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k00laid
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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion Here Only Please [Re: RogerRabbit] 2
#14525774 - 05/28/11 10:50 AM (12 years, 7 months ago) |
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can delete this is space is needed.
Edited by k00laid (05/28/11 12:39 PM)
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k00laid
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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion Here Only Please [Re: k00laid] 4
#14525776 - 05/28/11 10:50 AM (12 years, 7 months ago) |
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Welcome to myCERVANTES Race/Variety/Strain Journal. This is where we discuss 'Strains'.
Please read any pertinent information in these first THREE posts before asking about any cube 'Strain'.
If you have already read the first three posts of this thread, start posting. If not, read on.
If you have anything factual to add, see something that is incorrect or missing entirely, post it.
Introduction: 99% of your race/strain questions should be answerd in the first three posts of this thread[. Please read all three before posting any 'Strain' related discussion in my journal. If you wish to discuss, or update the information concerning a specific race/'strain' or topic, scroll down to the other posts in this thread and click on a particular cube or topic's name.
Please send me a PM if I need to add any new threads or profiles for missing cubensis races (strains).
If you want quality spores at a fair price, SUPPORT OUR SHROOMERY SPONSERS!
So... without further ado... welcome to Cervantes' Race (Strain) Journal!
Thanks, Cervantes
Now, start reading:
Why 'Race', 'Variety 'and 'Subvariety' are Often More Accurate Terms Than 'Strain': When discussing different types of cubes in general, let's use the words 'Race' or 'Variety' instead of the word 'Strain'. Cubes, like humans, come from all over the world... and like humans, there can be some variety from one cube patch to another. It is time for some racial tension here in the world of cubes. Most cubes are named after the place where their original wild spore specimen was discovered... so Race is a logical (if imperfect) word to use when describing these different types of cubes. At the very least, it is more accurate and far less confusing than the word 'Strain'.
In this thread, the word 'Strain' in quotation marks means something different than the word Strain without quotation marks. The word Strain refers to living dikaryotic mycelial tissue, the word 'Strain' refers to commercial spores.
The fungus known as Psilocibe Cubensis is a unique mushroom SPECIES. Shiitake is a unique mushroom species. Azures are their own species. Amanitas are a species... etc. It would be almost impossible and incredibly expensive to use two different fungus species and create a hybrid of the two. It'd be like successfully mating a human with a gorilla. However, a Caucasian human can effectively mate with an Asian human. Similarly, spores from one cube race can mate (or be mated) successfully with the spores of other cubensis races.
In the world of mycology, every single time a single spore's mycelium mates with another's to become dikaryotic, a unique Strain (no quotation marks) is created. Like baby humans, living cube Strains are each unique, and they tend to resemble their 'parents'. Each single viable spore print can produce thousands if not millions of unique strains. Most of these strains will produce mushrooms that look remarkably like the mushroom that produced the print from which they came.
The term 'Strain' is often used to describe the type of spores on a spore print or in a syringe filled with spores. When used in this context, the word 'Strain' is simply NOT ACCURATE (hence the 'Quotation marks'). It is a word used by vendors (who cater to hippies) in order to make magic shroom spores sound like different strains of marijuana. It is a word that suggests cubes are more varied from 'Strain' to 'Strain' than they actually are.
Marijuana is a plant, cubes are a fungus. Cubes come from SPORES, marijuana comes from SEEDS. Cubes breathe OXYGEN and produce CO2 as a byproduct (like animals). Marijuana, like all plants, breathes CO2 and produces OXYGEN.
The misuse of the word 'Strain' is widespread, and only encourages vendors to sell as many different 'Strains' as possible in spite of their obvious similarities. When people talk of commercial cube 'Strains' this leads to confusion and misinformation. Vendors (especially the shady ones) thrive on this misinformation.
An African, an Asian and a Caucasian are all undeniably human but there are obvious differences between each race. Even on a smaller scale... every single town (and sometimes neighborhood) in Great Britain features a slightly different dialect... and yet, there is still room for great diversity from one person to another in said towns... even though, when compared to a different race, most Brits tend to look alike.
Still, the world of genetics is often a funny thing, and sometimes spores will produce some surprisingly unique and unexpected strains... strains displaying recessive genetic traits and mutations that nobody could predict... again, just like humans.
These unique cubes can be selectively bred until these unique traits become common, even via multispore inoculation. This new, unique cube may be marketed as a new 'Strain' but it is really just a unique 'Variety' of cubensis spawned from its original race. Still, many vendors market each unique variety as a new 'Strain'. In general, every single commercially available cubensis 'RACE', is actually a domesticated VARIETY of the original specimen. Domesticated cubes contain intentionally limited genetics in order to increase the likelyhood of achieving the desired results, sort of like dog domestication and subsequent breeding.
Over time and multiple generations (spore to fruit to spore) a cubensis Variety can become genetically limited by inbreeding. This means results from multispore inoculation can become more consistent, and the likelihood of accidentally stumbling upon unique traits reduces. If a commercial cube's genetics become too limited, the inbreeding can produce undesired effects. In general, when it comes to life, too much inbreeding will eventually lead to problems.
Annother classification for different types of cubes is the 'Sub-variety'. For example, by using spores from each variety of cube, Workman crossed PF Albino (Probably a variety of the Matias Romero race) with Penis Envy (Probably a variety of an Amazonian or Columbian race) and produced the Albino Penis Envy. Albino Penis Envy is both a sub-variety of PF Albino and Penis Envy.
Since all this 'Variety' and 'Sub-Variety' talk can get very confusing, go ahead and use 'Race' if you prefer, even though it is not entirely accurate. It sure beats saying 'Strain'. There are racial differences between mushrooms, often due to natural selection based upon where they first grew... and sometimes varietal differences due to unnatural selection performed by mycologists.
Finally, there are different 'Brands' of cubes. A Sporeworks Brand syringe full of Penis Envy spores may have a slightly different ethnic diversity than a Ralphster Brand or Hawk's Eye Brand syringe of the same cube.
All of that said, vendors use the term 'Strain'... and n00bs learn the term from vendors. This incorrect term is SO widespread, it is even used in the same way by Paul Stamets. I'd love to use the proper terminology, and will do so from now on... but this will be an uphill battle. Most people recognize the incorrect term, and not the correct ones.
It seems the misuse of the word 'Strain' is only widespread in the world of magic mushrooms, but not in the rest of the mycological world. The fact that so many magic mycologists use incorrect terminology, further reduces our credibility in larger mycological circles. The misuse of this simple word can make our work seem illegitimate in the eyes of science.
The Truth About Different Types of Cubes: Most cubes look alike. All cubes grow in the same conditions. The differences between cube races, varieties or 'Strains' are, more often than not, minute. Some races are known for fast colonization, or large fruits... even high potency. BUT... these 'Facts' are often just vendor hype. Your results will most likely vary.
The Truth About Cube Potency: If you want something that is very potent, you should probably try a different species and avoid cubes all together... either that, or eat more cubes. Agar will potentially allow you to select a more potent substrain. A few cube races and varieties are reported as being more potent than others... but there is no scientific evidence to strengthen the potency argument. Everybody wants the answer to this question... but all we have is opinion. Most people agree there are differences in potency from one type of cubensis to another... but they seldom agree on which cube is the most (or least) potent.
The Truth About The Fastest Growing Cubes: Some cube races and varieties are known to grow at a faster or slower rate, on average, than others. There is evidence which suggests the fastest cubensis races produce the smallest shrooms and the slower races and varieties produce the most bulky fungus. Ultimately it all seems to even out in the end (with a few exceptions). Also, the slow cubes more frequently display unique macroscopic characteristics (in other words, they are more likely to look noticeably different from other races) while the fast ones usually look like average (or smaller than average) cubes. It tends to take more time to grow a large or unique cube. If you are looking for a cube which produces a LOT of quick bulk, you may be looking for a long time... and you'd better work with agar.
The Truth About Bulk: Race, variety or 'Strain' has little to do with bulk. With some work, any viable cube print should produce good flushes. Good isolation on agar, and good fruiting conditions are the only proven ways to get consistently bulky flushes. There are no quick and easy solutions. If you want bulk, first you are going to need diligent patience.
The Truth About Selecting Your Spores: The thing that distinguishes most races, varieties or 'strains' is where they originated and who collected the first specimen. If you are interested in Tasmania, try some Tasmanian spores. If you like the story of how SG30 was resurrected by Shdwstr, try SG30. If you think Penis Envy looks fun, try it. They are all cubes. Pick one that interests you, and see if you like working with it.
The Truth About Multispore vs. Strain Isolation: Agar allows you to work specifically with your spores but it costs more money and takes much more time. However, proper agar work will give you consistency from one grow to the next.
Multispore inoculation is a turkey shoot. You never know what you are going to get. Mother nature is unpredictable. If you intend to use multispore, it is suggested you work with a classic and/or popular cube variety. Cubes that have been popular for 10 or more years tend to be popular for a reason, and their genetics have probably been limited (in a good way) by being selectively bred over and over again... generation after generation. You are more likely to see consistent results via multispore, if you use a proven race.
*Special thanks to Livingston, apoonanor and george castanza.
*Taken from the link below
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Edited by k00laid (05/28/11 12:40 PM)
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k00laid
NEMO


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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion Here Only Please [Re: Base Icks] 3
#14532285 - 05/29/11 06:46 PM (12 years, 7 months ago) |
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original is in my sig.
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k00laid
NEMO


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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion Here Only Please [Re: madis503] 2
#14552199 - 06/02/11 06:26 PM (12 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
madis503 said: wot??? do i understand right that if i mix spores from different races together i can grow shrooms that look like mix of these two races?
mix cubes get cubes.
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k00laid
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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion Here Only Please [Re: higgledy-piggledy] 1
#14579924 - 06/08/11 01:53 PM (12 years, 7 months ago) |
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holy shit college boi.
read the first post in this thread.
or read the link in my sig.
when growing from spores. your mushrooms will have differing potencies.
no vendor can assure that all mushrooms formed from these spores will provide a "speedy" trip. its simply impossible.
stop being dumb.
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k00laid
NEMO


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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion Here Only Please [Re: occollegeboi] 1
#14580072 - 06/08/11 02:25 PM (12 years, 7 months ago) |
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TEXAN IS NOT A STRAIN when you can understand this. you will understand.
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k00laid
NEMO


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Re: Strain Thread Rulez [Re: anonjon] 1
#14651148 - 06/21/11 09:56 PM (12 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
anonjon said: ...
buy the grab bag, ask for pe
problem solved
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k00laid
NEMO


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Re: Strain Thread Rulez [Re: Fronnis] 1
#14684678 - 06/28/11 06:04 AM (12 years, 7 months ago) |
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how often do you grow true albinos from an albino print?
i havent had much luck.
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k00laid
NEMO


Registered: 05/03/10
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Re: Strain Thread Rulez [Re: vredstein] 1
#14689134 - 06/28/11 10:39 PM (12 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
vredstein said: Something to think about before starting the revolt.
dont worry sponsors pay good money to be sponsors here.
this is just banter
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k00laid
NEMO


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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion Here Only Please [Re: LucyLove] 1
#14767884 - 07/14/11 01:15 PM (12 years, 6 months ago) |
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ive grown PE outdoors.
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k00laid
NEMO


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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion Here Only Please [Re: LucyLove] 1
#14768940 - 07/14/11 05:50 PM (12 years, 6 months ago) |
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i have one pic in my gallery but it doesnt do justice.
i got an ounce dry off second flush of coir outdoors.
first flush was done indoors.
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k00laid
NEMO


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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion HERE ONLY Please [Re: NoxADVANCED]
#14871208 - 08/04/11 08:26 AM (12 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
NoxADVANCED said: what cube will work without manure?
all cubes
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k00laid
NEMO


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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion HERE ONLY Please [Re: Zerglingrush09]
#14886613 - 08/07/11 05:09 PM (12 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Zerglingrush09 said: I work with a glove box with a hepa filter with a fan.
thats your source of contamination
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k00laid
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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion HERE ONLY Please [Re: Zerglingrush09]
#14886728 - 08/07/11 05:29 PM (12 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
UnnamedGrower said:
Quote:
k00laid said:
Quote:
Zerglingrush09 said: I work with a glove box with a hepa filter with a fan.
thats your source of contamination
Exactly what I said
yup.
and then he said this
Quote:
Zerglingrush09 said: using fresh filters every 2 or 3 noc nocs.
so i figured he needed to be told again. since he cant read
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k00laid
NEMO


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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion HERE ONLY Please [Re: t23]
#14950107 - 08/19/11 10:55 PM (12 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
t23 said: cube is a cube is a cube my ass

from spores they are.
are you familiar with the popular shiitake strains?
shiitake arent shiitake because we are allowed to trade genetic isolates.
not so with cubensis.
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k00laid
NEMO


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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion HERE ONLY Please [Re: Zerglingrush09]
#14991802 - 08/28/11 02:43 PM (12 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Zerglingrush09 said: So can anyone explain to me why mushrooms can overcome trich outside but not inside.
the amount of fresh air.
and one does not "overcome" the other.
rather, the trich and the mycelium both continue to thrive.
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k00laid
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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion HERE ONLY Please [Re: MagixMushMan8]
#14992025 - 08/28/11 03:28 PM (12 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
MagixMushMan8 said: i'm talking more about the appearance of Penis Envy rather than chemically speaking
if two black people fuck they can still have an albino baby.
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k00laid
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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion HERE ONLY Please [Re: don_horhe]
#15061055 - 09/11/11 02:26 AM (12 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
don_horhe said: A friend of a friend is in possession of two fully colonized and already fruiting cakes of the "white lightning" strain. Now, the friend of a friend is completely new to mushroom cultivation - he bought 2 jars with already colonized and consolidated substrate and just had to place them in a FC and wait. What interest him most is the strain itself, and he couldn't find any information whatsoever on it, save for a thread over on Mycotopia which doesn't really say much anyway. So, my friend asked me to ask you if anybody knows anything about WL, what is its Latin name, relative potency, etc?
click the link in my sig entitled MUSHROOM STRAINS.
they are all bullshit.
and "white lightning" is no exception
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k00laid
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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion HERE ONLY Please [Re: NoxADVANCED]
#15067759 - 09/12/11 01:07 PM (12 years, 4 months ago) |
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somethin like that.
i wasnt sure theyd even colonize the brf unless you added manure.
pics pls :0
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k00laid
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Re: Strain Thread-Strain Discussion HERE ONLY Please [Re: overstand]
#15144710 - 09/27/11 10:50 PM (12 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
overstand said:
Quote:
Honeydew said: from sporeworks
also, my friend was telling me that there is a type of psylocybin mushroom that is greenish blue and is suppose to be ultra potent and its spores are super hard to find, is this true or is this just trickery?
There is a cubensis called Redboy that bruises green.
uhh green? :S
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