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OfflineSolomon Ash
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Is the world getting better or worse?
    #14461644 - 05/16/11 11:41 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

In terms of how you see current trends and your future life chances, do you think that things are generally getting better or worse? In other words, do you expect the future will be better or worse than the present?

Are you in broad terms optimistic or pessimistic about the future?
Is the world getting better or wose?
You may choose only one


Votes accepted from (05/16/11 11:41 AM) to (No end specified)
You must vote before you can view the results of this poll



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InvisibleLe_Canard
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: Solomon Ash]
    #14463330 - 05/16/11 05:26 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Eh, some things will get better and some things will get worse, as they always have.


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Offlineweedist
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: Le_Canard]
    #14492243 - 05/22/11 12:57 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

well the world didnt end, so thats a plus :thumbup:


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: Solomon Ash] * 1
    #14500662 - 05/23/11 06:53 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Thomas Berry was once asked whether he was an optimist or a pessimist.  He replied, "Oh, I've never been either of those.  Apocalypse is our only hope."

The point I take from this is that the evil in this world can seem to get overwhelming until it runs up against its own contradictions and gives way to something new, somewhat like Hegel described, though not as strictly deterministic.  This, I think, is what the idea of eschatology is getting at.  We have seen the abolition of chattel slavery, which had existed since the beginning of civilization.  We have seen the rise of women's rights.  We have seen monarchies give way to liberal democracy.  That gives me hope.

There are plenty of things that seem to be getting worse right now.  Human civilization is continuing an unsustainable course which could have catastrophic ecological consequences.  Large international corporations are becoming more and more empowered and their interests are taking hold of politics more than ever before.  Speculators and rentiers are gaining a foothold on the economy over the actual forces of production.  None of this is sustainable, and that which cannot be sustained will not be sustained.  There is indeed some uncertainty as to whether it will end peacefully or in a disaster.  My suspicion is that some crisis is inevitable, but that the ultimate outcome will be a net gain for humanity, and we'll be all the better for it.  I do believe that humanity does have the capacity to learn from the past.  I believe, as Martin Luther King put it, that "The arc of the moral universe is long, but it bends toward justice."


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Invisible4runner
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: Silversoul]
    #14501834 - 05/23/11 10:33 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Ouch, pessimists, the lot of ya.


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OfflineBothHands
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: Silversoul]
    #14501865 - 05/23/11 10:42 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Silversoul said:
Thomas Berry was once asked whether he was an optimist or a pessimist.  He replied, "Oh, I've never been either of those.  Apocalypse is our only hope."

The point I take from this is that the evil in this world can seem to get overwhelming until it runs up against its own contradictions and gives way to something new, somewhat like Hegel described, though not as strictly deterministic.  This, I think, is what the idea of eschatology is getting at.  We have seen the abolition of chattel slavery, which had existed since the beginning of civilization.  We have seen the rise of women's rights.  We have seen monarchies give way to liberal democracy.  That gives me hope.

There are plenty of things that seem to be getting worse right now.  Human civilization is continuing an unsustainable course which could have catastrophic ecological consequences.  Large international corporations are becoming more and more empowered and their interests are taking hold of politics more than ever before.  Speculators and rentiers are gaining a foothold on the economy over the actual forces of production.  None of this is sustainable, and that which cannot be sustained will not be sustained.  There is indeed some uncertainty as to whether it will end peacefully or in a disaster.  My suspicion is that some crisis is inevitable, but that the ultimate outcome will be a net gain for humanity, and we'll be all the better for it.  I do believe that humanity does have the capacity to learn from the past.  I believe, as Martin Luther King put it, that "The arc of the moral universe is long, but it bends toward justice."




Damn good post.  +5


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OfflineDrGreenThumb865
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: BothHands]
    #14525996 - 05/28/11 11:39 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Definitely worse... Seems like freedom has completely gone out the window, there's more war now than ever, and oil spills all over the gulf. If our forefathers could see us now, they would shake their heads in disbelief and shame.


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:mushdance:




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OfflineOboy
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: DrGreenThumb865]
    #14526622 - 05/28/11 02:19 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

DrGreenThumb865 said:
Definitely worse... Seems like freedom has completely gone out the window, there's more war now than ever, and oil spills all over the gulf. If our forefathers could see us now, they would shake their heads in disbelief and shame.



:whathesaid:


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OfflineBothHands
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: Oboy]
    #14526635 - 05/28/11 02:25 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Would you prefer to live in the dark ages?  Executed as a heritic for having logic, common sense, or furthering science?


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Invisibleowls
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: BothHands]
    #14532724 - 05/29/11 08:05 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

both simultaneously


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i love you

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OfflinePinniesPlox
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: owls]
    #14534651 - 05/30/11 07:12 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)



Google Kali Yuga for some insight correlative to this poll.


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I've got bigger blunts to smoke...


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OfflineHashishin13
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: PinniesPlox] * 2
    #14546716 - 06/01/11 04:39 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

All these people thinking that the world is getting worse are just funny. They must know absolutely no history.

It reminds me of these people called primitivists who think we should go back to nature and try living off the land, clearly not realizing that this would be a death warrant for over 95% of humanity.

All you need ot know about whether the world is getting better or worse is to look at average lifespans, and the technology we have all around us.

death=bad, living=good. We are living longer and therefor the world is better. Also all this new technology allows us to learn about anything and everything at speeds which outpace even the harshest of moralizing bureocrats, this site stands testament to that fact.

GET SOME PERSPECTIVE PEOPLE JESUS!


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It will be found an unjust and unwise jealousy to deprive a man of his natural liberty upon the supposition he may abuse it.
-George Washington


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Offlinedomite
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: Hashishin13]
    #14548626 - 06/01/11 11:27 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

"death=bad, living=good. We are living longer and therefor the world is better."





Isn't this kind of silly?


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OfflineLeeHarvOz
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: domite]
    #14548699 - 06/01/11 11:49 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

As i see it the purpose of the human race could very well be similar to that of a parasite, to feast upon our host's (Planet Earth) resources at its expense until it succumbs to our infestation. I see no problem with humanity filling this role but it most likely means that the world is getting worse.
we have been slowly destroying it for most of our modern existence in order to expand untill our infestation reached to all corners of the globe. the pace has picked up dramatically since the industrial revolution with no signs of slowing down. in fact it only seems that things are getting worse as time goes on and as technology advances. our technology is already beginning to turn on the planet in ways that are beginning to affect its ability to sustain life. for fucks sake japan's getting radioactive and we cant do a thing to stop it, and when we fuck up and unleash endless streams of oil into the ocean it takes months to fix our mistakes.
the world is fucked, my advice is sit back and enjoy the fall.


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InvisibleDieCommie

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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: Solomon Ash]
    #14550580 - 06/02/11 12:06 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

I think the world is very much getting better for humans, and by and large, has been for thousands of years.


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Offlinei like cow poo
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: DieCommie]
    #14551067 - 06/02/11 02:09 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

I heard something like there is a higher percentage of depression then ever. But who knows how accurate that is?
Personally I like living in this age compared to when they had the Black Plague that killed millions. Or being burned at the stake for being called a witch.:devil:
IDK life will always have some suffering, but a good dick suckin can help you forget about that for an hour or two:laugh2:


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InvisibleDistorted Vision
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: i like cow poo]
    #14556484 - 06/03/11 04:46 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

It's neither. There are still trillions of creatures bleeding to death as we speak, and trillions of creatures loving life. There is no better or worse.


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"Yo yo just here to spread my clit and show ya'll what a wonderful and free being we are all inside lets take the acid and turn inside into the outside come on over baby lets smell the roses ohh ohh come on we're about to get lit show my undies to your baby I'll hug it down three times go around frown come on we aint a nice clown kiss me upside down down down come on sorry if you cant handle my wokeness come on lets take her panties off write shroomery on my asshole and taste it lick it make if feel like we was 1978 come on baby lets do the locamotion"-Twig dude


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OfflineHashishin13
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: LeeHarvOz]
    #14558203 - 06/03/11 11:10 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

This view of humanity as a plague is incredibly masocistic and self-hating. We are the only animals that have ever existed with enough brain power to EVEN COMPREHEND the CONCEPT of earth, so how could you possibly look down on our species?

If we are doing badly in your eyes, we are still good overall because before us THERE WAS NO SUCH THING AS BAD. Morality and caring for other species ORIGINATED WITH US.

Also your assesment of the current state of affairs is just wrong on many levels, the earths resources are still incredibly plentiful, we have only even finished MAPPING the earth less then 100 years ago.

Sure we may have caused a new mass extinction during the adolescence of our species, but the rise of the enviromental movement is an indication that we are maturing. Also to think that we should hate ourselves for causing one out of the 7-8 mass extinctions that have happend in the past is incredibly short-sighted and unfair. If the universe can get away with 7 without being hated and reviled, why can't we get away with 1?

ALSO if you take the long view, the whole earth and everything in it will eventually crash into the sun, or the sun will explode. If Any trace of life including us alone escapes this fate then killing every other living thing on Earth would be forgivable. Considering that we are the only hope of this occuring, anything we do to any of the other animals short of hideous torture can be EASILY justified.

The world is far from "fucked", our lifespans have tripled in the last few hundred years and we have become aware of the environment and started changing our habits, if thats "fucked" I hope it gets as "fucked" as it possibly can. Dial the "fucking" of the earth up to twelve please.


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It will be found an unjust and unwise jealousy to deprive a man of his natural liberty upon the supposition he may abuse it.
-George Washington


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OfflineHashishin13
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: domite]
    #14559317 - 06/04/11 09:24 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Silly? So you think its silly to use being free from disease and living longer as a general rule for life being better? I don't think there are "happiness" scales, so what would you suggest?

Also any account for increased depression has to take into account that many more people are alive to even experience depression then in the past. Surely being alive and being depressed is better then being dead? At least if your alive there is hope that things could get better, death is hopeless.


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It will be found an unjust and unwise jealousy to deprive a man of his natural liberty upon the supposition he may abuse it.
-George Washington


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Offlinedevek
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: Hashishin13]
    #14567805 - 06/06/11 02:24 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

If you scratch the skin of the “modern” man there is still a brutal Neanderthal lurking in the darkness of our collective psyche: men who can kill, rape, and commit the most gruesome atrocities.


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Offlineweedist
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: devek]
    #14577879 - 06/08/11 01:32 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

devek said:
If you scratch the skin of the “modern” man there is still a brutal Neanderthal lurking in the darkness of our collective psyche: men who can kill, rape, and commit the most gruesome atrocities.



just because we can doesnt mean we will


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OfflinePrecariousCibarius
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: weedist]
    #14581525 - 06/08/11 07:38 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

I'm all for optimism and everything but...



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OfflineHashishin13
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: PrecariousCibarius]
    #14585340 - 06/09/11 12:37 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Overpopulation is a myth, the more people we have the more things we can get done. Also the more people we have the biger our markets become, and with mroe potential consumers there will be more products at cheaper prices.

Why do you think there are dozens of movie theatres in a city but only one in a town? Its population density and potential customers that encourage more theatres.

Also population growth is slowing down in almost all the countries, the developed world is actually in decline if you look at native births.

Humans aren't bacteria, we think and therefore self limit our population when birth control is available and when there are incentives to have less kids.

In the developing world they need more children to work on farms or earn money so the family doesn't starve, as countries get developed it becmoes a net cash loss to have kids so people have less.


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It will be found an unjust and unwise jealousy to deprive a man of his natural liberty upon the supposition he may abuse it.
-George Washington


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OfflinePrecariousCibarius
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: Hashishin13]
    #14591571 - 06/10/11 05:09 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

.... yeah i'm gonna have to disagree with you on that one... who's to say that more movie theaters is a good thing when it does nothing for the human race or the planet in general? i'm not a greeny tree hugger but I think that we as a species are in the midst of a huge dilemma whereby our illusions of what is proper and necessary for existence no longer fundamentally coincide with natural order. It's to the point now where it's almost completely illegal to live outside of contemporary human society and get back to a more natural existence.

and dude.. there are WAY too many people on the planet. you must be smoking some crazy shit


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OfflinePrecariousCibarius
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: PrecariousCibarius]
    #14591581 - 06/10/11 05:11 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

i'd keep the internet though - it's radness.


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: Hashishin13]
    #14591602 - 06/10/11 05:16 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Hashishin13 said:
Overpopulation is a myth, the more people we have the more things we can get done. Also the more people we have the biger our markets become, and with mroe potential consumers there will be more products at cheaper prices.

Why do you think there are dozens of movie theatres in a city but only one in a town? Its population density and potential customers that encourage more theatres.

Also population growth is slowing down in almost all the countries, the developed world is actually in decline if you look at native births.

Humans aren't bacteria, we think and therefore self limit our population when birth control is available and when there are incentives to have less kids.

In the developing world they need more children to work on farms or earn money so the family doesn't starve, as countries get developed it becmoes a net cash loss to have kids so people have less.



You're on the right track, but you seem to imply that more people is always good, which I can't get behind.  It's true that overpopulation is a myth in the sense of the Earth's current carrying capacity.  The Earth can easily support the current population and a few billion more.  But there is an upper limit to its carrying capacity.  Fortunately, birth rates are already starting to level off, and we're unlikely to ever reach that upper limit.


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OfflinePrecariousCibarius
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: PrecariousCibarius]
    #14591705 - 06/10/11 05:38 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

lets hope so. I'll agree that we are beginning to moderate ourselves better - things will probably get way better with continued and appropriate resource management. But i still think that there's a heavy imbalance within the world - a lack of sustainability driven by growth mentality.

what is it exactly that we are growing FOR in the first place? that's what I'm trying to get at.. everyone's running in the same direction.. jobs jobs jobs, push push push, money money money... but why? What are we trying to do? If we're just trying to get along and live together on the planet from now until the end of time (meaning "this is it, this is where we will be and where we will always come back to) what's up with this rhetoric about growth and industry and drive? are we moving toward moving off the earth? are we merely trying to advance our understand of the world? are we fighting for global domination? Financially or physically?
We got a lot of good things out of it.. antiseptics, global communication networks, advancing knowledge and understanding of the universe, breast implants....
but I kinda think that we have a strange an non-beneficial way of going about achieving these things.


Edited by PrecariousCibarius (06/10/11 05:47 PM)


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: PrecariousCibarius]
    #14591737 - 06/10/11 05:44 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

The real problem is not out-of-control population growth, but an addiction to economic growth.  We need to learn as a civilization to live within our means.  Part of that, however, means learning to share the resources we have more equitably.  Once exponential growth becomes unattainable(as is likely to happen as a result of peak oil), people will be less tolerant of all the wealth going to the top, and eventually we'll be compelled to build a more fair and just society.


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OfflinePrecariousCibarius
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: Silversoul]
    #14591797 - 06/10/11 05:56 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

it kinda seems like that would be the ideal outcome - but when peak oil comes and goes, whoever gets their hands on the next primary source of energy will begin the cycle all over again. i'm sure they've already got it planned out. unless of course lawrence livermore labs is successful in their attempt at perfecting fusion power.. (i'm sure we'll still get a huge bill from the utility companies)


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: PrecariousCibarius]
    #14591878 - 06/10/11 06:14 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

PrecariousCibarius said:
it kinda seems like that would be the ideal outcome - but when peak oil comes and goes, whoever gets their hands on the next primary source of energy will begin the cycle all over again. i'm sure they've already got it planned out. unless of course lawrence livermore labs is successful in their attempt at perfecting fusion power.. (i'm sure we'll still get a huge bill from the utility companies)



What you describe is only possible if that primary source of energy is some scarce, easily controlled resource, like oil.  If, on the other hand, it's something we can grow ourselves, like biofuels, or energy that can be harvested anywhere, like solar and wind, then would-be monopolists have a much bigger task ahead of them.


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OfflinePrecariousCibarius
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: Silversoul]
    #14591945 - 06/10/11 06:27 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

agreed


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OfflineHashishin13
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: Silversoul]
    #14592451 - 06/10/11 08:08 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

My point is we naturally limit ourselves, as we reach the carrying capacity it will become exponentially more expensive to live and if people have to pay their own way thery will limit themselves to less or no children, we don't need bureocrats doing it for us.


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It will be found an unjust and unwise jealousy to deprive a man of his natural liberty upon the supposition he may abuse it.
-George Washington


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OfflineHashishin13
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: PrecariousCibarius]
    #14592489 - 06/10/11 08:17 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

What you two need to understand is that oil isn't going to disappear as quickly as we found and used it up. Also all the toher traditional power sources are still more efficient then wind and solar.

The way the price system works is that as things get scarcer they get proportionally more expensive. This means that without any government agent taxing and regulating we will naturally be weaned off oil as we slowely use it up.

We have only just hit peak oil, which in case you didn't know means we have only just started finding less new oil then the oil we use up, it ignores the massive reserves.

I suggest looking up libertarianism and austrian economics, they explain a lot more about life then you might think.


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It will be found an unjust and unwise jealousy to deprive a man of his natural liberty upon the supposition he may abuse it.
-George Washington


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: Hashishin13]
    #14592544 - 06/10/11 08:29 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Hashishin13 said:
Also all the toher traditional power sources are still more efficient then wind and solar.



Not if you take away the subsidies.  Furthermore, if we taxed land values instead of

Quote:

I suggest looking up libertarianism and austrian economics, they explain a lot more about life then you might think.



As a former libertarian, I will suggest that people take anything the Austrian school says with a grain of salt.  They have their points, but they tend toward extreme dogmatism.  I recommend reading economists from a wide variety of different schools, from post-Keynesian to Georgist to Institutionalist to Evolutionary and Behavioral economics.  If there's any Austrian economist I recommend, it's Hayek, as he was the least dogmatic out of all of them.  People like Von Mises and Rothbard turned Austrian economics into a cult.


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OfflineHashishin13
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: Silversoul]
    #14595843 - 06/11/11 12:31 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Solar panels don't even generate as much power as it takes to make them, let alone all the materials and transportation costs. If it wasn't for rubes and government subsidies we would probably only see them on space stations and satelites.

Wind is also heavily subsidized and the most economical designs they have, those giant white ones, give off a high pitched whine that screws with people's and animal's minds.

The word cult is so meaningless its laughable to use it against anything. There is lots of arguement and diverse opinions amongst austrians so how could they possibly be a cult?

Murray and Von Mises even disagree on fundamentals like whther or not government is legitimate, so calling them cult leaders is really off base.

Why are you a former libertarian? Freedom too much for you?:P


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It will be found an unjust and unwise jealousy to deprive a man of his natural liberty upon the supposition he may abuse it.
-George Washington


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InvisibleSilversoul
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: Hashishin13]
    #14596055 - 06/11/11 01:21 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Hashishin13 said:
Solar panels don't even generate as much power as it takes to make them, let alone all the materials and transportation costs. If it wasn't for rubes and government subsidies we would probably only see them on space stations and satelites.



Source?  I find this a particularly dubious claim, given that nuclear power receives far more subsidies, yet gets hardly any private sector investment.

Quote:

Wind is also heavily subsidized and the most economical designs they have, those giant white ones, give off a high pitched whine that screws with people's and animal's minds.



Again, I'm going to have to see a source on that.  Wind, like solar, gets lots of private market investment, and is also one of the most efficient sources of electricity out there.

Quote:

The word cult is so meaningless its laughable to use it against anything. There is lots of arguement and diverse opinions amongst austrians so how could they possibly be a cult?



I'm sure you can find some disagreements among Scientologists as well.

Quote:

Why are you a former libertarian? Freedom too much for you?:P



No.  I just realized that freedom means a lot more than what dupes like Ron Paul are talking about.  Actually, it's not so much that I stopped being libertarian.  It would be more accurate to say that I moved from right-libertarian("propertarian" would be a better term) to left-libertarian.  It was reading left-libertarian ideas from people like Proudhon, Benjamin Tucker, and Henry George that I realized how private property, far from being a guarantor of liberty as the Austrians insisted, was quite often a means to tyranny.  In short, it was realizing how tyranny was not limited to government that snapped me out of my stupor.


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Edited by Silversoul (06/11/11 01:40 PM)


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OfflineHashishin13
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: Silversoul]
    #14597815 - 06/11/11 08:36 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

I can't remember where I heard that bit about solar panels, and I don't feel like hunting for evidence, but just think about it. Everyone knows solar panels generate next to no electricity, a giant array in the middle of the desert isn't even equal to a medium sized coal plant or dam. Do you have any idea how much energy it takes to melt glass and wiring? If you were to do it with electricity it would be insanely expensive.

The wind thing I know because they were proposing putting one up by my cottage and it got turned down on that basis. Go look at Denmark where they were invented and used on land for a while, they have since banned their use from land and they are only allowed out in the ocean now.

How can you possibly say that being subject to private property is worse then being subject to your community? At least under private property you have a chance of being left alone and living how you want, regardless of how everyone else wants to live. If your community is screwed up under left-anarchy your just a slave.

It reminds me of an arguement I had one time where the person asked me if the slaves being able to work their way out of slavery and then being able to own slaves themselves lessened how objectionable slavery was, and I think that absolutely it does, and it should to any rational person.

If "Roots" was a movie about black slave owners in the south would it really have been as harshly impacting? I doubt it.


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It will be found an unjust and unwise jealousy to deprive a man of his natural liberty upon the supposition he may abuse it.
-George Washington


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Offlineweedist
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: Hashishin13]
    #14599135 - 06/12/11 01:38 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

But wheres the evidence?


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OfflinePrecariousCibarius
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: Hashishin13]
    #14599926 - 06/12/11 08:54 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Hashishin13 said:

If we are doing badly in your eyes, we are still good overall because before us THERE WAS NO SUCH THING AS BAD. Morality and caring for other species ORIGINATED WITH US.





oh yea? oh yea?



i REST MY CASE :n00bslayer:


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OfflineHashishin13
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: PrecariousCibarius]
    #14600379 - 06/12/11 11:35 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

I meant species not individuals. -.-

Which is more likely, the dog is worried about tigers going extinct so its nursing baby tigers or is it that the tiger babies crying sounds a lot like puppies?

I REST MY CASE.


--------------------
It will be found an unjust and unwise jealousy to deprive a man of his natural liberty upon the supposition he may abuse it.
-George Washington


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OfflineHashishin13
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: weedist]
    #14600381 - 06/12/11 11:35 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Be more specific?


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It will be found an unjust and unwise jealousy to deprive a man of his natural liberty upon the supposition he may abuse it.
-George Washington


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OfflinePrecariousCibarius
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: Hashishin13]
    #14600574 - 06/12/11 12:18 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

my main point since I started posting in this thread is that things are getting worse because as our species continues advancing technologically and consciously, there is a great divide growing between the fundamentals of sentience and the illusions (behavioral/social/ideological what-have-you) that we so readily subscribe to throughout our lives.

it's the whole ego/superego nature v.s. nurture dichotomy. We have (in most major metropolitan areas) really lost touch of the free spirit of existence and have converted ourselves to some form of slavery or indebtedness as a viable means of extracting some kind of intrinsic value from ourselves that doesn't actually exist. But psychologically it's pleasing.

for the common man, ailments like this are growing exponentially in this day and age. ("information" age) We're more concerned with our market value individually than the value of life in some kind of poignant, focused endeavor that our entire species is undertaking as a whole.

yes, humans are special - but we're not that special. mostly i think we're full of shit and confused.. like a smart-ass teenager. (on the large scale)

it's really not worth arguing about though.. just my $0.02. :smile: there are a lot of good thoughts in this thread - yours included


Edited by PrecariousCibarius (06/12/11 12:32 PM)


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OfflineHashishin13
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: PrecariousCibarius]
    #14601578 - 06/12/11 03:21 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

I disagree, I see what your saying but I think that THANKS TO our new technology we have access to so much more then we would have otherwise. For instance my family 500+ years ago living in christian europe would have had precisely zero access to buddhism and the important knowledge I have extracted from it.

They lived in fear of a fictional deity constantly watching and judging them, ready to doom them to hell for all iternity for a slight lapse in judgement.

They lived their lives toiling away and putting up with governmental and religious abuse under the pretense that if they didn't they were doomed.

Your worried about how most people ignorantly live their lives like cogs in the machinery of society, well I'm telling you now that we are much more able to free ourselves from that fate today then we EVER have been in the past.


--------------------
It will be found an unjust and unwise jealousy to deprive a man of his natural liberty upon the supposition he may abuse it.
-George Washington


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OfflinePrecariousCibarius
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Re: Is the world getting better or worse? [Re: Hashishin13]
    #14602378 - 06/12/11 06:23 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

eh - cool thought. spirituality was/is a pretty significant road to philosophical well-being. good points. i gotta go post up an ID request.


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