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InvisibleAleon
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Re: Spacing of Lions Mane Sawdust Blocks [Re: mikesethnobotany]
    #15924137 - 03/09/12 01:13 PM (9 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

mikesethnobotany said:
Sorry to bring up an old post but this old thread deserves a bump! I gotta ask, did you use fuel pellets for sawdust on the shiitake?

-Mike




HEy mike, yes for this grow of shiitake 75 i used mixed hardwood fuel pellets, pennywise brand.  I added water %5 gypsum and %2 OG Wheat Bran, of the total dry weight of the block.  This was sterilized at 15PSI For 2-3 hours.  That batch had 1/4 of a liter jar worth of spawn per block, 115g grain (weight in ambient dry state before hydration.)  Incubation for 10 weeks, no cold shock, no slap, just rinsed. 

Due to the fact that shiitake blocks cannot be pushed together like the lions mane, i have been growing alot more of other varieties recently.  Id like to max the lb/ft3 and since i can yield 2lb of lions mane and other varieties, but in the same space i can only grow 1 lb of shiitake, i have been slowing down with shiitake production. Im testing feasibility of being mostly a king oyster and spawn farm. Kings blocks can be pushed together to give high yield and they have a taste and shelf-life that the lions mane and regular oysters lack.

Well, so my testing of close spacing of blocks for oyster mushrooms is a success as well, with sawdust blocks this is now the main way i grow them.  I have doubled my yeild/ft2 by top fruiting and pushing the bags together.  Some strains respond to top fruiting better than others.  IM harvesting very early to ensure quality and even then im getting .75-1.25lb/block.  Here are some pictures, enjoy.  They are grown on pure oak pellets, %5 gypsum and %20 OG wheat bran by dry weight; sterilized at 15PSI for 2 or 3 hours.  I used 1/2 liter ajr of spawn (225g ambient dry state), incubate for 2 weeks harvest after 10-14 days in FC.  Temps are cooler, thats why the growth is slow, 50-60F in the day and 45-55 at night.  The strain is "PL" from aloha meds; steel blue is a great description they gave of the color. Its not your average blue oyster. ENJOY!

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Re: Spacing of Lions Mane Sawdust Blocks [Re: Aleon]
    #15925349 - 03/09/12 06:06 PM (9 years, 4 months ago)

Very nice!! You are a talented mushroom farmer Aleon, congrats on those beautiful steel blue oysters.  And are those custom made bags with your business name on them?!?! How bad a is that!

I am excited to know that you had good success with wood pellets for the S75, as shiitake is going to be my main crop and I plan to use the 100% hardwood pellets. Someone recently called me out on using the pellets and said I will never get good flushes using them, so I have been worrying about having to switch to new sawdust sources. But your success is sure-fire proof that wood pellets do work.

Do you know if Aloha has any low spore producing oysters, or any with no spores at all?? I would eventually like to try out oysters but my GH is setup in the living room.

Btw, are oysters more per Lb. than shiitake are?

Thanks for the info btw.


Edited by mikesethnobotany (03/09/12 11:37 PM)


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InvisibleAleon
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Re: Spacing of Lions Mane Sawdust Blocks [Re: mikesethnobotany]
    #15928742 - 03/10/12 11:14 AM (9 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

mikesethnobotany said:
Very nice!! You are a talented mushroom farmer Aleon, congrats on those beautiful steel blue oysters.  And are those custom made bags with your business name on them?!?! How bad a is that!

I am excited to know that you had good success with wood pellets for the S75, as shiitake is going to be my main crop and I plan to use the 100% hardwood pellets. Someone recently called me out on using the pellets and said I will never get good flushes using them, so I have been worrying about having to switch to new sawdust sources. But your success is sure-fire proof that wood pellets do work.

Do you know if Aloha has any low spore producing oysters, or any with no spores at all?? I would eventually like to try out oysters but my GH is setup in the living room.

Btw, are oysters more per Lb. than shiitake are?

Thanks for the info btw.




Thanks.  The bags are unicorn bags, but I print and make my own labels.  This reduces my time in the lab emitting contaminants.  Slap a sticker on is quick.  And when I sell grow kits I can just pull any bag from my  spawn shelves and its ready to go.  They are printed on %100 recycled paper and soon I'll be getting biodegrable ink.

Pellets will give you results if proper technique is followed.  With mixed hardwood pellets different batches may give slightly different results, due to the mix of hardwoods constantly varying.  My guy who owns the pellet company said that for the mixed hardwood pellets they consider aspen a hardwood, and it is normally in there.  They will throw w/e into the mixed, so watch out, you might have trouble getting a consistent incubation time and consistent quality of mushrooms,  you MIGHT.  Good luck with your grows.

I don't know if aloha has non spore producing oysters, but its something I would like to know too. 

I sell oysters for a little les than shiitake.  Shiitake, IMO, are very difficult to grow , and they take forever compared to oysters.


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Re: Spacing of Lions Mane Sawdust Blocks [Re: Aleon]
    #15929453 - 03/10/12 03:45 PM (9 years, 4 months ago)

Wow man! Great looking oysters shiitake and lionsmane!  Awsome results. I hope I can get results like that someday! Dayamn!

Great work there Aleon! Yea!


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Re: Spacing of Lions Mane Sawdust Blocks [Re: shroomsynergy]
    #15929910 - 03/10/12 05:51 PM (9 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:


Thanks.  The bags are unicorn bags, but I print and make my own labels.  This reduces my time in the lab emitting contaminants.  Slap a sticker on is quick.  And when I sell grow kits I can just pull any bag from my  spawn shelves and its ready to go.  They are printed on %100 recycled paper and soon I'll be getting biodegrable ink.




Great idea and I love to see other people who are interested in saving the environment, even if it means cutting out the little things. I noticed at my local natural market that they only had a couple bags of oyster , yellow I think, don't know cuz they were so mashed up lol, but they were selling them for $9 a Lb, while the nasty looking shiitake next to them were $8 a Lb!

Maybe I need to rent out some growing space and startup some oysters haha!

Aleon, are the tube lights alone lighting the room or is their additional supplementation?

-Mike


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InvisibleAleon
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Re: Spacing of Lions Mane Sawdust Blocks [Re: mikesethnobotany]
    #15932887 - 03/11/12 01:28 PM (9 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

mikesethnobotany said:
Quote:


Thanks.  The bags are unicorn bags, but I print and make my own labels.  This reduces my time in the lab emitting contaminants.  Slap a sticker on is quick.  And when I sell grow kits I can just pull any bag from my  spawn shelves and its ready to go.  They are printed on %100 recycled paper and soon I'll be getting biodegrable ink.




Great idea and I love to see other people who are interested in saving the environment, even if it means cutting out the little things. I noticed at my local natural market that they only had a couple bags of oyster , yellow I think, don't know cuz they were so mashed up lol, but they were selling them for $9 'a Lb, while the nasty looking shiitake next to them were $8 a Lb!

Maybe I need to rent out some growing space and startup some oysters haha!

Aleon, are the tube lights alone lighting the room or is their additional supplementation?

-Mike




Oyster create a nice niche for local producers.  If they aren't produced withing a few hours drive, the oysters will suck.  Opening up a market niche for small scale/entry growers.  I'm actually making a presentation at a local foods conference in Rockford, ILnext week and the main focus they wanted me to have was teaching peoplee how to get oyster mushroom farms started.  I'd rather have other people grow the oysters and I'll provide them with spawn and grow help.  Then I could specialize in more unique varieties.  People do like regular oysters and they want to by them, that's why I grow them.  If I grow only shiitake some people would still be asking for the regular oysters.  I'm trying to get a kind of growers coop, where each of us grows one variety of mushrooms, so we can dial in parameters, then we all switch off delivering, and back up growers if that have a contam issue, etc.  Just an idea.

For lighting I have 2 lines of led rope light on each shelf which is 32" wide.  This is on 12/12.  I then have 1 4' T5 light/ 5'x10' of floor space.  So I have 3 of these, set on 9on/15off.  This simulates low light conditions during sunset and rise, and saves a few bucks on electricty.


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Edited by Aleon (03/11/12 01:43 PM)


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Re: Spacing of Lions Mane Sawdust Blocks [Re: Aleon]
    #15933043 - 03/11/12 02:26 PM (9 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

For lighting I have 2 lines of led rope light on each shelf which is 32" wide.  This is on 12/12.  I then have 1 4' T5 light/ 5'x10' of floor space.  So I have 3 of these, set on 9on/15off.  This simulates low light conditions during sunset and rise, and saves a few bucks on electricty.




Ah hah thats cool.

Quote:

Oyster create a nice niche for local producers.  If they aren't produced withing a few hours drive, the oysters will suck.  Opening up a market niche for small scale/entry growers.  I'm actually making a presentation at a local foods conference in Rockford, ILnext week and the main focus they wanted me to have was teaching peoplee how to get oyster mushroom farms started.  I'd rather have other people grow the oysters and I'll provide them with spawn and grow help.  Then I could specialize in more unique varieties.  People do like regular oysters and they want to by them, that's why I grow them.  If I grow only shiitake some people would still be asking for the regular oysters.  I'm trying to get a kind of growers coop, where each of us grows one variety of mushrooms, so we can dial in parameters, then we all switch off delivering, and back up growers if that have a contam issue, etc.  Just an idea.




You're awesome lol. I wish I had the time to get into starting a real mushroom farm. Stupid medical career! Seems like spawn is an easier way to make money with mushrooms. You don't ever have to worry about yield, really, and grain + bags are your only costs. Don't need to control humidity.... Whats your profit margin for the spawn might I ask?


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Re: Spacing of Lions Mane Sawdust Blocks [Re: mikesethnobotany]
    #15935486 - 03/11/12 11:59 PM (9 years, 4 months ago)

IMO i wouldnt consider spawn producing an easy way to make $, there are alot of different equipment, skills, and risks than that of mushroom farming.  PLus the orders that would keep a spawn business alive would be regular bulk orders, which are discounted like crazy to make the mushrooms grower have room for profit.  Also instead of making 10 or 20 master jars a week, one would be making hundreds.  That takes alot more time than it sounds.  Not to mention grain prep needs lots of time, space, and equipment. 

I sell a 6.5lb bag of grain for $25, which can do 18-36 sawdust blocks, and a 4lb bag of grain for $20.  If someone buys more quantity the prices are reduced.


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Re: Spacing of Lions Mane Sawdust Blocks [Re: Aleon]
    #15935560 - 03/12/12 12:17 AM (9 years, 4 months ago)

How do you sterilize that much grain so fast?!

I wasn't meaning that spawn production is easy, but maybe has less vectors of production to worry about? Less ingredients to mix, less environmental conditions to control, etc. etc. But yeah, at $25 per 6.5Lb. block there cannot be much profit!!


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Re: Spacing of Lions Mane Sawdust Blocks [Re: mikesethnobotany]
    #15989070 - 03/24/12 10:34 AM (9 years, 4 months ago)

Heres an update of this close spacing "top-fruit, bed" style growing.  I have started doing 2nd and 3rd harvests because of how many more blocks i can fit, and since I switched to oak recently ive been getting up to a 1/2lb per block on the 2nd and 3rd flush from oyster and lions mane.  Oak really does have longevity, the difference is incredible (though it is slower to colonize).  Its also nice to remove the blocks from the FC and have them weigh only a few pounds because so many mushrooms were harvested.  Also, less sterilizing, less plastic and spawn used/lb of mushrooms, and more.  Because my FC is screened and positively pressurized with hepa filter air, i rarely get contams or bugs, even when doing 3 or 4 harvest.  I figured i should take advantage of multiple harvests, because my previouse setup always got bugs and contams after the first harvest, especially gnats. Im going to be trying this close spacing with pioppino mushrooms; i am just getting some harvests in, and experimenting will begin shortly. Enjoy!



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Re: Spacing of Lions Mane Sawdust Blocks [Re: Aleon]
    #15989823 - 03/24/12 02:39 PM (9 years, 4 months ago)

Awsome! Thats good to hear about the oak. thats what I'm using as well.

Thannx for the update Aleon!


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Re: Spacing of Lions Mane Sawdust Blocks [Re: shroomsynergy]
    #16042350 - 04/04/12 12:14 PM (9 years, 3 months ago)

Hey Aleon,

I was wondering, do you dunk/soak your oyster blocks after first flush? if so, for how long?

Keep up the great work!


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Re: Spacing of Lions Mane Sawdust Blocks [Re: shroomsynergy]
    #16042931 - 04/04/12 02:33 PM (9 years, 3 months ago)

Lion's Mane?  I look forward to Aleon's perspective,
but, for my part, my LM blocks have never had sufficient
cohesion to survive a dunk.

Take care,

JD


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Re: Spacing of Lions Mane Sawdust Blocks [Re: Javadog]
    #16043523 - 04/04/12 04:21 PM (9 years, 3 months ago)

I agree, but no, I was asking about his Oyster blocks.:wink:


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Re: Spacing of Lions Mane Sawdust Blocks [Re: shroomsynergy]
    #16044825 - 04/04/12 09:21 PM (9 years, 3 months ago)

Once again, ill say it a million times but people still normally forget it; each person has their own way of doing things (ie there is no "best way" just whats best for you). 

With that said, i have never dunked any blocks to get multiple harvests (except shiitake, which i think is assumed).  There is honestly no reason.  I never did it with straw and i never do it with sawdust.  I normally get my 2nd flush of oysters and lions mane 10-14 days after the 1st one was harvested; and the 3rd flush is similar.  Even without dunks my second flushes are .3-.5lbs/block and 3rd flush is about .5 of that.  It saves so much time to just let them sit in place.  Lions mane blocks definitely do not need a dunk. IMO its just going overboard to dunk.

Pics of: one of the mixed box i delivered to restaurants today, sample box i give to new restaurants, and pioppino block.





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Re: Spacing of Lions Mane Sawdust Blocks [Re: Aleon] * 1
    #16044850 - 04/04/12 09:27 PM (9 years, 3 months ago)

Nice piopinno Aleon, I also plan to cultivate this one soon.
Your local buyers will all be 5 star restaurants if they use those :thumbup:


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Re: Spacing of Lions Mane Sawdust Blocks [Re: mikesethnobotany]
    #16044935 - 04/04/12 09:45 PM (9 years, 3 months ago)

hi Aleon this is john, how do you initiate pinning on the pioppino?  i was unable to get mine to fruit.

john


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Re: Spacing of Lions Mane Sawdust Blocks [Re: john-hai]
    #16044984 - 04/04/12 09:54 PM (9 years, 3 months ago)

What are the CO2 levels on those pioppino?
When I grew them at ambient outdoor CO2 levels I found the stems too short.

I have to say, yours are looking great :thumbup:


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Re: Spacing of Lions Mane Sawdust Blocks [Re: GroboClone]
    #16045059 - 04/04/12 10:11 PM (9 years, 3 months ago)

Hey team,

I was going to post my own pioppino question...

I checked a sack and found pins on a block...where
I was thinking that a casing soil might be necessary.
(this was my question)



As to how to get these to fruit...ignore them </sheepish>

Sorry John, but nothing special at all was done for my blocks.

As to my stems, I am sure that they are squat because
they formed inside a closed bag.

Take care all,

JD


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Re: Spacing of Lions Mane Sawdust Blocks [Re: GroboClone]
    #16045919 - 04/05/12 01:42 AM (9 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

john-hai said:
hi Aleon this is john, how do you initiate pinning on the pioppino?  i was unable to get mine to fruit.

john




Honestly this species is really difficult.  Ive tried quite a few blocks with little success, and im just now starting to get it going.  For the block pictured i let the pins form within the bag (during incubation) until about 2" tall.  Some of the other blocks did not do this though, and pinned once the top of the bag was cut off; those produced shorter stems.  I have alot of different pinning strategies to try, ill update when i find the most consistent one.  The pinning stage for low light/CO2 tolerant mushrooms is crucial to get good flushes.  As long as we dont give up, failures bring us closer to success.

Quote:

GroboClone said:
What are the CO2 levels on those pioppino?
When I grew them at ambient outdoor CO2 levels I found the stems too short.

I have to say, yours are looking great :thumbup:




Like i said they pinned in the bag, so really high CO2 there.  For growth, the CO2 in my FC is flirting with 1000PPM.  Im still growing CO2 intolerant species in there so i cant go any higher... yet. Im building another indoor FC that is 7'x15' so i can have that grow the oysters, lions mane, shitake, etc in there.  Then i can convert my larger FC to 2000PPM CO2, less light (all LED), and cool temps (48-58F) to grow the kings oysters, pioppino, enoki, beech, nameko, etc.


JD, casing is a good method to try!  Im going to go to that as my last option as i know i can figure out how to grow them w/out one, and that saves time and resources. But for smaller/hobby grows, id probably go with a peat-based casing.

Happy mushrooming
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