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InvisibleSpector
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Registered: 05/13/11
Posts: 167
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Re: Is this the way to get potent mushrooms? [Re: 3n1gm4]
    #14502244 - 05/24/11 12:17 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

3n1gm4 said:
Quote:

wygram said:
You are still talking about doing this backwards. Start with spores, isolate single sector strains and fruit each to test. When you wait to clone desirable mushrooms the various "strains" have mixed already, diluting the characteristics of any great strains that were in the mix.




Okay TYVM, very good to the point answer that I was looking for. It is amazing how a few simple words can open your eyes and make you understand the complex things others have said.:awesomenod::thumbup: for wygram!



lol, the knowledge!!! the ppowweerrrrr! eerrrrraahhh!!!

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Offline3n1gm4
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Re: Is this the way to get potent mushrooms? [Re: Spector]
    #14502252 - 05/24/11 12:19 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

The person that told me the compatible strains from a clone would be less and easier to isolate was BSing me.


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Invisiblewygram
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Re: Is this the way to get potent mushrooms? [Re: Spector]
    #14502259 - 05/24/11 12:21 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Spector said:
could you go in a lil more in depth please?



When you start spores the genetic pool contains great, decent and crappy genes. As the spores grow they exchange genetic material between the various individual "strains." In the time the mycelium grows on the grain it combines great genetics with bad ones. After spawning, as the mycelium colonizes the substrate it combines great genetics with bad ones. By the time you see fruits, they are composed of strains that are an average of what you started with.

Starting with spores and isolating quickly before they have too much time to mix, gives you strains that have more variety and greater difference between each other. Many will be crappy, but a few will be outstanding. Performing the isolations early also lets you store fresh young mycelium in stasis as you test each isolate, allowing you to then go back and get fresh fast growing mycelium to work with.


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InvisibleSpector
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Re: Is this the way to get potent mushrooms? [Re: wygram]
    #14502284 - 05/24/11 12:26 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

ok cool, yea thats basically what we've been discussing thru the thread. but you summed it up great!

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Invisiblebbox244
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Re: Is this the way to get potent mushrooms? [Re: Spector]
    #14502536 - 05/24/11 01:28 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

I have a question regarding a possibility of potency measure without the use of chromatography....  We all know that psilocin oxidizes and turns blue.  I've noticed that on some of the stronger mushies I've had, my mouth turns black as I chew.  Now, since psilocin is the active we're looking for, and it turns blue when oxidized.  What if someone took a fixed size sample of a fruit, under a specific atmosphere, couldn't you gauge psilocin content by discoloration over a fixed period of time?  Just a thought.


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Offline3n1gm4
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Re: Is this the way to get potent mushrooms? [Re: bbox244]
    #14502566 - 05/24/11 01:36 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

My mouth turns black when I eat my print caps too.


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Invisiblewygram
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Re: Is this the way to get potent mushrooms? [Re: 3n1gm4]
    #14502790 - 05/24/11 03:29 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Psilocybin and psilocin levels in twenty species from seven genera of wild mushrooms in the Pacific Northwest, USA
MW Beug… - Journal of Ethnopharmacology, 1982 - Elsevier

... Recreational users of hallucinogenic mushrooms sometimes regard the intensity of
bluing as a guide to psilocybin and psilocin levels, but we could find no correlation
between degree of bluing and either psilocybin or psilo- cin levels. ...


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Offline3n1gm4
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Re: Is this the way to get potent mushrooms? [Re: wygram]
    #14502804 - 05/24/11 03:41 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Someone did a study on the active amounts dried and fresh, someone should do a study on the amounts in specific sub-strains using the same alcohol extraction and measure the levels of the actives from race/variety/strains dry/wet. Hurry and get started so I can read it in a few years.:awesomenod::thumbup::mushroomgrow::super:


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InvisibleSpector
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Re: Is this the way to get potent mushrooms? [Re: mill]
    #14503294 - 05/24/11 08:12 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

3n1gm4 said:
Someone did a study on the active amounts dried and fresh, someone should do a study on the amounts in specific sub-strains using the same alcohol extraction and measure the levels of the actives from race/variety/strains dry/wet. Hurry and get started so I can read it in a few years.:awesomenod::thumbup::mushroomgrow::super:




In a nation that common ppl do things like that on there own, would be a nation were We didnt elect president bush for two terms. Or where our #1 cause of death was not a Choice, but an addiction.

Quote:

mill said:
I 100% agree with Koolaid about what he said. Want an harder trip, then eat more shrooms.




not trying to insult you mill, just quoting :awelol:


But to add to Bbox comment, i would say thats a good idea. I would also say if thats the case in measuring potency then the scale could be set as blueing at Cubic centimeter, or Area. does that make sense to you guys?

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Offlinek00laid
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Re: Is this the way to get potent mushrooms? [Re: Spector]
    #14503384 - 05/24/11 08:45 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

wygram said:
Psilocybin and psilocin levels in twenty species from seven genera of wild mushrooms in the Pacific Northwest, USA
MW Beug… - Journal of Ethnopharmacology, 1982 - Elsevier

... Recreational users of hallucinogenic mushrooms sometimes regard the intensity of
bluing as a guide to psilocybin and psilocin levels, but we could find no correlation
between degree of bluing and either psilocybin or psilo- cin levels. ...



Quote:

Spector said:
if thats the case in measuring potency then the scale could be set as blueing at Cubic centimeter, or Area. does that make sense to you guys?




NO BECAUSE BLUEING HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH POTENCY.

did you read this whole thread?


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InvisibleSpector
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Re: Is this the way to get potent mushrooms? [Re: k00laid]
    #14503436 - 05/24/11 09:09 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

i guess not there skippy.

you still on your mission to
catch me when im down? lol

but like you out lined in bold letters
that was in 1982, is there anything new
on bluing?

Edited by Spector (05/24/11 09:11 AM)

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Offlinek00laid
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Re: Is this the way to get potent mushrooms? [Re: bbox244]
    #14503443 - 05/24/11 09:11 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

bbox244 said:
We all know that psilocin oxidizes and turns blue. Now, since psilocin is the active we're looking for, and it turns blue when oxidized.  What if someone took a fixed size sample of a fruit, under a specific atmosphere, couldn't you gauge psilocin content by discoloration over a fixed period of time?




no im on a mission to correct all of this bullshit information.

people will be coming to this thread through the search engine. and then they see this bs.

and then they see a TC post that its bullshit

and then they see someone post like the TC didnt say anything.

mixed signals bro. :shrug: we want good information on these boards.


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InvisibleSpector
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Re: Is this the way to get potent mushrooms? [Re: k00laid]
    #14503453 - 05/24/11 09:13 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

yea, and your packed full of it.
funny that you state its to post good info,
but only post when I happend to mis-read or
state sumthing incorrectly.

oh and if you just put sumtime into reading
the post, you'll see that iv Quoted TC's that
verified sum, if not most of our discussion,
and clarified anything in question.
you can keep to just looking over our post
for typos and misspellings now, lol

Edited by Spector (05/24/11 09:17 AM)

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Offlinek00laid
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Re: Is this the way to get potent mushrooms? [Re: Spector]
    #14503460 - 05/24/11 09:16 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

i try to post good info. but mostly i correct bad info.
:/ isolating for potency is isolating at random.

and you cant test for potency besides eating them.

and its (in my opinion) impossible to use subjective test subjects to determine potency.

and you certainly cannot determine it by how blue your fruit is.


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InvisibleSpector
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Re: Is this the way to get potent mushrooms? [Re: k00laid]
    #14503471 - 05/24/11 09:21 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

i added on to my post before yours. here ill quote it for ya.
Quote:

Spector said:

oh and if you just put sumtime into reading
the post, you'll see that iv Quoted TC's that
verified sum, if not most of our discussion,
and clarified anything in question.
you can keep to just looking over our post
for typos and misspellings now, lol



but for real this convo adds nothing to this thread,
so lets just leave it at this. =]

Edited by Spector (05/24/11 09:21 AM)

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Offlinek00laid
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Re: Is this the way to get potent mushrooms? [Re: Spector]
    #14503484 - 05/24/11 09:26 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

no one has verified anything about blue = psilocin oxidizing.

what about species of mushrooms that bruise blue but contain absolutely NO psilocin or psilocybin?


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Invisiblefloatindownsligo
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Re: Is this the way to get potent mushrooms? [Re: Spector]
    #14503493 - 05/24/11 09:28 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

OP- If you are truly interested in hunting down the most potent isolates, i would just simply eat 95% of the fruit body to "test" it out, and leave the other 5% to dry out. after you have determined the most potent, take the dried piece and start it on agar.
good luck, a very nice experiment indeed!


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InvisibleSpector
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Re: Is this the way to get potent mushrooms? [Re: k00laid]
    #14503519 - 05/24/11 09:37 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

k00laid said:
no one has verified anything about blue = psilocin oxidizing.

what about species of mushrooms that bruise blue but contain absolutely NO psilocin or psilocybin?




that was a quick question from sumbody who had one, lmao
it was only briefly discussed recently. i was talkin about
everything before that. it was an quick idea, anything else?
lmao!

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OfflineKarate_donkey
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Re: Is this the way to get potent mushrooms? [Re: Spector]
    #14505116 - 05/24/11 03:35 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

thanks guys with this thread and the other reading ive been doing i have learned alot.
one more quick question. when trying to get a good isolate, would a clone be a good place to start instead of spores on agar. correct me if im wrong but if i cloned to agar would i not start out with less isolates making it a little easier. Would I not already know that all the isolates from the clone would be fruiters?


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Invisiblefloatindownsligo
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Re: Is this the way to get potent mushrooms? [Re: Karate_donkey]
    #14505453 - 05/24/11 04:52 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

its definitely possible to only have one isolate when cloning a piece of tissue, but it is also possible to have several sub-species, but after growing it out a few times growing them out and repeating the steps you will quickly end up with a better and more stable isolate.


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