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InvisibleKOPELANDIAA
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psilocybe argentipes...
    #1499975 - 04/28/03 05:37 AM (14 years, 3 months ago)

i want to start my quest for this japanese specie...if you have some info on the type of growing location, season and nutrition of this specie please tell me thanks !!! :tongue:


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InvisibleKOPELANDIAA
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Re: psilocybe argentipes... [Re: KOPELANDIAA]
    #1500078 - 04/28/03 08:44 AM (14 years, 3 months ago)

Mjshroomer...where are youu ?


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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Re: psilocybe argentipes... [Re: KOPELANDIAA]
    #1500617 - 04/28/03 02:27 PM (14 years, 3 months ago)

Cannot ind my photo imaes. Sorry. OI do have some images of Psilocybe venenata in Japan somewhere. Give me a day or so to find them. very busy

mj


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InvisibleKOPELANDIAA
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Re: psilocybe argentipes... [Re: mjshroomer]
    #1502604 - 04/29/03 12:00 AM (14 years, 2 months ago)

wow ! thanks ! I couldn't find any pics of venenata...
The most rewarded informations are, in fact : when to look for those shrooms and where...
the rain season is coming in one month, so i want to be ready...
If i find something, i'll try to get some pictures, prints and isolations as well...
Thanks Mj !!!


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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Re: psilocybe argentipes... [Re: KOPELANDIAA]
    #1503393 - 04/29/03 05:51 AM (14 years, 2 months ago)

HEre are a few photos of P. venenata from Japan.









And here we have Psilocybe venenata and some Gymnopilus liquiriitae

Hope this helps.

Still cannot find the P. argentipes photos.

need to reorganize my species foolders

mj


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InvisibleKOPELANDIAA
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Re: psilocybe argentipes... [Re: mjshroomer]
    #1504601 - 04/29/03 03:35 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

yes ! very helpfull !!!! thanks a lot mjshroomer !!!
Venenata seems to be more difficult to ID compared to Argentipes...but i'll do my best...i bought today a guide in Japanese with a description of Argentipes habitat, etc...as soon as i'll translate, i'll post ! Promise ! thanks again for your efforts !


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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Re: psilocybe argentipes... [Re: KOPELANDIAA]
    #1504728 - 04/29/03 04:20 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

HEre is the habitat for argentipes--

The mushroom was first reported as P. subcaerulipes Hongo. Later named a new species as P. argentipes.

Afterwards, this species was found in Kyoto, Osaka, Shiga Saitama, Niigata and MIyagi In Japanj.

a CASE OF ACCIDENTAL POISONIING OCCURRED IN NIIGATA WHEN THREE INDIVIDUALS MISTOOK IT FOR THE EDIBLE ARMILLARIA MELLEA (NARATAKE)

HAte that capital button.

mj


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InvisibleKOPELANDIAA
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Re: psilocybe argentipes... [Re: mjshroomer]
    #1504814 - 04/29/03 04:43 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

thanks ! but it seems more widespread than just the locations you gave. i found some pics, doing a search on yahoo japan:



Aren't they cute ?  :laugh:



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InvisibleKOPELANDIAA
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Re: psilocybe argentipes... [Re: KOPELANDIAA]
    #1504843 - 04/29/03 04:51 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

...and some psilocybe Fasciata !



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Offlineblaze2
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Re: psilocybe argentipes... [Re: KOPELANDIAA]
    #1505273 - 04/29/03 06:46 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

nice pics! good luck with your hunt. peace

blaze2


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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Re: psilocybe argentipes... [Re: blaze2]
    #1505438 - 04/29/03 07:37 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

The P. fasciata are Really P. venenata.

Mjshroomer


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Offlineferret
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Re: psilocybe argentipes... [Re: mjshroomer]
    #1506577 - 04/30/03 02:56 AM (14 years, 2 months ago)

nice shrooms- those purple gills are spectacular!


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InvisibleKOPELANDIAA
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Re: psilocybe argentipes... [Re: ferret]
    #1506917 - 04/30/03 08:15 AM (14 years, 2 months ago)

...???!!!! What ?! Venenata are Fasciata ???!!! The same specie ?!!! But they looks differents to me !!! Can you explain ?


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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Re: psilocybe argentipes... [Re: KOPELANDIAA]
    #1506998 - 04/30/03 09:52 AM (14 years, 2 months ago)

It was first described by S. Imai in the 1930s as Stropharia caerulescens and then by Hoingo in the 1950s as Psilocybe fasciata. later emended by both S. Imae and Hongo as P. fasciata. I do not at the time have the time to sdig out the Guzman papers or the ima papers on this.

But it is the same. Maybe the pictures are misidentified. That happens on a regular basis onthe internet.

Someone recently posted some wrong inmage so fo PSilocybe silvatica, which weren't.

mj


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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Re: psilocybe argentipes... [Re: KOPELANDIAA]
    #1507183 - 04/30/03 11:52 AM (14 years, 2 months ago)

HEre is Guzm?n's paper on the species of P. venenata. Imae made wrong ID inthe 1930s.

Read and see. It is confusing, especially when they say is similar to. like P. semilanceata. many papers say such things and they are mainly regarding microscopis. But as far as asame goes, they are allin the same genera.













The other plates only showed some microscopics so I did not include them

Good luck.

mj


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InvisibleKOPELANDIAA
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Re: psilocybe argentipes... [Re: mjshroomer]
    #1508325 - 04/30/03 06:03 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

wow...
thanks for those precious informations !!! I keep it in my collection, now, thanks.
Can'T wait the rain season...
As for my translation, i didn' t finished yet, but i can provide some informations:
Psilocybe Argentipes in japanese : higake shibire take, means litteraly " shadow numbness mushroom" (!!!) It occur from the summer to the autumn, begining in June with the rain season. It grows on rotten leaves, in the grass, manured fields, in the parcs and streets (!!!), mainly in the shadow...
As it occurs in the summer, wich is very hot and wet, i was wondering if it would be possible to grow this specie in terrarium...time will tell  :smirk:


Edited by KOPELANDIAA (04/30/03 06:04 PM)


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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Re: psilocybe argentipes... [Re: KOPELANDIAA]
    #1508974 - 04/30/03 09:50 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

Actaually shibirtake refers to panaeolus papilionaceus and is from two articles published in 1911 and 1933. WHoeever wrote what youare translating copeied that form someone elses paper.

I already listed that in my Ancient Shamanic mushroom names. It was in use before P. argentipes was ever recorded int he literatuere.

John


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InvisibleKOPELANDIAA
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Re: psilocybe argentipes... [Re: mjshroomer]
    #1509044 - 04/30/03 10:19 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

HIGAKE shibire take...that's different ! There is other shrooms with shibire in the name, but i'm 150% sure of the japanese name...i checked in 6 differents books and on internet...and i asked to a friend ! hehe...


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Invisiblemjshroomer
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Re: psilocybe argentipes... [Re: KOPELANDIAA]
    #1509338 - 04/30/03 11:40 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

Shibretake means benumbing mushroom.

Remember when one journal writes something and twenty others repeat it you have urban legend.

below frm my book on Ancient Shamanic mushroom names of mesoamerica and other regions of the world, with later references to the ones I listed. The wasson and Emboden took them from earlier papers .


Japan:
maitake (dancing mushroom).
waraitake (laughing mushroom).
o-waraitake (big laughing mushroom).
odoritake (jumping mushroom).
shibiretake (numbing mushroom).
waraitake modoki (?) (Sanford, 1972; Wasson, 1959; Emboden, 1979).

China:
hsiao chun (laughter mushroom).
hsiao:ho (laughter) (Emboden, 1979; Wasson, 1959).

The maitake reference is from the 11th Century Japan and comes from the book "Tales of Long Ago." I have the actual translation of the Japanese title of the book.

The chinese reference is from the 2nd century A.D. from an Indexa medica book of herbal remieedies.

Anyway. Other Japanese authors repeat the names form before. Some change them


For exampler, Gary Lincoff in the Audubon Field Guide to Mushrooms called P. stuntzii Stuntzii's Blue Legs. Blue LEgs was an epithet given to P. caerulipes by Alexzand H. Smith, A mycologist form the University of Michigan.

I asked Lincoff who gave him the name Stuntzis Blue Legs and he told me he made it up for lack of anything better.

Andrew Weil in his book Marriage of the Sun and the Moon, called the bluue ringers, Washington Blue Veils in his book. Again, he just used it after hearing one person refer to them as such.

Hopwever in the PNW, 99% of everyone who encountered the blue ringers called them blue Ringers.

So I can see Japanese mycologists using names which were being used in the past and not referencing them after using them.

mj


Edited by mjshroomer (04/30/03 11:46 PM)


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InvisibleKOPELANDIAA
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Re: psilocybe argentipes... [Re: mjshroomer]
    #1509623 - 05/01/03 12:51 AM (14 years, 2 months ago)

...isn't it strange that P. Papillonaceus has the "numbing" adjective too but (correct me if i am wrong) doesn't have Psilocibin nor Psilocin ...?


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