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Offlineskatealex2
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lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god
    #14505488 - 05/24/11 04:58 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

someone i know from my area who's deeply religious buys me food sometimes so i was talking to him earlier and he wanted to know statistics of scientists that believe in god so i sent him some, such as  in a survey of 1,646 scientists 9% believed god exists and 31% deisbelieve.  and in national science academy 96% don't believe in god.

than he replies back-

"Wow! so many crazy people out there who want to believe so that they could do whatever they want! thanks"



:rofl::rofl:  The ignorance is staggering.  I feel like religious people are just screwed from not doing their own research in their earlier days and now most of them are just attached to their beliefs.    He couldn't come up with one logical reason god exists except that 'he has to exist'.    :eyeball:  well long as he brings it up ill continue to dismantle his beliefs :shrug:  ill prob stop meeting with him tho religion talk is annoying :suicide:


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Offlinepropensity
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: skatealex2]
    #14505510 - 05/24/11 05:01 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Yes. Religion talk is annoying.

So you make a thread about religion talk.


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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: propensity]
    #14505513 - 05/24/11 05:02 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

<----- :facepalm:


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Offlineskatealex2
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: skatealex2]
    #14505518 - 05/24/11 05:03 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

i hearby denounce talking about religion    :pimp2:


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: skatealex2]
    #14505542 - 05/24/11 05:07 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

skatealex2 said:
i hearby denounce talking about religion    :pimp2:




Care to elaborate?
:maximumtrolling:


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InvisibleShins
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: skatealex2]
    #14505548 - 05/24/11 05:08 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

How do you and those scientists define god?

What if you define god as "the all" or the "source of the all?"

Don't you and scientists acknowledge the existence of existence itself?  or is there not enough "proof?" it's hard to deny God in that context.

One funny thing about science is that it is all based off of completely fallible human senses and perceptions.

I always laugh at people who think they can find absolution in science. 

Science is a tool for best proving truths, it is not the truth itself - that would be god.


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Offlineskatealex2
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: Shins]
    #14505574 - 05/24/11 05:13 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Shins said:
How do you and those scientists define god?

What if you define god as "the all" or the "source of the all?"

Don't you and scientists acknowledge the existence of existence itself?  or is there not enough "proof?" it's hard to deny God in that context.

One funny thing about science is that it is all based off of completely fallible human senses and perceptions.

I always laugh at people who think they can find absolution in science. 

Science is a tool for best proving truths, it is not the truth itself - that would be god.





I get what you are saying but my main point in arguing is that I want nothing to do with a religious god that doesn't show himself and that there is no proof he has anything to do with anything.

Science doesn't prove how are existence came to be but neither does religion.  So why should anyone praise god?    If god is real I may be greatful for my existence but I'd also feel as if he left everyone sort of hanging.  What do 100,000 year old scriptures have anything to do with anything?


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: Shins]
    #14505575 - 05/24/11 05:14 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

:horly:

how does god prove truths?


And I'm sure most of those scientists define god as do a majority of other human beings, an omniscient, omnipotent creator of everything.


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OfflineBoneMan
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: Shins] * 1
    #14505599 - 05/24/11 05:17 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

the worst part about science/scientists is that so many of them think as if humanity already knows everything there is to know about a lot of things.. and when a new idea/discovery/theory comes up they respond to it like its complete nonsensical lunacy at first.  eventually the community comes around when that controversial or revolutionary idea is proven to be correct.

but its such bullshit because science is intended to discover new information about the universe.. but when new information comes up, a lot of scientists scoff at it.  how can someone who dedicates their life to discovering new things be so closed off to new things?


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: BoneMan]
    #14505629 - 05/24/11 05:22 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

BoneMan said:
the worst part about science/scientists is that so many of them think as if humanity already knows everything there is to know about a lot of things.. and when a new idea/discovery/theory comes up they respond to it like its complete nonsensical lunacy at first.  eventually the community comes around when that controversial or revolutionary idea is proven to be correct.

but its such bullshit because science is intended to discover new information about the universe.. but when new information comes up, a lot of scientists scoff at it.  how can someone who dedicates their life to discovering new things be so closed off to new things?




Normalcy bias.

I'm sure if some earth-shattering discovery came to light with indisputable evidence, however, any logical person would accpet it as truth. Most new "discoveries" like the Higgs boson for example, are still in the theory stage.


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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #14505668 - 05/24/11 05:26 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

You guys are missing the point.  God does reveal himself but you are blind to see.  God is Everywhere, everything, and reveals himself in everything everywhere. 

God is not said to be an omnipotent man in the clouds by any Abrahamic religion, that's a misconception.


The reason god is said to be an all seeing and all knowing creator is because god IS "The All" and the source of it all. 

Acknowledging God is basically acknowledging that there is a huge universe out there beyond your little ego.


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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: Shins] * 2
    #14505676 - 05/24/11 05:27 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Why do you call it a he?

Anyway. You don't even need to call the entirety 'god', its an unnecessary extra step. Plus the word is far too stigmatized and far too misleading. Universe suffices to express itself.


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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #14505686 - 05/24/11 05:29 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
Quote:

BoneMan said:
the worst part about science/scientists is that so many of them think as if humanity already knows everything there is to know about a lot of things.. and when a new idea/discovery/theory comes up they respond to it like its complete nonsensical lunacy at first.  eventually the community comes around when that controversial or revolutionary idea is proven to be correct.

but its such bullshit because science is intended to discover new information about the universe.. but when new information comes up, a lot of scientists scoff at it.  how can someone who dedicates their life to discovering new things be so closed off to new things?




Normalcy bias.

I'm sure if some earth-shattering discovery came to light with indisputable evidence, however, any logical person would accpet it as truth. Most new "discoveries" like the Higgs boson for example, are still in the theory stage.




Good point, It's also interesting to point out that people like newton and Einstein could not have formulated their Theories of gravity without religious/occult inspiration.


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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: Shins]
    #14505690 - 05/24/11 05:30 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Yes? Why not?


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: Shins]
    #14505698 - 05/24/11 05:30 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

god =/= existence.

Your definition of god differs from 99.9% of humans.

Do I think the universe is all connected?  in a sense, yes.  That doesn't mean it's god though, it's just existence.  Matter.  Time and space.


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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: Shins]
    #14505704 - 05/24/11 05:32 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Shins said:
You guys are missing the point.  God does reveal himself but you are blind to see.  God is Everywhere, everything, and reveals himself in everything everywhere. 

God is not said to be an omnipotent man in the clouds by any Abrahamic religion, that's a misconception.


The reason god is said to be an all seeing and all knowing creator is because god IS "The All" and the source of it all. 

Acknowledging God is basically acknowledging that there is a huge universe out there beyond your little ego.





I acknowledge there is something way beyond me.............. were less than ants compared to the size of the universe haha,  but i can't claim to know if god is 'god' or just some force of nature or something. i dont know whats really going on in the big picture if im to look at the entirety of the world  :shrug:


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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: twighead]
    #14505710 - 05/24/11 05:32 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

twighead said:
Why do you call it a he?

Anyway. You don't even need to call the entirety 'god', its an unnecessary extra step. Plus the word is far too stigmatized and far too misleading. Universe suffices to express itself.





"The entirety" has been called god a lot longer than "man in the clouds" have been falsely called that.

"Universe" does not suggest creation or a creative "spirit" but more just the current state of what is.


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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: Shins] * 1
    #14505726 - 05/24/11 05:35 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Universe suggests whatever you want it to suggest - to me it is everything there has been and will be.

Anyway. Useless semantic argument.


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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #14505729 - 05/24/11 05:35 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
god =/= existence.

Your definition of god differs from 99.9% of humans.

Do I think the universe is all connected?  in a sense, yes.  That doesn't mean it's god though, it's just existence.  Matter.  Time and space.




Again, This has been the definition of the top god since ancient times.  I highly question you 99.9% number as BS.


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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #14505730 - 05/24/11 05:35 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

yea, shins, i see what you're saying, but you're not blowing all our minds with some new idea of what god is. you're just using a totally different definition than what OP means by god. and yes there are many christians who think god is a man in the clouds waiting to smite them or accept them upon death.


this is really a bizaare conversation because to discuss what 'god' is we'd have to come to an agreement on what we define 'god' to be.


in essence i see god (though i NEVER refer to anything as god and never use the term) as nature. nature truly is infinite, as far as we know this universe and all of existence is going to continue expanding and evolving....forever.

nature is the force which creates. nature is the big bang. nature is the apocalypse. nature is what breeds all life.


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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: twighead]
    #14505738 - 05/24/11 05:38 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

twighead said:
Universe suggests whatever you want it to suggest - to me it is everything there has been and will be.

Anyway. Useless semantic argument.




Does it suggest and answer to WHY everything is as it is?  why was the universe programmed the way it was to go together how it does and not another way?

I really don't think it's useless as many people obviously have different misconceptions and definitions of god, which makes polling them difficult.


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: Shins]
    #14505739 - 05/24/11 05:39 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Shins said:
Quote:

twighead said:
Why do you call it a he?

Anyway. You don't even need to call the entirety 'god', its an unnecessary extra step. Plus the word is far too stigmatized and far too misleading. Universe suffices to express itself.





"The entirety" has been called god a lot longer than "man in the clouds" have been falsely called that.

"Universe" does not suggest creation or a creative "spirit" but more just the current state of what is.




ok but why call "everything that is" god?  Can't we just label it existence, or reality, or the universe, and stamp out the confusion?


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #14505746 - 05/24/11 05:40 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

in my opinion, god is supposed to have the answers to all the "why" questions, not the "what."


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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: blazenn]
    #14505759 - 05/24/11 05:43 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

blazenn said:
yea, shins, i see what you're saying, but you're not blowing all our minds with some new idea of what god is. you're just using a totally different definition than what OP means by god. and yes there are many christians who think god is a man in the clouds waiting to smite them or accept them upon death.


this is really a bizaare conversation because to discuss what 'god' is we'd have to come to an agreement on what we define 'god' to be.


in essence i see god (though i NEVER refer to anything as god and never use the term) as nature. nature truly is infinite, as far as we know this universe and all of existence is going to continue expanding and evolving....forever.

nature is the force which creates. nature is the big bang. nature is the apocalypse. nature is what breeds all life.




Yeah fo shizzo,  The last thing i'm going to say here is;  The NATURE of the UNIVERSE is God, along with the universe itself.

That's my best definition, and fits in with ancient cultures who used stories of deities to help them understand the nature of the universe.


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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: Shins]
    #14505764 - 05/24/11 05:45 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Still semantics :lol:

My definition of the universe includes its nature and any aspect that could ever be associated with it.


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OfflineEshu
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: twighead]
    #14505963 - 05/24/11 06:27 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

twighead said:
Why do you call it a he?







I call God a He because HE is Jesus' father.

which in turn.. makes him a HE. You get it? father is to boy as boy is to he?


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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: skatealex2]
    #14506018 - 05/24/11 06:37 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Umm... that doesn't mean that there isn't proof of god.
That is just poll that a bunch of educated douchebags took.
I'm sorry I won't take a religious authorities word for it that there is a god. I sure as hell won't take a scientists word for it either.
Human beings are flawed. Question authority ALWAYS!!!
Especially when said authority has "credentials" that supposedly make them an "expert".
Usually that means that they are even more full of shit then the average bear.
Humans are so varied in their experience of "reality" that even if there was a god it is doubtful that any of them would expereince "it" in the same way.
Besides they couldn't possibly poll every single fucking scientist in the world.


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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: Eshu]
    #14506024 - 05/24/11 06:38 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

"He" is? Proof?


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OfflineEshu
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: twighead]
    #14506036 - 05/24/11 06:40 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

twighead said:
"He" is? Proof?




The Bible.

Before you go and talk your non-sense on how untrue it is. Please Prove it wrong... :awetongue:


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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: Eshu]
    #14506042 - 05/24/11 06:42 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)



Okay done.


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Offlinepropensity
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: Eshu]
    #14506104 - 05/24/11 06:55 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Eshu said:
Quote:

twighead said:
"He" is? Proof?




The Bible.

Before you go and talk your non-sense on how untrue it is. Please Prove it wrong... :awetongue:



:ifyoucanawe:

... Really?


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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: skatealex2]
    #14506255 - 05/24/11 07:20 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

What pisses me off is this

Quote:

skatealex2 said:
"Wow! so many crazy people out there who want to believe so that they could do whatever they want! thanks"





Why do people assume a world with morals can't exist without god? Atheists != sociopaths. In fact I'd be willing to bet most criminals are religious.


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: F0SS1L]
    #14506313 - 05/24/11 07:31 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

F0SS1L said:
What pisses me off is this

Quote:

skatealex2 said:
"Wow! so many crazy people out there who want to believe so that they could do whatever they want! thanks"





Why do people assume a world with morals can't exist without god? Atheists != sociopaths. In fact I'd be willing to bet most criminals are religious.




They are.  Its been proven.

http://www.holysmoke.org/icr-pri.htm

Protect your livelihood, denounce god!


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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #14506349 - 05/24/11 07:37 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
Quote:

F0SS1L said:
What pisses me off is this

Quote:

skatealex2 said:
"Wow! so many crazy people out there who want to believe so that they could do whatever they want! thanks"





Why do people assume a world with morals can't exist without god? Atheists != sociopaths. In fact I'd be willing to bet most criminals are religious.




They are.  Its been proven.

http://www.holysmoke.org/icr-pri.htm

Protect your livelihood, denounce god!



Damn that graph doesn't reflect the % of each religion in the general population of the Us at all..


There are half as many muslims in the US as Jews yet their crime rate is 7x that of Jews...
~25% of the population is catholic... ~51% Protestant yet there are more catholics in prison :smilingpuppy:
And I bet the relatively high % of rasta is thanks to weed prohibition :highdog:


--------------------
¿Check out some art m8?



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OfflineMeowMix96
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: F0SS1L]
    #14506700 - 05/24/11 08:37 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

F0SS1L said:
What pisses me off is this

Quote:

skatealex2 said:
"Wow! so many crazy people out there who want to believe so that they could do whatever they want! thanks"





Why do people assume a world with morals can't exist without god? Atheists != sociopaths. In fact I'd be willing to bet most criminals are religious.




I would be a real shit head if i was an atheist.
Instead of somewhat of a shit head. :grin:
If the atheist is intelligent then there wouldn't be any morals. Only morals that would be there would be those of convenience.
I mean logically if there is no good and evil you get away with the things that have little to no risk to get caught.
The things that you enjoy and are profitable.
You should murder if it amuses you or rape, steal... whatever your cultural taboo may be, because it wouldn't matter as long as, you could get away with it.
Most humans, including atheists, aren't logical though.... so they follow their cultural morals until death.


--------------------
The road goes on forever and the party never ends......


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OfflineMeowMix96
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #14506736 - 05/24/11 08:43 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
Quote:

F0SS1L said:
What pisses me off is this

Quote:

skatealex2 said:
"Wow! so many crazy people out there who want to believe so that they could do whatever they want! thanks"





Why do people assume a world with morals can't exist without god? Atheists != sociopaths. In fact I'd be willing to bet most criminals are religious.




http://www.holysmoke.org/icr-pri.htm

Protect your livelihood, denounce god!



I call bull shit on that study. You can't call it proven from one independent study.
Plus how many atheists are there in the world? How many muslims? How many catholics? It all varies culture to culture.
What are the nature of their crimes? Whos prisons are these? USA? China? where are these prisons at?


--------------------
The road goes on forever and the party never ends......


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InvisibleSlashOZ
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: MeowMix96]
    #14506747 - 05/24/11 08:45 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

I'm sure my post will get ignored but I'd just like to say a few things.

First, religious people should go through an atheistic phase if they want to be taken seriously by atheists.

Secondly, atheists need to go through a religious phase in order to be taken seriously by religious people.

It sounds like neither you or your friend OP have gone through such phases and are therefore, rather predictably, just arguing past each other.


--------------------
"Life sucks but in this really beautiful way" - Axl Rose
"Life's a bitch and then you die that's why we get high cuz you never know when you're gonna go." - NAS
"When people don't know what you're about they put you down and shut you out" - Black Sabbath
"An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind" - Gandhi
"Look up at me I am God, look down on me and I am evil, look at me I am you." - Charles Manson.
"Don't question my reality." - Me (as far as I know)


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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: SlashOZ]
    #14506759 - 05/24/11 08:47 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

i like to think of god as the source of consciousness


i.e. the way in which the universe may perceive itself

Quote:


In the Old Testament God declared that His name was YHWH (Exodus 6:3; 20:7; see also 3:14). Scholars believe that "YHWH," or "Yahweh" is the third person singular form of the ancient Hebrew verb, "haya," meaning "to be." The basic thrust of this verb describes the state of existence. As the third person form of haya, Yahweh literally means "I am," or "I exist." It is a description of who God is. He is the self-existing one.

To understand the importance of this we must understand the nature of Hebrew names. Hebrew names are not simply nominal devices used to identify one person from another as they are in the English language; they are actually sentences in themselves. It is similar to how the Indians named their children "rising sun" or "running bear." These were not quite complete sentences, but they were descriptions (partial sentences). God's name, YHWH, is a full sentence. It just so happens to be the shortest sentence in any language--"I am."




--------------------
smack a hoe out this dimension
continue my ascension
-bhad bhabie

rip. todcasil, acid sloth, st1llnox, zappaisgod, big worm (sketch), tim b


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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: SlashOZ]
    #14506761 - 05/24/11 08:48 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Let no inferior, incomplete human knowledge impeach divine truths,

nor any mists of incredulity prevent ones mind from touching divine mysteries.


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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: sunset_mission]
    #14506802 - 05/24/11 08:54 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

there is no "afterlife" there is only life itself. existence itself. to accept jesus is to achieve salvation, not in the afterlife- but right now. through acting as the template form of your true essence "Yeshua" (i.e. Jesus), i.e. YHWH in verb form, describing what God (I AM) DOES, this is to be free of ego and to exist completely as christ consciousness/ buddha nature/ eternal being etc. wahtever you wish to call it.. that u truly are

i went to catholic school for 12 yrs


--------------------
smack a hoe out this dimension
continue my ascension
-bhad bhabie

rip. todcasil, acid sloth, st1llnox, zappaisgod, big worm (sketch), tim b


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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: Envix] * 1
    #14506819 - 05/24/11 08:58 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Envix said:
there is no "afterlife" there is only life itself. existence itself. to accept jesus is to achieve salvation, not in the afterlife- but right now. through acting as the template form of your true essence "Yeshua" (i.e. Jesus), i.e. YHWH in verb form, describing what God (I AM) DOES, this is to be free of ego and to exist completely as christ consciousness/ buddha nature/ eternal being etc. wahtever you wish to call it.. that u truly are

i went to catholic school for 12 yrs




The only "afterlife" is when this illusory veil we are experiencing is lifted and we remember that we are yet another aspect of the Creator experiencing itself in the infinite and varied ways it can.

:pm: I found an excellent LoO study guide I think you'd appreciate! :super:


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InvisibleSlashOZ
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: sunset_mission]
    #14506866 - 05/24/11 09:08 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

sunset_mission said:
Quote:

Envix said:
there is no "afterlife" there is only life itself. existence itself. to accept jesus is to achieve salvation, not in the afterlife- but right now. through acting as the template form of your true essence "Yeshua" (i.e. Jesus), i.e. YHWH in verb form, describing what God (I AM) DOES, this is to be free of ego and to exist completely as christ consciousness/ buddha nature/ eternal being etc. wahtever you wish to call it.. that u truly are

i went to catholic school for 12 yrs




The only "afterlife" is when this illusory veil we are experiencing is lifted and we remember that we are yet another aspect of the Creator experiencing itself in the infinite and varied ways it can.

:pm: I found an excellent LoO study guide I think you'd appreciate! :super:




I'm sorry but the veil of life is lifted? What the fuck?

if anything death is having the veil being placed over us.


--------------------
"Life sucks but in this really beautiful way" - Axl Rose
"Life's a bitch and then you die that's why we get high cuz you never know when you're gonna go." - NAS
"When people don't know what you're about they put you down and shut you out" - Black Sabbath
"An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind" - Gandhi
"Look up at me I am God, look down on me and I am evil, look at me I am you." - Charles Manson.
"Don't question my reality." - Me (as far as I know)


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Invisiblemillzy
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: SlashOZ] * 1
    #14506975 - 05/24/11 09:27 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

"religious person" usually = uneducated retard, in most cases.

that being said, there are very compelling arguments for god, depending on what your definition of him/it is. people tend to ascribe god human attributes because most mythology uses the male aspect of conception as a metaphor in order to describe reality (which is again another word that is totally hung up on how you define it). idiots can pass seminary school too, so that's the conception of god that people with no intellectual depth whatsoever tend to gravitate towards. that might sound harsh but it's the truth of it. i think most militant atheism is just a scorching critique of what amounts to the dumbest of what humanity has to offer. and, i get it. but really, neither side has no clue about religion or the purpose it serves. it's a really stupid argument that has no solution and i'm really not sure why i'm even bothering to post in this thread.

/gets beer


--------------------
I'm up to my ears in unwritten words. - J.D. Salinger


Edited by millzy (05/24/11 09:28 PM)


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Offlinesunset_mission
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: SlashOZ]
    #14507038 - 05/24/11 09:36 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

SlashOZ said:
Quote:

sunset_mission said:
Quote:

Envix said:
there is no "afterlife" there is only life itself. existence itself. to accept jesus is to achieve salvation, not in the afterlife- but right now. through acting as the template form of your true essence "Yeshua" (i.e. Jesus), i.e. YHWH in verb form, describing what God (I AM) DOES, this is to be free of ego and to exist completely as christ consciousness/ buddha nature/ eternal being etc. wahtever you wish to call it.. that u truly are

i went to catholic school for 12 yrs




The only "afterlife" is when this illusory veil we are experiencing is lifted and we remember that we are yet another aspect of the Creator experiencing itself in the infinite and varied ways it can.

:pm: I found an excellent LoO study guide I think you'd appreciate! :super:




I'm sorry but the veil of life is lifted? What the fuck?

if anything death is having the veil being placed over us.




The veil of forgetfulness, i.e. forgetting your true nature, in order to allow free will to operate efficiently and so that we (as aspects of the One Infinite Creator) may partake in experiences purely and freely and experience the Creation as we choose, for if we were all incarnated with the set and certain knowledge that we are all portions of the divine it would make for a pretty boring existence, wouldn't ya think? - since nobody would do anything outside of the boundaries of peace and love and whatnot. There would be no preferences, no biases, no room for misunderstandings, and ultimately no experiences to teach us.

Quote:

THE VEIL OF FORGETFULNESS

THE VEIL IS PRESENT ONLY IN THIRD DENSITY

RA: This is the only plane of forgetting.  It is necessary for the 3rd density
entity to forget so that the mechanisms of confusion or free will may operate
upon the newly individuated consciousness complex. (B1,193)

RA: The same conditions existed in time/space (the metaphysical realms) both
before and after the veiling (or veil of forgetfulness); that is, the veiling process
is a space/time phenomenon. (B4,73)

RA: Without the veil the mind was not caught in your illusory time. (B4,94)

THE VEIL IS NEEDED IN ORDER TO HAVE "EXPERIENCE"

DON: Why must an entity come into an incarnation and lose conscious memory of what he wants
to do? Why can't he accomplish the same thing in between incarnations when the entity is aware of
what he wants to do? (B2,132)

RA: WERE THERE NO POTENTIALS FOR MISUNDERSTANDING,
THERE WOULD BE NO EXPERIENCE. (B3,24)

DON: The first change made for the extension of free will was to make the communication between
the conscious mind (Ra calls it the Matrix) and unconscious mind (Ra calls it the Potentiator)
relatively unavailable one to the other during the incarnation.  Is this correct? (B4,40)

RA: We would perhaps rather term the condition as relatively more mysteryfilled than relatively unavailable. (B4,41)
DON: The idea was then to create some type of veil between the conscious mind and the
unconscious mind.  Is this correct? (B4,41)
RA: This is correct.
DON: It was probably the design of the Logos to allow the conscious mind greater freedom under
the first distortion by partitioning it from the unconscious mind which had a greater communication
with the total mind, therefore allowing for the birth of "uneducated" portions of consciousness. Is
this correct? (B4,41)
RA: This is roughly correct. (B4,41)




Edited by sunset_mission (05/24/11 09:40 PM)


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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: sunset_mission]
    #14507092 - 05/24/11 09:48 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Law of One is the shit :thumbup:


--------------------
smack a hoe out this dimension
continue my ascension
-bhad bhabie

rip. todcasil, acid sloth, st1llnox, zappaisgod, big worm (sketch), tim b


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InvisibleSlashOZ
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: sunset_mission]
    #14507159 - 05/24/11 10:05 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

sunset_mission said:
Quote:

SlashOZ said:
Quote:

sunset_mission said:
Quote:

Envix said:
there is no "afterlife" there is only life itself. existence itself. to accept jesus is to achieve salvation, not in the afterlife- but right now. through acting as the template form of your true essence "Yeshua" (i.e. Jesus), i.e. YHWH in verb form, describing what God (I AM) DOES, this is to be free of ego and to exist completely as christ consciousness/ buddha nature/ eternal being etc. wahtever you wish to call it.. that u truly are

i went to catholic school for 12 yrs




The only "afterlife" is when this illusory veil we are experiencing is lifted and we remember that we are yet another aspect of the Creator experiencing itself in the infinite and varied ways it can.

:pm: I found an excellent LoO study guide I think you'd appreciate! :super:




I'm sorry but the veil of life is lifted? What the fuck?

if anything death is having the veil being placed over us.




The veil of forgetfulness, i.e. forgetting your true nature, in order to allow free will to operate efficiently and so that we (as aspects of the One Infinite Creator) may partake in experiences purely and freely and experience the Creation as we choose, for if we were all incarnated with the set and certain knowledge that we are all portions of the divine it would make for a pretty boring existence, wouldn't ya think? - since nobody would do anything outside of the boundaries of peace and love and whatnot. There would be no preferences, no biases, no room for misunderstandings, and ultimately no experiences to teach us.

Quote:

THE VEIL OF FORGETFULNESS

THE VEIL IS PRESENT ONLY IN THIRD DENSITY

RA: This is the only plane of forgetting.  It is necessary for the 3rd density
entity to forget so that the mechanisms of confusion or free will may operate
upon the newly individuated consciousness complex. (B1,193)

RA: The same conditions existed in time/space (the metaphysical realms) both
before and after the veiling (or veil of forgetfulness); that is, the veiling process
is a space/time phenomenon. (B4,73)

RA: Without the veil the mind was not caught in your illusory time. (B4,94)

THE VEIL IS NEEDED IN ORDER TO HAVE "EXPERIENCE"

DON: Why must an entity come into an incarnation and lose conscious memory of what he wants
to do? Why can't he accomplish the same thing in between incarnations when the entity is aware of
what he wants to do? (B2,132)

RA: WERE THERE NO POTENTIALS FOR MISUNDERSTANDING,
THERE WOULD BE NO EXPERIENCE. (B3,24)

DON: The first change made for the extension of free will was to make the communication between
the conscious mind (Ra calls it the Matrix) and unconscious mind (Ra calls it the Potentiator)
relatively unavailable one to the other during the incarnation.  Is this correct? (B4,40)

RA: We would perhaps rather term the condition as relatively more mysteryfilled than relatively unavailable. (B4,41)
DON: The idea was then to create some type of veil between the conscious mind and the
unconscious mind.  Is this correct? (B4,41)
RA: This is correct.
DON: It was probably the design of the Logos to allow the conscious mind greater freedom under
the first distortion by partitioning it from the unconscious mind which had a greater communication
with the total mind, therefore allowing for the birth of "uneducated" portions of consciousness. Is
this correct? (B4,41)
RA: This is roughly correct. (B4,41)








So i'm still not sure why you are so dogmatic about this density stuff?

Clearly if you are aware of this oneness thing then there is no veil.

furthermore preaching about oneness would only further your argument of life being lived entirely within the boundaries of love, etc, etc. teddy bears, etc.

so if their is a veil and you've found out about it wouldn't it be in our best interest to remain under the veil in order to experience this existence to its fullest, otherwise, according to you, life would be pretty boring and unfruitful.


--------------------
"Life sucks but in this really beautiful way" - Axl Rose
"Life's a bitch and then you die that's why we get high cuz you never know when you're gonna go." - NAS
"When people don't know what you're about they put you down and shut you out" - Black Sabbath
"An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind" - Gandhi
"Look up at me I am God, look down on me and I am evil, look at me I am you." - Charles Manson.
"Don't question my reality." - Me (as far as I know)


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Offlinesunset_mission
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: SlashOZ]
    #14507207 - 05/24/11 10:12 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

SlashOZ said:


So i'm still not sure why you are so dogmatic about this density stuff?

Clearly if you are aware of this oneness thing then there is no veil.

furthermore preaching about oneness would only further your argument of life being lived entirely within the boundaries of love, etc, etc. teddy bears, etc.

so if their is a veil and you've found out about it wouldn't it be in our best interest to remain under the veil in order to experience this existence to its fullest, otherwise, according to you, life would be pretty boring and unfruitful.




Lol "this density stuff". Densities only refer to different levels of consciousness. The Law of One isn't dogmatic or imposing in that

1 – The principle is universally applicable, non sectarian, available to all.
2 – No particular skills and knowledge are required. It works for everyone.
3 – It is based on the respect of Free Will, with no manipulation.
4 – It is self-empowering, and based on individual choices.
5 – It does not rely on judgement, and is based on unconditional love.
6 – It is non-dogmatic.
7 – It promotes unity, rather than separation.

And regardless of whether someone chooses the negative or positive path, one with crackwhores and fistfights or peaceful meditation, it's all the same. Religions would like to say otherwise, thus creating an elite and dividing rather than unifying. They don't tell you that regardless of the path you choose there is no fire and brimstone waiting


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InvisibleSlashOZ
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: sunset_mission]
    #14507234 - 05/24/11 10:19 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

sunset_mission said:
Quote:

SlashOZ said:


So i'm still not sure why you are so dogmatic about this density stuff?

Clearly if you are aware of this oneness thing then there is no veil.

furthermore preaching about oneness would only further your argument of life being lived entirely within the boundaries of love, etc, etc. teddy bears, etc.

so if their is a veil and you've found out about it wouldn't it be in our best interest to remain under the veil in order to experience this existence to its fullest, otherwise, according to you, life would be pretty boring and unfruitful.




Lol "this density stuff". Densities only refer to different levels of consciousness. The Law of One isn't dogmatic or imposing in that

1 – The principle is universally applicable, non sectarian, available to all.
2 – No particular skills and knowledge are required. It works for everyone.
3 – It is based on the respect of Free Will, with no manipulation.
4 – It is self-empowering, and based on individual choices.
5 – It does not rely on judgement, and is based on unconditional love.
6 – It is non-dogmatic.
7 – It promotes unity, rather than separation.

And regardless of whether someone chooses the negative or positive path, one with crackwhores and fistfights or peaceful meditation, it's all the same. Religions would like to say otherwise, thus creating an elite and dividing rather than unifying. They don't tell you that regardless of the path you choose there is no fire and brimstone waiting




I'll give you that last paragraph because I agree pretty much 100%.

I still don't get the arbitrary 3rd density stuff though. Why not label it 1-100 flavors of gummy bears or something equally as arbitrary? In fact, why not just stick with the second half of your thread instead of creating some sort of imposed hierarchy of consciousness????


--------------------
"Life sucks but in this really beautiful way" - Axl Rose
"Life's a bitch and then you die that's why we get high cuz you never know when you're gonna go." - NAS
"When people don't know what you're about they put you down and shut you out" - Black Sabbath
"An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind" - Gandhi
"Look up at me I am God, look down on me and I am evil, look at me I am you." - Charles Manson.
"Don't question my reality." - Me (as far as I know)


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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: SlashOZ]
    #14507275 - 05/24/11 10:25 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

SlashOZ said:
Quote:

sunset_mission said:
Quote:

SlashOZ said:


So i'm still not sure why you are so dogmatic about this density stuff?

Clearly if you are aware of this oneness thing then there is no veil.

furthermore preaching about oneness would only further your argument of life being lived entirely within the boundaries of love, etc, etc. teddy bears, etc.

so if their is a veil and you've found out about it wouldn't it be in our best interest to remain under the veil in order to experience this existence to its fullest, otherwise, according to you, life would be pretty boring and unfruitful.




Lol "this density stuff". Densities only refer to different levels of consciousness. The Law of One isn't dogmatic or imposing in that

1 – The principle is universally applicable, non sectarian, available to all.
2 – No particular skills and knowledge are required. It works for everyone.
3 – It is based on the respect of Free Will, with no manipulation.
4 – It is self-empowering, and based on individual choices.
5 – It does not rely on judgement, and is based on unconditional love.
6 – It is non-dogmatic.
7 – It promotes unity, rather than separation.

And regardless of whether someone chooses the negative or positive path, one with crackwhores and fistfights or peaceful meditation, it's all the same. Religions would like to say otherwise, thus creating an elite and dividing rather than unifying. They don't tell you that regardless of the path you choose there is no fire and brimstone waiting




I'll give you that last paragraph because I agree pretty much 100%.

I still don't get the arbitrary 3rd density stuff though. Why not label it 1-100 flavors of gummy bears or something equally as arbitrary? In fact, why not just stick with the second half of your thread instead of creating some sort of imposed hierarchy of consciousness????




Densities just refer to the set levels of consciousness we progress through.

1st Density - Growth (i.e. fire, wind, earth, water)
2nd Density - Awareness (animals, trees)
3rd Density - Self-Awareness
4th Density - Love or understanding

y'know what I'll :pm: you the source I am citing from as to not derail this thread and because I've went off on loooong Law of One tangents when left to my own devices in the past and I'm trying to keep that to a minimum for the sake of the Shroomery.


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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: sunset_mission]
    #14507310 - 05/24/11 10:32 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

sunset_mission said:
Quote:

SlashOZ said:
Quote:

sunset_mission said:
Quote:

SlashOZ said:


So i'm still not sure why you are so dogmatic about this density stuff?

Clearly if you are aware of this oneness thing then there is no veil.

furthermore preaching about oneness would only further your argument of life being lived entirely within the boundaries of love, etc, etc. teddy bears, etc.

so if their is a veil and you've found out about it wouldn't it be in our best interest to remain under the veil in order to experience this existence to its fullest, otherwise, according to you, life would be pretty boring and unfruitful.




Lol "this density stuff". Densities only refer to different levels of consciousness. The Law of One isn't dogmatic or imposing in that

1 – The principle is universally applicable, non sectarian, available to all.
2 – No particular skills and knowledge are required. It works for everyone.
3 – It is based on the respect of Free Will, with no manipulation.
4 – It is self-empowering, and based on individual choices.
5 – It does not rely on judgement, and is based on unconditional love.
6 – It is non-dogmatic.
7 – It promotes unity, rather than separation.

And regardless of whether someone chooses the negative or positive path, one with crackwhores and fistfights or peaceful meditation, it's all the same. Religions would like to say otherwise, thus creating an elite and dividing rather than unifying. They don't tell you that regardless of the path you choose there is no fire and brimstone waiting




I'll give you that last paragraph because I agree pretty much 100%.

I still don't get the arbitrary 3rd density stuff though. Why not label it 1-100 flavors of gummy bears or something equally as arbitrary? In fact, why not just stick with the second half of your thread instead of creating some sort of imposed hierarchy of consciousness????




Densities just refer to the set levels of consciousness we progress through.

1st Density - Growth (i.e. fire, wind, earth, water)
2nd Density - Awareness (animals, trees)
3rd Density - Self-Awareness
4th Density - Love or understanding

y'know what I'll :pm: you the source I am citing from as to not derail this thread and because I've went off on loooong Law of One tangents when left to my own devices in the past and I'm trying to keep that to a minimum for the sake of the Shroomery.





i'd rather you not send me an appeal to authority as that is not a sound way to prove things.

oneness is not something i disagree with. the whole arbitrary labeling and categorizing of reality is what i'm disagreeing with. if all things are truly one then there are not different densities to reality. all distinctions are in the end, false. to try and justify this whole density thing is really counterproductive to the oneness argument.


--------------------
"Life sucks but in this really beautiful way" - Axl Rose
"Life's a bitch and then you die that's why we get high cuz you never know when you're gonna go." - NAS
"When people don't know what you're about they put you down and shut you out" - Black Sabbath
"An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind" - Gandhi
"Look up at me I am God, look down on me and I am evil, look at me I am you." - Charles Manson.
"Don't question my reality." - Me (as far as I know)


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Offlinesunset_mission
Entheonaut
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: SlashOZ]
    #14507353 - 05/24/11 10:39 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Read the Law of One, you'll understand it. This isn't some arbitrary lulzy labeling I'm spouting off, these are the apparent levels of consciousness all things everywhere move through as they return back to the Source.

www.lawofone.info
study guide: http://home.comcast.net/~super-manny/eBooks/The%20Law%20of%20One%20Study%20Guide%20V.2.pdf

As we are all one, stop arguing with yourself. :crazy2:


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OfflineTheHandOfDoom
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: sunset_mission]
    #14507541 - 05/24/11 11:20 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

How can you be sure this isn't some sort of arbitrary lulzy bullshit your talking about? Are you schizophrenic or something? I'm gonna label you crazy..
:awedance:


--------------------
:niggawe::niggawe::niggawe::niggawe::Awesketch::niggawe::niggawe::niggawe:


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InvisibleSophistic Radiance
Free sVs!
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: millzy]
    #14507583 - 05/24/11 11:28 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

millzy said:
"religious person" usually = uneducated retard, in most cases.

that being said, there are very compelling arguments for god, depending on what your definition of him/it is. people tend to ascribe god human attributes because most mythology uses the male aspect of conception as a metaphor in order to describe reality (which is again another word that is totally hung up on how you define it). idiots can pass seminary school too, so that's the conception of god that people with no intellectual depth whatsoever tend to gravitate towards. that might sound harsh but it's the truth of it. i think most militant atheism is just a scorching critique of what amounts to the dumbest of what humanity has to offer. and, i get it. but really, neither side has no clue about religion or the purpose it serves. it's a really stupid argument that has no solution and i'm really not sure why i'm even bothering to post in this thread.

/gets beer




:cheers:


--------------------
Enlil said:
You really are the worst kind of person.



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OfflineMr.Qabalistic
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: Sophistic Radiance]
    #14507631 - 05/24/11 11:38 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

I personally believe that if my God (this is my God im talking about now, im not sure if you have a God or no God or what ever) reviled him self to the world as of to present him self as is/ a spirit fully/directly in front of you that the majority of people would be utterly destroyed from the evil working in their lives- it would all just scramble and they would die.


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Offlinesunset_mission
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: TheHandOfDoom]
    #14508548 - 05/25/11 06:07 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

TheHandOfDoom said:
How can you be sure this isn't some sort of arbitrary lulzy bullshit your talking about? Are you schizophrenic or something? I'm gonna label you crazy..
:awedance:




The elves told me. :dumblol:


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OfflineKada
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: Mr.Qabalistic]
    #14508569 - 05/25/11 06:22 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

I can't believe how bat shit crazy some of you are.


--------------------
~The Cultivators Motherload~

"I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them.
I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do." -Robert A. Heinlein

"There is no need for temples, no need for complicated philosophies.
My brain and my heart are my temples; my philosophy is kindness."-Dalai Lama

Live long and prosper.



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OfflineEnvix
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: Kada]
    #14510097 - 05/25/11 02:17 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

people who arent crazy are boring :yawn:


--------------------
smack a hoe out this dimension
continue my ascension
-bhad bhabie

rip. todcasil, acid sloth, st1llnox, zappaisgod, big worm (sketch), tim b


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OfflineKada
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: Envix]
    #14510231 - 05/25/11 02:46 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

True. I like crazy, but when you throw religion in with it that's when things start getting fucked up.


--------------------
~The Cultivators Motherload~

"I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them.
I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do." -Robert A. Heinlein

"There is no need for temples, no need for complicated philosophies.
My brain and my heart are my temples; my philosophy is kindness."-Dalai Lama

Live long and prosper.



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Invisiblemillzy
Male

Registered: 05/12/10
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Re: lol- talking over a religous person showing there is no proof of god [Re: Kada]
    #14511704 - 05/25/11 08:17 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

i think the afterlife has more to do with our egotistical need for justice. people seem to have this desire to be rewarded for all the good they've done and all the evil that's been done to them to be punished. it's all about us. i think that's a natural response that is deeply rooted in how we are wired for survival. but i also think it's important to recognize that when looking through the lens that religion can provide. for me, the concept of the afterlife is better when applied to events in my life. i can easily look back at periods of my life when i was a distinctly different person, and i can mark that person's birth and i can mark exactly when that person died, and i can apply the mythological framework of religion to that cycle in order to better understand myself and my place in....whatever it is that this is that we all seem to be a part of. i think that when religion is used in this way it can provide some very remarkable personal incite, and i also think that this is the exact way that it is intended to be used.

when your body dies, the need for an ego becomes unnecessary, and you wouldn't have a living brain to produce whatever it is that you're sensing. that being said, i think whatever happens is probably okay, even if you go out in a really terrible way. in the end i bet it's pretty peaceful. one thing we can all certainly agree on is that we'll all find out one day.


--------------------
I'm up to my ears in unwritten words. - J.D. Salinger


Edited by millzy (05/25/11 08:22 PM)


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