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OfflineDepth
Stranger

Registered: 05/09/11
Posts: 7
Last seen: 12 years, 5 months
ID Request...Central-Southern California
    #14428852 - 05/10/11 08:51 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Hello everyone,

This is my first post, I've read through these forums on occasion but just recently started attempting to identify mushrooms so I'm now a registered member. Woot! :smile: Anyway, onto more interesting matters...

I found these 2 seemingly young specimens amidst other smaller, and much younger specimens. Perhaps too young to identify? These we're the biggest I could find. I've seen these types of mushrooms in this area once or twice before, so I'm curious as to what they may be. I'm in the Central-Southern California region. Details and pictures below:

Species 1 is bigger.

Habitat: Found growing on the ground in a grassy area. Temperature ranges from low 50's F at night to around 80's F during daytime in my area. Dry climate in general in my area, the area had a sprinkler system.

Gills: Tan-ish brown on outer rim and getting darker near inner-side (around beginning of stem). A tinge of grey.

Stem: Brown ranging from tan to dark brown. There seem to be some lines running down stem, as indicated in the pictures. Stem color definitely got darker, especially near the bottom of the stem where I was holding both specimens as I was transporting them. Almost redish (or burgandy). About 2 or 2.5 inches in length, give or take.

Cap: Ranging from light tan near rim, to yellow in middle with slight variations of brown around the edges (zonates?) and in the middle. There was possibly a slight color change from the time i picked them to when i took the pictures. To me they seemed to be lighter in color by the time i took the pictures. And the zonates (i think that's what they're called, the dark circular lines on the caps) seemed to be lighter and less definitive.

Seemed to not be sticky at the time, or not viscid when i touched them (im not %100 sure on this). I did see some moisture after I touched the cap of species 2 while it was still in the ground, but didn't at the time attribute it to the cap itself but rather the grass around it being moist. So I'm not sure about that. By the time I had gotten home from picking them there did not seem to be any kind of moisture on top of the cap.

Spore print: Black. I don't see brown or any other color at all, but I'm going to get some second opinions. See picture.

Bruising: Bruised dark brown, kind of reddish color on stems at first. Then after about 20 minutes the bruising got darker and turned almost black. I was holding the mushrooms by the stem for about ten minutes, so im sure that weakened the structure at the ends in some ways. The stems seemed dehydrated after about an hour of picking and became pretty blackened, and they were also heavily bruised by that point. I believe these we're quite young specimens as they were pretty small, but I am new at this.

Location: Picked in Central-Southern California.

My guess is they are a Panaeolis species, and if the spore print is indeed black (looks like it to me) then I suppose Panaeolus subbalteatus.

Any ideas?

I plan on going back to the same location to see how the rest of the mushrooms I saw are growing, hopefully I can get a more mature specimen!

Thanks and let me know if you need anymore information!

Pictures:

SPECIES ONE



BOTH SPECIES ONE AND SPECIES TWO



SPECIES TWO



STEMS ABOUT 6 TO 8+ HOURS AFTER PICKING

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Invisiblekoraks
Registered: 06/02/03
Posts: 26,691
Re: ID Request...Central-Southern California [Re: Depth]
    #14428866 - 05/10/11 08:55 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Panaeolus sp. We'll have to take your word for the spore print, because the pics of the prints are really underexposed (try putting them in some decent light and overexposing them by 1.5 stops to compensate for the white paper). If they're all black, then you might have pan. cinctulus. There are no poisonous panaeolus species, but if these are active, you would still need more than two for noticeable effects.

Welcome to the Shroomery!

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OfflineDepth
Stranger

Registered: 05/09/11
Posts: 7
Last seen: 12 years, 5 months
Re: ID Request...Central-Southern California [Re: koraks]
    #14428886 - 05/10/11 08:59 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

koraks said:
Panaeolus sp. We'll have to take your word for the spore print, because the pics of the prints are really underexposed (try putting them in some decent light and overexposing them by 1.5 stops to compensate for the white paper). If they're all black, then you might have pan. cinctulus. There are no poisonous panaeolus species, but if these are active, you would still need more than two for noticeable effects.

Welcome to the Shroomery!




Thanks!

Yeah I'll try to get some better pictures of the spore prints asap.

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Invisiblekoraks
Registered: 06/02/03
Posts: 26,691
Re: ID Request...Central-Southern California [Re: Depth]
    #14428903 - 05/10/11 09:03 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Yeah, you do that. There's a fair chance those are pan. cinctulus.

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OfflineDepth
Stranger

Registered: 05/09/11
Posts: 7
Last seen: 12 years, 5 months
Re: ID Request...Central-Southern California [Re: koraks]
    #14428985 - 05/10/11 09:23 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Ok, more pictures below. I took these outside for better light. Let me know though if they need to be more exposed, my camera isn't the greatest...but I'll see what I can do.

Thanks again.


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Invisiblekoraks
Registered: 06/02/03
Posts: 26,691
Re: ID Request...Central-Southern California [Re: Depth]
    #14428989 - 05/10/11 09:25 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

That's a lot better! And it really looks like a jet black print to me. I'm not a panaeolus expert, so wait for someone else to drop by and have his/her say, but you might have gotten lucky today.

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OfflineDepth
Stranger

Registered: 05/09/11
Posts: 7
Last seen: 12 years, 5 months
Re: ID Request...Central-Southern California [Re: koraks]
    #14429056 - 05/10/11 09:51 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

koraks said:
That's a lot better! And it really looks like a jet black print to me. I'm not a panaeolus expert, so wait for someone else to drop by and have his/her say, but you might have gotten lucky today.





Awesome, sounds good. I've uploaded a couple more pictures i took with my camera phone before I picked them. These are pretty bad quality, especially color-wise, but I'll leave them here for reference. I am pretty sure these pics are both of species 1.


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OfflineFeelers
Anti-Myth-Rhythm-Rock-Shocker
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Registered: 06/18/02
Posts: 1,806
Loc: Land of Oz
Last seen: 5 years, 9 months
Re: ID Request...Central-Southern California [Re: koraks]
    #14429058 - 05/10/11 09:52 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

From what I've seen of these print black/jet black matchups, I'd put my money on these being Pan foes. From what I've seen the Jet black seems to pop off the screen at you, and these don't quite get there for me. But yeah, subbehunter420 is the man with the eye for this. :thumbup:

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OfflineDepth
Stranger

Registered: 05/09/11
Posts: 7
Last seen: 12 years, 5 months
Re: ID Request...Central-Southern California [Re: Feelers]
    #14429078 - 05/10/11 09:59 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Feelers said:
From what I've seen of these print black/jet black matchups, I'd put my money on these being Pan foes. From what I've seen the Jet black seems to pop off the screen at you and these don't quite get there for me. But yeah, subbehunter420 is the man with the eye for this. :thumbup:




Okay, thanks for the input. I know what you mean too about the jet black prints popping out.

Because of that the second pics I took in the sunlight are making me second guess that they're subbs, but only slightly. I just still can't tell. Thanks.

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InvisibleIeponumos
Mycophile/Phytophile
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Registered: 09/02/09
Posts: 4,850
Re: ID Request...Central-Southern California [Re: Depth]
    #14429172 - 05/10/11 10:29 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

1 looks like a subb
2 looks like a foe.

:2cents:


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]

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OfflineFeelers
Anti-Myth-Rhythm-Rock-Shocker
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Registered: 06/18/02
Posts: 1,806
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Re: ID Request...Central-Southern California [Re: Ieponumos]
    #14429219 - 05/10/11 10:47 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Someone posted a pic of this comparison a few days ago printed on tin foil, I thought it was subbehunter420, but it's not listed in his last posts. :frown:

Here we go, found it! From Byrain, (thanks Google!)


Maybe they are P cints? What a bitch of an ID problem these cause. :grin:

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OfflineOreganic
Connoisseur of Life
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Registered: 02/08/10
Posts: 1,807
Loc: Orygun
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Re: ID Request...Central-Southern California [Re: Feelers]
    #14429244 - 05/10/11 10:53 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

It looks to me like the print on the right simply is thicker - resulting in a darker spore print.  :2cents:


--------------------

__________________________________
In case you didn't know, The Shroomery holds a Picture of The Month poll each month and anyone is welcome to nominate pictures and vote! Keep it active folks!

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OfflineBlue-FunGuy
The Bad Pungi
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Registered: 03/05/10
Posts: 5,365
Loc: Northeast Flag
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Re: ID Request...Central-Southern California [Re: Depth]
    #14429265 - 05/10/11 10:58 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Depth said:
Ok, more pictures below. I took these outside for better light. Let me know though if they need to be more exposed, my camera isn't the greatest...but I'll see what I can do.

Thanks again.






Is it me or do they look a little purple-black?

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OfflineDepth
Stranger

Registered: 05/09/11
Posts: 7
Last seen: 12 years, 5 months
Re: ID Request...Central-Southern California [Re: Blue-FunGuy]
    #14429415 - 05/10/11 11:34 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Well, hadn't thought of purple until you said that and I can sort of see it, i think by now my eyes are playing tricks on me though. I thought I was seeing brown in the daylight pics, very minute, but I can't tell if its just jpg artifacts or maybe nothing at all.

So I guess I'm going to need

-better pictures
-better spore prints, perhaps on glass or other transparent material? im not sure about what's the best material to put them on, read about glass somewhere...or tin foil.
-more specimens

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Invisiblekoraks
Registered: 06/02/03
Posts: 26,691
Re: ID Request...Central-Southern California [Re: Depth]
    #14429424 - 05/10/11 11:35 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

The white balance in those pics is a tad off, that might explain the purple. Which I don't see btw, but this laptop's screen isn't too stellar, so that might be the problem.

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InvisibleByrain


Registered: 01/07/10
Posts: 9,664
Trusted Identifier
Re: ID Request...Central-Southern California [Re: Oreganic]
    #14430119 - 05/10/11 02:35 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Op has Panaeolus cinctulus, all the prints he posted pictures of are jet black.

Edit: Spoke too soon, these don't look jet black to me.

Quote:

Depth said:





Mixed collection I am guessing.


Quote:

Oreganic said:
It looks to me like the print on the right simply is thicker - resulting in a darker spore print.  :2cents:




make the picture larger here - http://mushroomobserver.org/65540?q=4PLZ

You can see that the ones on the left aren't jet black as the ones on the right are.

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OfflineDepth
Stranger

Registered: 05/09/11
Posts: 7
Last seen: 12 years, 5 months
Re: ID Request...Central-Southern California [Re: Depth]
    #14436608 - 05/11/11 07:45 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Ok, well I went back and collected four other specimens from the same spot. They were the last ones I saw and all but one had started decaying. For now here are pics of the healthiest one I found. I know the lighting isn't the best, they were taken outside though.


Labeled species 3.


The print looks black to me. But I am so new to all this, I can't say for sure.:confused:



Question, can blue bruising rub-off with touch? I ask this because I think i am seeing one of the stems I collected (not of species 3) bruising blue at the bottom, however when I touch the area lightly, the blue seems to disappear. Or maybe the the outer layer is just changing color due to touching it again? Or is that mycelium?

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InvisibleBobzimmer
Crawlin' Kingsnake
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Registered: 09/07/08
Posts: 8,696
Loc: NY
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Re: ID Request...Central-Southern California [Re: Depth]
    #14436638 - 05/11/11 07:52 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

The print looks black to me. Panaeolus cinctulus, I'd say.


--------------------
Mr. Mushrooms said:
I will confess something that should be quite obvious, CC.  I love mushrooms, i.e. fungi.  I really do.  I am talking about a strong feeling, i.e. emotion, for them.  I think they are beautiful.  I even dream of them.

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OfflineFeelers
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Registered: 06/18/02
Posts: 1,806
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Last seen: 5 years, 9 months
Re: ID Request...Central-Southern California [Re: Bobzimmer]
    #14436787 - 05/11/11 08:23 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Bobzimmer said:
The print looks black to me. Panaeolus cinctulus, I'd say.



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OfflineBlue-FunGuy
The Bad Pungi
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Registered: 03/05/10
Posts: 5,365
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Re: ID Request...Central-Southern California [Re: Feelers]
    #14437150 - 05/11/11 09:28 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

:yesnod:The stems are red-ish too!:thumbup:

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