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InvisibleBlindtheeye
All Seeing Nothing


Registered: 10/03/10
Posts: 2,573
Loc: TX Flag
Re: Powerlifting, diet, supplements, bulking... ya dig? [Re: PDU]
    #14743035 - 07/09/11 10:21 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

PDU said:
Would you want people to know you take steroids (or took steroids) to get where your at? Would you tell your friends, your lover and your parents? How do you justify yourself in spite of others opinions (be they right, or wrong?)

I would be happy to hear anyones opinion on this.




I've told most of the people closest to me.  I find it fascinating the negative stigma that steroids hold.  I have a neighbor "friend" that I've known for years.  The guy shoots crystal meth in his arm for christ sakes and when I told him I was contemplating a cycle he says he doesn't want to know about it if I do.  Everyone likes to call it cheating and most people who hold predisposed opinions about steroids know VERY little about them.  Like anything else most ignorant opinions are the most passionate.  This is how I see it, if this makes sense.  I realize that most judgment comes from an uneducated source.  That to me is enough to feel no need for justification.  While questions such as yours I actually appreciate, because most don't care to find out they would rather blindly judge.

It's simply fascinating to me.  Someone should do a cultural study on the rampant and yet highly misunderstood "steroid" use.


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A great truth cannot be communicated, it must be realized.

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Invisibleindica
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Registered: 08/17/05
Posts: 18,905
Re: Powerlifting, diet, supplements, bulking... ya dig? [Re: Blindtheeye]
    #14743093 - 07/09/11 10:38 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

It's a touchy subject for sure. I too only just realised in the last couple of months the stigma attached to it, and I'm sure most of it would have come from the soviet olympians who were 'cheating' to win, and the women with balls growing out of their tits from steroid use/abuse, and a lot of it has hung around since then.

May I ask why/when steroids were made illegal? was it a result of trying to stamp out cheating in sports?

Talking to my brother the other night (who never has and never will steroids) and he said it's just a fact that's gotta be accepted that most if not all the guys who are lifting those insane weights smashing world records are juiced to the gills, and they really don't give a fuck what you think about it, to them all that matters is that they are lifting more than you and are bigger than you and could literally crush your skull if you had a problem with it (not  that I condone that at all)

There is a big gap in the mentality of people who use steroids and those who are against. I guess it's the same gap as pot-heads vs. anti-pot people of "what's the big deal?"

In all fairness I can see why people would want to get the ABSOLUTE MAXIMUM out of their training to the umpteenth degree and will go by whatever means necessary to smash and exceed their goals/expectations.

The line between use and abuse is a little grey I think and is all subjected to personal opinion.

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Invisibleindica
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Registered: 08/17/05
Posts: 18,905
Re: Powerlifting, diet, supplements, bulking... ya dig? [Re: indica]
    #14743100 - 07/09/11 10:40 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

2 years ago we were worried about a mate and were worried he wasn't going to get juiced up. We had an uncle who died of liver cancer or something from steroid abuse.  The thought of steroids repulsed me and I thought anybody who uses them is an absolute idiot, now my opinion has softened a lot since spending a lot of time in the gym and talking to a LOT of people who have used steroids and by no means are 'freakishly big' or over-the-top stacked with muscle, they said they just used it for a small boost to get to their next ideal plateau and stay there. Only a couple of people I know of have done more than one cycle.

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InvisibleBlindtheeye
All Seeing Nothing


Registered: 10/03/10
Posts: 2,573
Loc: TX Flag
Re: Powerlifting, diet, supplements, bulking... ya dig? [Re: indica]
    #14743176 - 07/09/11 10:57 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Excellent addition to the thread Indica, and I'm sorry but a thread about power lifting and BB is absolutely going to have a steroid discussion one way or another.  It's simply inevitable.

I also think it should be a side note though rather than the main topic.  That being said I hope everyone had a good workout today. I know I did.


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A great truth cannot be communicated, it must be realized.

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Invisibleindica
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Registered: 08/17/05
Posts: 18,905
Re: Powerlifting, diet, supplements, bulking... ya dig? [Re: Blindtheeye]
    #14743184 - 07/09/11 11:00 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

cheers mate, all good on the discussion. i've never been on a BB or weights forum so i havent really ever discussed all this online or got opinions from others outside of my circle.

anyway, there's another yoga class today at 5pm, i might try make it

only thing is the yoga classes at my gym don't have the meditation at the end :P might have to look into doing yoga elsewhere?


also start with a boxing PT this week. will go to gym tomorrow and do legs

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InvisibleEminence
Male


Registered: 07/25/10
Posts: 16,627
Loc: Richmond, VA Flag
Re: Powerlifting, diet, supplements, bulking... ya dig? [Re: indica]
    #14743185 - 07/09/11 11:00 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Yeah roids don't give you cancer. They can only speed up cancer growths if you already have it or are predisposed to it.

They can be damaging to you kidneys, but it's not hard to take a liver protector. And kidney damage is only with oral steroids.

Steroids were banned in 1976, that's what I just read. I read other info stating different dates for some reason, but I do know they were banned in Arnold's prime, which was in the 70's.

And I'm sure they were just banned cuz they were medical drugs being used in a way they weren't meant to be used for.

But just in case you're interested in reading about the subject, elitefitness.com is a great site for that.


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Invisibleindica
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Registered: 08/17/05
Posts: 18,905
Re: Powerlifting, diet, supplements, bulking... ya dig? [Re: Eminence]
    #14743213 - 07/09/11 11:10 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

cheers

from what little information i got/heard my uncle was a roid freak. I saw pictures of him he was disgustingly big (ie- abused steroids) which apparently destroyed his kidneys and eventually he got liver cancer. the last photos i saw of him he was a skinny skeletal old man at the age of 49 or something. everyone who ever talked about it said the doctors blamed the steroids. i never knew the man so :shrug:

anyway, enough talk of roids. on with the lifting  :strong:

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Offlinedshow
Nomad
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Registered: 01/22/09
Posts: 5,255
Last seen: 12 years, 3 months
Re: Powerlifting, diet, supplements, bulking... ya dig? [Re: indica]
    #14744482 - 07/10/11 08:57 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

I dont BB.

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Invisibleindica
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Registered: 08/17/05
Posts: 18,905
Re: Powerlifting, diet, supplements, bulking... ya dig? [Re: dshow]
    #14744505 - 07/10/11 09:06 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

" IF THE BAR AIN'T BENDIN', YOU'RE JUST PRETENDIN' "

Edited by indica (07/10/11 09:07 AM)

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Invisibleindica
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Re: Powerlifting, diet, supplements, bulking... ya dig? [Re: indica]
    #14749054 - 07/11/11 12:27 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Well, after 5 days off lifting to rest my shoulder, I decided to go and give it another crack.

My diet hasn't been great the last couple of weeks, good food but just not a great deal of it, not as much as I'd like. So I expected a little strength loss.

Avoiding a lot of carbs in my rest days (I've lost a lot of fat around my abdomen which is fucking awesome!) and just concentrating on protein intake.

The rush I get from smashing 90-100g carbohydrates w/ 90g protein after a workout is intense... feels like the ultiamte sugar high, and my body just swells up like a balloon. so fucking good haha.

Anyway.


Squats
20kg - 1x10
50kg - 1x10
80kg - 1x5
120kg - 1x5
140kg/308lbs - 1x2 - I was hoping to make this my working set but I felt my strength loss so eased back to..
120kg - 3x5

I was still happy to hit 140kg. My shoulder felt comfortable and I am getting a lot more confident with low-bar squatting. I fucking love it. low-bar or :gtfo:

Standing Barbell OH Press
20kg - 1x10
30kg - 1x10
35kg - 1x10
40kg - 3x5 - I really struggled on the last set, I blame my shoulder. I am doing assistance exercises (snatches, side & front delt raises with 10kg dumb-bells) to get my shoulders nice and strong.

Pendlay Rows
40kg - 1x10
60kg - 1x10
80kg/175lbs - 3x8
Underhand - 80kg - 1x8

No power-cleans today until my shoulder is awesome again.

Tricep-pulldown - 3x12 @ 40kg
Bicep preacher curls - 3x8 @ 40kg

My excuse for going to bro-curlz is that I want the arm strength for supporting heavier weights on my low-bar squats, and also to assist with my pendlay rows as I do a final set under-hand.

Dumb-bell seated shoulder OH Press

15kg - 3x8

deadlift
80kg - 3x10

Working back for 190kg on Wednesday (fingers crossed)

Also did a few delt exercises on the side.
A pretty half-arsed workout today I definately feel the lack of energy (I'm really poor atm lol) so I will buy my shit-load of awesome groceries on Wednesday night.

Not too bad on my squats though, I'm still glad I can hit 140.

Edited by indica (07/11/11 01:16 AM)

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Invisibleindica
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Registered: 08/17/05
Posts: 18,905
Re: Powerlifting, diet, supplements, bulking... ya dig? [Re: indica]
    #14749204 - 07/11/11 01:08 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

btw if anyone has tumblr and wants to follow my blog (mostly just my lifting log but with other random shit on there as well)


My Blog

Edited by indica (07/11/11 01:08 AM)

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InvisibleChampion des Champignons
long standing member;)

Registered: 07/26/00
Posts: 2,680
Loc: Alba
Re: Powerlifting, diet, supplements, bulking... ya dig? [Re: PDU]
    #14749230 - 07/11/11 01:18 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

PDU said:
Anyways, i reached a Deadlift PR today following a format i've never used before:

3x5 @ 230
1x5 @ 260
1x3 @ 295
1x2 @ 325
1x1 @ 345
1x1 @ 355



good stuff:thumbup:
that kind of weight progression is much better for strength gains than 4 sets of 10 reps or whatever.
I wouldn't even bother with 3 sets @ 230 next time, save your strength, see if you can get 2 @ 345 and 2 @ 355.

if you're interested in getting stronger that is.
beware, it's very addictive.:grin:


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---------------------------------------------------
hmmm........

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Invisibleindica
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Registered: 08/17/05
Posts: 18,905
Re: Powerlifting, diet, supplements, bulking... ya dig? [Re: Champion des Champignons]
    #14749238 - 07/11/11 01:19 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

so you suggest doing more sets of less reps? I guess CNS gets a good rest with the drop in reps throughout the progression, would you suggest it for all lifts?

my SS program suggests the 4 warmup exercises and always doing 5 reps at least (up to the working set)

or would you suggest satying at the 4 warmups - to working set and then doing the above posted progression on 1rm days?

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OfflinePDU
travel kid vs.amerika
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Posts: 10,675
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Re: Powerlifting, diet, supplements, bulking... ya dig? [Re: Champion des Champignons]
    #14750072 - 07/11/11 08:00 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Champion des Champignons said:

good stuff:thumbup:
that kind of weight progression is much better for strength gains than 4 sets of 10 reps or whatever.





You know what - i might give this type of progression a try more often. the 5x5 or similar that i usually do kills my CNS and makes me really sleepy on day 2 of recovery, especially if i am lifting 300+.

It feels different in the body, lifting for endurance 5x5+ compared with lifting near max. My back/shoulders/chest and legs all feel like they're developing in a different way since that PR.

I do think i will add maintenance set; 5x5 DL session mid week with 220lbs or so, it's so light, but still beneficial i think.


--------------------
GO OUTSIDE.

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Offlinedon_vedo
MerKaBa
Male


Registered: 05/12/11
Posts: 1,383
Loc: 5th dimension
Last seen: 3 years, 10 months
Re: Powerlifting, diet, supplements, bulking... ya dig? [Re: PDU]
    #14751243 - 07/11/11 01:00 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

I always really enjoyed lower reps, more sets. Do nice to constantly push heavier weight.

Lah'Kesh


--------------------
Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. We ask ourselves, Who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous, talented, fabulous? Actually, who are you not to be? We were born to make manifest the glory of God that is within us all. And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same.

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Offlinedshow
Nomad
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Registered: 01/22/09
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Re: Powerlifting, diet, supplements, bulking... ya dig? [Re: PDU]
    #14751303 - 07/11/11 01:11 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

PDU said:
Quote:

Champion des Champignons said:

good stuff:thumbup:
that kind of weight progression is much better for strength gains than 4 sets of 10 reps or whatever.





You know what - i might give this type of progression a try more often. the 5x5 or similar that i usually do kills my CNS and makes me really sleepy on day 2 of recovery, especially if i am lifting 300+.

It feels different in the body, lifting for endurance 5x5+ compared with lifting near max. My back/shoulders/chest and legs all feel like they're developing in a different way since that PR.

I do think i will add maintenance set; 5x5 DL session mid week with 220lbs or so, it's so light, but still beneficial i think.






that 3x5 at a lower weight then going up to a higher weight is a waste of time. You either go 3x5 at the heaviest weight possible and do not higher. Or you just warm up with reps of 2 or 3 until you get to your 1 rep max.


go to 315.. see how many you can do..

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InvisibleChampion des Champignons
long standing member;)

Registered: 07/26/00
Posts: 2,680
Loc: Alba
Re: Powerlifting, diet, supplements, bulking... ya dig? [Re: indica]
    #14752017 - 07/11/11 03:33 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

PDU said:
so you suggest doing more sets of less reps?



not necessarily more sets even, but if you are purely looking for strength gains the 1-3 reps range is where it's at. it has to be the kind of weight you couldn't do for 5 reps even if you tried.
10 sets of 2 reps will not make you stronger than 2 sets of 10 if the weight is the same;)

Quote:

I guess CNS gets a good rest with the drop in reps throughout the progression, would you suggest it for all lifts?



the big lifts, yes, not so much for curls or the like.:grin:

Quote:

would you suggest satying at the 4 warmups - to working set and then doing the above posted progression on 1rm days?



I'd use that sort of progression for a normal session, and even fewer warmup reps for a 1rm attempt.
saying that, I've been lifting for years, and know what my body can put up with warmup-wise, most people warm up a lot more than I do.
personally I think of the warmup reps as warming up my CNS for exerting large forces rather than warming up my muscles etc.
the warmup protocol for eg going for a run is quite a different beast, that really is about getting "warm", the warmup for weightlifting is more about getting "ready".
IMHO.
when I bench later in the week it'll go something like this.

60x5
90x3
110x2
120x3
125x2
130x1
135x1

that's 3 warmup sets and 4 work sets
if you feel like it (and you shouldn't if you're pushing yourself hard enough) you could throw in a couple of higher rep, lower weight sets to "get your pump on".
it may vary for others, but I find if I add too much volume work in it slows down, or even stops strength gains.
a hard set of 10 reps is no substitute for a face-bursting set of 3.
for strength gains.
saying that, you will get bigger training for strength, just not as "pumped up" looking.


--------------------
---------------------------------------------------
hmmm........

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Offlinedon_vedo
MerKaBa
Male


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Posts: 1,383
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Re: Powerlifting, diet, supplements, bulking... ya dig? [Re: Champion des Champignons]
    #14752244 - 07/11/11 04:16 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Champion des Champignons said:
not necessarily more sets even, but if you are purely looking for strength gains the 1-3 reps range is where it's at. it has to be the kind of weight you couldn't do for 5 reps even if you tried.
10 sets of 2 reps will not make you stronger than 2 sets of 10 if the weight is the same;)




I would go as far to say that lifting heavier will equate to more mass as well as strength; as long as you're fueling up right. For people lifting for size I would definitely recommend heavy ass sets to start your lifts and then light pump sets to finish; size never came faster for me when I started lifting like that.

Lah'Kesh


--------------------
Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. We ask ourselves, Who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous, talented, fabulous? Actually, who are you not to be? We were born to make manifest the glory of God that is within us all. And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same.

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OfflinePDU
travel kid vs.amerika
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Posts: 10,675
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Last seen: 8 years, 5 months
Re: Powerlifting, diet, supplements, bulking... ya dig? [Re: don_vedo]
    #14752978 - 07/11/11 06:46 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

don_vedo said:
Quote:

Champion des Champignons said:
not necessarily more sets even, but if you are purely looking for strength gains the 1-3 reps range is where it's at. it has to be the kind of weight you couldn't do for 5 reps even if you tried.
10 sets of 2 reps will not make you stronger than 2 sets of 10 if the weight is the same;)




I would go as far to say that lifting heavier will equate to more mass as well as strength; as long as you're fueling up right. For people lifting for size I would definitely recommend heavy ass sets to start your lifts and then light pump sets to finish; size never came faster for me when I started lifting like that.

Lah'Kesh





This is good news. I would rather do lower sets/reps with more challenging weight because thus far my recovery has been PAIN FREE.


--------------------
GO OUTSIDE.

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Offlinedon_vedo
MerKaBa
Male


Registered: 05/12/11
Posts: 1,383
Loc: 5th dimension
Last seen: 3 years, 10 months
Re: Powerlifting, diet, supplements, bulking... ya dig? [Re: PDU]
    #14753921 - 07/11/11 09:48 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

PDU said:
This is good news. I would rather do lower sets/reps with more challenging weight because thus far my recovery has been PAIN FREE.




Don't over do it though PDU, I know your definitely good about the way you exercise but being to sore isn't always a good thing. When you are sore it means you have literally broken down your body and need to give it time to heal properly. In my opinion a huge mistake that is made by a lot of people is to train sore and think you are just being more savage by training through the pain. The body needs time to recover to grow bigger and stronger.

Lah'Kesh


--------------------
Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. We ask ourselves, Who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous, talented, fabulous? Actually, who are you not to be? We were born to make manifest the glory of God that is within us all. And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same.

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