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Offlinewood chip
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Re: weak strians and the spores they produce [Re: k00laid]
    #14526334 - 05/28/11 12:52 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Thanks for clearing it up.
How did you figure that out?
You might want to qualify what you are stating.


The rate of spore germination depends on many variables.


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Offlinek00laid
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Re: weak strians and the spores they produce [Re: wood chip]
    #14526351 - 05/28/11 12:57 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

wood chip said:
How did you figure that out?




ive only bought spores once. and have grown from the spores those fruits produced. and the spores those fruits produced and etc etc.

when you get spores you are at the starting point.

where that spore came from is only a little bit relevant.


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Offlinewood chip
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Re: weak strians and the spores they produce [Re: k00laid]
    #14526519 - 05/28/11 01:45 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

I guess you lucked out and received one of the immortal strains. 

But your way of thinking and contemplating the subject is "racist"  in that you are assuming  your single observation applies to the whole tribe.  Fungi that grow all around the world in the right climate are very diverse.  Your stain will likely mutate in time unless you hold it on a slant and quit aging the cell line.     

I think your said percentage may be, unfortunately, over optimist, and something you randomly made up and stated as a fact.  Even for your immortal stain grown in the most pristine conditions.


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Invisiblefngbronco
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Re: weak strians and the spores they produce [Re: wood chip]
    #14526568 - 05/28/11 02:00 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

If anything growing from spores grown in that one environment will domesticate the strain for those growin conditions. It's adaptation and happens all the time. In theory the fruits grown indoors should produce and pass on genes that are better suited for those conditions.


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I challenge you to challenge yourself more! When you feel complacent and ready to hang it up, challenge yourself to get over it! If you fail, don't look at it as you didn't succeed, look at it as you would a rock face you're trying to climb. Stand back, wayyyy back, and look at it and plot another path. If you can't find one, shuffle down the way a little, a little change of scenery or a view from a different angle may give you the insight you need.

Anything I state is relayed information from a friend of a friend and should be viewed as completely fictitious. I do not partake in any illegal or grey-area-of-the-law activities, but do have lots of friends who may or may not.    -fngbronco

Pill Divider Agar Tek


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Offlinek00laid
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Re: weak strians and the spores they produce [Re: wood chip]
    #14526833 - 05/28/11 04:03 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

wood chip said:
I guess you lucked out and received one of the immortal strains. 





holy shit.
i just got trolled hard, huh.


--------------------
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Offlinewood chip
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Re: weak strians and the spores they produce [Re: k00laid]
    #14528332 - 05/28/11 09:26 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Actually your "trolling" and contributed mostly false information as pointed out. 

"I guess you lucked out and received one of the immortal strains"

If your cultivation experience has been like this, why do you look at my quote as trolling?  It is an accurate statement about what you said your experience has been.  Anyone who obtains a strain that breeds true forever is very lucky if sending it off in mass cell division to obtain spores.  Not saying it is impossible but it is unusual.  I would recommend you try to keep that strain on a slant so as not to risk loosing it.  How many cycles have you run it so far?


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Invisiblefngbronco
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Re: weak strians and the spores they produce [Re: wood chip]
    #14528736 - 05/28/11 11:20 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

If what you say is true then mushrooms around the world must be endangered!


--------------------
I challenge you to challenge yourself more! When you feel complacent and ready to hang it up, challenge yourself to get over it! If you fail, don't look at it as you didn't succeed, look at it as you would a rock face you're trying to climb. Stand back, wayyyy back, and look at it and plot another path. If you can't find one, shuffle down the way a little, a little change of scenery or a view from a different angle may give you the insight you need.

Anything I state is relayed information from a friend of a friend and should be viewed as completely fictitious. I do not partake in any illegal or grey-area-of-the-law activities, but do have lots of friends who may or may not.    -fngbronco

Pill Divider Agar Tek


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Offlinepsyeye
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Re: weak strians and the spores they produce [Re: fngbronco]
    #14529289 - 05/29/11 03:02 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Nooooooooo o o  o  oo oo:cruelworld:


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  Noob principles thread


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OfflineSKrink
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Re: weak strians and the spores they produce [Re: wood chip]
    #14530106 - 05/29/11 10:46 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

wood chip said:
something you randomly made up and stated as a fact.




OP, where is your evidence to back up your claims? So far you have been staunchly fighting for your own random untested hypothesis... Good for you for sticking to your guns, but as the saying goes: where's the cream fillin'?

"if this, then this, YES IT IS TRUE" isn't very convincing.


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:crazy2: SWEET POTATO HOME FRIES :crazy2:
:mushroom2:HOW TO USE A PENIS ENVY SPORE SWAB:mushroom2:

   

... Oh mighty masticator, salivator, vocalizer, swallower, licker biter sucker brow-knitter looker blinker rubbernecker thumber prodder up-yours fingerer ringwearer nosepicker waver drinker armlifter bodybender hipswiveler kneer springer runner ZERO::::::::OOOOOOOOO:::::::: RUN!!!


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OfflineWing
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Re: weak strians and the spores they produce [Re: SKrink]
    #14530480 - 05/29/11 12:28 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Omg this is the worst thread ever! Wood chip quit trolling and do more reading. Your facts are unfounded and way off base. I cant read this conspiracy theory whacko  thread anymore.
:notards:  :gump:  :tard:


--------------------
My Old Grow Logs



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Offlinewood chip
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Re: weak strians and the spores they produce [Re: Wing]
    #14536028 - 05/30/11 01:26 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

fngbronco said:
If what you say is true then mushrooms around the world must be endangered!




Mushrooms as a group are not endangered.  Mushrooms are evolving.  By that I mean a single "species" will become more diverse by anastomoses,mutation, and spore crossings creating new and novel stains.  A stain that does not change over time is rare unless it is hibernating on a slant.  In time, strains can diverge enough to be viewed as substains or in time new species.  A general biological observation of all life. 

Fungi happen to mutate very quick which makes them an incredibly diverse group.  A species is kind of an interesting concept in that only a few stains are studied  It is also why commercial stains of "know by experimental observation"  are preserved on slants. This makes mutation by cell division infrequent.  The  actual question of this thread, which was never even close to being debated, was related to chosen slants for spore generation.  All spores are not created equal and vary widely.


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Offlinek00laid
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Re: weak strians and the spores they produce [Re: wood chip]
    #14537823 - 05/30/11 08:51 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

wood chip said:
was related to chosen slants for spore generation.  All spores are not created equal and vary widely.




yes they do.

good thing vendors dont grow from spores then huh.


--------------------
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Invisiblewygram
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Re: weak strians and the spores they produce [Re: wood chip]
    #14538099 - 05/30/11 09:44 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

wood chip said:
Most stains grown over and over (a spawn run with lots of cell divisions) mutate over time usually for the worst.   
 
Are the clones of these Agaricus stains, from the store, so much weaker than the mother spawn just because of a single run through compost.




You just answered your own question.

Quote:

wood chip said:
Why do commercial "Agaricus bisporus group" spawn producers often use stains isolated many years ago and held on slants? These advanced strain crossers and world wide isolaters of new wild Agaricus mushrooms must know the answer, unfortunately there are very secretive. 

If you have several close species of a mushroom and one was clearly superior in performance would you sell it and allow the strain to be freely amplified?  No commercial operation would allow this.




There is no conspiracy to hold down "new" strains of commercial mushrooms. Most commercial strains are old and well-known because for mushroom farms to stake their livelyhood on an unproven strain is dumb.

As to the point about not allowing the best strains to be freely available is moot. Most commercial strains of mushrooms are widely available and can be purchased by the general public.


--------------------
Changing your mind is one of the best ways of finding out whether or not you still have one.


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Offlineafrosheen
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Re: weak strians and the spores they produce [Re: wygram]
    #14538272 - 05/30/11 10:17 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Most commercial strains of mushrooms are widely available and can be purchased by the general public.




Not only that but it's possible to buy some commercial mushrooms fresh, spore print them or sample the tissue, then work up from agar.


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Offlinewood chip
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Re: weak strians and the spores they produce [Re: wygram]
    #14538347 - 05/30/11 10:33 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

There is no conspiracy to hold down "new" strains of commercial mushrooms.

True. There is no conspiracy or the suggestion of one.  A company being secret with patented science does not does not equal conspiracy.  They openly admit they are secretive. A conspiracy would make it look like they were something else than they are.  This is not the case.     

However, Are you suggesting Amycel can purchase all of Sylvans Agaricus strains? 

I disagree with you if you actually believe this.


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Invisiblefngbronco
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Re: weak strians and the spores they produce [Re: wood chip]
    #14538578 - 05/30/11 11:30 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Anyone can purchase anything. It's all about money and royalties. Watch Food, Inc. you'll learn how agriculture works.


--------------------
I challenge you to challenge yourself more! When you feel complacent and ready to hang it up, challenge yourself to get over it! If you fail, don't look at it as you didn't succeed, look at it as you would a rock face you're trying to climb. Stand back, wayyyy back, and look at it and plot another path. If you can't find one, shuffle down the way a little, a little change of scenery or a view from a different angle may give you the insight you need.

Anything I state is relayed information from a friend of a friend and should be viewed as completely fictitious. I do not partake in any illegal or grey-area-of-the-law activities, but do have lots of friends who may or may not.    -fngbronco

Pill Divider Agar Tek


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OfflineWing
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Re: weak strians and the spores they produce [Re: wood chip]
    #14538667 - 05/30/11 11:54 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

If the spores of weak stains are germinated the resulting cultures will be weak.




False. If a man has never been athletic and has chronic back pain, the sperm he releases that may eventually fertilize an egg may produce an athlete. If the man's family has a high rate of cancer, it doesn't mean his offspring will.


Quote:

This leads to a situation in which the vendor may intentionally produce weak spores because one cannot propagate them very long (unless they save the first isolate on a slant which would still be weak)  and it will likely be slightly weaker than the strain used by the vendor do make spores.




Do your own friggin' isolate! You think a ms syringe is gonna produce as well as a fresh isolate? And as stated before, a man's sperm (or in this case a fruits spores) aren't going to mirror the fruit it came from. Your weak strain theory is wrong.

Quote:

If one is selling spores and wants someone to be dependent on reordering, they could easily take a weak stain and put it on a slant for the purpose of making sure a strong strains spores are not sold which has a greater diversity and the possibility of generating large numbers of high quality stains.




If you want "perfect" results your going to have to do the work on agar and test or stuff and find what u want. Again, your weak strain theory is flawed.

Quote:

The time of spore germination (or weak slant culture start up) to fruit body (minus the hibernation time)  is usually not given to the spore consumer.  Why?




Because spores are supposed to be used for study, not cultivation. That's illegal!  :foreheadslap:

There are variables as to when/where spores would germinate

Quote:

This is not a flame, but a question in regards to weather this type of practice occurs or if the theory itself has holes in it.




I think your theory has holes in it.  :logic:


rrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr ..... rrrrrrr ... rrr ... r

Here man, you left all these r's out of "strain" in this thread.  :laugh2:


--------------------
My Old Grow Logs



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Offlinewood chip
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Re: weak strians and the spores they produce [Re: Wing]
    #14540982 - 05/31/11 02:42 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

fngbronco said:
Anyone can purchase anything. It's all about money and royalties. Watch Food, Inc. you'll learn how agriculture works.




Well, not anyone, they have to be very rich.  Monsanto is a good example.   

As and example in the mushroom world of high dollar strains, there exist the new GM Agriucs bisporus.   
Peter Romaine has patented this technology
Anyone think they will produce spores? 
Couple of links
https://sites.google.com/a/psu.edu/curtislab/research-projects/mushrooms
http://www.physorg.com/news114697498.html


I doubt any large agaricus spawn company will sell mother cultures in the traditional way.  Sure they have a price but it is not something anyone would pay unless they wanted to purchase the company. 

Strains are one of the most important aspects in the success or failure of a mushroom farm


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Offlineafrosheen
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Re: weak strians and the spores they produce [Re: wood chip]
    #14541947 - 05/31/11 06:05 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

:popcorn: Waiting for RR to chime in and pwn.


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Offlinek00laid
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Re: weak strians and the spores they produce [Re: wood chip]
    #14541997 - 05/31/11 06:17 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

ok so why the fuck wasnt this just posted simply before.

PE doesnt drop spores but no one just HAS to keep buying spores of that.

lern2cultureslant :shrug:

Quote:

wood chip said:
 
Peter Romaine has patented this technology
Anyone think they will produce spores? 
Couple of links
https://sites.google.com/a/psu.edu/curtislab/research-projects/mushrooms
http://www.physorg.com/news114697498.htmlm




--------------------
AMU - AMU Q & A - MyVideo Teks!


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