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Shop: Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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OfflineKickleM
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Gravity - im still confused...
    #14419745 - 05/08/11 01:56 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

So I, perhaps due to my elementary knowledge of gravity, am puzzled. I am under the perhaps mistaken impression that the mass (density?) of the Earth is responsible for the level of gravity we experience as human beings. Yet how could the mass (density) of the Earth exist without gravity?

Where did this mass originate? Smaller gravity producing chunks that were pulled together by this very same gravity? Is there a limit to how much density (mass?) is required before a gravitational pull can be observed? Crikey... I feel like I need to take a basic course on this... I'm bewildered by the idea of material floating around in space and then clumping together over time into distinct planets all in an orbit around a giant ball of gas. :wtf:


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Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction?
Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain

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Offlinedizzyease
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Re: Gravity - im still confused... [Re: Kickle]
    #14419768 - 05/08/11 02:03 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

i'm still convinced gravity is nothing but magnetism. heavier objects have more magnetic attraction.

But yes, every little particle has gravity.

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OfflinejivJaN
yes
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Re: Gravity - im still confused... [Re: Kickle]
    #14419799 - 05/08/11 02:11 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

posting so i can join this discussion later.


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All my posts in this forum are strictly fictional.
They are derived from an acute mental illness , from which i am forced to lie compulsively.
I have never induced any kind of mind altering substance in my life  and i have no intentions whatsoever of doing anything illegal.
If I have ever suggested such a thing it would have most likely been , due to my personality disorder and i probably do not remember it at all..

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InvisiblePoid
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Re: Gravity - im still confused... [Re: Kickle] * 1
    #14419824 - 05/08/11 02:21 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Kickle said:
So I, perhaps due to my elementary knowledge of gravity, am puzzled. I am under the perhaps mistaken impression that the mass (density?) of the Earth is responsible for the level of gravity we experience as human beings. Yet how could the mass (density) of the Earth exist without gravity?


Mass and density are not the same thing; the density of a material is defined as its mass (and sometimes weight) per unit volume.

I don't understand why you're asking that question..the Earth's mass exists with gravity, so why ask how it can exist without gravity? :undecided:


Quote:

Kickle said:
Where did this mass originate? Smaller gravity producing chunks that were pulled together by this very same gravity? Is there a limit to how much density (mass?) is required before a gravitational pull can be observed?


Gravitation is a natural phenomenon by which physical bodies attract with a force proportional to their mass, so anything that has mass is capable of a "gravitational pull"; the mass originated from the remnants of the big bang.



Quote:

dizzyease said:
i'm still convinced gravity is nothing but magnetism. heavier objects have more magnetic attraction.


Gravitation and magnetism are two distinct phenomena; gravitation is one of the fundamental forces of the universe, and magnetism is part of the electromagnetic force, another fundamental force of the universe.

Magnetism
Quote:

Magnetism is a property of materials that respond at an atomic or subatomic level to an applied magnetic field. For example, the most well known form of magnetism is ferromagnetism such that some ferromagnetic materials produce their own persistent magnetic field. However, all materials are influenced to a greater or lesser degree by the presence of a magnetic field. Some are attracted to a magnetic field (paramagnetism); others are repulsed by a magnetic field (diamagnetism); others have a much more complex relationship with an applied magnetic field. Substances that are negligibly affected by magnetic fields are known as non-magnetic substances. They include copper, aluminium, gases, and plastic.
The magnetic state (or phase) of a material depends on temperature (and other variables such as pressure and applied magnetic field) so that a material may exhibit more than one form of magnetism depending on its temperature, etc.



Gravitation
Quote:

Gravitation is a natural phenomenon by which physical bodies attract with a force proportional to their mass. In everyday life, gravitation is most familiar as the agent that gives weight to objects with mass and causes them to fall to the ground when dropped. Gravitation causes dispersed matter to coalesce, and coalesced matter to remain intact, thus accounting for the existence of the Earth, the Sun, and most of the macroscopic objects in the universe. Gravitation is responsible for keeping the Earth and the other planets in their orbits around the Sun; for keeping the Moon in its orbit around the Earth; for the formation of tides; for natural convection, by which fluid flow occurs under the influence of a density gradient and gravity; for heating the interiors of forming stars and planets to very high temperatures; and for various other phenomena observed on Earth.
Gravitation is one of the four fundamental interactions of nature, along with electromagnetism, and the nuclear strong force and weak force. Modern physics describes gravitation using the general theory of relativity by Einstein, in which it is a consequence of the curvature of spacetime governing the motion of inertial objects. The simpler Newton's law of universal gravitation provides an accurate approximation for most physical situations.




As you can clearly see, they are not the same at all. :shake:


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Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

Edited by Poid (05/08/11 02:27 PM)

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Offlinemylfgur
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Re: Gravity - im still confused... [Re: dizzyease]
    #14419837 - 05/08/11 02:26 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

dizzyease said:
i'm still convinced gravity is nothing but magnetism. heavier objects have more magnetic attraction.

But yes, every little particle has gravity.



I agree, this explanation also would explain the discrepancies in the "force of gravity" around the universe. Our gravity calculations are based on the earth's attractive/repulsive force. If another cosmic object had the exact same composition as the earth, it would exhibit the same effect of gravity. However, I think that if if there was a planet made entirely out of, say, molybdenum or other heavy metals--it would exhibit a much different "gravitational force" than a planet made out of stone and organic material with relatively small deposits of heavier elements like ours.

Another part of the gravitational theory that I've been considering is why our solar system is in a disc form. It's currently believed that things spin in a disc form in space to conserve rotational momentum. Everything gravitates around the sun's equator, not any other part of the sun. The sun is, of course, a plasma that rotates; If you've ever seen the electromagnetic field of the sun, it is constantly changing at different speeds, as the plasma rotates at different speeds on different regions of the sun because of it's spherical shape. The large, rotating, equator portion of the plasma is what we rotate. Could it be that we are pulled towards most powerful electromagnetic area on the sun and rotate in a disc form because of that?

I'm not a physicist though. But it baffles me how we can think that gravity is the sole product of mass. So the same mass of carbon and plutonium should exert the same gravity? I would expect the plutonium mass to exhibit a much larger electromagnetic pull than the same mass of carbon.


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Offlinefall
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Re: Gravity - im still confused... [Re: dizzyease]
    #14419845 - 05/08/11 02:29 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

With newtonian physics....
F = Gm1m2/r2,
Meaning the force due to gravity = the gravity constant*mass1*mass2/radius b/w the 2 mass' squared

So pretty much, no one knows exactly why gravity works or what really causes the force you feel.  But the gravity constant implies that 'gravity' is a force(function) working on x number of relative masses y distance apart

And then you can move into GR which relates newtons gravity with SR as an ingrained property of spacetime... and says that the curvature of spacetime is directly related to the energy & mass present.  But I definitely could not explain Einsteins equations on all of that, so you're on your own from here.

Aaaand that shouldn't have clarified all that much for you, but might be worth something...

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OfflineAhimsa
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Re: Gravity - im still confused... [Re: Kickle]
    #14419858 - 05/08/11 02:32 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)


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Offlinedizzyease
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Re: Gravity - im still confused... [Re: Ahimsa]
    #14420428 - 05/08/11 04:37 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Ahimsa said:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y350oOiunf4

:thumbup:



I just watched the whole thing,
thats crazy shit.

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OfflineAhimsa
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Re: Gravity - im still confused... [Re: dizzyease]
    #14420447 - 05/08/11 04:43 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Yea, and if you're in no hurry, he also did a more extended version on that one:



:wink:

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