent confusion in the future if we keeping pushing forward.
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novictimnocrime
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Re: Psilocybe pelliculosa hunters please comment [Re: The Lightning]
#15366634 - 11/13/11 08:47 PM (12 years, 4 months ago) |
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I would post some pictures of some, but i was out of town for the season and came back to snow
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psylosymonreturns
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Re: Psilocybe pelliculosa hunters please comment [Re: The Lightning]
#15366664 - 11/13/11 08:52 PM (12 years, 4 months ago) |
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you should always print the small species in a cold enviroment . the longer you can keep the cap moist, the more likely you are going to succeed in getting a dark definetive print from a species like P peliculosa . I have had to find a way since i do pick tiny species like P peliculosa , C cyanopus and P semilanceata.
using a wet q tip to moisten the cap periodically really helps as well.
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The Lightning
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Interesting. What I do sometimes is place a tupperware container upside down ontop of the cap, or a similar humidity-preserving dome.
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novictimnocrime
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Re: Psilocybe pelliculosa hunters please comment [Re: The Lightning]
#15366743 - 11/13/11 09:06 PM (12 years, 4 months ago) |
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Are the gills attached to the stipe?
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psylosymonreturns
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Re: Psilocybe pelliculosa hunters please comment [Re: The Lightning]
#15366750 - 11/13/11 09:07 PM (12 years, 4 months ago) |
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naw. you have to do that EVERY time. i should have mentioned covering them, but thats common practice anyways so i didnt mention it.
do what i suggested and you will get better prints from small, quickly dryed, species.
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The Lightning
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Re: Psilocybe pelliculosa hunters please comment [Re: novictimnocrime]
#15366766 - 11/13/11 09:10 PM (12 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
novictimnocrime said: Are the gills attached to the stipe?
Technically, yes.
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novictimnocrime
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Re: Psilocybe pelliculosa hunters please comment [Re: The Lightning]
#15366809 - 11/13/11 09:18 PM (12 years, 4 months ago) |
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I'm 95% sure that's Psilocybe Pelliculosa
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Shmigoli
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Re: Psilocybe pelliculosa hunters please comment [Re: novictimnocrime]
#15366882 - 11/13/11 09:33 PM (12 years, 4 months ago) |
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I was in that same area looking for pelliculosa and edibles today. (probably the same forest) All I came across where boatloads of Hypholoma, galerina, and other various species in the clear cuts. Nice find, if those are pelliculosa. If I seen those I definately would have picked them to identify, however I've never found them before.
Edited by Shmigoli (11/13/11 09:40 PM)
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The Lightning
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Re: Psilocybe pelliculosa hunters please comment [Re: Shmigoli]
#15366961 - 11/13/11 09:46 PM (12 years, 4 months ago) |
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It's definitely a cool mushroom, and everything in me is telling me its Psilocybe pelliculosa.
Below: A couple more images. Two of the mushrooms now appear to have bluing in very small areas that cannot be photographed. The spore prints taken on glass appear to have a lavender quality within the brown color.
I would not call this a purple-brown spore print. I would call it a spore print that may require magnification beyond 3x in good lighting. I would also say magnification is needed for bluing in some collections.
Edited by The Lightning (11/14/11 03:34 AM)
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psylosymonreturns
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Re: Psilocybe pelliculosa hunters please comment [Re: The Lightning]
#15367200 - 11/13/11 10:34 PM (12 years, 4 months ago) |
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the print on paper looks good to me. and i do see the blueing!
if you can measure spore size it would be cool to see if you have any P silvatica in there..
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suchen
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Yeah I even saw the bluing in the earlier photos. Good hunt!
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The Lightning
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I need a pixel ruler for made for mac.
I need it to be rotatable 360 degrees in on order to measure spores.
Edited by The Lightning (11/14/11 03:47 AM)
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Oregonic
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Re: Psilocybe pelliculosa hunters please comment [Re: The Lightning]
#15367256 - 11/13/11 10:46 PM (12 years, 4 months ago) |
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I've spent a small amount of time in clear cuts hunting Pellis... I have seen specimens that have looked exactly like those you've collected and passed them up due to them just not seeming to match other examples I've seen of Pelliculosa. But then again, seemingly many photographs I've seen of Pellis can vary. IMO, those look like a completely different mushroom than the Pellis in Psilocybin Mushrooms of the World, but look very similiar to some photos in the results of a google image search of Psilocybe Pelliculosa. But I think it's looking pretty good for you... and me, since I am now going to go back to a couple clear cuts.
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maynardjameskeenan
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Re: Psilocybe pelliculosa hunters please comment [Re: The Lightning]
#15367271 - 11/13/11 10:51 PM (12 years, 4 months ago) |
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Those look a lot more like a psilocybe once dried! I bet that they are pelliculosa.
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Alan Rockefeller
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Re: Psilocybe pelliculosa hunters please comment [Re: The Lightning]
#15368334 - 11/14/11 08:39 AM (12 years, 4 months ago) |
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I don't see any lamellar trama in your video, and the gill isn't really a perfect triangular shape, making me wonder if the gill is folded over on the tip and you are actually looking at the gill edge. The cystidia is too abundant to be pleurocystidia and the shape is more like what I would expect to see in cheilocystidia.
You might need to work on your sectioning some more. The fact that you coudn't focus well in some places indicates that it is too thick.
P. pelliculosa is supposed to have irregularly branched cheilocystidia.
Regarding telling cheilocystidia from pleurocystidia - They are often different shapes.
It would be a good idea to draw the shapes of the cystidia you see on paper to help convey the shapes that you see. Check Oluna Ceska's drawings on mushroomobserver for examples.
The spores and cystidia are the same in dried and fresh material. When you examine dried material it gets rehydrated first with KOH or isopropanol.
Make sure you are saving good herbarium specimens, and label them with the MO observation number so later you know which mushrooms go with which photos.
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HarryL
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Re: Psilocybe pelliculosa hunters please comment [Re: Alan Rockefeller]
#15368366 - 11/14/11 08:52 AM (12 years, 4 months ago) |
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I think most of those are Pells
I believe there are several sub species or variants of Pells
The pellicle, purplish spore print and habitat will keep you straight
Even being careful, I have picked galerina and found them at home on sorting
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Alan Rockefeller
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Re: Psilocybe pelliculosa hunters please comment [Re: HarryL]
#15368382 - 11/14/11 08:58 AM (12 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
HarryL said: I believe there are several sub species or variants of Pells
¿orale? Which ones are you aware of?
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novictimnocrime
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Re: Psilocybe pelliculosa hunters please comment [Re: Alan Rockefeller]
#15369051 - 11/14/11 12:41 PM (12 years, 4 months ago) |
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Nevermind, those are not Pelliculosa based on the spore print and bruising. I've never (ever) had a pelliculosa blue, or have a brown print, and i've picked many hundreds. maybe a galerina. but nice find
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tdmm
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Re: Psilocybe pelliculosa hunters please comment [Re: novictimnocrime]
#15369076 - 11/14/11 12:47 PM (12 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
novictimnocrime said: Nevermind, those are not Pelliculosa based on the spore print and bruising. I've never (ever) had a pelliculosa blue, or have a brown print, and i've picked many hundreds. maybe a galerina. but nice find
Really? I'm confused... Stamets' book says:
"Stem: (...) ...brownish toward the base, blue green where bruised or with age."
I thought I've heard reports that some pelli hunters to see some blueing, although fairly uncommon, it's not unheard of?
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Alan Rockefeller
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Re: Psilocybe pelliculosa hunters please comment [Re: novictimnocrime]
#15369115 - 11/14/11 12:53 PM (12 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
novictimnocrime said: maybe a galerina.
That would explain the presence of pleurocystidia and capitate cystidia.
OP check the spores for a germ pore.
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novictimnocrime
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Re: Psilocybe pelliculosa hunters please comment [Re: Alan Rockefeller]
#15370705 - 11/14/11 07:08 PM (12 years, 4 months ago) |
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might be location or something but, ive never seen one blue. I'd like to know what that is though
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