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OfflineMadtowntripper
Sun-Beams out of Cucumbers
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Registered: 03/06/03
Posts: 21,289
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Re: American Propaganda [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1500730 - 04/28/03 01:17 PM (21 years, 3 months ago)

"I'm boycotting them because they went out of their way in stabbing us in the back by signing onto 1441 then backing off and threatening a veto when just months earlier they made a promise. "

Where in the resolution does it say that if Iraq doesnt comply, we must invade them? I'll post a link to the text of the resolution here...Serious consequences are mentioned...Is it so far out of line for different cultures to have different interpretations of the same thing?

On a side note, I think I'm about done with this thread...<pants> I do enjoy it though...Debating is fun stuff...We'll see if anything gets posted that riles me up enough to post again....


--------------------
After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action.  If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it.  - Ernest Hemingway

If it is life that you feel you are missing I can tell you where to find it.  In the law courts, in business, in government.  There is nothing occurring in the streets. Nothing but a dumbshow composed of the helpless and the impotent.    -Cormac MacCarthy

He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God.  - Aeschylus

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OfflineMadtowntripper
Sun-Beams out of Cucumbers
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Registered: 03/06/03
Posts: 21,289
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Re: American Propaganda [Re: Madtowntripper]
    #1500731 - 04/28/03 01:18 PM (21 years, 3 months ago)



--------------------
After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action.  If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it.  - Ernest Hemingway

If it is life that you feel you are missing I can tell you where to find it.  In the law courts, in business, in government.  There is nothing occurring in the streets. Nothing but a dumbshow composed of the helpless and the impotent.    -Cormac MacCarthy

He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God.  - Aeschylus

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InvisibleInnvertigo
Vote Libertarian!!
Male

Registered: 02/08/01
Posts: 16,296
Loc: Crackerville, Michigan U...
Re: American Propaganda [Re: Madtowntripper]
    #1500740 - 04/28/03 01:22 PM (21 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Where in the resolution does it say that if Iraq doesnt comply, we must invade them?




I've had this debate before and it says that if Iraq doesn't comply with 1441 the there will be serious consequences. Those serious consequences were understood. What were we supposed to do, threaten them with a noogie?

Quote:

Is it so far out of line for different cultures to have different interpretations of the same thing?




yes it is...it's also no surprise since Germany, France and russia had been supplying them with weapons and technology in DIREST violation of the sanctions that THEY argeed with. Where i come from that is a breach of contract.

Quote:

On a side note, I think I'm about done with this thread... I do enjoy it though...Debating is fun stuff...We'll see if anything gets posted that riles me up enough to post again....




you're fun to debate with, come back more often.


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson

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OfflineAzmodeus
Seeker

Registered: 11/27/02
Posts: 3,392
Loc: Lotus Land!! B.C.
Last seen: 19 years, 6 months
Re: American Propaganda [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1500755 - 04/28/03 01:28 PM (21 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Quote:

  Where in the resolution does it say that if Iraq doesnt comply, we must invade them?




I've had this debate before and it says that if Iraq doesn't comply with 1441 the there will be serious consequences.  Those serious consequences were understood.  What were we supposed to do, threaten them with a noogie 




Actually this was a bit more serious....a purple nurple should have sufficed! :grin:


--------------------
"Know your Body - Know your Mind - Know your Substance - Know your Source.

Lest we forget. "

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InvisibleInnvertigo
Vote Libertarian!!
Male

Registered: 02/08/01
Posts: 16,296
Loc: Crackerville, Michigan U...
Re: American Propaganda [Re: Azmodeus]
    #1500764 - 04/28/03 01:31 PM (21 years, 3 months ago)

that or a wedgie :grin:


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson

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OfflineCeeEssGee
Canadian-American

Registered: 09/29/02
Posts: 1,894
Loc: Toronto, Ontario
Last seen: 17 years, 5 months
Re: American Propaganda [Re: atomikfunksoldier]
    #1500765 - 04/28/03 01:31 PM (21 years, 3 months ago)

Okay, I don't "fall" for anything. There is, however, a problem with many of the people who argue that all american media (or at least, CNN, especially) is propaganda. The reason is, people like radioactive slug say "ooh, this is propaganda, lookie here because my internet site567 says so, hyuk!" Hey, I believe robots are going to take over the world, proof here.

So, you don't think american troops are heroes? So what, some people do, and not because of the media, because they understand the sacrifice. It's an opinion-related matter, and has very little to do with facts.

Anything that doesn't agree with your opinions will be dismissed as propaganda, and anything that does, well, that's automatically a credible source, right? Right.



--------------------
Why, sirrah, why may a caudled fillhorse be deemed the brother to a hiren candle in the night? Withal, because a candle may be greased, yet a fillhorse be without a fat argier!

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OfflineAzmodeus
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Posts: 3,392
Loc: Lotus Land!! B.C.
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Re: American Propaganda [Re: CeeEssGee]
    #1500778 - 04/28/03 01:35 PM (21 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

There is, however, a problem with many of the people who argue that all american media (or at least, CNN, especially) is propaganda.




Dare you suggest CNN is not propoganda?! I agree some of the opposite sites are just as bad though!


--------------------
"Know your Body - Know your Mind - Know your Substance - Know your Source.

Lest we forget. "

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InvisibleCracka_X
Spiritual Dirt Worshipper
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Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 01/25/03
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Re: American Propaganda [Re: atomikfunksoldier]
    #1500793 - 04/28/03 01:39 PM (21 years, 3 months ago)

I read some Abstinence propaganda today "6% of the time condoms will break"

Is that not fucking rediculous


--------------------
The best way to live
is to be like water
For water benefits all things
and goes against none of them
It provides for all people
and even cleanses those places
a man is loath to go
In this way it is just like Tao        ~Daodejing

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OfflineI_Fart_Blue
Stranger

Registered: 06/25/02
Posts: 3,495
Loc: SItting on the Group W Be...
Last seen: 20 years, 6 months
Re: American Propaganda [Re: Cracka_X]
    #1500800 - 04/28/03 01:41 PM (21 years, 3 months ago)

Why is that rediculous? Do you have any proof otherwise, or is this another case of you dismissing something because it doesn't fall into your personal realm of experience?


--------------------
"A study of the history of opinion is a necessary preliminary to the emancipation of the mind. I do not know which makes a man more conservative-to know nothing but the present, or nothing but the past." -John Maynard Keynes

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OfflineMadtowntripper
Sun-Beams out of Cucumbers
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Registered: 03/06/03
Posts: 21,289
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Re: American Propaganda [Re: Cracka_X]
    #1500809 - 04/28/03 01:44 PM (21 years, 3 months ago)

"There is, however, a problem with many of the people who argue that all american media (or at least, CNN, especially) is propaganda. "

Damnit, I have no willpower...Fucking Drugs. This is a completely ridiculous statement...Its obvious that the media is biased to anyone. Not that its only the American media...Al-Jazeera is just as biased. But watch CNN for an hour, then FoxNews for an hour, and tell me the two arent radically different. They are, which means one must be putting a slant on the news, ya? In my opinion, FoxNews is a very conservative, pro-Bush network, while CNBC/CNN balances things out...I'm not complaining....


--------------------
After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action.  If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it.  - Ernest Hemingway

If it is life that you feel you are missing I can tell you where to find it.  In the law courts, in business, in government.  There is nothing occurring in the streets. Nothing but a dumbshow composed of the helpless and the impotent.    -Cormac MacCarthy

He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God.  - Aeschylus

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InvisibleInnvertigo
Vote Libertarian!!
Male

Registered: 02/08/01
Posts: 16,296
Loc: Crackerville, Michigan U...
Re: American Propaganda [Re: Cracka_X]
    #1500812 - 04/28/03 01:45 PM (21 years, 3 months ago)

6% sounds credible to me, even though it sounds made up... :smirk:


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson

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OfflineCeeEssGee
Canadian-American

Registered: 09/29/02
Posts: 1,894
Loc: Toronto, Ontario
Last seen: 17 years, 5 months
Re: American Propaganda [Re: Azmodeus]
    #1500840 - 04/28/03 01:52 PM (21 years, 3 months ago)

"Dare you suggest CNN is not propoganda?! I agree some of the opposite sites are just as bad though!"

Yes, I did dare to suggest it, is there a problem with this? Feel free to rebut, though I suggest you slow down to type, this time.


--------------------
Why, sirrah, why may a caudled fillhorse be deemed the brother to a hiren candle in the night? Withal, because a candle may be greased, yet a fillhorse be without a fat argier!

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InvisibleinfidelGOD
illusion

Registered: 04/18/02
Posts: 3,040
Loc: there
Re: American Propaganda [Re: CeeEssGee]
    #1500982 - 04/28/03 02:38 PM (21 years, 3 months ago)

forget boycotting. we should try to oust France from the security council. seriously. They have way more power than they deserve. I mean look at this list of the five permanent members... United States, China, Russia, Great Britain and.... FRANCE!?!?!?! WTF? they have no business being in there.

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Offlinehongomon
old hand
Registered: 04/14/02
Posts: 910
Loc: comin' at ya
Last seen: 20 years, 3 months
Re: American Propaganda [Re: jimsuzo]
    #1501023 - 04/28/03 02:52 PM (21 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

I hate to draw fire from folks that I'm usually aligned with, but I kinda think that the French should have towed the American line - no matter how fucked up it was and still is. The bottom line is that the French owe the USA big-time. If it weren't for us, those bastards - and all of Europe for that matter - would be speaking German right now. It's just not nice to shit on people that have saved your ass. I hope for their sake they never need it saved again.





IMO, Europe, and the rest of the world, has long since repaid any debt to the U.S. for whatever role we played in the outcome of a war over 50 years ago. This would not necessarily be the case if the U.S. had not behaved in such a way as it has in those fifty years. Again, I encourage you all to read the post url=http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.phpCat=&Board=Forum14&Number=1485957&page=2&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=&fpart=1]wolves and sheep[/url]
and consider the ideologies Goff et all suggest that have driven first the neoliberals and their multilateral attitude of living high and now the neocons and their unilateral attitude of living high. The whole thing has been a sham.

Sorry, I don't know why it won't convert the URL into a link. I'm going to go ahead and bump "Wolves and Sheep"

hongomon

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Offlinehongomon
old hand
Registered: 04/14/02
Posts: 910
Loc: comin' at ya
Last seen: 20 years, 3 months
Re: American Propaganda [Re: Cracka_X]
    #1501057 - 04/28/03 03:04 PM (21 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

I read some Abstinence propaganda today "6% of the time condoms will break"

Is that not fucking rediculous




That's because 6% of the users don't make sure to prevent a pocket of air forming in the tip. Yer s'posedta pinch the end as you put 'er on.

This fact has been fabricated.

hongomon

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InvisibleXlea321
Stranger
Registered: 02/25/01
Posts: 9,134
Re: American Propaganda [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1501191 - 04/28/03 03:48 PM (21 years, 3 months ago)

I think it was somewhere around 39 plus 15 others.

And how many do you think really agreed with the US or had simply been warned "Fuck with us and we'll screw with your economy?"


--------------------
Don't worry, B. Caapi

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InvisibleXlea321
Stranger
Registered: 02/25/01
Posts: 9,134
Re: American Propaganda [Re: Azmodeus]
    #1501212 - 04/28/03 03:54 PM (21 years, 3 months ago)

if Iraq doesn't comply with 1441 the there will be serious consequences. Those serious consequences were understood.

Yes, they were understood not to mean military force. Which, btw, is the only reason 1441 got passed in the first place. If it had meant military force France and Germany would have vetoed it then.

Everyone knew it didn't authorise military action which is why the US and UK were so desperate to get a second resolution authorising military force. They failed.


--------------------
Don't worry, B. Caapi

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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,247
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Re: American Propaganda [Re: Xlea321]
    #1501221 - 04/28/03 03:56 PM (21 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Yes, they were understood not to mean military force.



I must have missed that when I read the resolution. Perhaps you'd be so kind as to show us where it says that?


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers

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InvisibleinfidelGOD
illusion

Registered: 04/18/02
Posts: 3,040
Loc: there
Re: American Propaganda [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1501252 - 04/28/03 04:01 PM (21 years, 3 months ago)

it's called strategic ambiguity. everyone "understood" that.

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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?
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Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,247
Loc: Lost In Space
Re: American Propaganda [Re: infidelGOD]
    #1501284 - 04/28/03 04:09 PM (21 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

it's called strategic ambiguity. everyone "understood" that.




Apparently not everyone.

No-one should ever sign an ambiguous document.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers

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