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InvisibleIcelander
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The conscious universe, stupidity and evil.
    #15145668 - 09/28/11 07:49 AM (9 years, 7 months ago)

Someone in another forum  made a comment on how stupid and ignorant humans could be and that got me thinking about something I've been meaning to create a thread on for discussion.  Here's my response from that thread and maybe you'd like to add your two cents on this subject.

We are bound by the constraints of our genetics and physicality and particular animal nature.  You can't think like the lion no matter how hard you try.  What's interesting to reflect on is that we are a product of nature and the universe and creation at large. If we are "stupid" and do stupid things that is a reflection of creation at large.  We cannot operate independently outside that system.  This is why I believe humans created the myth of a conscious universe that is deliberately dumbing down as a game of remembering itself.  We have to find a way to account for our stupidity and evil without condemning creation itself.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Offlinecrkhd
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Re: The conscious universe, stupidity and evil. [Re: Icelander]
    #15145711 - 09/28/11 08:09 AM (9 years, 7 months ago)

All our myths simply reflect our own shortcomings.

Truly I don't come on here or talk to anybody anywhere except to talk to myself and neither do you. The reflections tell you where your shadows are, where you are going wrong.

You can lead a horse to water, etc.


--------------------


"Everything there is, and all that there is, is a Pattern of unspeakable proportion. The Pattern contains everything that is, completely fixed in succession, all the minimal particles interconnected in every way that is. Every way that is is not every conceivable way, because not everything that can be conceived is manifest in the pattern."

"THE Human, you, is a miniscule but essential part of that pattern. In it lies complete fulfillment. It will never become something it is not, but it will never need to be anything else." - Wiccan_Seeker

"If boring drudgery was the way of the universe, everything would have killed itself long ago." - Spacerific


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: The conscious universe, stupidity and evil. [Re: crkhd]
    #15145740 - 09/28/11 08:27 AM (9 years, 7 months ago)

I'm going to  send a PM to myself right now. :lol:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Offlinezzripz
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Re: The conscious universe, stupidity and evil. [Re: Icelander] * 1
    #15146462 - 09/28/11 12:23 PM (9 years, 7 months ago)

i left a reply top that OP in original thread, so I wont here--I likes to be original

YES I DO think every magical 'particle' and inbetween of the uni~verse is alive.

be careful of the stories you tell yourself. they could be a prison for you :smile:


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OfflineTony
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Re: The conscious universe, stupidity and evil. [Re: zzripz]
    #15146611 - 09/28/11 01:08 PM (9 years, 7 months ago)

I heard this recently: "all knowledge is a form of ignorance"


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: The conscious universe, stupidity and evil. [Re: zzripz]
    #15146623 - 09/28/11 01:11 PM (9 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

zzripz said:
i left a reply top that OP in original thread, so I wont here--I likes to be original

YES I DO think every magical 'particle' and inbetween of the uni~verse is alive.

be careful of the stories you tell yourself. they could be a prison for you :smile:





They are just as much a prison for you sir.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Offlinezzripz
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Re: The conscious universe, stupidity and evil. [Re: Icelander]
    #15146641 - 09/28/11 01:17 PM (9 years, 7 months ago)

how so? If my story i am in a box is a prison, how come a story i am NOT confined to the box a prison also?


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Invisiblec0sm0nautt
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Re: The conscious universe, stupidity and evil. [Re: zzripz]
    #15146652 - 09/28/11 01:20 PM (9 years, 7 months ago)

Just stop with the stories. You are only truly free when you step outside the rigidity of concepts and language. This freedom, IMO, can be found in a feeling in the ever present moment. The story will take you out of it.


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: The conscious universe, stupidity and evil. [Re: zzripz]
    #15146684 - 09/28/11 01:31 PM (9 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

zzripz said:
how so? If my story i am in a box is a prison, how come a story i am NOT confined to the box a prison also?





If it's not true you will miss the advantages of knowing you are in a prison and doing what you can to make it more comfortable.

All the things you tell yourself are just stories. No one knows the truth imo.  So anything you tell yourself will not be the complete story and be limiting.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Offlinezzripz
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Re: The conscious universe, stupidity and evil. [Re: Icelander]
    #15146724 - 09/28/11 01:40 PM (9 years, 7 months ago)

they can only BE limiting because reality is infinitely mysterious--of course, hence the stories we DO choose to tell ourselves and others need to comehow reflect this depth of reality. That is my view.
Take Native American and other indigenous stories/myths about humans relationships with animals. They have stories that say we learnt from animals, so there is, for example, the story of Raven, Coyote, and so on. To me that is affording the other species we live with deep loving respect, and helps us form a symbiotic imaginal matrix with them, and other life forms.
Compare with the Cartesian story/myth that animals are machines and cannot feel pain like humans--well 'rational humans' (because that evil story would lump people who were 'close to the animals' in same category)!! Later Wilhelm Wundt says the same about humans--that we are like machines! THAT is where we are at now if scientism is telling the story!


Once we dismiss stories which are imaginative and yet relate us to the natural world and other species is when things become more and more toxic.


Edited by zzripz (09/28/11 01:44 PM)


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: The conscious universe, stupidity and evil. [Re: zzripz] * 1
    #15147163 - 09/28/11 03:47 PM (9 years, 7 months ago)

Take Native American and other indigenous stories/myths

Good example.  The medicine man told them the ghost dance would make the white man go away and the ghost shirt would  stop his bullets.  Guess what happened. That magical story caused their demise.

I'm not against you telling yourself anything you want.  I do it myself  but for some the stories that turn you off will make them happy and fulfilled. Why? Cause they're only stories we tell ourselves.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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InvisibleRaven Gnosis
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Re: The conscious universe, stupidity and evil. [Re: c0sm0nautt]
    #15147285 - 09/28/11 04:10 PM (9 years, 7 months ago)

I prefer to use questions as my answers to the 'great mystery."
Stories and facts often wither in the face in the question mark.

Quote:

c0sm0nautt said:
Just stop with the stories. You are only truly free when you step outside the rigidity of concepts and language. This freedom, IMO, can be found in a feeling in the ever present moment. The story will take you out of it.


:thumbup:


--------------------
To be human is to be fettered, to endure what one is, in perpetuum, no matter what the debility or perversity.


Edited by Raven Gnosis (09/28/11 04:14 PM)


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Offlinezzripz
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Re: The conscious universe, stupidity and evil. [Re: Icelander]
    #15147437 - 09/28/11 04:39 PM (9 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
Take Native American and other indigenous stories/myths

Good example.  The medicine man told them the ghost dance would make the white man go away and the ghost shirt would  stop his bullets.  Guess what happened. That magical story caused their demise.

I'm not against you telling yourself anything you want.  I do it myself  but for some the stories that turn you off will make them happy and fulfilled. Why? Cause they're only stories we tell ourselves.





If I was mean I would give you a good SLAP tyo wake you up--sorry to get personal but.....hmmmm

Now, what should the Native Americans have done, do you think?? Been ready with  hydrogen bomb right? I mean THAT is real superior right? I mean look at us will ya, yeahhh take a GOOD LOOK

Yeah, me and Bill's asking you to take a guuuurrrd look. You seen anythin yet??
No.....? Oh shit, (looks at watch with no hands)--how fukin long i got?


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Offlinecrkhd
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Re: The conscious universe, stupidity and evil. [Re: Icelander]
    #15147522 - 09/28/11 04:55 PM (9 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
I'm going to  send a PM to myself right now. :lol:




Speaking of that... What the hell stops us from having full on conversations with ourselves? There's a few one-man forums and facebooks on the interwebs where a few otherwise ordinary people literally do the work of an entire forum, all talking to themselves. Creepy, but why? If I sent myself a PM, I wouldn't be inclined to respond to it. There's no inclination to disagree. But if someone PMed me the exact same thing suddenly there's a need to respond. And even disagree.


--------------------


"Everything there is, and all that there is, is a Pattern of unspeakable proportion. The Pattern contains everything that is, completely fixed in succession, all the minimal particles interconnected in every way that is. Every way that is is not every conceivable way, because not everything that can be conceived is manifest in the pattern."

"THE Human, you, is a miniscule but essential part of that pattern. In it lies complete fulfillment. It will never become something it is not, but it will never need to be anything else." - Wiccan_Seeker

"If boring drudgery was the way of the universe, everything would have killed itself long ago." - Spacerific


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: The conscious universe, stupidity and evil. [Re: zzripz]
    #15147692 - 09/28/11 05:21 PM (9 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

zzripz said:
Quote:

Icelander said:
Take Native American and other indigenous stories/myths

Good example.  The medicine man told them the ghost dance would make the white man go away and the ghost shirt would  stop his bullets.  Guess what happened. That magical story caused their demise.

I'm not against you telling yourself anything you want.  I do it myself  but for some the stories that turn you off will make them happy and fulfilled. Why? Cause they're only stories we tell ourselves.





If I was mean I would give you a good SLAP tyo wake you up--sorry to get personal but.....hmmmm

Now, what should the Native Americans have done, do you think?? Been ready with  hydrogen bomb right? I mean THAT is real superior right? I mean look at us will ya, yeahhh take a GOOD LOOK

Yeah, me and Bill's asking you to take a guuuurrrd look. You seen anythin yet??
No.....? Oh shit, (looks at watch with no hands)--how fukin long i got?




Don't freak out dood. I have no idea what you're on about.  The American Indian weren't genetically predisposed to building nuclear bombs but had they had one they would have blown us the fuck away.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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InvisibleCups
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Re: The conscious universe, stupidity and evil. [Re: zzripz]
    #15147818 - 09/28/11 05:43 PM (9 years, 7 months ago)

I'll be damned if I let some british punk judge how us god fearin 'mericans chose to deal with the Native question.

:minigun:

God help me, I will swim right cross that pond and smack the tea right out of your Monarch loving hand.

:rofl2:


--------------------
What's up everybody?!


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: The conscious universe, stupidity and evil. [Re: Cups]
    #15147923 - 09/28/11 06:04 PM (9 years, 7 months ago)

The Brits can't help it. :shrug: It's genetics.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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OfflinejivJaN
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Re: The conscious universe, stupidity and evil. [Re: Icelander]
    #15147995 - 09/28/11 06:20 PM (9 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
Someone in another forum  made a comment on how stupid and ignorant humans could be and that got me thinking about something I've been meaning to create a thread on for discussion.  Here's my response from that thread and maybe you'd like to add your two cents on this subject.

We are bound by the constraints of our genetics and physicality and particular animal nature.  You can't think like the lion no matter how hard you try.  What's interesting to reflect on is that we are a product of nature and the universe and creation at large. If we are "stupid" and do stupid things that is a reflection of creation at large.  We cannot operate independently outside that system.  This is why I believe humans created the myth of a conscious universe that is deliberately dumbing down as a game of remembering itself.  We have to find a way to account for our stupidity and evil without condemning creation itself.




do not understand.
Do you understand why i don't ?


--------------------



---------------------

All my posts in this forum are strictly fictional.
They are derived from an acute mental illness , from which i am forced to lie compulsively.
I have never induced any kind of mind altering substance in my life  and i have no intentions whatsoever of doing anything illegal.
If I have ever suggested such a thing it would have most likely been , due to my personality disorder and i probably do not remember it at all..


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Offlinezzripz
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Re: The conscious universe, stupidity and evil. [Re: jivJaN]
    #15151079 - 09/29/11 04:47 AM (9 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:


Don't freak out dood. I have no idea what you're on about.




I wasn't.

I know...?


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: The conscious universe, stupidity and evil. [Re: zzripz]
    #15151238 - 09/29/11 06:54 AM (9 years, 7 months ago)

Then explain so I may.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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