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Invisiblejbbishop
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The Automated Shotgun Tub (Truly Hydroponic Mushrooms) * 1
    #14589058 - 06/10/11 04:58 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

I just wanted to take a moment and make sure that everyone had a chance to consider the proposal that I'd made in an earlier thread.  I rather think a lot of people might have missed this suggestion and felt it deserved a thread of its own.

As you all know I have made my case for being the original designer of the first method (to my knowledge) of automated mushroom growing which is currently referred to as the Monotub.  My original designs were shared exclusively with moderators and administrators of Shroomery.org back in about 2002 - 2003 and this method was very soon incorporated here publicly as THE growing method of choice for many years (refer to my Journal).  As such, I would expect that there are those then who would appreciate the following suggestions on the basis of my reputation alone.

Unlike the aeroponic design or "greenhouse" method as some are using (along with a large, expensive sonic humidifier) I have proposed in a previous thread to automate the Shotgun Tub (eliminating the need for misting and fanning four times a day), while in the proposition of doing so, making it a true Hydroponic Growing Method (a form of geoponics).

The Shotgun Tub or Tek currently requires tedious and meticulous misting and fanning multiple times per day.  This technique also requires local atmospheric humidity to be at 30% or higher.  The Tek specifically requires that you pre-moisten your Perlite and some have considered hygrometers to measure the moisture content to insure 95% humidity all the way through the fruiting process.  These Shotgun Tubs are elevated and it is recommended to keep a towel under them.  I understand the theory of the Shotgun Tub and as I understand the physics of this method this represents an advancement over the Monotub.  But my main complaint is that it is not AUTOMATED.

Fortunately, small personal sonic humidifiers are available at relatively inexpensive rates (from about $20 - $30).  My proposition for you is to incorporate one of these into a piping distribution network precisely the same as that used with the Monotub where it circulates air from aquarium pumps into the sterilized water medium and Perlite substrate, but instead using the personal sonic humidifier in place of the aquarium pump and marrying this with the Shotgun Tub.  As this would be circulating a mist of air and water, the personal sonic humidifier and piping system would need to be elevated above the level of the tubs to allow liquid condensation to drain.  Also this would be set on a 24 hour timer and allowed to run for 15 minutes 4 or 6 times per day for example (whatever is necessary to facilitate proper hydration).  Obviously this would eliminate the need for manually fanning and misting multiple times per day.  NOW IT'S AUTOMATED!  Also, this can be truly considered a Hydroponic Growing Method.

I fervently believe this method could work very well and while it may be some time before I personally get around to trying it I would strongly encourage people to consider experimenting with these notions.

What remains unclear is whether we want to run the tubing on top of the Perlite layer or someplace underneath it. 

But first, take a look at some of these personal sonic humidifiers.  It wouldn't take much of an adaptation for some of the designs available to connect the output nozzle to the hose with a leak proof seal.  It would then be possible to determine whether the same size of tubing is adequate or whether a larger size of tubing might be more desirable in which case connections could be cemented with silicon.  I would use a single length of tubing in the tub running in a circular loop from a t-splitter with holes drilled into the tubing at regular intervals, perhaps 4 on each side and have these holes pointing straight upward.  Based on the nature and efficiency of the vapor or mist production that the personal sonic humidifier pumps out one can determine if two or even more tubs could be hooked up to a single one of these units using a t-splitter or a five way splitter.  I'd be inclined to think it would be sufficient for multiple units (at least two).

My intuition tells me that it might be most desirable to have this tubing system running just beneath the surface of the Perlite layer and I understand that this is pre-moistened.  Thus I am going to suggest that there is a wicking process involved in the method I'm proposing and that to be truly automated the cakes cannot be set on tin foil.  I have found that trimmed down, small sized coffee filters do in fact work fine in a wick based system as a base if one merely replaces it periodically throughout the fruiting cycle.

You would just need to refill the water reservoir when it's running dry, but as it it is fully automated it seems to me a great improvement over having to manually mist and fan.  Personally I like this system a little better than the greenhouse procedure (the cost of a single personal sonic humidifier has got to be much less than a very large one used for a greenhouse, and insofar as it is such, it is more modular and thus flexible to the volume of your production). 

Not only am I proposing a fully automated growing system as a Mod on the Shotgun Tub Tek but, once again, I would truly call it Hydroponic.

Please feel free to share your thoughts, ideas concerning this proposition.  I encourage anyone experimenting with this proposed system to post your comments and insights here for everyone's benefit.

Thanks again to all.  Best Wishes.

JBB


--------------------
How "Reverse Hydroponics" (The Monotub) originated from my original designs and Improvements to the Method -- Please read my Journal Entry.  Hopefully this will clear up any questions or misunderstandings.  Thank you Moderator for your assistance.

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/14476036

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OfflineZangarmarsh
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Registered: 02/16/11
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Re: The Automated Shotgun Tub (Truly Hydroponic Mushrooms) [Re: jbbishop] * 2
    #14589200 - 06/10/11 06:56 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Why propose anything? Why not use the do-it-and-prove-it method?  I read your first post (and like most that did), was unclear what you were getting at... 

It seemed to me, more like you wanted acclaim for something done in the past.

So what's stopping you now from taking the next step, go from writing about inventions and (rather) prove your invention. 

Best for all of us that you did?

Replicate the old system, build the new system, and run them both side by side with the same spawn/sub/casing and let us see what happens. (with a photo journal)

Otherwise, what will happen is a... waiting for people to tell you that you are fundamentally wrong on some level, and then arguments from you for why you are not.

Lets just see the damn thing in action. Oo

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OfflineMatty_Rulez
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Re: The Automated Shotgun Tub (Truly Hydroponic Mushrooms) [Re: Zangarmarsh] * 1
    #14589207 - 06/10/11 07:00 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

:whathesaid:


--------------------
Life would be tragic if it weren't funny. - Stephen Hawking

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Offlinek00laid
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Re: The Automated Shotgun Tub (Truly Hydroponic Mushrooms) [Re: Matty_Rulez]
    #14589245 - 06/10/11 07:21 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

:ignorethetroll:


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Offlinek00laid
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Re: The Automated Shotgun Tub (Truly Hydroponic Mushrooms) [Re: k00laid]
    #14589251 - 06/10/11 07:23 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

oh and if its not a troll

search for wattballasts grows.

he uses a humidifier to supplement his SGFC



its not really a new idea.

:S


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Invisiblestonesun
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Re: The Automated Shotgun Tub (Truly Hydroponic Mushrooms) [Re: jbbishop]
    #14589279 - 06/10/11 07:38 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

jbbishop said:
I just wanted to take a moment and make sure that everyone had a chance to consider the proposal that I'd made in an earlier thread.  I rather think a lot of people might have missed this suggestion and felt it deserved a thread of its own.

As you all know I have made my case for being the original designer of the first method (to my knowledge) of automated mushroom growing which is currently referred to as the Monotub.  My original designs were shared exclusively with moderators and administrators of Shroomery.org back in about 2002 - 2003 and this method was very soon incorporated here publicly as THE growing method of choice for many years (refer to my Journal).  As such, I would expect that there are those then who would appreciate the following suggestions on the basis of my reputation alone.

Unlike the aeroponic design or "greenhouse" method as some are using (along with a large, expensive sonic humidifier) I have proposed in a previous thread to automate the Shotgun Tub (eliminating the need for misting and fanning four times a day), while in the proposition of doing so, making it a true Hydroponic Growing Method (a form of geoponics).

The Shotgun Tub or Tek currently requires tedious and meticulous misting and fanning multiple times per day.  This technique also requires local atmospheric humidity to be at 30% or higher.  The Tek specifically requires that you pre-moisten your Perlite and some have considered hygrometers to measure the moisture content to insure 95% humidity all the way through the fruiting process.  These Shotgun Tubs are elevated and it is recommended to keep a towel under them.  I understand the theory of the Shotgun Tub and as I understand the physics of this method this represents an advancement over the Monotub.  But my main complaint is that it is not AUTOMATED.

Fortunately, small personal sonic humidifiers are available at relatively inexpensive rates (from about $20 - $30).  My proposition for you is to incorporate one of these into a piping distribution network precisely the same as that used with the Monotub where it circulates air from aquarium pumps into the sterilized water medium and Perlite substrate, but instead using the personal sonic humidifier in place of the aquarium pump and marrying this with the Shotgun Tub.  As this would be circulating a mist of air and water, the personal sonic humidifier and piping system would need to be elevated above the level of the tubs to allow liquid condensation to drain.  Also this would be set on a 24 hour timer and allowed to run for 15 minutes 4 or 6 times per day for example (whatever is necessary to facilitate proper hydration).  Obviously this would eliminate the need for manually fanning and misting multiple times per day.  NOW IT'S AUTOMATED!  Also, this can be truly considered a Hydroponic Growing Method.

I fervently believe this method could work very well and while it may be some time before I personally get around to trying it I would strongly encourage people to consider experimenting with these notions.

What remains unclear is whether we want to run the tubing on top of the Perlite layer or someplace underneath it. 

But first, take a look at some of these personal sonic humidifiers.  It wouldn't take much of an adaptation for some of the designs available to connect the output nozzle to the hose with a leak proof seal.  It would then be possible to determine whether the same size of tubing is adequate or whether a larger size of tubing might be more desirable in which case connections could be cemented with silicon.  I would use a single length of tubing in the tub running in a circular loop from a t-splitter with holes drilled into the tubing at regular intervals, perhaps 4 on each side and have these holes pointing straight upward.  Based on the nature and efficiency of the vapor or mist production that the personal sonic humidifier pumps out one can determine if two or even more tubs could be hooked up to a single one of these units using a t-splitter or a five way splitter.  I'd be inclined to think it would be sufficient for multiple units (at least two).

My intuition tells me that it might be most desirable to have this tubing system running just beneath the surface of the Perlite layer and I understand that this is pre-moistened.  Thus I am going to suggest that there is a wicking process involved in the method I'm proposing and that to be truly automated the cakes cannot be set on tin foil.  I have found that trimmed down, small sized coffee filters do in fact work fine in a wick based system as a base if one merely replaces it periodically throughout the fruiting cycle.

You would just need to refill the water reservoir when it's running dry, but as it it is fully automated it seems to me a great improvement over having to manually mist and fan.  Personally I like this system a little better than the greenhouse procedure (the cost of a single personal sonic humidifier has got to be much less than a very large one used for a greenhouse, and insofar as it is such, it is more modular and thus flexible to the volume of your production). 

Not only am I proposing a fully automated growing system as a Mod on the Shotgun Tub Tek but, once again, I would truly call it Hydroponic.

Please feel free to share your thoughts, ideas concerning this proposition.  I encourage anyone experimenting with this proposed system to post your comments and insights here for everyone's benefit.

Thanks again to all.  Best Wishes.

JBB




tl;dr

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InvisibleSillicybin
Registered: 02/14/05
Posts: 2,134
Loc: Flag
Re: The Automated Shotgun Tub (Truly Hydroponic Mushrooms) [Re: stonesun] * 1
    #14589309 - 06/10/11 07:52 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Ugh, this guy again. :sad:

The term 'hydroponics' being used in reference to mycology makes me cringe every time I hear/read it.  It's like nails on a chalkboard.

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Invisiblejbbishop
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Registered: 04/16/11
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Re: The Automated Shotgun Tub (Truly Hydroponic Mushrooms) [Re: Matty_Rulez] * 1
    #14589322 - 06/10/11 07:58 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

When I developed my original prototype as described in my Journal, I was confident it would work before I ever began.  It proved to be 100% successful.  Naturally, I was thrilled that it worked so well and, as you might imagine, I was eager to share my innovation for the benefit of others.  I am equally confident here. 

As I am on a short seasonal leave from my employment as a Medicare Insurance Specialist I will probably not be able to undertake this project before August.  But it is now that I have this innovation to share with all the kind folks here.

I apologize once again for any confusion that may have occurred due to unknown issues with my first posting.  It did not communicate the information I had intended and believed had been posted; specifically where I hoped to offer suggestions on improvements related to the bulk casing system of my original design (The Monotub).  So hopefully from my Journal, which relates most of what was intended to be conveyed in my original post, someone may find some of my suggestions for improvements understandable and useful if they are using that method.

I see that this is not exactly a "new" idea.  For example see here:

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/13677942#13677942

I do not take credit for this author's work, in fact I just read about it.  My approach was arrived at independently.  But because of this precedent this gives me all the more reason to believe the method is sound.  But it might be helpful to review information from the above post as that author's experience undoubtedly offers insights useful to the method I am proposing.


--------------------
How "Reverse Hydroponics" (The Monotub) originated from my original designs and Improvements to the Method -- Please read my Journal Entry.  Hopefully this will clear up any questions or misunderstandings.  Thank you Moderator for your assistance.

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/14476036

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Offlinek00laid
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Re: The Automated Shotgun Tub (Truly Hydroponic Mushrooms) [Re: jbbishop]
    #14589363 - 06/10/11 08:11 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

supplementing a SGFC with a humidifier works.

its cool... i guess.

whats this thread about again?


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AMU - AMU Q & A - MyVideo Teks!

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InvisibleDeepSpace9
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Registered: 05/24/11
Posts: 144
Loc: U.S.A. Flag
Re: The Automated Shotgun Tub (Truly Hydroponic Mushrooms) [Re: k00laid]
    #14589366 - 06/10/11 08:14 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Hydroponics is a method of growing plants using mineral nutrient solutions, in water, without soil. This would lead me to believe that there is no such thing as a truly hydroponic mushroom, but then again, I'm a noob.

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Offlinek00laid
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Re: The Automated Shotgun Tub (Truly Hydroponic Mushrooms) [Re: DeepSpace9]
    #14589376 - 06/10/11 08:15 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

DeepSpace9 said:
Hydroponics is a method of growing plants using mineral nutrient solutions, in water, without soil. This would lead me to believe that there is no such thing as a truly hydroponic mushroom, but then again, I'm a noob.




you're right.

the op comes on here every month or so posting about his hydroponic mushrooms,

also claims to have a reverse hydroponic method of growing mushrooms.


just a big old troll/attention whore


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AMU - AMU Q & A - MyVideo Teks!

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Invisiblejbbishop
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Re: The Automated Shotgun Tub (Truly Hydroponic Mushrooms) [Re: k00laid] * 1
    #14589433 - 06/10/11 08:33 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Aeroponics is the process of growing plants in an air or mist environment without the use of soil or an aggregate medium (known as geoponics).  Unlike hydroponics, which uses water as a growing medium and essential minerals to sustain plant growth, aeroponics is conducted without a growing medium.  (Wiki)  It was always my understanding that some forms of hydroponics used an aggregate medium.

I'm sorry if the term "hydroponic" has been bandied about so often that people are sick of hearing about it because "there's no such thing." 

Feel free to disagree with my interpretation.

Edited by jbbishop (06/10/11 08:41 AM)

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InvisibleDeepSpace9
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Re: The Automated Shotgun Tub (Truly Hydroponic Mushrooms) [Re: jbbishop]
    #14589524 - 06/10/11 08:58 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

IDK, I dont feel like reading your entire book, but it seems to me like this is the Poor Mans Pod, using a humidifier rather than air pump. I believe they accomplish the same thing, but the humidifier is more costly. Also, I've only been on the site a month or so but I swear I've seen several who are already using some version of this. Just seems like overkill to me unless it were done in some type of greenhouse application.

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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: The Automated Shotgun Tub (Truly Hydroponic Mushrooms) [Re: jbbishop]
    #14589848 - 06/10/11 08:58 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

This thread has been closed.

Reason:
Re-hashing 20 year old growing techniques that we've all moved beyond, and flat-out stating misinformation and disinformation about current techniques while claiming. . . .blah blah blah which only shows how little you actually know.

Everyone calls bullshit.

Grow an actual mushroom and then post telling us how it went.  Quit trying to step on toes, but missing and landing on your own dick.
RR

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