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OfflineAhimsa
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Re: Is homosexuality a mental illness? [Re: Poid]
    #14419943 - 05/08/11 02:52 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Eeuh... i do believe my soul desires happiness and that nature provides for that. What's wrong with that? Too simplistic? Naive? What?

And why can't you see that there is a purpose for everything? Male and female... sure that's not hard to see, is it?

OK perhaps some minority of people do feel satisfied with a homosexual relationship and live a long life as partners together.

Look I'm not outspoken pro or contra homosexuality. But there are plenty of examples indicating that homosexuality is not healthy.

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InvisibleSleepwalker
Overshoes


Registered: 05/07/08
Posts: 5,503
Re: Is homosexuality a mental illness? [Re: Ahimsa]
    #14420002 - 05/08/11 03:01 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Ahimsa said:
And why can't you see that there is a purpose for everything? Male and female... sure that's not hard to see, is it?




Homosexuality is not included within "everything"?

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OfflineAhimsa
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Re: Is homosexuality a mental illness? [Re: Sleepwalker]
    #14420030 - 05/08/11 03:05 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Yes it is. But it doesn't help to sustain human life.
I guess i am biased towards nature's design. Hey, my choice man!

edited: *does -> doesn't

Edited by Ahimsa (05/08/11 03:20 PM)

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InvisiblePoid
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Re: Is homosexuality a mental illness? [Re: Ahimsa]
    #14420035 - 05/08/11 03:07 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Ahimsa said:
Eeuh... i do believe my soul desires happiness and that nature provides for that. What's wrong with that? Too simplistic? Naive? What?


There is no evidence which suggests that souls are real.


Quote:

Ahimsa said:
And why can't you see that there is a purpose for everything? Male and female... sure that's not hard to see, is it?


What's there to see? Do you not understand evolution?


Quote:

Ahimsa said:
But there are plenty of examples indicating that homosexuality is not healthy.


Such as?


--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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InvisibleSleepwalker
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Registered: 05/07/08
Posts: 5,503
Re: Is homosexuality a mental illness? [Re: Ahimsa]
    #14420048 - 05/08/11 03:10 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Ahimsa said:
Yes it is. But it does help to sustain human life.
I guess i am biased towards nature's design. Hey, my choice man!




I don't understand.  Plenty of animals can be homosexual.  It is as much a part of nature as reproductive sex.

I think you meant to say it doesn't help to sustain human life, which is speculation at best.  A controlled population is important.  Infinite growth is unhealthy.

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OfflineAhimsa
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Re: Is homosexuality a mental illness? [Re: Poid]
    #14420071 - 05/08/11 03:19 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

The life-force taking me from birth to death i regard to be my soul.
Well, it takes male/female to continue the human race. So there, that's my logic.
Homosexuality is often associated STD's, drug or alcohol abuse, murder, suicide and according to psychologists less happiness but not due to stigmatization.

Just saying, it is not wrong, but there are consequences, and, to me it appears the natural commodities are the way to go! Just my take on it.

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InvisiblePoid
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Re: Is homosexuality a mental illness? [Re: Ahimsa]
    #14420112 - 05/08/11 03:27 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Ahimsa said:
The life-force taking me from birth to death i regard to be my soul.


There are already words for the biological functions that support our lives..why give them another name, especially one as loaded as "soul"?


Quote:

Ahimsa said:
Well, it takes male/female to continue the human race. So there, that's my logic.


Your logic for what?


Quote:

Ahimsa said:
Homosexuality is often associated STD's, drug or alcohol abuse, murder, suicide and according to psychologists less happiness but not due to stigmatization.


Source?


Quote:

Ahimsa said:
Just saying, it is not wrong, but there are consequences...


Not necessarily--there could just as easily be consequences for any other sexual orientation.


Quote:

Ahimsa said:
...and, to me it appears the natural commodities are the way to go!


What do you mean by this?


--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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OfflineAhimsa
µdose
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Registered: 01/11/07
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Last seen: 4 years, 3 months
Re: Is homosexuality a mental illness? [Re: Poid]
    #14420190 - 05/08/11 03:43 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Come on man. Simply put,there is a natural scheme of things. Why go contrary so persistently? Fun? Some people enjoy SM or other ways... i don't know, it feels like deviating from the natural mean and means.

------------------------------------------
Here are some references for you to ponder:

The Archives of Internal Medicine, "Homosexually active men are significantly more likely to report syphilis and less likely to present with primary syphilis than heterosexual men."

New England Journal of Medicine, "At least 80 percent of homosexual men presenting to our sexually transmitted disease clinic with anorectal or intestinal symptoms were infected with one or more sexually transmissible anorectal or enteric pathogens. Such infections were also found in 39 percent of homosexual men presenting to the clinic without intestinal symptoms."

Harrisonís Principles of Internal Medicine, "In one New York Study, all nontraveled immunocompetent males with giardiasis were, in fact, homosexual."

New England Journal of Medicine, "Anal intercourse may predispose to anal cancer through the transmission of an infection, most probably infection with human papillomavirus."

The Journal of the American Medical Association, "among men, report of any lifetime homosexual activity was associated with an elevated risk for HSV-2 [herpes simplex virus - 2]."

American Journal of Medicine,"... heterosexual men in a sexually transmitted disease clinic have a substantially lower prevalence of cytomegalovirus seropositivity than do homosexual men."

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InvisibleSleepwalker
Overshoes


Registered: 05/07/08
Posts: 5,503
Re: Is homosexuality a mental illness? [Re: Ahimsa]
    #14420240 - 05/08/11 03:53 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Ahimsa said:
Come on man. Simply put,there is a natural scheme of things. Why go contrary so persistently? Fun? Some people enjoy SM or other ways... i don't know, it feels like deviating from the natural mean and means.




The point is, it is NOT deviation.  Homosexuals are doing exactly what nature urges them to do.  Contrary to what?

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OfflineAhimsa
µdose
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Registered: 01/11/07
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Re: Is homosexuality a mental illness? [Re: Sleepwalker]
    #14420255 - 05/08/11 03:58 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Contrary to reproduction.

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InvisibleSleepwalker
Overshoes


Registered: 05/07/08
Posts: 5,503
Re: Is homosexuality a mental illness? [Re: Ahimsa]
    #14420262 - 05/08/11 04:00 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

But, even assuming nature HAS a plan, reproduction is not the whole story.  What about all the barren lifeless planets in the universe? Are those not part of nature?
What about death itself?
Humans will live on regardless of whether there are homosexuals in the world or not.

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OfflineAhimsa
µdose
Male

Registered: 01/11/07
Posts: 1,827
Last seen: 4 years, 3 months
Re: Is homosexuality a mental illness? [Re: Sleepwalker]
    #14420313 - 05/08/11 04:10 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Yes that's true. ALL things have their purpose, and so does homosexuality. STD's are found among heterosexuals also.
I don't think homosexuality is a mental illness, but then again, for example, what is too much sex? :smirk:
Personally i find nature to be providing quite reasonable answers.

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OfflineMushroomTrip
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Registered: 12/02/05
Posts: 14,794
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Re: Is homosexuality a mental illness? [Re: Ahimsa]
    #14420333 - 05/08/11 04:15 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Ahimsa said:
Come on man. Simply put,there is a natural scheme of things. Why go contrary so persistently? Fun? Some people enjoy SM or other ways... i don't know, it feels like deviating from the natural mean and means.

------------------------------------------
Here are some references for you to ponder:

The Archives of Internal Medicine, "Homosexually active men are significantly more likely to report syphilis and less likely to present with primary syphilis than heterosexual men."

New England Journal of Medicine, "At least 80 percent of homosexual men presenting to our sexually transmitted disease clinic with anorectal or intestinal symptoms were infected with one or more sexually transmissible anorectal or enteric pathogens. Such infections were also found in 39 percent of homosexual men presenting to the clinic without intestinal symptoms."

Harrisonís Principles of Internal Medicine, "In one New York Study, all nontraveled immunocompetent males with giardiasis were, in fact, homosexual."

New England Journal of Medicine, "Anal intercourse may predispose to anal cancer through the transmission of an infection, most probably infection with human papillomavirus."

The Journal of the American Medical Association, "among men, report of any lifetime homosexual activity was associated with an elevated risk for HSV-2 [herpes simplex virus - 2]."

American Journal of Medicine,"... heterosexual men in a sexually transmitted disease clinic have a substantially lower prevalence of cytomegalovirus seropositivity than do homosexual men."




So, just because some statistics seem to say that homosexuals have more chances to get std's, you concluded that the natural scheme of things doesn't include homosexuality? To me it just sounds like a giant leap of logic. Maybe this natural scheme also doesn't include driving, since there are always so many driving-related accidents. :crazy2:


--------------------
:bunny::bunnyhug:
All this time I've loved you
And never known your face
All this time I've missed you
And searched this human race
Here is true peace
Here my heart knows calm
Safe in your soul
Bathed in your sighs

:bunnyhug: :yinyang2:

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InvisiblePoid
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Re: Is homosexuality a mental illness? [Re: Ahimsa]
    #14420341 - 05/08/11 04:16 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Ahimsa said:
Why go contrary so persistently?


Gay people do not "go contrary" to their own nature..why is this so hard for you to understand?


Quote:

Ahimsa said:
Fun? Some people enjoy SM or other ways... i don't know, it feels like deviating from the natural mean and means.


What is "the natural mean and means"? Earlier you were suggesting that people explore different avenues of sexuality, now you're deploring S&M? :what:

Who cares if people do things that deviate from the norm? Why is it any of your concern, and why would you label it as being pathological?


Quote:

Ahimsa said:
------------------------------------------
Here are some references for you to ponder:


Do you have a link for this?


Quote:

Ahimsa said:
The Archives of Internal Medicine, "Homosexually active men are significantly more likely to report syphilis and less likely to present with primary syphilis than heterosexual men."

New England Journal of Medicine, "At least 80 percent of homosexual men presenting to our sexually transmitted disease clinic with anorectal or intestinal symptoms were infected with one or more sexually transmissible anorectal or enteric pathogens. Such infections were also found in 39 percent of homosexual men presenting to the clinic without intestinal symptoms."

Harrisonís Principles of Internal Medicine, "In one New York Study, all nontraveled immunocompetent males with giardiasis were, in fact, homosexual."

New England Journal of Medicine, "Anal intercourse may predispose to anal cancer through the transmission of an infection, most probably infection with human papillomavirus."

The Journal of the American Medical Association, "among men, report of any lifetime homosexual activity was associated with an elevated risk for HSV-2 [herpes simplex virus - 2]."

American Journal of Medicine,"... heterosexual men in a sexually transmitted disease clinic have a substantially lower prevalence of cytomegalovirus seropositivity than do homosexual men."


Alright, so homosexuals as a group have a higher rate of STDs than heterosexuals..so what? This doesn't mean that homosexuality is inherently more dangerous than heterosexuality, it's merely incidental. It also doesn't in any way prove that homosexuality is not part of the natural scheme of things.


--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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OfflineAhimsa
µdose
Male

Registered: 01/11/07
Posts: 1,827
Last seen: 4 years, 3 months
Re: Is homosexuality a mental illness? [Re: MushroomTrip]
    #14420395 - 05/08/11 04:29 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

I know, a few facts don't prove a thing.
Perhaps it's about love. Or sex. I don't think i said that homosexuality is not part of nature. It clearly is.
Thing is, there are not going to be any children, and there are some increased health-risks associated.

Still, nature has provided male and female for a reason. Can you do better than nature?

Besides there are ways to prevent more childbirth, doesn't need to through same-sex relations.

They are not wrong, just incomplete i feel.

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InvisiblePoid
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Re: Is homosexuality a mental illness? [Re: Ahimsa]
    #14420413 - 05/08/11 04:34 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Ahimsa said:
Still, nature has provided male and female for a reason.


What reason is that?


Quote:

Ahimsa said:
Can you do better than nature?


Nature has also provided for male & male.


Quote:

Ahimsa said:
Besides there are ways to prevent more childbirth, doesn't need to through same-sex relations.


:lol:, are you serious? Do you actually think that people become gay in order to prevent childbirth?

You don't seem to be able to put yourself in the shoes of an individual who has a different sexual orientation than you do. :shrug:


Quote:

Ahimsa said:
They are not wrong, just incomplete i feel.


That's a pretty harsh judgement..this type of thinking has lead to lots of cruelty towards gays in the past (and even today), and many laws which restrict gay people from marrying each other. :nonono:


--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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OfflineAhimsa
µdose
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Registered: 01/11/07
Posts: 1,827
Last seen: 4 years, 3 months
Re: Is homosexuality a mental illness? [Re: Ahimsa]
    #14420431 - 05/08/11 04:38 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

I think male-female relationship is normal because it is what nature advocates by design.
Same-sex relationships are not a mental illness and do belong to the possibilities.
After all i guess it boils down to being happy with what you do.
Why would you do it otherwise? To be unhappy? Don't think so.
I may not be much of a thinker, but whenever i look at this world, nature, i am overwhelmed by its ways, its design, its perfection and completeness. I don't doubt that. The rest i am skeptical about.

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InvisibleSleepwalker
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Registered: 05/07/08
Posts: 5,503
Re: Is homosexuality a mental illness? [Re: Ahimsa]
    #14420435 - 05/08/11 04:39 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Ahimsa said:
They are not wrong, just incomplete i feel.




I have met gay people who are very clear on who they are, what they like, and where they are going in life.
Just because they aren't going to procreate means they are incomplete?  :wtf:

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OfflineAhimsa
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Re: Is homosexuality a mental illness? [Re: Sleepwalker]
    #14420450 - 05/08/11 04:43 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

I thought they would be. So i'm wrong i guess. I would.

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InvisiblePoid
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Re: Is homosexuality a mental illness? [Re: Ahimsa]
    #14420484 - 05/08/11 04:54 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Ahimsa said:
I think male-female relationship is normal because it is what nature advocates by design.


It also advocates male-male relationships by design..if it didn't, there wouldn't be any male-male relationships.


--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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