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porcupine
Stranger
Registered: 01/09/05
Posts: 1,289
Loc: MI
Last seen: 12 years, 18 days
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Re: Psychedelic enlightenment [Re: joemolloy]
#14780106 - 07/17/11 02:00 AM (12 years, 8 months ago) |
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joemolloy said: Porcupine, I see that you put materialism on equal footing with a spiritual perspective on the world and say both are belief systems. They are both belief systems, but they are not equal. There's a fetish on this site to believe that all points of view are equally valid and everything is in the eye of the beholder. A brain diseased person's reality is as real and valid as mine, right? Wrong. If he claims that I am working with Ghandi's evil ghost to create a race of horny mice in my basement to rape Mormons, his perspective is skewed, false, and bullshit. His view is verifiably wrong and goes against everything we know about consensus reality. Yes, its two beliefs battling it out but one is based on poor thinking from a sick mind.
A physical understanding of the world does not assume anything other than empirical evidence, it is limited by falsifiable observation. A spiritual understanding assumes any old thing - there's no limit to the claims, once you invoke unverifiable magical actors behind the curtain. To say these two points of view are equal is to say the Bible is equal to your geology textbook in the bullshit department.
A spiritual understanding does not "assume any old thing". There is no need to invoke anything, only the need to cultivate a sharp, aware mind. Where is the problem?
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Seanfu
Jesus Christ Tacos
Registered: 11/26/09
Posts: 2,131
Loc: Brazil
Last seen: 11 years, 1 month
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Re: Psychedelic enlightenment [Re: Austrip]
#14781390 - 07/17/11 12:02 PM (12 years, 8 months ago) |
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Austrip said:
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joemolloy said:
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Herbal said: There is no enlightenment.
And those who claim to have it are delusional or lying. Nobody has any fucking clue to any existential answers, not any holy book or revered figure or psychedelic epiphany. The meaning of life, Truth, death, none of it is available to us. You can follow someone with a good line of shit or create your own line of shit, but don't ever forget that it is shit.
Theres many levels of enlightenment, I personally consider one of the most enlightening things I've got from the psychedelic experience is a greater appreciation for life itself. I can see what you mean, theres no instant knowledge gained about where you go after death, or what the meaning of all this is, but a simple thing like changing how I look at things day to day gave me a new outlook on life and a completely new form of happiness that carried over into every part of my sober life. I may not be enlightened, but I am more open minded, more curious about the world, and a much happier person then when I began this journey
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I have firsthand experience having astrally projected and firsthand experience with chakras/auras. I dont see how firsthand experience is bullshit even if not proof.
I have had psych epiphanies and L helped me understand duality and the fact that everything is tribal. I have had more than one cognitive shift and these kinds of things seem like epiphanies. who's to say we cant have answers from beyond even if not proof.
When me and my closest friend did salvia one night he told me all these things about "beyond". He told me all these functions of soul etc. To him it was very real, to me batshit crazy because I was an agnostic atheist. I come to read the law of one a year later and i find that everything he was saying is in different wording expressing the same general concepts.
So its like all those bible bashing religious types who have met god so he must exist right?
I've been invaded by entities from both good and bad parts of the trip, torn apart, killed my ego, filled with love, met god, played with the universe like a toy, experienced things outside of the realm of possibility ect ect. I've literally floated in a dimension that was like an endless void just filled with the emotions of love, I was being hugged by a god-like creature who made me feel accepted and like I was finally where I was supposed to be.
Isn't that first hand experience as well? and I wouldn't consider any of it enlightenment, to me those parts of the trip ARE the distraction from what I'm trying to get too. Its like my mind constantly creates the visuals to keep me from getting to the inner layer of whats really going on here. Whats located there in the inner layers of the psychedelic experience, still isn't enlightenment though, its just a new box of mysteries for you too open and spend your next trip decyphering the hidden symbols and meanings.
It's up to you to discern. I feel like there is a lot to learn in my trips when I am going in seeking. I dont often get visuals but I think it goes without saying that the visual info isnt as deep as the thought, just like storystructure in a movie vs CGI.
-------------------- I am a chronic liar.
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Lostkeys
Fractal Thought Pattern
Registered: 06/06/09
Posts: 1,355
Loc: Sirius
Last seen: 4 months, 2 days
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Re: Psychedelic enlightenment [Re: Seanfu]
#14783297 - 07/17/11 07:52 PM (12 years, 8 months ago) |
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This may have been mentioned before, if it has, then pay no mind to the ramblings of this madman.
IMO reaching a state of personal enlightenment is all about the "bad trips" people report. I've found that those instances are the greatest source of growth I've yet to encounter. IMO we all reach a point when it's time to move past the giggling euphoria of tripping and get down to resolving psychological issues. This comes in the form of having our lives presented to us objectively for better or worse.
When it gets to this point people separate into two groups. Those who run in fear from psychedelics when faced with a "bad trip" rarely gain anything substantial from their use. This is the type of person who has a "bad trip" and decides to never touch psychedelics again. The experience is written off as a "bad trip", and the lesson doesn't stick.
Then there's the other type of person who experiences the presented lesson, integrates it into their life, and moves on to the next lesson these miraculous chemicals are ready to present.
The willingness to persevere is what separates sheeple from psychonauts.
-------------------- So heavy I fell through the earth...
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Fractalted
Fryin never dyin
Registered: 07/17/11
Posts: 140
Loc: Outworld
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Re: Psychedelic enlightenment [Re: Lostkeys]
#14783394 - 07/17/11 08:15 PM (12 years, 8 months ago) |
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dreamyyy
Edited by Fractalted (05/07/23 04:13 PM)
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