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OfflineCosmicjoker
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Ram Dass (spiritual teacher) merges with Amti Goswami (PhD physicist)
    #14848234 - 07/30/11 11:27 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)



First watch the above video I created, on a talk in which spiritual teacher Ram Dass comes together with Amit Goswami, a PhD physicist, on two important points... I will address how these points relate to ZM's quest for RBE

ZM = zeitgeist movement... www.thezeitgeistmovement.com

RBE = Resource Based Economy, for more information into what RBE is... click [url=
youtube.com/watch?v=4mkRFCtl2MI&feature=player_embedded[/url]

Point 1: Oneness of both consciousness and material, interdependance, interconnections

Science seems to ultimately be points towards this Oneness addressed by both Ram Dass and Amit, whether through quantum mechanics or such simple understanding of how the ecological system shows an emergent symbiotic organism that is the Earth, interconnected with a larger astronomical cycle and connections of the Universe... Even an athiest that doesn't believe in a God or awarness at the center of it, a creator or designer of great intelligence, we can agree on the concept of interdependance and interconncection of all time and space, a oneness with emergent and evolutionary characteristics, thus we must agree that leaving spiritual experience aside for moment, we need a system which addressed the needs of an entire planet and allows an abundance for all, based on the resources avaliable and the application of advanced technology, there is no need to a putting down of either spiritual oneness people or athiest oneness people, however there is a need for us to understand each other's wisdom and move forward toward not only RBE, but humanity working together despite cultural differences, thus the emerging of a universal cultural idea that addresses all groups within RBE, the oneness... and then we can live in peace arguing the nature of the oneness, and debating about consciousness, God and spirituality.


Point 2: are we ready for gurus?

There are some that claim beings on this planet throughout the years have attained a cosmic awareness and experience the oneness to such a degree that they identify with it... if this is so, why do these gurus not step forward together to promote an RBE... my answer, is that the oneness is allowing them to be elusive to the general populace due to the readiness of varied individuals... we are simply not ready for them, bot looking around the time is near, when we should prepare ourselves for their wisdom by embracing both spiritual ideals of oneness and practical scientific solutions of RBE, by placing these at thier feet, they can help us in the development of a transitional system that works towards RBE


I stayed away from a sensational title to avoid namecalling, childish insults and flames by those that feel spirituality should go away and will go away when we advance to RBE. I hope that all in ZM both spiritual, athiest and in between who read this post can comment and give feedback on my video with candor and intelligence so we can have a fruitful discussion... feel free to bring up any points in the video not addressed.

For those not in ZM, of all different types of background, I hope both videos, inspire much feedback and discussion on these points... I also welcome personal feedback on the first video in terms of ascetics and enjoyment, for I learn from these comments, how to create better videos to share on this forums and others.

NOTE: if you watched the first video WHILE ON shrooms or any other psychedelic, please note this, and tell me how it was.


--------------------
http://www.youtube.com/user/Cosmicjokester1

Check out my channel and if you want to explore further into my point of view, my website is linked on some of my videos depending on which one you watch... The channel is called "THE COSMIC JOKE (ONENESS)

Edited by Cosmicjoker (07/30/11 11:32 AM)

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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Ram Dass (spiritual teacher) merges with Amti Goswami (PhD physicist) [Re: Cosmicjoker] * 1
    #14848289 - 07/30/11 11:45 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

we are simply not ready for them

That's true, almost no one is open to my teachings due to their inability to see and accept difficult  truth.  When this body ascends I may not return for 1000 years or never. Don't waste this chance.:heart:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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OfflineCosmicjoker
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Re: Ram Dass (spiritual teacher) merges with Amti Goswami (PhD physicist) [Re: Icelander]
    #14849150 - 07/30/11 03:06 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
we are simply not ready for them

That's true, almost no one is open to my teachings due to their inability to see and accept difficult  truth.  When this body ascends I may not return for 1000 years or never. Don't waste this chance.:heart:




I am open to your teachings, can you share? or are you being sarcastic?


--------------------
http://www.youtube.com/user/Cosmicjokester1

Check out my channel and if you want to explore further into my point of view, my website is linked on some of my videos depending on which one you watch... The channel is called "THE COSMIC JOKE (ONENESS)

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OfflineCosmicjoker
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Re: Ram Dass (spiritual teacher) merges with Amti Goswami (PhD physicist) [Re: Cosmicjoker]
    #14850561 - 07/31/11 07:04 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

No other reactions to my video or points... come on, I know people are viewing this thread. please respond!


--------------------
http://www.youtube.com/user/Cosmicjokester1

Check out my channel and if you want to explore further into my point of view, my website is linked on some of my videos depending on which one you watch... The channel is called "THE COSMIC JOKE (ONENESS)

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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Ram Dass (spiritual teacher) merges with Amti Goswami (PhD physicist) [Re: Cosmicjoker]
    #14850828 - 07/31/11 09:24 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Cosmicjoker said:
Quote:

Icelander said:
we are simply not ready for them

That's true, almost no one is open to my teachings due to their inability to see and accept difficult  truth.  When this body ascends I may not return for 1000 years or never. Don't waste this chance.:heart:




I am open to your teachings, can you share? or are you being sarcastic?





My teachings are all based on death anxiety and the fear of impermanence of the self.  The fact that all our meanings are subjective and that nothing about the ultimate meaning of life or  god(s) etc., will ever be known to us. That basically we are biological animals and no more or less important than any bug and have no knowledge beyond that, that we are sure of. 

This is all what no one wants to hear as it pushes the biggest fear button we have.  The fact that we are temporary and relatively unimportant, we will age decay and die and be no more as far as we know. 

If you are seriously open like you say then I will suggest you read Earnest Beckers book Denial of Death  Then, if you have a pov on the matter I'd love to hear it.:satansmoking:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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InvisibleOlympus Mons
esprit de l'univers

Registered: 09/15/09
Posts: 5,777
Loc: ∞
Re: Ram Dass (spiritual teacher) merges with Amti Goswami (PhD physicist) [Re: Icelander]
    #14850845 - 07/31/11 09:29 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
Quote:

Cosmicjoker said:
Quote:

Icelander said:
we are simply not ready for them

That's true, almost no one is open to my teachings due to their inability to see and accept difficult  truth.  When this body ascends I may not return for 1000 years or never. Don't waste this chance.:heart:




I am open to your teachings, can you share? or are you being sarcastic?





My teachings are all based on death anxiety and the fear of impermanence of the self.  The fact that all our meanings are subjective and that nothing about the ultimate meaning of life or  god(s) etc., will ever be known to us. That basically we are biological animals and no more or less important than any bug and have no knowledge beyond that, that we are sure of. 

This is all what no one wants to hear as it pushes the biggest fear button we have.  The fact that we are temporary and relatively unimportant, we will age decay and die and be no more as far as we know. 

If you are seriously open like you say then I will suggest you read Earnest Beckers book Denial of Death  Then, if you have a pov on the matter I'd love to hear it.:satansmoking:



those are not your teachings guy.


--------------------
I close my eyes and seize it
I clench my fists and beat it
I light my torch and burn it
I am the beast I worship....

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InvisibleIcelander
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Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
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Re: Ram Dass (spiritual teacher) merges with Amti Goswami (PhD physicist) [Re: Olympus Mons]
    #14850888 - 07/31/11 09:45 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Yes they are. As much as anyones teachings are. I learned about it from others, all the events in my life, my own experience and observations of others.  Now they are mine as I live them.

What, you think Becker would have written that book without the influence of Jung, Rank, Freud etc?


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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OfflineCosmicjoker
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Registered: 12/16/10
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Re: Ram Dass (spiritual teacher) merges with Amti Goswami (PhD physicist) [Re: Icelander]
    #14851078 - 07/31/11 10:42 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
Quote:

Cosmicjoker said:
Quote:

Icelander said:
we are simply not ready for them

That's true, almost no one is open to my teachings due to their inability to see and accept difficult  truth.  When this body ascends I may not return for 1000 years or never. Don't waste this chance.:heart:




I am open to your teachings, can you share? or are you being sarcastic?





My teachings are all based on death anxiety and the fear of impermanence of the self.  The fact that all our meanings are subjective and that nothing about the ultimate meaning of life or  god(s) etc., will ever be known to us. That basically we are biological animals and no more or less important than any bug and have no knowledge beyond that, that we are sure of. 

This is all what no one wants to hear as it pushes the biggest fear button we have.  The fact that we are temporary and relatively unimportant, we will age decay and die and be no more as far as we know. 

If you are seriously open like you say then I will suggest you read Earnest Beckers book Denial of Death  Then, if you have a pov on the matter I'd love to hear it.:satansmoking:





I disagree as you probably guessed, I simply percieve the universe and understand it differently then you, I experience a oneness of my being with the universe, while also at the same time being a human part of everything, interconnected and independant, yet a sense of subjectivity and seperation to a degree... I acknowledge the duality is an illussion yet even though I percieve oneness, I am caught in the duality matrix as I call it. It is simply a process of awakening... I have faith in this experience so strong that I dedicate my life to it, and no longer question or doubt it at this point in my path, my faith is rooted in using science (mainstream and fringe), ancient mystical teachings, and so on.... but I admit, my understanding of science is limited and I have a radical interpretation of it... I decided to give up my role and go the journey towards oneness, no holding back... at this point in my realization journey, I don't look down on views like yours, I respect them and see there in place the universe... but I can't help by find them funny and ultimately taking us away from who we are, and putting us deep into the suffering of seperation if your views were embraced. So I have to laugh, but in a compassionate respectful way.

So we are important, everything is, even the tinest electron zipping here or there,

and as to death


Death is just transformation of consciousness, and it is an enjoyable experience, the painful dying process that are possible are horrible... but the moment of death itself, it awakening from the dream you called your life, it is a breathe of fresh air, I remember death, I try to die in life, an ego death... Why fear death? I understand fearing the oneness, because it is everything, including all the fucked up things, but in the fear, you find the love at the center of it, and the fear shrinks and disappears, and there is only compassion and love and peace left.


--------------------
http://www.youtube.com/user/Cosmicjokester1

Check out my channel and if you want to explore further into my point of view, my website is linked on some of my videos depending on which one you watch... The channel is called "THE COSMIC JOKE (ONENESS)

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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Ram Dass (spiritual teacher) merges with Amti Goswami (PhD physicist) [Re: Cosmicjoker]
    #14851086 - 07/31/11 10:44 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Well it's like you said,  not ready to receive the teachings of the enlightened ones. :shrug:

Hang in there. :thumbup:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
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Re: Ram Dass (spiritual teacher) merges with Amti Goswami (PhD physicist) [Re: Cosmicjoker]
    #14851630 - 07/31/11 01:22 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Awesome vid! I turned my lady onto the vid about resource-based economy and she really dug it.
Of course I've listened to Ram Dass since before Neem Karolie died, and I love the animation with Dr. Quantum. The convergence of Eastern mysticism and quantum theory was first established in my thinking by Frithjof Capra's The Tao of Physics.


--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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OfflineCosmicjoker
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Re: Ram Dass (spiritual teacher) merges with Amti Goswami (PhD physicist) [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #14851927 - 07/31/11 02:23 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

MarkostheGnostic said:
Awesome vid! I turned my lady onto the vid about resource-based economy and she really dug it.
Of course I've listened to Ram Dass since before Neem Karolie died, and I love the animation with Dr. Quantum. The convergence of Eastern mysticism and quantum theory was first established in my thinking by Frithjof Capra's The Tao of Physics.




Glad you dug both vids... and I heard of Tao of Physics... did you ever meet Ram Dass? I met him and he totally lived up to his own hype, incredible vibe, kind and compassionate, and is living to a degree in the oneness...


What did you like the most about the resource based economy idea?

I feel we need a transition economy, before we jump right into this advanced idea, one that moves us in the right direction... it may be in this century that we implement an RBE though, perhaps, but def. before 200 years.


--------------------
http://www.youtube.com/user/Cosmicjokester1

Check out my channel and if you want to explore further into my point of view, my website is linked on some of my videos depending on which one you watch... The channel is called "THE COSMIC JOKE (ONENESS)

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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
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Re: Ram Dass (spiritual teacher) merges with Amti Goswami (PhD physicist) [Re: Cosmicjoker]
    #14853450 - 07/31/11 08:04 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

I stood in front of Ram Dass on his 50th birthday, I believe, in Miami. I was too uptight to give him a hug or thank him -  that I wrote a 222 doctoral dissertation based on one idea, on one page of his first book The Only Dance There Is. I was with my psycho ex wife at the time, and I don't even know why she went, except as something to do. We were horribly mismatched. I was a Mental Health Counselor and she was mentally ill.

I think the economy is futuristic, as an attached video with Captain Picard from 'Star Trek:The Next Generation' explaining his version to a man from the past (our present). It is visionary until it becomes actuality, which, given the current level of human development, is not going to happen in my lifetime or anytime soon after my generation passes from this Earth.



--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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Offlinedeff
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Re: Ram Dass (spiritual teacher) merges with Amti Goswami (PhD physicist) [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #14853481 - 07/31/11 08:11 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

We were horribly mismatched. I was a Mental Health Counselor and she was mentally ill.




sounds like a great match to me tbh :lol:


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Ram Dass (spiritual teacher) merges with Amti Goswami (PhD physicist) [Re: deff]
    #14853617 - 07/31/11 08:34 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

She was his muse.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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OfflineCosmicjoker
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Re: Ram Dass (spiritual teacher) merges with Amti Goswami (PhD physicist) [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #14853894 - 07/31/11 09:32 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

MarkostheGnostic said:
I stood in front of Ram Dass on his 50th birthday, I believe, in Miami. I was too uptight to give him a hug or thank him -  that I wrote a 222 doctoral dissertation based on one idea, on one page of his first book The Only Dance There Is. I was with my psycho ex wife at the time, and I don't even know why she went, except as something to do. We were horribly mismatched. I was a Mental Health Counselor and she was mentally ill.

I think the economy is futuristic, as an attached video with Captain Picard from 'Star Trek:The Next Generation' explaining his version to a man from the past (our present). It is visionary until it becomes actuality, which, given the current level of human development, is not going to happen in my lifetime or anytime soon after my generation passes from this Earth.







I never read the only dance there is, what is on the first page?

It's funny I worked as a therapist in a mental hospital before, and I struggle with mental illness despite my spiritual understanding, and was way back in the day, years and years ago, a patient in the mental hospital... one of those cosmic jokes or ironies, a mental patient, balancing himself out, and ending up a therapist in the place he hated and wanted to get out of... I no longer am a therapist, but I am more balanced then ever and cofortable with my current situation...

The video didnt work, the sound, maybe it was my computer, is it?

And I agree, RBE is looking into the future, the important lesson of the RBE idea, is that is gives goal to shoot for, a direction to move in... what we need to develop NOW is a transition economy... I feel what would work, would be a socialist democrasy in which the elected represantives make it a law to provide the basics for the worlds poor, shelter, clothing, health care, education, condoms, abortions, all for free... which we can DO with the technology we have now... The upper upper class will have to not have as much power and wealth, but there will still be elites and class divisions, however, we can stand employing and taking voluteers and base the economy around building new cities, creating new infrastructure, switching to green renawable sustainable energy, and so on... while we work TOWARD RBE, with it as its eventual goal... However, for this to happen we need to also be evolving towards a collective human consciousness, a group mind of all humanity connected with universal oneness, even if just to a saw degree, enough to move both our consciousness, and our society to the direction of a transition economy, then trasition economy, and then one day, RBE.


--------------------
http://www.youtube.com/user/Cosmicjokester1

Check out my channel and if you want to explore further into my point of view, my website is linked on some of my videos depending on which one you watch... The channel is called "THE COSMIC JOKE (ONENESS)

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