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OfflineJwlst
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Registered: 02/24/05
Posts: 1,338
Last seen: 11 years, 5 months
Interdimensional hypothesis
    #14733715 - 07/07/11 10:04 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

The discussion:

Was doing a bit of reading and come across an interesting theory on aliens. (1)

I have always felt that psycadelics have something to do with interdimensional travel (just something I play with in my head, I do not really believe it). I understand alot of other people feel this way about pyscadelics, especially dmt with the whole 'entity contact'.

A guy called Jacques Vallee (2) has come up with this, I am going to read some of his books and see if maybe they match up with the pyscadelic/dmt experience. I am guessing someone here has probaly already done this so I would like to hear your thoughts, particulary comparing Jacques Vallee's Interdimensional hypothesis to the pyscadelic experience.

I appreciate any input on this and would be grateful if the topic is kept serious (i.e no crazy 'I know %100 that it is demons from the planet spruce moose and pyscadelics are the key') however know that the nature of a topic on such a vague and psuedo science topic will probaly result in stupidity/lack of objective thinking/shizophrenic morons/skeptic know it alls/trolls.

I also understand that this has been discussed very frequently on the shroomery but want to discuss just in detail a comparison of Jacques theory vs popular pyscadelic theories and how they relate to each other, not just everyones view on what pyscadelics do. For example please no 'pyscadelics just effect the neurotransmitters between the synapes causing hallcinations' as I think most of us already get that.

I would also appreciate discussion on whether you think 'close encounter' is possibly from another dimension or firmly rooted in this one whether physical (aliens) or mental (molestation/sexual abuse/PTSD/Natural)

(1)http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interdimensional_hypothesis
(2)http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacques_Vallee

I know wikipedia is not a perfect reference but you should be able to do some of your own research if you are interested from the links provided on the wiki. Also aware that I come across in this thread like I have a massive pole up my anus, please try to ignore that and enjoy the discussion.

My personal view:

I think that Jacques is certainly onto something here with the fact the ET/angels/fairies are all coming from a single source. I personally believe that psycadelic drugs can lead you straight to this source, however I am not sure that this source is external as Jacques believes and think that it is more of an internal inbuilt physiological response triggered by the psycadelics, rather than actually travelling to another dimension/percieving creatures from another dimension. I think that this response can be triggered by many things other than pyscadelics and when it is this is when people percieve it more of a 'close encounter' than a biological response whereas drug users have an obvious scrape goat for these encounters i.e 'I was pretty fucken up man I doubt it really happened'

In conclusion I personally believe that 'close encounters' with any supernatural or alien visitors do not exist and that it is a mental construct in which pyscadelics can 'provoke' into happening, some kind of basic biological function that is not yet explainable by modern neroscience.

I do however have a tiny part of me that believes pycadelics do lead too contact from another dimension and can also take me to this place. I kind of hope this to be true, but am highly skeptical of this so it just sits on the backburner of my belief system.  I guess believing this gives me the feeling that maybe instead of just getting high, I am some kind of amazing explorer on the frontier of an unknown dimension making contact with these amazing entities. That fantasy fits right in with childhood dreams of being an explorer as well as making me feel like I am doing something important with my life. I wonder if other people also want to believe this theory for this reason :smile:


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OfflinejivJaN
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Registered: 08/09/08
Posts: 4,245
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Re: Interdimensional hypothesis [Re: Jwlst]
    #14733813 - 07/07/11 10:28 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

In conclusion I personally believe that 'close encounters' with any supernatural or alien visitors do not exist and that it is a mental construct in which pyscadelics can 'provoke' into happening, some kind of basic biological function that is not yet explainable by modern neroscience.




My biggest question is  :

Why is it not yet explainable ?

People have been eating mushrooms, drinking ayahuasca and taking all sorts of other psychedelics for thousands of years.
All religion and mythology might have its roots in psychedelic plants.

To think that we wage wars over religion and yet it is somehow illegal to investigate what may possibly be the source of all this "delusion" is what gets to me.

I don't think that its unexplainable, i think its not being explained on purpose.


--------------------



---------------------

All my posts in this forum are strictly fictional.
They are derived from an acute mental illness , from which i am forced to lie compulsively.
I have never induced any kind of mind altering substance in my life  and i have no intentions whatsoever of doing anything illegal.
If I have ever suggested such a thing it would have most likely been , due to my personality disorder and i probably do not remember it at all..


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OfflineJwlst
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Registered: 02/24/05
Posts: 1,338
Last seen: 11 years, 5 months
Re: Interdimensional hypothesis [Re: jivJaN]
    #14733893 - 07/07/11 10:48 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

jivJaN
Quote:

jivJaN said:
Quote:

In conclusion I personally believe that 'close encounters' with any supernatural or alien visitors do not exist and that it is a mental construct in which pyscadelics can 'provoke' into happening, some kind of basic biological function that is not yet explainable by modern neroscience.




My biggest question is  :

Why is it not yet explainable ?





I would assume that it is because of the difficulty in replicating a 'close encounter' experience. I have seen a documentary though where they place a helmet with magnets on a persons head and shortly after the person 'senses' a presence in the room. I would have to find the name of the documentary for you..


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Offlinecircastes
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Re: Interdimensional hypothesis [Re: Jwlst]
    #14734077 - 07/07/11 11:32 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Science describes (within a paradigm), it doesn't 'explain.'


--------------------
My solitude...
My shield...
My armour...

TESTED
WITH
FULL
FORCE


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OfflineJwlst
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Registered: 02/24/05
Posts: 1,338
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Re: Interdimensional hypothesis [Re: circastes]
    #14734127 - 07/07/11 11:48 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

circastes said:
Science describes (within a paradigm), it doesn't 'explain.'




Some people would disagree with that idea:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/belief/2010/jul/12/science-religion-philosophy

edit\\ also please try to stay on topic.


Edited by Jwlst (07/08/11 12:24 AM)


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Invisiblewondercat
Dashing

Registered: 07/25/10
Posts: 476
Loc: Flag
Re: Interdimensional hypothesis [Re: Jwlst]
    #14739113 - 07/09/11 12:37 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

I think that these dimensions exist together, not separately, but can only be accessed after reaching certain 'checkpoints'. I think some extraterrestrials are on our level and others are on higher ones, perhaps being capable of traveling to the lower.

Psychedelics do not completely bring you to the source of all dimensions ,but they serve as a window to glimpse how much more is out there, IMO.


--------------------


it truly is an illusion- your senses are just perceiving the varying vibrations in different ways- its holography; a representation.

"Nothing" is easy - Mooji


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InvisibleBridgeburner
Not spiritual at all.
Male


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Posts: 20,010
Re: Interdimensional hypothesis [Re: wondercat]
    #14739132 - 07/09/11 12:42 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Vallee is my fav writer on the subject of UFO's. I'm more interested how stuff happens to you while not "high" :stoned:


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OfflinejivJaN
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Re: Interdimensional hypothesis [Re: Jwlst]
    #14739149 - 07/09/11 12:48 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

I would assume that it is because of the difficulty in replicating a 'close encounter' experience.




What difficulty ?
Have you heard of rick strassmans work ?


--------------------



---------------------

All my posts in this forum are strictly fictional.
They are derived from an acute mental illness , from which i am forced to lie compulsively.
I have never induced any kind of mind altering substance in my life  and i have no intentions whatsoever of doing anything illegal.
If I have ever suggested such a thing it would have most likely been , due to my personality disorder and i probably do not remember it at all..


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OfflineJwlst
Stranger

Registered: 02/24/05
Posts: 1,338
Last seen: 11 years, 5 months
Re: Interdimensional hypothesis [Re: jivJaN]
    #14748208 - 07/10/11 09:40 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

jivJaN said:
Quote:

I would assume that it is because of the difficulty in replicating a 'close encounter' experience.




What difficulty ?
Have you heard of rick strassmans work ?





Yes I have, I have read all his work. I do not believe he had an %100 way to create authentic abuduction procedures though. From what I remember only a few of the 50 or so subjects actually had a traditional alien abduction experience and quite a few people did not even have an entity experience (i.e entity other than alien) at all.

Also I found an interesting thesis on the dmt reality and how it may be possible to verify if it is a real place that could be visited. The article is well written and skips all the mystical bullshit, just gets right down to a good idea on how to actively test if source of experiences are internal or external:

http://www.scientificexploration.org/journal/jse_21_1_rodriguez.pdf

Also have to say boredstiff I agree. It is an amazing topic for research however unfortunetly the crazy folk seem to hijack any realistic discussion on alien abduction discussion/research, focusing on x files plots rather than the hard evidence. I find too that the problem with alien abduction discussion is that most people have already decided what it is, rather than look at all the evidence and try and come up with a plausible answer, they will have their mind set on what they think it is and try and find evidence to prove thier point of view. This creates very narrow views on a topic that very little is known about, with each view ignoring evidence other views bring.

Whether or not it is physiological/physcological/inter space/inter dimension, there is strong evidecne that "alien abduction" does exist on some level and some serious research should be put into finding out exactly what is behind it.


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OfflineSeanfu
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Registered: 11/26/09
Posts: 2,131
Loc: Brazil Flag
Last seen: 11 years, 17 days
Re: Interdimensional hypothesis [Re: Jwlst]
    #14750000 - 07/11/11 07:35 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

I think judging from the bunch of footage out there of disk shaped craft that mysteriously appear from air and travel in ways not explainable by physics that there is probably a whole fourth dimension watching us.


--------------------
I am a chronic liar.

:etjesus: :whacker: :coleman: :awewtf:


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InvisibleBridgeburner
Not spiritual at all.
Male


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Registered: 09/16/06
Posts: 20,010
Re: Interdimensional hypothesis [Re: Seanfu] * 1
    #14750134 - 07/11/11 08:18 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

dimensions are unable to watch anything, as a meter or a few pounds are.


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OfflinejivJaN
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Posts: 4,245
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Re: Interdimensional hypothesis [Re: Bridgeburner]
    #14752331 - 07/11/11 04:33 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

you know what he meant.
don't be a smartass.


--------------------



---------------------

All my posts in this forum are strictly fictional.
They are derived from an acute mental illness , from which i am forced to lie compulsively.
I have never induced any kind of mind altering substance in my life  and i have no intentions whatsoever of doing anything illegal.
If I have ever suggested such a thing it would have most likely been , due to my personality disorder and i probably do not remember it at all..


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InvisibleBridgeburner
Not spiritual at all.
Male


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 09/16/06
Posts: 20,010
Re: Interdimensional hypothesis [Re: jivJaN]
    #14752428 - 07/11/11 04:51 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

i was pointing out a fallacy or a carelessness in language. it pays to be precise in these things and not fling words around. pay attention.


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OfflineSeanfu
Jesus Christ Tacos

Registered: 11/26/09
Posts: 2,131
Loc: Brazil Flag
Last seen: 11 years, 17 days
Re: Interdimensional hypothesis [Re: Bridgeburner]
    #14761135 - 07/13/11 06:52 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

b0red5tiff said:
i was pointing out a fallacy or a carelessness in language. it pays to be precise in these things and not fling words around. pay attention.




It would be near impossible to be precise to anything given our primative english language.


--------------------
I am a chronic liar.

:etjesus: :whacker: :coleman: :awewtf:


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InvisibleBridgeburner
Not spiritual at all.
Male


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 09/16/06
Posts: 20,010
Re: Interdimensional hypothesis [Re: Seanfu]
    #14773063 - 07/15/11 02:05 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Seanfu said:
Quote:

b0red5tiff said:
i was pointing out a fallacy or a carelessness in language. it pays to be precise in these things and not fling words around. pay attention.




It would be near impossible to be precise to anything given our primative english language.




*primitive

the goal isn't achieving maximum precision in language but in thought. then language follows by itself.


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OfflineSeanfu
Jesus Christ Tacos

Registered: 11/26/09
Posts: 2,131
Loc: Brazil Flag
Last seen: 11 years, 17 days
Re: Interdimensional hypothesis [Re: jivJaN]
    #14773109 - 07/15/11 02:14 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

jivJaN said:
you know what he meant.
don't be a smartass.




He got the idea, the words didnt follow.


--------------------
I am a chronic liar.

:etjesus: :whacker: :coleman: :awewtf:


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Offlinedesert father
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Registered: 07/17/10
Posts: 1,102
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
Re: Interdimensional hypothesis [Re: Jwlst]
    #14773189 - 07/15/11 02:30 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

dude you would love the x files....

but to contribute, i saw the movie "the one" the other day.

it got me thinking about inter-dimensional travel/black holes.

someone mentioned pinpointing "checkpoints", and perhaps these "checkpoints" could be 'mapped' out astrologically.

as in each moment in time has a different astrological alignment, obviously.  so perhaps certain parts of certain days are "better" suited for these types of phenomenon.

for instance, maybe there is a particular day of each month, or time of each day, when accessing these black holes, or "checkpoints" might be easier.  perhaps after astrologically determining the perfect time to travel through a black hole, you can determine the perfect "spot" on the earth to do it.

after determining the perfect time and place, you'd have to work on the perfect state of mind to travel these dimensions.  maybe the influence of spirit plants/guides (weed, mushrooms, mescaline, datura...) could prepare you to be better suited to 'notice' what exactly it is your looking for.

maybe "holy spots" around earth are just that, places that are easiest to travel the dimensions.

shamans have that whole "world" mapped out, and maybe these spiritual/astrological beliefs influenced where, when, and how people settled certain parts of the earth as well as how in depth they took their calendars/astrology.

sorry for a rant but i wanted to contribute to your post dude.


--------------------
vi veri veniversum vivus vici

What she said :
"I smoke 'cos I'm hoping for an
Early death
AND I NEED TO CLING TO SOMETHING !"


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