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OfflineCosmicjoker
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Registered: 12/16/10
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My heartfelt spiritual response, to a scientist who bashes me!
    #15033513 - 09/05/11 03:57 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Artic Xiongmao wrote:
I'm afraid you completely misunderstand the Gaia hypothesis.

The Gaia Hypothesis says that living organisms usually adapt their environment (so not only to their enviromnent) for their own survival. That is, they modify the world to allow themselves to keep existing. An example is plants, that assure their own existence by heating the planet. It's natural selection interacting with ecology, nothing more, nothing less. And that explanation comes directly from an actual biologist sitting next to me right now.

Your metaphysical beliefs have nothing to do with the gaia hypothesis. The concept does not postulate a conscious living Earth, but a world which organisms are able to adapt. It is OK for you to believe that, but DO NOT pretend it is science by misrepresenting actual science.

If you want to know if you have the necessary intellectual honesty, let's see what happens now. If this was part of the 'evidence' that led you to believe what you believe, you would just cease believing now you know that is NOT the scientific viewpoint, or you would at least cease believing that much (if you have other 'evidence'.) But you proably won't change your mind, because you already believe in this stuff, and find evidence afterwards. That's what pseudoscience such as creationism DO.

TO WHICH I RESPOND with the following

My friend, I didn't take any offense to what you said, It gave me a good laugh and inspired me, a person you might call a crazy pseudo scientist who supports RBE because he somehow thinks it fits into his irrational metaphysical new age ideas, to write away and communicate more in depth! However I call myself... a mystical scientist... This will make more sense after you read everything I wrote below...

I call it

A mystical scientist Gaia Hypothesis journey


By Reverand Eric (Note I am a member of the universal life church, in which you can believe in anything, including atheism and be a member... and the church feels everyone is a reverand thus anyone over 18 can register as one, so don't take offense to my title, it is not something I take seriously or in a way that holds me ABOVE anyone...)

Let just look at one piece of evidence, there is soooo much evidence, but to illustrate my point I will focus on one point of evidence.

Look at the temp of the planet over long periods, it started out hot, cooled rapidly, until it reached the crucial rate that certain life evolved, then it remained relatively steady enough to support this life... the living organisms of the time had an energy exchange by how they interacted with the environment and had a big part to play in keeping the temp of the earth steady...

Now I am sure to you things liked natural selection and coincidence come to mind... but that is because, no offense, you are locked in a materialistic mind set that is keeping your seperate from the oneness of your being, that shows everything is you, and everything is aware in some way or another, and a "divine" intelligence is inherant in the universe... the interconnected and interdepedance in a sense is the creator, it is the sea of intelligence and awareness that all arises from... Instead of connecting with your true nature and inner being, you see thing strictly from a materialistic framework, almost insulted by the idea that the earth could be alive and conscious let alone the universe... thus if someone even suggests a creator might exist in some way guiding evolution, you think it silly to even be open to this crazy idea.

Now I do not fault you for this prison you are trapped in, I to once thought exactly like you... and when I approached science and evidence, I couldn't see beyond the materialistic framework...

However, when I was 17, I had such a profound mystical experience on LSD (what you might deem as serious brain damage), that I took serious for the first time, my own inner subjective experience, because it was so profound, all that materialistic interpretation no matter how well argued and logically convincing, PALED in comparison to this experience... I felt one with it all, and literally saw that not only the earth was alive and conscious but everything is... At first I had a dare I say the word on these forums "faith" in my own personal mystical experience, and figured science would some day prove it and for a little period in my life become disinterested in science... Yet as the years progressed through meditation, I was able to live in the oneness of being, everything is alive experience... and the light from within let me to seriously explore science again... Looking at quantum mechanics, I didn't find complicated experiments that showed the randomness and materialness of the universe... I saw it pointing to and proving the ONE BEING...

But leaving quantum mechanics aside... and just focusing on the regulation of the earth's temp... to you it probably seems like flimsy evidence to support my metaphysical beliefs... to me it seems obvious the earth is reacting just like our body does to change temp, shivering when cold, sweating when hot... If this were the sole piece of evidence, it would easily be enough for me to conclude the earth is conscious and intelligent, let alone the universe. But blessedly there is TONS of evidence like the regulation of the earth's temp that supports my ideas, and I am bold enough to say proves the earth's intelligence and consciousness...

Of course from the materialist framework, this is bullocks, this is psuedo science, this is metaphysical nonsense... I am not putting down this point of view at all... I have total respect for it, it has a part to play in the universe, and this type of thinking, no matter how deluded in grasping the ultimate truth, has lead to INCREDIBLE DEVELOPMENTS IN TECHNOLOGY! It is powerful and people that hold firm in it, a very useful productive and sometimes moral people. So I bow to it's lotus feet. and even materialist won't deny there is some sort of interconnection and interdependance of matter on earth, symbiotic and emergent as Joseph puts it in the Zeitgeist Addendum, thus we can come together from our different perspectives of oneness and both support a movement that promotes a resource based economy.

However, I have come to see science as an important piece, an ESSENTIAL piece to the great puzzle of life, in fact without it, the mystery will not be even a little bit solved in a totally down to earth sense... Yet from my point of view, mysticism and spirituality and metaphysical ideas and so on are another important piece, dare I say an ESSENTIAL piece... from my view, mysticism and all it techniques of altering normal consciousness are different kind of science... They are a INTROSPECTIVE PSYCHOLOGICAL SCIENCE, and in fact, this idea was in vogue for a short period of time in the 1800s psychology, but the materialist prison mindset took over and basically called introspective science, psuedo science and a waster of time for getting at the truth. Yet even though its not popular, mysticism is not a belief system it a science... For the most part unlike religion, it never asks anyone to accept point blank on blind faith a belief, It sets up a hypothesis like "Everything is Allah" is sufism another way of saying all is one being... then these scientists do experiments on thier own consciousness, like reading sacred texts in a meditative manner, or sufi dancing or sufi poetry... Then they report back the results on the experiments and make a theory after many many repeated experiments and conclude "Everything is Allah" Although its SUBJECTIVE and not OBJECTIVE like doing experiments with electrons or studying the earth's temp... The subjective, going within, discovering the nature of consciousness by experiencing many different states of consciousness is JUST AS important as the objective... and the sciences dealing with both are two important and essential pieces of the puzzles. Ironically the ONLY conclusion that makes sense is that all is one BEING, because that is the only thing that allows all the pieces of the puzzle to fit together... It makes sense of introspective science or mysticism and it makes sense of the objective sciences... plus when factored in on the HUNDREDS of repeated experiments in say parapsychology or meditation, that show clear evidence that proves the materialist perspective as INVALID for explaining the results of these experiments (example, the well documented and repeated random number generator experiments with psychic intention)... It comes more and more obvious the spiritual reality is true, and that of course the earth is a conscious intelligent living being, like the native americans knew, the mother earth.

Yet even these two sciences, and what makes them fit together, I do not exclude other pieces of the puzzle, I feel religion is another piece of the puzzle, cultural common sense another... another piece is anecdotal evidence, people simply telling thier stories of how they percieve reality... then anther piece would be tribal wisdom with a oral passing down of understanding the earth... and of course, all this is understood as I said before, from my experience of oneness of being... I can't help it man, I don't believe in oneness of being, I don't see it as a metaphysical musing or some kind of belief system... I daily EXPERIENCE this as reality, it is real to me, as if you take a apple and drop it, it will fall to the earth... it has become my being, an observable fact like an orange is orange, my essence, I can't doubt it, I can't somehow argue it away... From your perspective I am brain damaged and live in an altered state of consciousness that has no meaning or purpose, and should be seen as bullocks. In fact, some might see fit to locking me up in a reeducation center until I accept mainstream scientific concensus... who knows?


So you see how I put together the mystery puzzle and understand it... do you get me? Thus when I see something like the temp of the earth and how it remains steady relatively to support a type of life... you see how I could easily conclude from that it is conscious intelligent organism... after all like you put it, I already have my mind made up or like I put it, oneness is my being and everyday reality...


But understand in conclusion, that I honor what you said and seek to learn from it... As Baba Ram Dass says, "When you know how to listen, EVERYBODY is the guru, it is right here, always" So I bow to you my materialist guru, for making me better explain and communicate my perception of reality. And I hope you don't take offense to saying you are in a mind prison, lol, who knows maybe you are being ONE more then me and just pretend you are not... I am NOT JUST a mystic planting seeds in the brains of people in the zeitgeist movement about spiritual ideas hoping they grow into mystical realization... I am also a rational logical scientist that supports a resource based economy and using the scientific method for social concern... I support the oreintation guide, but at the same time, I feel my role in the movement, is NOT JUST to support RBE, but also remain true to the EVOLUTION that MUST happen for RBE to not become another utopian dream that in the name of eliminating poverty and providing abundance ends up creating destruction and serious serious problems on the planet worse then it is now, and it is pretty bad now... This evolution that MUST happen at least to a small degree, is a visible collective conscious humanity, that works as one, lives as one, be's as one, so on... of course not a uptopian humanity that does nothing wrong is not what I am talking about... This evolution could even happen to such a small degree that we move in the right direction and have a long transition toward RBE... so this is my role and I will continue to have discussions like this on the ZM forums... I have many openly support me and my threads, I have many private message from spiritual ZMers that are afraid to challange militant materialist atheists that cling aggressively to the mainstream scientific consensus, that urge me to continue to brave through the insults and petty name calling that occurs against me sometimes... My point is, I will NOT be silenced on these forums by a vocal MINORITY that wants me banned for being an oreintation guide materialist athiest nazi that PUSHED his/her ideas on everyone. Note I am not trying to say you are IN ANY WAY trying to silence me or insult me... but I have encountered some pretty tough customers on these forums throughout the years, some who have left or been kicked off, and outlasted them all! I hope I did not insult them in anyway, I am not trying to name call.

Anyway, I hope you see that we are on the same side, we are in the same movement, and we both are trying to work toward RBE albiet in seeminly different ways...


LOVE LIGHT AND ONENESS TO ALL THAT READ THIS AND TO ALL BEINGS EVERYWHERE


PS: Since I coverd a lot of my spiritual journey in this thread, here are some videos I made if you are interested in furthering understanding my journey




TL, DR, lol, lazy bastards, just don't respond at all if you are gonna just type TL DR


--------------------
http://www.youtube.com/user/Cosmicjokester1

Check out my channel and if you want to explore further into my point of view, my website is linked on some of my videos depending on which one you watch... The channel is called "THE COSMIC JOKE (ONENESS)


Edited by Cosmicjoker (09/05/11 04:24 PM)


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Offlinecbub
it
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Registered: 10/17/10
Posts: 1,412
Last seen: 6 years, 12 days
Re: My heartfelt spiritual response, to a scientist who bashes me! [Re: Cosmicjoker]
    #15036207 - 09/06/11 02:15 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

He won't be able to understand until he experiences it.
It's funny he knows all of it, but doesn't realize. It's made like that, likely for a very good reason.
People are very afraid of letting go, afraid to go mad, loosing control over self, but that's where the answers are.


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OfflinejivJaN
yes
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Registered: 08/09/08
Posts: 4,245
Last seen: 10 years, 10 months
Re: My heartfelt spiritual response, to a scientist who bashes me! [Re: Cosmicjoker]
    #15036330 - 09/06/11 03:35 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Where were you talking to this person ?


--------------------



---------------------

All my posts in this forum are strictly fictional.
They are derived from an acute mental illness , from which i am forced to lie compulsively.
I have never induced any kind of mind altering substance in my life  and i have no intentions whatsoever of doing anything illegal.
If I have ever suggested such a thing it would have most likely been , due to my personality disorder and i probably do not remember it at all..


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InvisibleIcelander
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Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: My heartfelt spiritual response, to a scientist who bashes me! [Re: Cosmicjoker]
    #15036348 - 09/06/11 03:49 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

This guy certainly doesn't write or communicate like any scientist I've ever known.:wink:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Offlinezzripz
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Registered: 12/23/08
Posts: 8,292
Loc: Manchester, UK
Last seen: 4 years, 7 months
Re: My heartfelt spiritual response, to a scientist who bashes me! [Re: Icelander]
    #15036668 - 09/06/11 06:48 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

This is why beings come. to tease rigid mindsets out of their..rigid-ness


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InvisibleAIRDOG
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Registered: 10/16/99
Posts: 3,493
Loc: world's shroom capital
Re: My heartfelt spiritual response, to a scientist who bashes me! [Re: cbub]
    #15036990 - 09/06/11 08:39 AM (12 years, 5 months ago)

I get it and i feel the same way, have experienced de inteligent nature of the universe.

I believe we can make magic in everyday life if we have faith and connection with your inner god.


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OfflineCosmicjoker
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Registered: 12/16/10
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Re: My heartfelt spiritual response, to a scientist who bashes me! [Re: AIRDOG]
    #15039157 - 09/06/11 05:37 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

cbub said:
He won't be able to understand until he experiences it.
It's funny he knows all of it, but doesn't realize. It's made like that, likely for a very good reason.
People are very afraid of letting go, afraid to go mad, loosing control over self, but that's where the answers are.




I agree, you really have to go mad, to find true sanity!

Quote:

jivJaN said:
Where were you talking to this person ?




The Zeitgeist movement forums... www.thezeitgeistmovement.com

Quote:

zzripz said:
This is why beings come. to tease rigid mindsets out of their..rigid-ness




Nice way to capture my intent. I also look at it, as I am planting idea seeds in people's minds... sometimes they even get enough sunlight to grow.


Quote:

AIRDOG said:
I get it and i feel the same way, have experienced de inteligent nature of the universe.

I believe we can make magic in everyday life if we have faith and connection with your inner god.




Agreed... and my debate with this man was an attempt to make magic





THANKS TO ALL FOR READING


--------------------
http://www.youtube.com/user/Cosmicjokester1

Check out my channel and if you want to explore further into my point of view, my website is linked on some of my videos depending on which one you watch... The channel is called "THE COSMIC JOKE (ONENESS)


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Offlinecbub
it
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Re: My heartfelt spiritual response, to a scientist who bashes me! [Re: Cosmicjoker]
    #15042995 - 09/07/11 02:02 PM (12 years, 5 months ago)

might as well link him this one


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