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Anonymous

Re: Shrooms: Divine Insight or Delusions of Grandeur? [Re: Sclorch]
    #1495367 - 04/26/03 08:00 AM (18 years, 14 days ago)

What a delightful thread. :smile:

I only have one question to ask.

If there is no commonality to be found in entheogenic plants etc., then how is it that the shaman of the Amazon were able to find the exact two plants that fit together to make Ayahuasca?

The only answer I have ever heard from the High Court of Empirical Knowledge ( Harrumph Harrumph) is that was coincidence or an accident.  You wouldn't really expect a truly skeptical mind to believe that, would you? 


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Offlinethelox
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Re: Shrooms: Divine Insight or Delusions of Grandeur? [Re: ]
    #1495387 - 04/26/03 08:36 AM (18 years, 14 days ago)

I completely agree with HB
"If you feel it, it's real" At least to you it's real.
Same thing with dreams, you feel real emotions. Why wouldn't dreams be considered
real? Anyone got a dictionary handy to check the defintion of real and/or reality?
Maybe it should be updated.


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OfflineGrav
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Re: Shrooms: Divine Insight or Delusions of Grandeur? [Re: thelox]
    #1495396 - 04/26/03 09:21 AM (18 years, 14 days ago)

do you have a link to information on that, Mushrooms?
sounds interesting

thanks sheister, I liked it too... one of my rare moments of being able to remotely explain an opinion. :smile:


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Anonymous

Re: Shrooms: Divine Insight or Delusions of Grandeur? [Re: Grav]
    #1495400 - 04/26/03 09:27 AM (18 years, 14 days ago)

It's pretty common knowledge Grav but I read about the details in a book called "One River", a tribute to Timothy Plowman.

Check it out.

Cheers,


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Invisiblewhiterasta
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Re: Shrooms: Divine Insight or Delusions of Grandeur? [Re: Sclorch]
    #1495417 - 04/26/03 09:58 AM (18 years, 14 days ago)

Sclorchito my amigo! Fungi bring divine enlightenment W/O a doubt!
1)Enlighten; to bring light or knowlege
2)divine:something sensed which is greater than ego

Perhaps you have not experienced a personal "divine enlightenment" from fungi but I can assure you many others  through ego dissillusion have directly experienced events which have precipitated personal growth  and important realizations regarding their lives.
So "Divine Enlightenment": information of a novel nature obtained in a state of ego dissillusion or diminshment which has the potential to help in personal growth.
No magic here,nothing all that mystic and only delusional if one integrates ego/desire into the paradigm.
I am almost heteroabsolutly positive that this is the case :grin:WR
 


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To old for this place


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Anonymous

Re: Shrooms: Divine Insight or Delusions of Grandeur? [Re: whiterasta]
    #1495422 - 04/26/03 10:05 AM (18 years, 14 days ago)

Howdy Parder! :wink:

So then can we say that this consensus of which you speak can draw a parallel to the consensus about reality in general?

Cheers,


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Invisiblewhiterasta
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Re: Shrooms: Divine Insight or Delusions of Grandeur? [Re: ]
    #1495449 - 04/26/03 10:41 AM (18 years, 14 days ago)

If I understand what your asking,Yes. When we experience true novelty of thought we have recieved "Divine Enlightenment" whether this is "Good or Evil" is a human perspective.These are the "Delusions of Grandeur"that information is either good or evil when we apply these perspectives to information with our inherent ego/desire system.When this system is interupted via any one of many methods of ego suppression novel information can be integrated w/o ego /desire and the delusional thought proceses acompanying the ego/desire portion of our consciousness.
This differing self perspective can allow for an  extra-conscious information to be  integrated.
This is based upon the idea of the conscious mind existing as a subunit of a greater Super-mind which is the total of our mentation,conscious,subconscious,autonomic,more? by subduing the dominant conscious portion information is more available from the balance of the "mind" some of which is in tune with the novelty of the universe(Divine?).
I am not sure this is what you were looking for in a reply :confused:
And a fine good AM to you all  :wink:WR


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Anonymous

Re: Shrooms: Divine Insight or Delusions of Grandeur? [Re: whiterasta]
    #1495455 - 04/26/03 10:52 AM (18 years, 14 days ago)

:smile:  Thank you.

Then I take it that since a consensus can be used as a verification then that idealism ala Berkeley is the load of nonsense that I have always maintained it was.

I am glad to know this.

evens Sans Goedel.

Great.

Cheers,


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Invisiblebuttonion
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Re: Shrooms: Divine Insight or Delusions of Grandeur? [Re: ]
    #1495555 - 04/26/03 12:12 PM (18 years, 14 days ago)

Quote:

Then I take it that since a consensus can be used as a verification then that idealism ala Berkeley is the load of nonsense that I have always maintained it was.

I am glad to know this.





Come on... I know you can do better than that.


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Concepts which have been proved to be useful in ordering things easily acquire such an authority over us that we forget their human origins and accept them as invariable.- Albert Einstein


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Anonymous

Re: Shrooms: Divine Insight or Delusions of Grandeur? [Re: buttonion]
    #1495652 - 04/26/03 01:07 PM (18 years, 14 days ago)

:grin:

I might be shamming.  But who knows? :wink:

Let us say I am not.  What would be wrong with my argument?

Philosophically speaking, of course. :smile:

Cheers,


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OfflineHB
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Re: Shrooms: Divine Insight or Delusions of Grandeur? [Re: atomikfunksoldier]
    #1495700 - 04/26/03 01:28 PM (18 years, 14 days ago)

Well, if you choose to be experiencing this reality, that would mean that you are choosing to live within the rules and boundaries of what we know as 'reality'

If you choose to be manifesting this reality, it's essentially like taking all the 'laws' of reality and tossing them out, as buddhist monks and others do

It comes down to, do you BELIEVE that you are in control?

I'll show you what I mean.

I took a friend on a high dose trip at my ranch ... he took his first 6 gram dose. By the peak, he had lost all concept of the laws of reality (having a name, going to work, etc etc, all the human-created things) but with my help he became no different than 'god'. He was able to create giant majestic valleys and make himself feel cold or warm on command, etc etc.

You may say it's all fake.

But how is it fake when it's no different than what we are experiencing this very 'sober' instant? The only way it is different is that it is not socially acceptable because it is not a common way to experience life.

The eternity he spent there creating worlds was just as real as the next morning he woke up and ate cereal, he just CHOSE to spend it differently.

You can harness such power without drugs, by way of astral projection, meditation and remote viewing, which I am currently working on right now with my herbalist.

BUT

You have to BELIEVE that the world is malleable before you can set forth and experience this while sober. If you don't believe it can be done, and that the world still has fundamental rules, you'll never go beyond.

My herbalist has taken me on three astral projections now ... the 'farthest' I have gone was releasing my physical body and experiencing the room I was in as an energy rather than a visual experience which most people would see it as ... instead of 'seeing' a wall, you feel it in your 'master control panel', for lack of better words ...

He left for 45 minutes to let me 'explore', and I could feel when he was coming back, so sure enough, after I brought myself back, literally 3 seconds later he opened the door. We will be working on astral projection and meditation for a long time, I think it's the most interesting thing I have ever done.

Again, this all requires that you believe you can do these things, if you tell something like this to Joe Nobody on the streets, he'll laugh at you.


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InvisibleSclorch
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Re: Shrooms: Divine Insight or Delusions of Grandeur? [Re: HB]
    #1495943 - 04/26/03 03:15 PM (18 years, 14 days ago)

This thread needs another injection of pragmatism...

Fuck consensus opinion on almost everything (the masses aren't to be trusted).
Berkeley sucks (hey, another thing me and M_M agree on!).

Pragmatism is applicable idealism.

---------------------------------------
That's all for now... the women just showed up... sorry.



--------------------
Note: In desperate need of a cure...


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Re: Shrooms: Divine Insight or Delusions of Grandeur? [Re: Sclorch]
    #1495959 - 04/26/03 03:23 PM (18 years, 14 days ago)

Quote:

Fuck consensus opinion on almost everything




Absolutely


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OfflineHB
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Re: Shrooms: Divine Insight or Delusions of Grandeur? [Re: HB]
    #1495967 - 04/26/03 03:25 PM (18 years, 14 days ago)

Society tries to organise everybody's thoughts together in order to make a solidified glue

A very obvious and depressing example is Hot or Not?

They try to OBJECTIVELY say whether somebody is attractive, without realizing that, 'Hey! Everybody has different taste!' ...

It's so ... truly depressing ... it sickens me ... and it makes a lot of people feel terrible about themselves ...

I'd go on that show and go through it all in hopes that I'd win just so I could tell the world exactly what I think of it on live television

That would surely shake them the fuck up ...


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Anonymous

Re: Shrooms: Divine Insight or Delusions of Grandeur? [Re: Sclorch]
    #1497557 - 04/27/03 11:31 AM (18 years, 13 days ago)

Quote:

This thread needs another injection of pragmatism...

Fuck consensus opinion on almost everything (the masses aren't to be trusted).
Berkeley sucks (hey, another thing me and M_M agree on!).

Pragmatism is applicable idealism.

---------------------------------------
That's all for now... the women just showed up... sorry.

 




:grin:
I knew you'd get my point!

Cheers,


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Invisiblebuttonion
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Re: Shrooms: Divine Insight or Delusions of Grandeur? [Re: ]
    #1498192 - 04/27/03 05:24 PM (18 years, 13 days ago)

A consensus opinion does not necessarily point to the ?Truth.?


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Concepts which have been proved to be useful in ordering things easily acquire such an authority over us that we forget their human origins and accept them as invariable.- Albert Einstein


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Anonymous

Re: Shrooms: Divine Insight or Delusions of Grandeur? [Re: buttonion]
    #1498258 - 04/27/03 05:54 PM (18 years, 13 days ago)

Then what does?


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Invisibletekramrepus
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Re: Shrooms: Divine Insight or Delusions of Grandeur? [Re: atomikfunksoldier]
    #1499573 - 04/28/03 02:15 AM (18 years, 13 days ago)

Quote:

supermarket: "I no longer have ego"


hmmmm.....thats a very interesting comment. do you know what an ego is?





I have never claimed that I dont have ego, as I in my normal unconscious state still identify with it.


Ego is basically The product of God identified with body and mind. When we start to actually believe we are only a human with a mind and body - and are associated with it fully - our mind runs our being. This is ego. It consists of what we want ourselves to think of ourselves, what we want others to think of ourselvses...it also consists of Want, and clinging.

Yes, i certainly have ego - but I have also certainly had MANY periods in my life in which ego did not exist. Can you say that you havent? Ego loss happens often to me - some triggers are psychedelics, intense fear, intense surrender to the current presence, and meditation.


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Offlineatomikfunksoldier
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Re: Shrooms: Divine Insight or Delusions of Grandeur? [Re: tekramrepus]
    #1499728 - 04/28/03 03:09 AM (18 years, 13 days ago)

"Ego is basically The product of God identified with body and mind"

oh okay, so you are talking about your definition of ego, not the actual definition....now i understand, thanks!


--------------------
enjoy the entertaining indentity i have constructed for you while you can.


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InvisibleSclorch
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Re: Shrooms: Divine Insight or Delusions of Grandeur? [Re: tekramrepus]
    #1499868 - 04/28/03 04:24 AM (18 years, 13 days ago)

supermarket: Ego is basically The product of God identified with body and mind.

That's funny, I've always thought that ego is the product of body and mind, often mistakenly linked with that abstract concept (used primarily as a focusing method) sometimes called god.


--------------------
Note: In desperate need of a cure...


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