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asdfasdf


Registered: 07/26/10
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WBS moisture content 1
#15200695 - 10/09/11 02:18 PM (13 years, 3 months ago) |
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Anyone use there teeth to check how soft/hydrated their grain is? How should it feel when I bite on a grain?
Also, when you bite open a grain, you can clearly see where it soaked up water and where it hasn't. The middle will be a solid white (dry), and the outer part will be more wet looking/less white. Should a grain with perfect moisture content have none of this dry, hard, whiteness to it? Thanks.
-------------------- "FlexXx said:
To answer some of your questions...If by "ms" you mean "magic shrooms" then yes that's what I'm trying to grow"
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TranscendingLife
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Re: WBS moisture content [Re: asdfasdf] 1
#15200755 - 10/09/11 02:32 PM (13 years, 3 months ago) |
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It should squish easily between your thumb nail & forefinger. 0-5% kernels should be popped.
I soak WBS for 18-24 hours w/ gypsum, after a good rinsing. Then bring to a BOIL in the same pot, gently stirring. Once it hits a BOIL, dump the grains in a strainer. Toss every few minutes for 30-60 minutes (or until the exterior of the grains are dry). Load jars & PC for 90-120 minutes @ 15 PSI.
-------------------- AMU: We Quickly Answer Questions Here
"One must accept the probability of failure to experience the elation of success." - TranscendingLife
“A man of genius makes no mistakes; his errors are volitional and are the portals of discovery.” - James Joyce
      How I Do EVERYTHING     
"Your vision will become clear only when you can look into your own heart…. Who looks outside, dreams; who looks inside, awakes."- Carl Jung
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audiophoenix
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I don't see the need to PC beyond 90 minutes, My old PC went to 10 PSI and I did 90 minutes which never gave me any problems.
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SexySmurff
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i do 60
-------------------- Exalted is He from what they utter. Exalted is He from what they imagine. Exalted is He that exists without a place. Exalted is He that was there forever without a time or a beginning. Exalted is He that will be there forever without a time or an end. Exalted is He that will forever be praised. That is your God.
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audiophoenix
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Re: WBS moisture content [Re: SexySmurff]
#15200849 - 10/09/11 02:47 PM (13 years, 3 months ago) |
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ya that's what is suggested by most for 15 PSI
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TranscendingLife
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I'll never go under 90 minutes. It depends on how many jars you have in your PC. My AA930 fits 14 Quarts jars.
 If I load it completely full, I want to ensure that the center of my jars get hit w/ the heat for at least 30 minutes.
Remember, we're not completely sterilizing the grains, anyways. We're just giving our little mushi friends a better chance at growing on the grains vs. contams.
-------------------- AMU: We Quickly Answer Questions Here
"One must accept the probability of failure to experience the elation of success." - TranscendingLife
“A man of genius makes no mistakes; his errors are volitional and are the portals of discovery.” - James Joyce
      How I Do EVERYTHING     
"Your vision will become clear only when you can look into your own heart…. Who looks outside, dreams; who looks inside, awakes."- Carl Jung
"Anything that can be done chemically can be done by other means."- William S. Burroughs
"You are as dead now as you will ever be" - Seth
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SexySmurff
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i run ten jars at a time, and trust if i had a problem running at 60 i wouldn't.
-------------------- Exalted is He from what they utter. Exalted is He from what they imagine. Exalted is He that exists without a place. Exalted is He that was there forever without a time or a beginning. Exalted is He that will be there forever without a time or an end. Exalted is He that will forever be praised. That is your God.
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audiophoenix
Find Peace



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Well, it shouldn't matter how many jars you have in the PC if you are hitting 15 PSI the jars are reaching the same temp no matter how many you have in there, the steam will find its way into every inch.
Secondly, I was under the impression that you should certainly be sterilizing your grain, that is exactly what the point of PCing is, is it not? Spawn should be sterilized and substrates can be pasteurized, it only takes one spore left over of trich to overcome your entire jar.
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audiophoenix
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By the way, I start the timer once my pressure is reached, it should really only take about 15 minutes after that for the center of the jars to reach the max temp. So that gives about 45 minutes of sterilization.
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TranscendingLife
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It's not 100% sterilization. To fully sterilize grains, it would take 12-24 hours @ 15PSI. That'd make the grains mush.
If it works for you, it works. I like my times & haven't had a problem w/ them.
-------------------- AMU: We Quickly Answer Questions Here
"One must accept the probability of failure to experience the elation of success." - TranscendingLife
“A man of genius makes no mistakes; his errors are volitional and are the portals of discovery.” - James Joyce
      How I Do EVERYTHING     
"Your vision will become clear only when you can look into your own heart…. Who looks outside, dreams; who looks inside, awakes."- Carl Jung
"Anything that can be done chemically can be done by other means."- William S. Burroughs
"You are as dead now as you will ever be" - Seth
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audiophoenix
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I'm curious then, how is it that canning foods can allow them to last virtually forever without becoming contaminated? I have left jars alone that I had left over and never inoculated and for 6 months never harvest any contamination.
Not trying to be argumentative I am actually just curious.
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TranscendingLife
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Registered: 06/09/10
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Food is penetrated easier than grains.
I've done the same w/ a grain jar, too. Never had a problem. I think the moisture content is the reason for not growing contams. The jars will def. be dried out by that time.
-------------------- AMU: We Quickly Answer Questions Here
"One must accept the probability of failure to experience the elation of success." - TranscendingLife
“A man of genius makes no mistakes; his errors are volitional and are the portals of discovery.” - James Joyce
      How I Do EVERYTHING     
"Your vision will become clear only when you can look into your own heart…. Who looks outside, dreams; who looks inside, awakes."- Carl Jung
"Anything that can be done chemically can be done by other means."- William S. Burroughs
"You are as dead now as you will ever be" - Seth
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audiophoenix
Find Peace



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Interesting, well 60 minutes @ 15 PSI seems to work just dandy for me but to each his own.
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TranscendingLife
I Don't Need a Life to Live



Registered: 06/09/10
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Found the post I was thinking of when saying the grains are not 100% sterile.
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/5190571#5190571
-------------------- AMU: We Quickly Answer Questions Here
"One must accept the probability of failure to experience the elation of success." - TranscendingLife
“A man of genius makes no mistakes; his errors are volitional and are the portals of discovery.” - James Joyce
      How I Do EVERYTHING     
"Your vision will become clear only when you can look into your own heart…. Who looks outside, dreams; who looks inside, awakes."- Carl Jung
"Anything that can be done chemically can be done by other means."- William S. Burroughs
"You are as dead now as you will ever be" - Seth
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audiophoenix
Find Peace



Registered: 08/28/09
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Crazy, just when I think I have a grasp on this shit, dayumm
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TranscendingLife
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RR also uses a 55 gal drum changed into a pressure cooker. It only holds 1.5 PSI, but he says he runs it for 8 hours & that's good enough for supplemented bags or grains.
It's in his picture gallery. It is a bad ass looking beast.
-------------------- AMU: We Quickly Answer Questions Here
"One must accept the probability of failure to experience the elation of success." - TranscendingLife
“A man of genius makes no mistakes; his errors are volitional and are the portals of discovery.” - James Joyce
      How I Do EVERYTHING     
"Your vision will become clear only when you can look into your own heart…. Who looks outside, dreams; who looks inside, awakes."- Carl Jung
"Anything that can be done chemically can be done by other means."- William S. Burroughs
"You are as dead now as you will ever be" - Seth
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Viruk
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Registered: 03/12/06
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Ewwwwww with your fucking teeth? Are you... bacillus man... lots of it. Anyway to end your death wish. Take what you want to use, dump it into a bucket of water. I have the bucket already filled, stir it a bit once it's all in, and scoop off the top whatever didn't sink. Next stir, then rinse, stir, rinse, stir, rinse, and once it's kinda clearer, you will never get WBS water totally clear, just let it soak in room temp water for 6-12 hours, stir it up every so often, change it if it starts to stink. Then throw it in a strainer, shake it out, let it sit 5 mins, shake it out again. Spread it out thin, or let it sit in the strainer and stir it around every so often for an hour so it can mostly dry. Wet WBS sticks in large clumps, and is all sort of gloopy, you'll know it when you see it. Now after an hour it should be fairly dry, but in no means anywhere close to dry. Just throw it in your jars, and PC at 15psi for 90 mins to ensure the death of all Bacillus endospores. When you're done shake them up, if they don't break into bits after a good hard shake, and no matter what theres a solid clump in the jar you can't break apart, rinse more next time, and let it dry a little longer. (but that probably wont happen)
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audiophoenix
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Quote:
TranscendingLife said:
RR also uses a 55 gal drum changed into a pressure cooker. It only holds 1.5 PSI, but he says he runs it for 8 hours & that's good enough for supplemented bags or grains.
It's in his picture gallery. It is a bad ass looking beast.
holy shit that sounds like a good idear
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TranscendingLife
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Viruk - I've used the same method before. WBS is just as easy as rye, you just don't need to boil it as long. W/ your method it took my WBS 2-6 hours to dry properly. Now, it takes me 45 minutes. (I have lots of strainers).
Gypsum is, IMHO, a necessary additive to all grains. They colonize quicker & stronger. (Yes, I've done it both ways).
Also, you NEVER rinse after the soak. You'll rinse off the gypsum &/or coffee that was in your soak.
As for "floaters," there's no reason to remove them, unless they're the little pieces of wood that you find in most bulk grains. I've seen grows on strait Sunflower Seeds. Leave the floaters.
-------------------- AMU: We Quickly Answer Questions Here
"One must accept the probability of failure to experience the elation of success." - TranscendingLife
“A man of genius makes no mistakes; his errors are volitional and are the portals of discovery.” - James Joyce
      How I Do EVERYTHING     
"Your vision will become clear only when you can look into your own heart…. Who looks outside, dreams; who looks inside, awakes."- Carl Jung
"Anything that can be done chemically can be done by other means."- William S. Burroughs
"You are as dead now as you will ever be" - Seth
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Viruk
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Quote:
TranscendingLife said: Viruk - I've used the same method before. WBS is just as easy as rye, you just don't need to boil it as long. W/ your method it took my WBS 2-6 hours to dry properly. Now, it takes me 45 minutes. (I have lots of strainers).
Gypsum is, IMHO, a necessary additive to all grains. They colonize quicker & stronger. (Yes, I've done it both ways).
Also, you NEVER rinse after the soak. You'll rinse off the gypsum &/or coffee that was in your soak.
As for "floaters," there's no reason to remove them, unless they're the little pieces of wood that you find in most bulk grains. I've seen grows on strait Sunflower Seeds. Leave the floaters.

I don't add anything. I've tried simmering, too finicky. I usually just start the soak before bed, and throw it in the strainer in the morning, mix it around, and 1 hour later it's perfect. I don't do that hand test or paper towel test. In my experience it can be far wetter than the tests call for with the short soak method. Also I rinse after the soak to get off the majority of the bacteria that grew in the water, I think it helps prevent bacterial infection.
Since the sticks float in with the floating seeds, I remove them all. If they are rotting at all on the inside, then they are just space wasters anyway, plus it costs nothing.
Oh a trick I use to dry WBS faster. Lay it out in a tray, and rake it around with a piece of paper towel folded up. You will absorb a lot of the water that takes ages to dry off the WBS in relatively no time, and not much will stick to the towel.
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TranscendingLife
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Re: WBS moisture content [Re: Viruk]
#15205115 - 10/10/11 12:10 PM (13 years, 3 months ago) |
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We don't simmer, we Boil the grains. It helps kill the endospores that have germinated during the soak, also.
to each their own.
-------------------- AMU: We Quickly Answer Questions Here
"One must accept the probability of failure to experience the elation of success." - TranscendingLife
“A man of genius makes no mistakes; his errors are volitional and are the portals of discovery.” - James Joyce
      How I Do EVERYTHING     
"Your vision will become clear only when you can look into your own heart…. Who looks outside, dreams; who looks inside, awakes."- Carl Jung
"Anything that can be done chemically can be done by other means."- William S. Burroughs
"You are as dead now as you will ever be" - Seth
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asdfasdf


Registered: 07/26/10
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Last seen: 12 years, 4 months
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Quote:
TranscendingLife said: We don't simmer, we Boil the grains. It helps kill the endospores that have germinated during the soak, also.
to each their own.
Why do you keep saying this? "We don't simmer, we boil grains."
No, that's what you do. I like to simmer.
Boiling ain't gonna do anything that the PC won't.
-------------------- "FlexXx said:
To answer some of your questions...If by "ms" you mean "magic shrooms" then yes that's what I'm trying to grow"
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TranscendingLife
I Don't Need a Life to Live



Registered: 06/09/10
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Re: WBS moisture content [Re: asdfasdf]
#15205396 - 10/10/11 01:21 PM (13 years, 3 months ago) |
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I say "we" as the collective or royal "we." Simmering is pointless. PCing does NOT kill all the bacteria in the grains. We're just giving the mushis a better chance @ colonizing the grains.
Boiling, also, helps add a little moisture @ the end of the soak.
-------------------- AMU: We Quickly Answer Questions Here
"One must accept the probability of failure to experience the elation of success." - TranscendingLife
“A man of genius makes no mistakes; his errors are volitional and are the portals of discovery.” - James Joyce
      How I Do EVERYTHING     
"Your vision will become clear only when you can look into your own heart…. Who looks outside, dreams; who looks inside, awakes."- Carl Jung
"Anything that can be done chemically can be done by other means."- William S. Burroughs
"You are as dead now as you will ever be" - Seth
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asdfasdf


Registered: 07/26/10
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Last seen: 12 years, 4 months
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Quote:
TranscendingLife said: I say "we" as the collective or royal "we." Simmering is pointless. PCing does NOT kill all the bacteria in the grains. We're just giving the mushis a better chance @ colonizing the grains.
Boiling, also, helps add a little moisture @ the end of the soak.
No I understand what you mean by "we".
But saying it that way makes it sound like that's the only way to do it, and that it's the only way it's done, which is untrue.
I know PCing doesn't completely sterilize, but I cant imagine that adding an extra few minutes of 212 degrees is going to do much of anything when were already heating the jars to 250 degrees for 90 minutes, you know? Is that little extra bit really gonna help? I mean, plenty of people don't simmer or boil, just soak and PC. Are they doing it wrong? Is Agar doing it wrong?
In your tek you say you take it off the heat AS SOON as it hits boiling temps, so if just PCing kills 95% of bacteria, what does your tek do? Kill 95.0001 percent? It's unnecessary.
Simmering will add moisture just as well as boiling, it just takes longer, which is exactly why I prefer it. Every time I've boiled, I get too many burst grains. It happens too fast.
-------------------- "FlexXx said:
To answer some of your questions...If by "ms" you mean "magic shrooms" then yes that's what I'm trying to grow"
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TranscendingLife
I Don't Need a Life to Live



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Re: WBS moisture content [Re: asdfasdf]
#15205583 - 10/10/11 02:09 PM (13 years, 3 months ago) |
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It's not the ONLY way to do it, but it's the most beneficial way of doing it. Hell, it takes 30-40 minutes for me to bring a pot of WBS to a boil (14 quart jars worth). I couldn't imagine how long it take for you to simmer that much WBS.
Yes, I dump as soon as it hits boiling. I've found for WBS that if you don't dump immediately, you'll have more than 5% burst kernels.
To each their own.
I specify the difference between Boil & Simmer, because a lot of people misunderstand or interpret that simmer does not = boil. I say Boil to make sure that people understand I mean BOIL not simmer.
-------------------- AMU: We Quickly Answer Questions Here
"One must accept the probability of failure to experience the elation of success." - TranscendingLife
“A man of genius makes no mistakes; his errors are volitional and are the portals of discovery.” - James Joyce
      How I Do EVERYTHING     
"Your vision will become clear only when you can look into your own heart…. Who looks outside, dreams; who looks inside, awakes."- Carl Jung
"Anything that can be done chemically can be done by other means."- William S. Burroughs
"You are as dead now as you will ever be" - Seth
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Viruk
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Ya 14quarts of WBS I would definitely not simmer, or boil. I might pressure cook it an extra 10 minutes, but boiling that much is a ridiculous waste of time. The reason to simmer, or boil, is to cause the grain to expand from the heat, sucking water in during the process. You can also turn it to mush during this process. And a simmer, is a slow boil, so if simmer is pointless, so is boiling. Also endospores will not die in boiling water, they barely die in the pressure cooker, you may however be promoting the growth of endospores as they're more readily formed when the bacteria is put into a harsh environment.
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Javadog
Continuing along



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Re: WBS moisture content [Re: Viruk]
#15206242 - 10/10/11 04:33 PM (13 years, 3 months ago) |
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TL may be referring to the AMU "we", as he can and they know their stuff.
...or he might have meant him and me, as I do pretty much the same.
I suppose that the simmer/boil can be defended even if all it does is support the "steam dry" tek that follows.
I do the 24 hour soak + heat-to-boil-then-simmer + strain and fan dry + PC for 90 mins
Good luck,
JD
-------------------- Boyd Rice told my brother that life is a corny pack of freesakes
Myco-tek.org
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