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OfflineSeussA
Error: divide byzero

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Registered: 04/27/01
Posts: 23,480
Loc: Caribbean
Last seen: 2 months, 3 days
Re: Idea: A new rating system [Re: ]
    #1538206 - 05/10/03 11:17 PM (20 years, 11 months ago)

A few thoughts on this, and maybe a suggestion or two as well...

I think the shroom rating system needs to be weighted, but it must be thought out or the weighting will become meaningless:

A post count can get very large for a user without that user actually adding anything to the community. User A might spend 30 minutes writing a large post with a lot of thought and meaning. During the same time, user B might post 20 one liners that have little or no value.

A word count doesn't really help either... Motaman would have a huge word cound from all of the wonderful news stories he posts, but why should the cut and paste of news stories relate to his rating as seen in other forums? (Keep up the good work Motaman, I _love_ the news forum since you started posting there!)

Each forum could have its own rating. A user would then have different rates in different forums. This could get very complex to change or implement and isn't worth the hassle most likely.

One interesting idea I had was to expire ratings over time. After so many weeks or months the rating dies a silent death.

Probably the easiest to code while remaining effective is a mix:

split the number of posts a user has into five groups, <100, 100-499, 500-999, 1000-4999, >5000 as an example. Each group is given a modifier, 0.1, 0.2, 1, 1.5, 2 for example. When I rate another user, my own current rating (number of shrooms) and my post modifier are multiplied to create a new value. The new value is then used to weight my opinion of another user.

A newbie with 5 shrooms and 1 post rating somebody else will have little effect. A super poster with 10023 posts and 4 shrooms will have a large effect when rating another user.

I also think it would be nice, as a user, to see the individual ratings. I don't care to know who gave it to me, but it would be nice to see the spread... a tool to help better myself.

One last idea is to require a user to fill in feedback to rate another user. This would help cut down on spite ratings or people that give random or constant ratings for whatever reason. The feedback would also help the person being rated know what it was they did, good or bad. Again, no problem with anonymous feedback for non-mod/admin types.



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Just another spore in the wind.

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OfflineMurex
Reality Hacker

Registered: 07/28/02
Posts: 3,599
Loc: Traped in a shell.
Last seen: 16 years, 7 months
Re: Idea: A new rating system [Re: ]
    #1539848 - 05/11/03 08:29 PM (20 years, 11 months ago)

I was thinking that maybe only the last 25 ratings would count on a person- therefore eliminating the 'too many rates, no change' problem.


--------------------
What if everything around you
Isn't quite as it seems?
What if all the world you think you know,
Is an elaborate dream?
And if you look at your reflection,
Is it all you want it to be?


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OfflineI_Fart_Blue
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Registered: 06/25/02
Posts: 3,495
Loc: SItting on the Group W Be...
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Re: Idea: A new rating system [Re: Murex]
    #1540750 - 05/12/03 01:33 AM (20 years, 11 months ago)

Well, I'm gonna throw my two cents into the pile here.

I am glad to see that this issue is being addressed. While I've always liked the rating system, I've thought that the method by which it is administered is rather menial. I even suggested a separate mycological rating a few months ago.

Just a few comments really...First off let me say that I can understand where M_M is coming from concerning a potential system of weights and the length of time which a user has been registered here. However I think we need to look at this issue from a multitude of angles.

Lets face it, being a "newbie" sucks, and it's a trial by fire straight from the beginning. You're pretty likely to post stupid questions, disregard the FAQ's, and fail to use the search button if you have a question. So you catch hell for that. Lord help some of these folks if they wander further into the community where more of the tenured members reside. While it is slowly subsiding, I still occasionally have members talk down to me, with a snobbish air about them, for the fact that they have spent a good portion of their formative years here, and I have not been here for a year. I have oft wondered to myself if there was a set period of time which a member must be registered here for their shit no longer to stink. It sucks, eh? Must the ratings of those who are downtrodden be subjected to further scrutiny for the fact that their registration date falls after another's? Are their opinions not worth that of another user's?

But too, let us approach this from the other side of the coin. There is a large number of new users on a daily basis, the majority of which come here only for cultivation information. Some may pop in for only a few months, and potentially rack up a fair amount of karma, for one reason or another, and then disappear forever. Why should their ability to rate something be equal to that of another user who has been here four years?

I am sure folks can comment further on both sides of the issue here, and I certainly encourage others to do so, so that the administration may fairly consider this decision. Ultimately my opinion is that the length of which a user has been here should affect the weight of their karma, or whatever we choose to call it, but that affect should be very nominal.

Secondly let us examine how the post count could affect the weight system.

Post whoring is obviously the biggest problem one could foresee with crediting users with added weight for a post count. I think most would agree to that. But, let us consider the fact that all posts are not created equal. Is a post in OTD equal to that of a post in Advanced Mushroom Cultivation, or any of the numerous forums within Mushrooms and Mycology grouping, or even say the Support Group Central? Should not those users who seek to help out other users, and especially the newer users, be rewarded for their contributions to the site? There are a number of members who truly have had a large impact on the community through their continuous aid to other members. I think it would be a shame if they were not somehow rewarded. Furthermore I think this might encourage other users who really do not contribute to this site (:cough:me:cough:  :wink: ), to maybe help out other users.

This being said I think that a user's post count should somehow affect their rating. Furthermore, and most importantly I think, I believe that the forums should carry different weights themselves so that a posts in separate forums do not affect a user's weighting the same. For example say Mushroom Cult. =.1 or something, and OTD = .0001.

Like I said, glad to see that this is being developed. I'd like to see some comments further concerning both of these issues though. 


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"A study of the history of opinion is a necessary preliminary to the emancipation of the mind. I do not know which makes a man more conservative-to know nothing but the present, or nothing but the past." -John Maynard Keynes

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InvisibleCaptain Jack
i [heart] you

Registered: 01/23/00
Posts: 4,113
Re: Idea: A new rating system [Re: I_Fart_Blue]
    #1540808 - 05/12/03 01:57 AM (20 years, 11 months ago)

are you guys truly judge people by their ratings?

i don't really pay any more attention to someone with 4 than someone with 2.

maybe it's just me.


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-
Captain Jack has been hailed as a brilliant scholar, discredited as a brilliant fraud, and mistaken for a much taller man on several occasions.

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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?
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Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,247
Loc: Lost In Space
Re: Idea: A new rating system [Re: Captain Jack]
    #1540958 - 05/12/03 03:30 AM (20 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

are you guys truly judge people by their ratings?

i don't really pay any more attention to someone with 4 than someone with 2.

maybe it's just me.



No... it's not just you. I'm sure I'll be dismissed as complaining because I have only 2 shrooms, but the rating system sucks and should be abandoned, as well as the post count.

I'll use myself as an example. I give an automatic one to anyone who even mentions ratings.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers

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Offlineneuro
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Re: Idea: A new rating system [Re: Captain Jack]
    #1542054 - 05/12/03 02:55 PM (20 years, 11 months ago)

>>are you guys truly judge people by their ratings?
i don't really pay any more attention to someone with 4 than someone with 2.



I too do not look at a rating, my first impression on the shroom rating thing was more of a novelty than anything.


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Anonymous

Re: Idea: A new rating system [Re: I_Fart_Blue]
    #1542597 - 05/12/03 05:51 PM (20 years, 11 months ago)

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Invisiblematts
matts

Registered: 01/28/02
Posts: 3,649
[Re: ]
    #1542825 - 05/12/03 07:24 PM (20 years, 10 months ago)


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Anonymous

Re: Idea: A new rating system [Re: matts]
    #1543117 - 05/12/03 09:00 PM (20 years, 10 months ago)

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InvisibleThorA
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Posts: 10,017
Loc: Iceland
Re: Idea: A new rating system [Re: ]
    #1543545 - 05/12/03 10:56 PM (20 years, 10 months ago)

You could simply remove any weight given to posts made in OTD and the Pub.

Higher weight given to people who post in forums such as the Suggestion forum for example.

There are many ways to tweak this system, but simply put it is going to be vastly superior to the current one.

Not to mention it would go very well with the 'user rating system' that traders are starting to use:

User Rating System

I think that this will be a logical next step in the evelution of the community.

A system that rewards contributors, helpfull people, and especially encourage less rudeness, hate, etc...

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Anonymous

Re: Idea: A new rating system [Re: Thor]
    #1544619 - 05/13/03 09:14 AM (20 years, 10 months ago)

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Offlineblaze2
The Witness
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Registered: 12/20/02
Posts: 1,883
Loc: San Antonio, TX
Last seen: 11 years, 8 months
Re: Idea: A new rating system [Re: ]
    #1559340 - 05/19/03 02:41 AM (20 years, 10 months ago)

Ok i like the idea of different ratings for different forums. BUT if you just have a rate from OTD count less, whos to say that said person from OTD doesnt just go into mushroom forums and rate you bad there? What you need several sets of ratings id say 4 one for each bracket of forums. You could have each one be different colors or something, and they should be weighted with karma. Maybe even diffent karma programs for the different rating sets. For example in the mushroom forums most of the weight in rates would come from your own rating. Post count and time spent at forum having less weight. But in the community more weight could be put in to post count/time spent here. Trade could be just like the feedback section of ebay at least that is how i would do it. There would be a rating just like all the forums but you could click on the rates and it would take u to a seperate page of feedback from people hes had dealings with. you cant just rate someone you would have to put in a comment. Enthogenic experiance could be a mix of post count and rating weight. Because of the trip tips and general section the posts count could have some meaning, the garden is more about the content so that would also be weighted. I know that it isnt impossible for this system to be abused but i think that this would make it harder for them to. Even if you have a high rate from OTD that means nothing when you rate someone on their mushroom forum rate. About the only difference they could make would be to down you community rate, and most of the experts would still have respect where it counted.

now i know absolutly nothing about programming or anything like that. so i dont know if this is even feisable. id love some input on this one i kinda mixed and matched what i heard in other posts and added a little. anyways peace

blaze2


--------------------
"Religion without science is blind, Science without religion is lame." Albert Einstein

"peace is not maintained through force it is acheived through intelligence." Albert Einstein

"Those who desire to give up Freedom in order to gain Security, will not have, nor do they deserve, either one."
Thomas Jefferson

"To compel a man to furnish contributions of money for the propagation of opinions which he disbelieves and abhors, is sinful and tyrannical." --Thomas Jefferson

Edited by blaze2 (05/19/03 03:03 AM)

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OfflineMurex
Reality Hacker

Registered: 07/28/02
Posts: 3,599
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Last seen: 16 years, 7 months
Re: Idea: A new rating system [Re: blaze2]
    #1560114 - 05/19/03 01:19 PM (20 years, 10 months ago)


::zerk::zert::pop:::::spark:::sizzle:::...............Does not compute.......Doez not kompute........Does not compu:::<BOOM>:::

........................The flames of Murex's debries slowly die.



--------------------
What if everything around you
Isn't quite as it seems?
What if all the world you think you know,
Is an elaborate dream?
And if you look at your reflection,
Is it all you want it to be?


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Offlineblaze2
The Witness
Male

Registered: 12/20/02
Posts: 1,883
Loc: San Antonio, TX
Last seen: 11 years, 8 months
Re: Idea: A new rating system [Re: Murex]
    #1561702 - 05/19/03 09:40 PM (20 years, 10 months ago)

huh?


--------------------
"Religion without science is blind, Science without religion is lame." Albert Einstein

"peace is not maintained through force it is acheived through intelligence." Albert Einstein

"Those who desire to give up Freedom in order to gain Security, will not have, nor do they deserve, either one."
Thomas Jefferson

"To compel a man to furnish contributions of money for the propagation of opinions which he disbelieves and abhors, is sinful and tyrannical." --Thomas Jefferson

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OfflineMurex
Reality Hacker

Registered: 07/28/02
Posts: 3,599
Loc: Traped in a shell.
Last seen: 16 years, 7 months
Re: Idea: A new rating system [Re: blaze2]
    #1562184 - 05/20/03 01:22 AM (20 years, 10 months ago)

I'm too stupid to comprehend what you said above. It konfuzed me (and I'm not even stoned).


I like your sig thow. Good words.  :wink:


--------------------
What if everything around you
Isn't quite as it seems?
What if all the world you think you know,
Is an elaborate dream?
And if you look at your reflection,
Is it all you want it to be?


Edited by Murex (05/20/03 01:25 AM)

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Offlineblaze2
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Male

Registered: 12/20/02
Posts: 1,883
Loc: San Antonio, TX
Last seen: 11 years, 8 months
Re: Idea: A new rating system [Re: Murex]
    #1562270 - 05/20/03 02:10 AM (20 years, 10 months ago)

thx i like your artwork in your sigs/avatars too good stuff.

well ill try to explain things simpler i guess when i wrote that i was a little stoned and we all know how good things sound when your blazed and how dumb they sound later so here we go..

okay lets say that we went with what they were speaking about in the other posts. where(whatever forum your in) you rate someone would carry more weight(at least thats how i understood it.) so if you didnt like a guy in OTD and you rate him bad then it means nothing. but the problem is smart people would soon find out that all you would have to do to really hurt their rating would be go into one of the cult/hunt forums and rate em bad there.

so what i said is that you need seperate ratings systems for each braket of forums on the main page. and you would need 4(feedback section doesnt need rates everyone has a say) seperate systems. so instead of looking at one set of mushrooms in your avatar there would be 4 one for the mushroom forums, one for the entheo experiance forums, one for trade and one for community.

i went on to say that they could all be weighted differently for example the mushroom forums would be weighted mostly by your own rating post count/time on forums having little to no bering. so if i have a 5 rate and rate someone a 5 it means alot but if someone with a 1 rated someone the same it would mean nothing even if he had alot of posts.

in the eneteogenic experiance forum there would be some weight placed on post count/time spent at forum. more than the mushroom forums but less than the community. since some forums here like the general ? and trip tips have some folks that post alot but the garden is based more on a few good posts there would have to be a balance.

in the trade i proposed something like ebay. when you rate someone you leave your comments. this forum wouldnt be weighted but you could see every indivdual rate by clicking on a link in there avatar or something. this would tell you good people from ripoffs.

community would have more weight placed on post count/time spent in forum but still the ones with good rates will have more clout.

like i said this is a big proposal(at least i think it is) but it would be harder for people to fuck with others rates this way. if you for instance said something to offend someone in a community forum then they couldnt hurt your rating in the cult/hunting forums. and maybe you dont need all these ratings in your avatar in every forum maybe only the relevent rating will be visible in the forums you visit. that way it wouldnt make the pages any longer or anything like that. i hope i cleared some of things up. it should be easier to read since i didnt write it in one long block this time. peace

blaze2


--------------------
"Religion without science is blind, Science without religion is lame." Albert Einstein

"peace is not maintained through force it is acheived through intelligence." Albert Einstein

"Those who desire to give up Freedom in order to gain Security, will not have, nor do they deserve, either one."
Thomas Jefferson

"To compel a man to furnish contributions of money for the propagation of opinions which he disbelieves and abhors, is sinful and tyrannical." --Thomas Jefferson

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Anonymous

Re: Idea: A new rating system [Re: blaze2]
    #1562935 - 05/20/03 12:47 PM (20 years, 10 months ago)

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Offlineblaze2
The Witness
Male

Registered: 12/20/02
Posts: 1,883
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Last seen: 11 years, 8 months
Re: Idea: A new rating system [Re: ]
    #1564641 - 05/20/03 11:26 PM (20 years, 10 months ago)

thx glad to help. peace

blaze2


--------------------
"Religion without science is blind, Science without religion is lame." Albert Einstein

"peace is not maintained through force it is acheived through intelligence." Albert Einstein

"Those who desire to give up Freedom in order to gain Security, will not have, nor do they deserve, either one."
Thomas Jefferson

"To compel a man to furnish contributions of money for the propagation of opinions which he disbelieves and abhors, is sinful and tyrannical." --Thomas Jefferson

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Offlinepseudopod
scattered,smothered,covered...

Registered: 03/02/03
Posts: 244
Last seen: 10 years, 7 months
Re: Idea: A new rating system [Re: blaze2]
    #1564855 - 05/21/03 12:59 AM (20 years, 10 months ago)

Holy shit that is a brilliant post.

I'm around here enough now to form my own opinions about the people who post here, but your solution really gives depth to the amount of information you can get in a ratings system. Five of our soon to be devalued shrooms to you, my brother.

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Offlineblaze2
The Witness
Male

Registered: 12/20/02
Posts: 1,883
Loc: San Antonio, TX
Last seen: 11 years, 8 months
Re: Idea: A new rating system [Re: pseudopod]
    #1564884 - 05/21/03 01:11 AM (20 years, 10 months ago)

lol thx i think that what i proposed would probly be the best idea so far(of course i am biased :smile: )but i dont know how hard it would be to code or any of that i really have no idea about computers other than basic things like clicking and typing and all that.  when it gets down to programming and codes and shit im clueless so i guess we just wait for the admins like matt to stop by and give their opinion.  peace

blaze2


--------------------
"Religion without science is blind, Science without religion is lame." Albert Einstein

"peace is not maintained through force it is acheived through intelligence." Albert Einstein

"Those who desire to give up Freedom in order to gain Security, will not have, nor do they deserve, either one."
Thomas Jefferson

"To compel a man to furnish contributions of money for the propagation of opinions which he disbelieves and abhors, is sinful and tyrannical." --Thomas Jefferson

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