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Pastywhyte
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Registered: 09/15/12
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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion HERE ONLY Please [Re: cronicr]
#19609828 - 02/23/14 08:03 PM (9 years, 10 months ago) |
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Thanks cron, I been waiting for a reason to post here beautiful fruits BTW
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Pastywhyte
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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion HERE ONLY Please [Re: Happy Littletree]
#19650582 - 03/04/14 03:13 PM (9 years, 10 months ago) |
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Most of my AA+ grew tall and hollow, but I still love em.
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Pastywhyte
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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion HERE ONLY Please [Re: Solipsis]
#19759305 - 03/28/14 09:48 AM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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A strain is when two compatible hyphae meet and form clamp connections which result in dikarotic mycelium. A variety is what many people and vendors incorrectly refer to as a strain like B+ or cambodian. They are really samples of the same species that have been collected from different regions and some domestication may or may not have occurred.
When working with well established varieties, most of the extreme variation has been bred out. As this is oft typical of most of the popular "strains" they can for the most part be said to have similar traits which IMO makes the cube is a cube statement the easy response. I have been working with some wilds recently and have definitely noticed some different traits with them, that would make the cube is a cube statement less applicable. However they still are the same species so growth parameters are still typical for the most part.
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Pastywhyte
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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion HERE ONLY Please [Re: Northerner]
#19761847 - 03/28/14 09:21 PM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Northerner said: I get various strains in my underwear from time to time. Fortunately they usually wash out.
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Pastywhyte
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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion HERE ONLY Please [Re: lighthouse09]
#19764270 - 03/29/14 01:44 PM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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Well this will be subject to the variables of ms as well but, compared to more domesticated variety, I found wilds to have more tomentose growth and longer pin times. This could just be all luck of the ms draw of course, and I have yet to do a lot of wild ms work, but is consistent with what I've seen from other people as well.
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Pastywhyte
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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion HERE ONLY Please [Re: BittrBuffalo]
#19765266 - 03/29/14 05:49 PM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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Not yet. I gotta stack of to do prints, and they be in that pile. So many projects so little time
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Pastywhyte
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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion Here Only Please [Re: Happy Littletree]
#19865526 - 04/18/14 01:16 PM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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A lot of luecistic mutations been popping up lately with other varieties, so it could really be anything. It doesn't really matter at this point what the original variety was, if it was a mislabeled AA+ or something else. Point is that you now may have a leucistic trait and thats always something worth keeping around IMO. You will know for sure once you grow out the spores from the print you took.
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Pastywhyte
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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion Here Only Please [Re: Fractal420]
#19877276 - 04/21/14 09:55 AM (9 years, 9 months ago) |
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A+ strain like B+ was a variety that Mr. G came up with and was the parent so to speak of AA+. AA+ is luecistic and A+ is not. Pretty much the main difference. The writeup on the first page of this thread will tell you pretty much everything there is too know.
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Pastywhyte
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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion Here Only Please [Re: Fractal420]
#19970994 - 05/11/14 08:18 AM (9 years, 8 months ago) |
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Most cubes are just cubes. If you want typical results then just avoid mutants like PE, APE, PEU, and KSSS. If you want mutants and weird fruits then chose the ones I just listed. Albinos are also cool
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Pastywhyte
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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion Here Only Please [Re: Fractal420]
#19971046 - 05/11/14 08:37 AM (9 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
Fractal420 said: I think origin e.g. Central America vs Asia impacts the genes quite a bit
I agree with this to a certain extent. However, most of the domesticated varieties were domesticated with the same desired traits in mind. After several generations the amount of variability drops off quite significantly. Fact is that until you have done quite a few grows, the subtle differences are often unnoticed. For a new cultivator, the differences are meaningless and so its good for them to just start with something and have no preconceived notions like B+ is easy or Cambodians are potent.
Quote:
blindingleaf said: it is very hard for me to believe anyone could pic out what variety of cube was in a brf/grain/lc jar based on mycelial growth.
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Pastywhyte
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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion Here Only Please [Re: piratez]
#19972210 - 05/11/14 02:05 PM (9 years, 8 months ago) |
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Potency is genetic. My last cambo isolate turned out pretty meh on the potency. Has pretty much nothing to do with what variety you use.
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Pastywhyte
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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion Here Only Please [Re: Nemodeus]
#19972281 - 05/11/14 02:26 PM (9 years, 8 months ago) |
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Not really considering the amount of differential within said lineage. All African Americans can be said to have the same genetic lineage and many common traits exist but, both Shaq and Gary Colman are African americans, do you think they are that similar? How about Michael Jackson compared to Barry Bonds? They are identical right?
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Pastywhyte
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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion Here Only Please [Re: Nemodeus]
#19972334 - 05/11/14 02:44 PM (9 years, 8 months ago) |
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Yeah I agree with that. My point is that with mushrooms its a lot more subtle than that so, unless your working with mutant varieties like PE or AA+ I doubt most people would even notice. As for potency I like to compare that to inteligence in people. Which race is the smartest, no one could say for sure. Some would say asians others would say Germans. But then you can have an east indian who is a genuis.
Fact is most people don't even know what they want when they are starting out. I thought I wanted big fruits at first so I started with B+. Now tho my favs are the squat fatass bastards like KSSS and APE. The point is just get started with cubes and figure out how to grow in the first place, the rest will come.
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Pastywhyte
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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion Here Only Please [Re: Fractal420]
#19975182 - 05/12/14 08:15 AM (9 years, 8 months ago) |
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Yes but the point is, they are still people, they still have the potential for a lot of variability, and to untrained eye, they are not much different than lets say a pure African, even tho African Americans are the result of centuries of selective breeding. If you want a race of cubes that is the equivalent of a white person grow AA+ Even tho there is still the potential to isolate large fruits and small ones, just like some Caucasian people are tall and some are short 
Genetic isolation is the key your missing here. It doesn't matter where you start, you can isolate for pretty much anything with a little time and patience. Obviously certain strains might give you a leg up on some aspects macroscopically but, if its yield or potency your looking for, they all have the same potential in that regard when you use agar. That's why I use the intelligence analogy, no race has been proven to be "smarter".
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Pastywhyte
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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion Here Only Please [Re: PrimalSoup]
#19977749 - 05/12/14 06:25 PM (9 years, 8 months ago) |
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Fractal I didn't plan to reply to you any more as you seem to have your mind made up but, I will post this for anyone who cares 
Fact is that when we take a print from a single fruit in the wild, we have already seriously narrowed down the defining genetics a lot. Cube patches have a massive amount of genetic diversity and that is what makes wild prints both slightly unpredictable, as well as offering the best possible chance to breed "traits" like what you are implying.
The problem however with the notion of breeding more potent cubes, or faster ones, or larger ones, through successive generations is that small gene pool your working with (the fruit or few fruits that were printed to start the variety). Without the massive genetic diversity that the wild patch has and works with through natural selection, your efforts to train or domesticate traits, will ultimately lead to a destabilization of the genetics and be counterproductive. Your best bet would be to start with a wild fruit for the most noticeable results.
Quote:
Workman said: OK, so what is this point, or how many generations until you can be confident you have a true breeding strain? With a wild strain you would assume 100% heterozygosity. Previously domesticated strains will obviously have less heterozygosity but since that is unknown it doesn't hurt to be conservative.
Mathematically you can see the reduction in variability with each generation. It drops off quickly and then around generation 5 or 6 the gains in stability drop off dramatically. After generation 7, with heterozygosity less than 1%, the rate of random mutations will outpace any small amount of remaining variabilty loss in later generations.
Wild 100% F1 50% F2 25% F3 12.5% F4 6.25% F5 3.125% F6 1.5625% F7 0.78125%
Generate several strains from the spore print and you should expect to see huge differences between these new strains if the heterozygosity is high. Choose the strain(s) with traits you want (in this case, cap color and size) and take prints. Repeat with these new prints. You can probably feel pretty confident that after doing this 5 or 6 times that the strain is stable, especially if you don't see any new variants in the later generations.
Quote:
Workman said: I should point out that common sense dictates that inbreeding is bad since it can expose recessive genetic defects or undesirable traits. Ideally you want high heterozygosity to give a particular mushroom strain a wide range of available genes, which in turn makes it better adapted to unpredictable environmental conditions. This could be achieved by cloning a wild vigorous specimen or by crossing two very different strains. In my experience, the mushrooms resulting from such a cross are very vigorous and productive (hybrid vigor).
So we have some (not as much as you think) potential to influence a varieties behavior. AA+ was pushed to be leucistic, PE looks like a dick. But for the most part, the one thing that most vendors do when they are expanding their stock, is look for genetics that produce lots of spores. Makes sense that's the product. So most of your varieties are already manipulated for a purpose and the amount you are going to be able to influence it is minimal.
The good news is that even within that narrow band of variability, there is still a lot of potential for random mutation, your just not going to be able to breed it into the line before inbreeding becomes an issue. So instead use agar. Cloning and isolates will give you all the predictability you could want and you can keep them around for years, decades if you take care of them.
Check out these two fruits from a ms grow. They not only look nothing like each other, they also barely resemble cubes If this is not enough for you to play with and find something you like then your just not trying.

So rather than go looking for a magic bullet variety to get the traits you want, use agar. Or you can get some wilds and do a 1000 grows always going back to your master print(s) to narrow down the field. I guarantee that agar will be faster. I am doing both.
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Pastywhyte
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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion Here Only Please [Re: Fractal420]
#19978712 - 05/12/14 09:34 PM (9 years, 8 months ago) |
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Sorry if I jumped on ya there. Believe me I have my personal fav's as well but, that don't mean that I can't find a culture from any variety that was worth keeping. That's my goal actually, to have at least one decent culture for every variety I have grown or have prints for. Got 9 down and like 20 to go
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Pastywhyte
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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion Here Only Please [Re: Cactusdude]
#20005562 - 05/18/14 12:57 PM (9 years, 8 months ago) |
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I love all those you just listed, but I also like my CRS and would like to get my hands on a falbino
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Pastywhyte
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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion Here Only Please [Re: Cactusdude]
#20011615 - 05/19/14 08:40 PM (9 years, 8 months ago) |
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CRS = Colombian Rust Spore
Falbino = pf albino crossed with F+
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Pastywhyte
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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion Here Only Please [Re: MycologyMission]
#20040691 - 05/25/14 11:09 PM (9 years, 8 months ago) |
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Its in the marketplace but you won't have access for 90 days and you need 50 posts.
Welcome to the shroomery
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Pastywhyte
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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion Here Only Please [Re: MycologyMission]
#20040733 - 05/25/14 11:22 PM (9 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
MycologyMission said: What do you mean I'm "pasty" lol
No I'm Pasty 
Quote:
MycologyMission said: Well since I'm here in the strain list, are there actually difference in appearance in cube " strains " and other variances? Or is it like I see it put - a cube is a cube?
Read the thread. Or start here, lots of good info. There are a lot of opinions, you should form your own
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