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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



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'Live' Sporting Events?
#14556251 - 06/03/11 03:52 PM (12 years, 7 months ago) |
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Just finished watching The French Tennis Open. Amazing match between Federer and Djokovic - watch it if you get the chance. Then, of course, I thought how can I create yet another silly PSP topic on this... so here goes:
If you are watching in the stadium, you are seeing the action nanoseconds after it actually happened and hearing it milliseconds after it happened. To see the French Open in the USA, the image must be processed then bounced between several satellites then reprocessed and sent to my TV where it is processed once more, so I may be seeing the image a few hundred thousandths after it actually happened.
If we had a station on Mars, it would be several light seconds. If we beamed this to a hypothetical human habitation on Alpha Centauri, it would be 4.37 years in the past by the time they viewed it. In fact, one of the players could be retired or dead by the time they view the 'live' event.
So what does that truly mean? Just because the info could not get from A to B any sooner, does it still deserve to be called 'live'? I open the floor to discussion.
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Edited by OrgoneConclusion (06/03/11 09:55 PM)
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



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maybe
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



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Re: 'Live' Sporting Events? [Re: Icelander]
#14556357 - 06/03/11 04:12 PM (12 years, 7 months ago) |
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I have a feeling that you actually died by the time I read your response.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
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maybe
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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don_vedo
MerKaBa



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Re: 'Live' Sporting Events? [Re: Icelander]
#14556469 - 06/03/11 04:43 PM (12 years, 7 months ago) |
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I finished watching that match a little earlier as well, definetely a good one!
Lah'Kesh
-------------------- Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. We ask ourselves, Who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous, talented, fabulous? Actually, who are you not to be? We were born to make manifest the glory of God that is within us all. And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same.
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1983
Stranger

Registered: 04/14/11
Posts: 130
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Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said: If we beamed this to a hypothetical human habitation on Alpha Centauri, it would be 4.37 light years in the past by the time they viewed it.
A light year is a measure of length. It makes no sense to say 4.37 light years in the past.
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



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Re: 'Live' Sporting Events? [Re: 1983]
#14557855 - 06/03/11 09:56 PM (12 years, 7 months ago) |
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You, of course, are correct. Care to tackle the thrust of the topic?
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Grapefruit
Freak in the forest



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I think you are a nitpicker. 
But yes, the tennis was great. My favourite sport to watch on TV, watching their movements brings me great wonderment.
-------------------- Little left in the way of energy; or the way of love, yet happy to entertain myself playing mental games with the rest of you freaks until the rivers run backwards. "Chat your fraff Chat your fraff Just chat your fraff Chat your fraff"
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OrgoneConclusion
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Re: 'Live' Sporting Events? [Re: Grapefruit]
#14558016 - 06/03/11 10:30 PM (12 years, 7 months ago) |
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This is not about tennis nor about nits; it is about Einsteinian frames of reference. Thought some of youse would get that.
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don_vedo
MerKaBa



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I get where you were going but don't have much of a comment, other then the match was fantastic. One thing I will say is I believe nothing is live while everything is live at the same time; it all depends on how you want to look at it. From my point of view the only things that are happening live are those things that happen from my point of singularity, those things that I am actually interacting with at that moment in time. Other than that it is merely observation and response.
Lah'Kesh
-------------------- Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. We ask ourselves, Who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous, talented, fabulous? Actually, who are you not to be? We were born to make manifest the glory of God that is within us all. And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same.
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Sleepwalker
Overshoes

Registered: 05/07/08
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Factor in the delay between the photons hitting your receptors and your brain actually processing what it's seeing, and you might as well just say fuck it and accept that we are always lagging behind.
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BlueCoyote
Beyond


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I subjectively feel things as 'live' as long I think I could have influence on them... Physically, nothing seems to be connected 'live' or 'simultaneous'...
Change and 'time' are synonymous. Real weird that our brains can make sense out of that
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LunarEclipse
Enlil's Official Story


Registered: 10/31/04
Posts: 21,407
Loc: Building 7
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Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said: This is not about tennis nor about nits; it is about Einsteinian frames of reference. Thought some of youse would get that.
You are just pissed because you don't have a faster connection. Well that and you suck at tennis. That's what I think. Youse indeed.
-------------------- Anxiety is what you make it.
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Poid
Shroomery's #1 Spellir




Registered: 02/04/08
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Loc: SF Bay Area
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Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said: So what does that truly mean? Just because the info could not get from A to B any sooner, does it still deserve to be called 'live'? I open the floor to discussion.
live: at the actual time of occurrence : during, from, or at a live production <the program was broadcast live>
I don't see what's supposed to be so perplexing about this concept..obviously, information doesn't travel instantaneously, but this is taken for granted when people use the term 'live'. Live music, for example, isn't transmitted from the stage amplifiers to my ears instantaneously, but it is still live music; live TV, for example, isn't transmitted from a TV camera to my TV instantaneously, but it is still live TV. I suppose a more accurate definition than "at the actual time of occurrence" would be "basically at the actual time of occurrence".
-------------------- Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylan  fireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
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Cups
technically "here"


Registered: 12/24/09
Posts: 1,925
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Re: 'Live' Sporting Events? [Re: Poid]
#14559049 - 06/04/11 06:58 AM (12 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
Poid said: I don't see what's supposed to be so perplexing about this concept..obviously, information doesn't travel instantaneously, but this is taken for granted when people use the term 'live'.
The more you look into the experience of life the more you realize just how many things are "taken for granted". it's a bit terrifying, then depressing, and hopefully liberating at some point.
@ OC Was it like this?
Stuck in my headz man.
-------------------- What's up everybody?!
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



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Re: 'Live' Sporting Events? [Re: Poid]
#14559662 - 06/04/11 11:23 AM (12 years, 7 months ago) |
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So astronomers are witnessing the birth of several billion year old galaxies 'live'?
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
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Well if the light from an explosion took a billion years to reach your eye you are seeing it as it first happened. It would have to be at least considered live-ly due to the fact that in real time the explosion is gone. Except on the spiritual plane where it lives on as a reincarnated fart.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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OrgoneConclusion
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Re: 'Live' Sporting Events? [Re: Icelander]
#14559966 - 06/04/11 12:54 PM (12 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
Well if the light from an explosion took a billion years to reach your eye
I wish glaxies were more considerate. I hate waiting!
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DieCommie

Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
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Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said: So astronomers are witnessing the birth of several billion year old galaxies 'live'?
I could buy that interpretation.
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OrgoneConclusion
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Re: 'Live' Sporting Events? [Re: DieCommie]
#14559984 - 06/04/11 12:57 PM (12 years, 7 months ago) |
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What about sub-space transmissions?
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



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I didn't even know they had cars out that far.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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DieCommie

Registered: 12/11/03
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Then you are observing the future.
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OrgoneConclusion
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Re: 'Live' Sporting Events? [Re: Icelander]
#14560003 - 06/04/11 01:01 PM (12 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: I didn't even know they had cars out that far.
Never heard of a Ford Galaxy?
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



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My bad.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Poid
Shroomery's #1 Spellir




Registered: 02/04/08
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Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said: So astronomers are witnessing the birth of several billion year old galaxies 'live'?
They are witnessing the light from those galaxies live..what is the issue?
-------------------- Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylan  fireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
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OrgoneConclusion
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Re: 'Live' Sporting Events? [Re: Poid]
#14560427 - 06/04/11 02:50 PM (12 years, 7 months ago) |
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Differentiating between NOW and THEN; PAST and PRESENT. Sorry this thread was too deep for you.
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don_vedo
MerKaBa



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It's kind of trip thinking the light we see now in the present, is the light of the past. What is time anyways?
Lah'Kesh
-------------------- Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. We ask ourselves, Who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous, talented, fabulous? Actually, who are you not to be? We were born to make manifest the glory of God that is within us all. And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same.
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Poid
Shroomery's #1 Spellir




Registered: 02/04/08
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What about my post led you to believe that I have failed to understand the distinction between past and present? Obviously, the light from those galaxies is witnessed in the present (i.e. live) by an observer, even though its source produced that light in the past.
Where is your OrgoneConfusion stemming from?
-------------------- Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylan  fireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



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Re: 'Live' Sporting Events? [Re: Poid]
#14560467 - 06/04/11 02:59 PM (12 years, 7 months ago) |
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Because the word 'trippy' failed to appear in any of your responses.
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Poid
Shroomery's #1 Spellir




Registered: 02/04/08
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Live sporting events are groovy, baby, yeah!
-------------------- Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylan  fireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



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Re: 'Live' Sporting Events? [Re: Poid]
#14560502 - 06/04/11 03:05 PM (12 years, 7 months ago) |
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Like watching Tiger Woods play golf this year.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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don_vedo
MerKaBa



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Re: 'Live' Sporting Events? [Re: Poid]
#14560506 - 06/04/11 03:06 PM (12 years, 7 months ago) |
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Lah'Kesh
-------------------- Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. We ask ourselves, Who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous, talented, fabulous? Actually, who are you not to be? We were born to make manifest the glory of God that is within us all. And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same.
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



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Re: 'Live' Sporting Events? [Re: Poid]
#14560521 - 06/04/11 03:09 PM (12 years, 7 months ago) |
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Here is a point to ponder. A live event (as I proved) cannot truly be live because there is some delay - not merely the speed of light, but also the electronic and human processing time. Now if one signal from France was bounced off an earth orbit satellite and the same signal was bounced off of a transceiver on Mars and back to your TV, would the Mars signal still be considered 'live'?
Had two TVS on the other day. My old non HDTV and my new HDTV. The signals were several seconds apart. Were they both 'live'?
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



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Had two TVS on the other day. My old non HDTV and my new HDTV. The signals were several seconds apart. Were they both 'live'?
No TVs are not biological life forms. What do I win?
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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don_vedo
MerKaBa



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Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said: Had two TVS on the other day. My old non HDTV and my new HDTV. The signals were several seconds apart. Were they both 'live'?
I rarely watch TV but noticed that I had two TV's on in two separate rooms the other day, same thing happened. The HDTV was a couple seconds faster.
-------------------- Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. We ask ourselves, Who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous, talented, fabulous? Actually, who are you not to be? We were born to make manifest the glory of God that is within us all. And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same.
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



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Re: 'Live' Sporting Events? [Re: Icelander]
#14560545 - 06/04/11 03:13 PM (12 years, 7 months ago) |
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My old TV. The set is free; the shipping is $199.
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Poid
Shroomery's #1 Spellir




Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 40,372
Loc: SF Bay Area
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Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said: Here is a point to ponder. A live event (as I proved) cannot truly be live because there is some delay - not merely the speed of light, but also the electronic and human processing time.
You only proved that a live event cannot be witnessed/observed live..to say that a live event cannot truly be live would be nonsensical. You might as well say that orange cannot truly be orange, or that gravity cannot truly be gravity.
Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said: Now if one signal from France was bounced off an earth orbit satellite and the same signal was bounced off of a transceiver on Mars and back to your TV, would the Mars signal still be considered 'live'?
In a practical sense, yes. In a literal one, no.
Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said: Had two TVS on the other day. My old non HDTV and my new HDTV. The signals were several seconds apart. Were they both 'live'?
Again, they practically were, but literally were not.
-------------------- Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylan  fireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
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OrgoneConclusion
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Re: 'Live' Sporting Events? [Re: don_vedo]
#14560550 - 06/04/11 03:15 PM (12 years, 7 months ago) |
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Thus justifying Einstein's equations - that and American greed.
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OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



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Re: 'Live' Sporting Events? [Re: Poid]
#14560557 - 06/04/11 03:16 PM (12 years, 7 months ago) |
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An orange is not truly orange. Do a close-up.
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Poid
Shroomery's #1 Spellir




Registered: 02/04/08
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What about quantum gravity?
-------------------- Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylan  fireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
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ShroomScape
Sexplorer



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I think the issue you bring up is one of the way we describe an event more than an issue of the event itself. The limitations of language do not allow us to accurately convey what happens in reality. For instance: you can never talk about the 'true' present moment because even as you have thought it and said it, there has been a delay and what you wanted to talk about--the present--is now the immediate past.
Words are static objects which have a tough time accurately describing fluid processes.
We call things 'live' in a matter of convenience in order to approximate our experience of reality in the same way that we say conveniently say 'the grass is green.'

BTW, I watched that match. I'm rooting for Nadal in tomorrow's final.
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BlueCoyote
Beyond


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It's only our brain which puts together those single occurrences from the future and past to a pattern that makes out our perceived state of 'now. And this depends on the 'felt' and 'rationalized' range of influence we assume to have on this perceived occurrence. It's a backwards translation process in our brain, removing the existing delay, back to the events' causal simultaneities.
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ShroomScape
Sexplorer



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Re: 'Live' Sporting Events? [Re: BlueCoyote]
#14564261 - 06/05/11 11:28 AM (12 years, 7 months ago) |
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Nadal beats Federer 7-5, 7-6, 5-7, 6-1. I watched it live.
Or... as live as it gets.
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don_vedo
MerKaBa



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Re: 'Live' Sporting Events? [Re: ShroomScape]
#14564599 - 06/05/11 12:53 PM (12 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
ShroomScape said: Nadal beats Federer 7-5, 7-6, 5-7, 6-1. I watched it live.
Or... as live as it gets.
Saw the match too, Nadal is the man!
-------------------- Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. We ask ourselves, Who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous, talented, fabulous? Actually, who are you not to be? We were born to make manifest the glory of God that is within us all. And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same.
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