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OfflinePrimal Call
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Re: The Monotub Bag Colonization Thread [Re: kingpsilo281]
    #14273004 - 04/11/11 03:29 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I use regular trash bags in the PC with enough water to cover. Not the "best" way to go about it, but it works. :shrug:


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Offlinefaceyneck
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Re: The Monotub Bag Colonization Thread [Re: Primal Call]
    #14273351 - 04/11/11 04:28 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Hey guys. Just thought I'd quote this here, on account of it being excessively relevant.

Quote:

faceyneck said:
I've been reading Growing Gourmet and Medicinal Mushrooms this past week. I'm about half-way through it. I found this quote worth mentioning here:



Quote:

Paul Stamets Said:Without the exchange of fresh air, carbon dioxide levels will naturally rise from out-gassing by the mushroom mycelium. As carbon dioxide levels elevate, contaminants are triggered into growth.




I'd rather people just figure this stuff out on their own, but if an expert need be cited for credit to be given to this topic, here it is.

...and I'm still very glad I'm ignoring MorelMan. :lol: I don't know what he's saying, and I plan to keep it that way. :wink:




:super:

...and as for pasteurization - I of course go into depth in the pasteurization portion of my manure tek in my journal. And for bags to be used - Ozzy uses black trash bags, which is a great compromise on price per bag and amount bought. :thumbup:

I used to use paint strainer bags, but I didn't like leaving the substrate exposed to the open air while it cooled off. ESPECIALLY not in my damn bath tub. :lol:


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Offlinefaceyneck
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Re: The Monotub Bag Colonization Thread [Re: kingpsilo281]
    #14273420 - 04/11/11 04:36 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

kingpsilo281 said:
so when i make my mono tubs, i should:

" stuff holes with polyfil before spawning to sub?
" wrap the top with saran wrap?
" use No bag and i should expose to 12/12 light durring colonization?
     
    Ive made several mono tubs before and had fair results with coir spawned from rye..But, nothing to be proud of. Plus, i had the holes taped up and had a black trash bag over my tubs durring colonization.So, im excited about trying "yall's" method..I want the results facey and professor P have managed to dial in on..lol  :thumbup: i greatly respect you guy's.. For the knoledge/experience and the help..  this time im planning on using a clone with better genes than the last specimen..My substrate will be 60% horse poo and 20% coir 20% verm..  rather than just coir/verm..
  if i dont have any poly bags, what is another good method to pasturize my manure ?




Thanks for the kind words. :bow: :mypleasure:

...as for your other questions:

* I actually stuff the holes with polyfil immediately AFTER spawning to the substrate. That way, I don't need to worry about getting substrate or spawn on the polyfil. Placing it in before spawning is fine also. It gets in the way too much, for me.

* I don't wrap the top with saran wrap personally, because I don't like to waste materials I don't need. Full colonization in 1 week means I don't need to worry about much moisture being lost. It's certainly not a bad thing to do, though. :super:

* Yes.

Also when fruiting, be sure to get the polyfil as loose as possible. Aim to have it loose enough that it just barely holds itself in the wall of the bin.

During the first week or so, you can unplug one of the holes (:doggystyle::lmafo:) completely, to encourage extra evaporation. This will require manually misting to compensate for loss of moisture.



:cheers:


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InvisibleFoolOnTheHill
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Re: The Monotub Bag Colonization Thread [Re: faceyneck]
    #14417973 - 05/08/11 02:42 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

What does it mean to "bag during colonization"?

Do you inject the the bag directly both ways?


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Invisibleslapphappypill
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Re: The Monotub Bag Colonization Thread [Re: FoolOnTheHill]
    #14418148 - 05/08/11 03:53 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

What do you guys do for the bag holding the sub in a LARGE mono? I'm talking 50 GAL and sizes where the mouth of the bag is too small for the tub?

I was thinking of ousting the trashbag, dumping my spawn and substrate into the bag and shake it up (closed). Then maybe laying it down sideways and fitting it like that?


--------------------
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I have FINALLY written up a couple teks as to how SHP has done things in the past. DISCLAIMER: This is not for the newbie to mycology, and not going to work for everyone! This is simply what works for one person when other teks and methods have failed miserably!
~~~~~How SHP does their unconventional WBS Prep!! (NO DRY METHOD)~~~~
~~~~~SHP's highly disputed method of doing ALL their work outside of a flow hood or a Still air box!~~~~~
~~~~~Troubles harvesting the side and bottom pins in your mono? Learn how!! Dunking included ;-)~~~~~

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Offlinefaceyneck
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Re: The Monotub Bag Colonization Thread [Re: FoolOnTheHill]
    #14418359 - 05/08/11 06:18 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

mattmoss92 said:
What does it mean to "bag during colonization"?

Do you inject the the bag directly both ways?





It was and still is a common practice to place the entire monotub inside a trash bag and close it up until full colonization occurs. Well, that's the idea anyway. I always ended up with contamination doing this.

Here is a pic from Damion's Elementary Coir Tek:



EDIT_ To be clear - the picture above is an example of what I'm saying NOT to do. This should not be understood as a bash on Damion or anything. He's magical and can somehow bag up the substrate and get good results. So big ups to those skillz. :woot:

A bag liner which the substrate sits on is a different story. That is a practice which will avoid contamination, whereas bagging up the entire monotub can and does yield contamination very much of the time. I have yet to lose one bin to contamination using a bag liner. I have tried 3 times in the past to make up monotubs with a bag around the entire tub, all three of which failed.

EDIT_ The theory around bagging up the tub is that CO2 levels are kept extremely high, that way when fresh air is introduced, you will have a stronger pinning trigger. For many people, in many if not most environments, the CO2 levels will be kept too high, and contamination will result.

If the holes are stuffed tightly with polyfil, this will keep CO2 levels high enough, evaporation low enough, to get a good pinning effect when the substrate is fully colonized. At full colonization, reduce the amount of polyfil in the holes, and turn a fan on low nearby to encourage air circulation.

Optionally, the holes can be left the same density, and one hole can be completely unplugged - the hole facing AWAY from wherever the fan is located.

Mist and manually fan once daily. Mist up until just before pooling, regardless of casing preference. For uncased, you know you're misting and getting the right amount of air exchange when the water takes ~12+ hours to be fully absorbed/evaporated, but no more than 24 hours. Adjust accordingly if results don't fit this mold.


:goodluck:

Edited by faceyneck (05/08/11 06:29 AM)

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Offlinefaceyneck
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Re: The Monotub Bag Colonization Thread [Re: slapphappypill]
    #14418368 - 05/08/11 06:22 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

slapphappypill said:
What do you guys do for the bag holding the sub in a LARGE mono? I'm talking 50 GAL and sizes where the mouth of the bag is too small for the tub?

I was thinking of ousting the trashbag, dumping my spawn and substrate into the bag and shake it up (closed). Then maybe laying it down sideways and fitting it like that?




Use the bag as a liner for the substrate and nothing more. You will have no benefit whatsoever from suffocating the substrate with a bag.

You can see here that the substrate is sitting atop a bag:



Do that.

When making up a monotub, pretty much do exactly what Large_Dose does here.


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Invisibleslapphappypill
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Re: The Monotub Bag Colonization Thread [Re: faceyneck]
    #14418383 - 05/08/11 06:29 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

faceyneck said:
Quote:

slapphappypill said:
What do you guys do for the bag holding the sub in a LARGE mono? I'm talking 50 GAL and sizes where the mouth of the bag is too small for the tub?

I was thinking of ousting the trashbag, dumping my spawn and substrate into the bag and shake it up (closed). Then maybe laying it down sideways and fitting it like that?




Use the bag as a liner for the substrate and nothing more. You will have no benefit whatsoever from suffocating the substrate with a bag.

You can see here that the substrate is sitting atop a bag:



Do that.

When making up a monotub, pretty much do exactly what Large_Dose does here.




Yeah, I get that. I was asking how to do that if the tub is twice as long as a 64 qt tub and a single 30 gallon trash bag is too small. I wasn't planning to suffocate anything :bigjoint:


--------------------
We think we have freedom, but we're all just mice in a maze....

                   

FYI: I stole all my pix off google! F+ PORN! Here is a shit-ton of porn by yours truly!

I have FINALLY written up a couple teks as to how SHP has done things in the past. DISCLAIMER: This is not for the newbie to mycology, and not going to work for everyone! This is simply what works for one person when other teks and methods have failed miserably!
~~~~~How SHP does their unconventional WBS Prep!! (NO DRY METHOD)~~~~
~~~~~SHP's highly disputed method of doing ALL their work outside of a flow hood or a Still air box!~~~~~
~~~~~Troubles harvesting the side and bottom pins in your mono? Learn how!! Dunking included ;-)~~~~~

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Offlinefaceyneck
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Re: The Monotub Bag Colonization Thread [Re: slapphappypill]
    #14418386 - 05/08/11 06:32 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

...mouth of the bag is too small for the tub...




...confused me quite a bit. :lol:

Anyway, either use two bags or fillet the bag open to fit as needed. It need not be an actual bag for the appropriate effect to take place. A plastic sheet will suffice just as well. :thumbup:


--------------------
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New growers, or anyone else just needing help; I'm always glad to help right here. :grin:


We give cultivation advice here. :super:


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Re: The Monotub Bag Colonization Thread [Re: faceyneck]
    #14508448 - 05/25/11 04:53 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

:tongue2:bump.....

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Invisiblekingpsilo281
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Re: The Monotub Bag Colonization Thread [Re: ProfessorPinHead]
    #14508816 - 05/25/11 08:26 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

i went ahead and recased the tub that i just harvested, because of all the craters from the fruits  being pulled out."i only cased the spots that were missing casing. i had asked the other day if this was neccessary to do, but no one answered me back, so ill see if anyone can give me advice on this step,,or if its even neccessary,,




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OfflineRogueTrippeR
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Re: The Monotub Bag Colonization Thread [Re: kingpsilo281]
    #14508929 - 05/25/11 09:09 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

:popcorn:

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Re: The Monotub Bag Colonization Thread [Re: kingpsilo281]
    #14509070 - 05/25/11 09:59 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

kingpsilo281 said:
i went ahead and recased the tub that i just harvested, because of all the craters from the fruits  being pulled out."i only cased the spots that were missing casing.




That's known as "patching".  No, it's not necessary, but some people like to do it.  As long as you have adequate FAE, it doesn't hurt anything.  If your FAE is low, it can allow molds like trichoderma to gain a foothold in the new/uncolonized spots.

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Invisiblekingpsilo281
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Re: The Monotub Bag Colonization Thread [Re: Sillicybin]
    #14509552 - 05/25/11 12:05 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

thanx sillicybin,
  i figured it would have some sort of contamination issue if not done properly,,but, this is my first time using a casing and wasnt quite prepared for this..Ive been working alot of hours, and got so much goin on, i just forgot that i would need to do this, till the last min,,:stoned:  n-e ways, ill just fan it more.. and mist lightly till i see the next flush pulln through..


--------------------
For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places...

  infowars.com  shatterthedarkness.net  stevequayle.com

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Offlineely2121
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Re: The Monotub Bag Colonization Thread [Re: kingpsilo281]
    #14566502 - 06/05/11 09:08 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

So much info in this thread!  Good read over the last couple days.
About to set up a couple 30qt tubs and spawn tomorrow :smile:
Excited and nervous.
Going to stuff with Poly during colonization and press and seal the top.
If anybody sees this;
Do you guys who saran wrap or press+seal the top of your mono tubs also then put the lid back on during colonization or leave it off to expose to light cycles?
Also, does the saran wrap breath at all or is it airtight?
Thanks!
My head feels so heavy after digesting this info. Love all the different opinions but glad there is some civility here as well :O)

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Invisiblekingpsilo281
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Re: The Monotub Bag Colonization Thread [Re: ely2121]
    #14568568 - 06/06/11 09:22 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

ELY2121:
  you can leave the lid off for light exposure, but make sure the saran wrap is making a good seal to the tub..I dont believe it needs to be air tight. just a good seal..  Like facey and pro-p. say, its good to have a little fresh air always leaking in ,because too much co2 build up can encourage contams.. Itll also help your tub to colonize quicker..I just made another 30 quart tub like a week ago with 3 quart jars, and from when i spawned it, it only took 3 days to be fully colonized, i let it consolidate for a day or two, and then i cased it..that was 4 days ago, now im getting the first pins..:biggrin: and i didnt even use saran wrap this time, i just used the lid bro.."but mine are clear lids". and then covered the wholes with tyvek instead of stuffing with polyfil..It just works better for me..  Aslo, is your tub clear? if not, you should cut a square on the lid and secure a piece of plexi glass with gorrilla tape or duck tape to have a nice window for your light, and you wont need to mess around with all the saran wrap..
i use 2 quarts of rye on the bottom layer of the tub, and 1 quart of wbs on the top layer, and i make sure that there is like a 60/50  ratio of sub to spawn mixed well on the top layer, so that it can colonize your tub in 3-4 days,,instead of 7-10 days like some people do..
And i would recomend trying a casing if you havent, it worked great for me on my first time a couple weeks ago..I got exactly 4 oz dry from the first flush, i fu#kt up and forgot to dunk my tub i just recased it, so my second flush was only 1.5 oz, but i dunked after that 2nd flush and now it looks like im getting 3 times the fruits the 2nd flush gave me, just cause i dunked it for 3 hours..so, dont forget to dunk,Because its so important for the next flushes to have that water..


--------------------
For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places...

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Offlineely2121
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Re: The Monotub Bag Colonization Thread [Re: kingpsilo281]
    #14570149 - 06/06/11 04:03 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Thanks kingpsilo :smile:
Holy shit on the 3 day colonization! Makes me excited to get going on this.  I think I have been putting off making up my first monos because I am nervous about F'ing it up haha.

I have a 18 gal black Rubbermaid style mono I made up with 1.75" holes, the lid I cut and affixed a Plexiglas piece so no saran wrap per your suggestion thanks :smile:

Also, really good to hear you sound off positive about tyvek over the holes. I have been reading heavily over the last six months and one topic that will never be done is the polyfil debate. How tight, how loose, not to use, always use, GE, AE?! It is endless and I have determined that it will always be because it is so subjective to yourself and your own environment.
That being said...I have thought that if my dual layer tyvek on my lids works fine for spawn...why wouldn't it be a simple solution to the problem of what to put it on the holes in the tubs?

I think I am going to go uncased this first round because I am worried about complicating things at first, maybe case next time if I am flawless the first time (crossed fingers)
Also awesome to hear you say it's ok to mix subs.  I have WBS colonized and some rye catching up :smile:  Wasn't sure if I could mix or if they would fight or something haha.  Stupid noobs...

Long winded post holy shit sorry :smile: 
Good on you for admitting to mistakes. I will make sure to do the soak/rinse between flushes and def before casing haha :smile:
I made a few late night mistakes in my prep myself. Small size PC means many all nighters doing four jars at a time haha.  Get loopy after a while and start to forget things, mis-labeled a few jars and pretty sure I forgot to noc up one jar in my GB and put it in the incubator anyways haha :smile:

Thanks for the help! Getting my nerve up to clean house and cook up some coir. Wish me luck. Got 12 pints of WBS @ 100% for 5 days or so and 2 qts of the same. 
Trying to decide if that is enough for my 18 gal mono and a 5gal homer bucket all cut and taped up ready to rock.
I want to run them both at the same time but want a high spawn/sub ratio to guarantee first time success :smile: (if there is such a thing ha)

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Invisiblekingpsilo281
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Re: The Monotub Bag Colonization Thread [Re: ely2121]
    #14574637 - 06/07/11 02:01 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

ely2121:
 
Your welcome bro, always glad to help :hatsoff:
  The mono tub is designed to hold the perfect environment for the fruits..It really depends on how much air movement you have around the tubs, on how tight you need to stuff the holes with polyfil.. the more air movement around the tub, the tighter you stuff the holes..Or you will evaporate all the moisture in the tub..thats why i tape tyvek over the holes, it held the perfect moisture inside the tub, even with alot of draft in the room..I just fan 4-6 times a day and mist till the substrate glisten's with water droplets..  I recomend you case, if you have some coir,verm,peatmoss,, i just case with coir,verm,gypsum,hydrated lime..  The casing will def. help you have better success than non casing IMO.. Its easier to get it right when you case, because when you mist, alot of the water is absorbed into the substate and doesnt pool and settle on the surface as easy as a mat of mycelium.. Do what you feel comfortable doing, im just letting you know what ive speculated.. And the casing will create the perfect micro climate for pin development, but when you dont case, you have to make sure that the environment in the tub is perfect, so that you can get a decent pinset..but fae and the right light are also important factors to consider,,Genetics play a big role aswell, but; you just might have a great producer and might not know it,,:shrug:  Only one way to find out..  and as for 12 pint jars and 2 quart jars..you can make 3 homer buckets with 12 pint jars..3-4 pints of spawn per bucket.. and the 18quart mono only needs 4-5 pint jars of spawn  or 2 quart jars and 2 pints will be more than enough.. try and make 3-5 tubs/buckets,,always line the tubs/buckets with black plastic, or the pooling water at the bottom of the tub will fu%K you grow UP!! TRUST me on that one..:minigun:


--------------------
For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places...

  infowars.com  shatterthedarkness.net  stevequayle.com

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InvisibleMr. Alien
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Re: The Monotub Bag Colonization Thread [Re: kingpsilo281]
    #19510284 - 02/02/14 10:24 AM (10 years, 30 days ago)

Please correct me if i am wrong

in the colonization stage, you will benefit from high levels of CO2,and very low AE, only GE is allowed, in order to do that, the polyfil in the holes must be very tight and when is in the fruiting stage (100% colonized) the polyfil have to be very loosy for more AE.

is this the correct way? is there a problem if i do that?

or should i just leave the holes with loosy polyfil all the time even in the colonization stage, like others had success.

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Re: The Monotub Bag Colonization Thread [Re: Mr. Alien]
    #19510303 - 02/02/14 10:29 AM (10 years, 30 days ago)

for mono's we tape the holes during colonizing, then stuff them at fruiting, top holes stuffed loose bottom holes tight as can be


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* How long should myco bags take to fruit? stealth 2,228 6 06/05/02 11:27 AM
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