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InvisibleSleepwalker
Overshoes


Registered: 05/07/08
Posts: 5,503
Re: Countercultures [Re: 4896744]
    #14421505 - 05/08/11 08:06 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

ok


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OfflineBeanhead
IS IRONIC PARADOX
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Registered: 10/11/08
Posts: 17,257
Loc: Geospatial inversion.
Last seen: 3 years, 5 months
Re: Countercultures [Re: Sleepwalker]
    #14423439 - 05/09/11 07:29 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teknival
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_tekno

:shrug: what do you mean with counterculture if it doesn't include subculture, aren't these practically one and the same.


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InvisiblePoid
Shroomery's #1 Spellir
Male User Gallery


Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 40,372
Loc: SF Bay Area Flag
Re: Countercultures [Re: Beanhead]
    #14424761 - 05/09/11 01:51 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Beanhead said:
...aren't these practically one and the same.


Nope; counter-cultures necessarily oppose their mother culture, whereas sub-cultures don't necessarily do that; all counter-cultures are subcultures, but not all subcultures are counter-cultures.


Subculture
Quote:

In 2007, Ken Gelder proposed to distinguish subcultures from countercultures based on the level of immersion in society. Gelder further proposed six key ways in which subcultures can be identified:
  • through their often negative relations to work (as 'idle', 'parasitic', at play or at leisure, etc.);
  • through their negative or ambivalent relation to class (since subcultures are not 'class-conscious' and don't conform to traditional class definitions);
  • through their association with territory (the 'street', the 'hood', the club, etc.), rather than property;
  • through their movement out of the home and into non-domestic forms of belonging (i.e. social groups other than the family);
  • through their stylistic ties to excess and exaggeration (with some exceptions);
  • through their refusal of the banalities of ordinary life and massification.




Counterculture
Quote:

Counterculture (also written counter-culture) is a sociological term used to describe the values and norms of behavior of a cultural group, or subculture, that run counter to those of the social mainstream of the day, the cultural equivalent of political opposition. Counterculture can also be described as a group whose behavior deviates from the societal norm. It is a neologism attributed to Theodore Roszak. Although distinct countercultural undercurrents have existed in many societies, here the term refers to a more significant, visible phenomenon that reaches critical mass and persists for a period of time. A countercultural movement expresses the ethos, aspirations, and dreams of a specific population during an era—a social manifestation of zeitgeist. It is important to distinguish between "counterculture," "subculture," and "fringe culture".




--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.


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OfflineHippieChick8
seeker of justice
Female


Registered: 06/25/09
Posts: 869
Loc: Texas
Last seen: 9 years, 2 months
Re: Countercultures [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #14425251 - 05/09/11 03:39 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

OrgoneConclusion said:
Quote:

Curiousgeorge22 said:
Are there any countercultures present today? Why or why not.




Counter-cultures generally crack me up. "I want to be a rebellious and unique biker and wear a leather vest and boots and sport tats, a beard/goatee, unkempt hair, a buck-knife, a long chain and ride a Harley like EVERY OTHER BIKER."

Same with goths, punks or substitute the CC of your choice.




If the counter-cultures that you are referring to are only interested in making a fashion statement, I do not consider them to actually be a counter-culture.  According to the Wiki article that Poid posted, their values, norms and behavior have to deviate from the societal norm.


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OfflineEpigallo
Stranger

Registered: 09/17/06
Posts: 8,155
Last seen: 6 years, 10 months
Re: Countercultures [Re: HippieChick8]
    #14426493 - 05/09/11 07:45 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Yeah, I don't see what is so ironic about countercultures having overt "tags" of their shared idiosyncratic values. It isn't like the fashion and mannerisms of mainstream cultures are there for a purely utilitarian, rather than social function. Why do I have a collar on my shirt?


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Invisiblemonkeyheaven
Male


Registered: 07/09/07
Posts: 964
Loc: yonder
Re: Countercultures [Re: Curiousgeorge22]
    #14428206 - 05/10/11 03:35 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

There used to be lots of anarchists in Colorado. 
I attended a lecture at the anarchist bookstore in Denver, and borrowed a book (which I never returned) maybe a decade ago.
 
They were out in force blocking off streets to protest the runnup to the Iraq war, throwing teargas cannisters at police and whatnot.

It's sad, the antiwar movement was pretty fractured (I attended one seminar that was infested with spinter groups who only cared about getting credit for their work rather than achieve anything) and it failed.

There are probably still anarchists in Colorado, and I know there are lots of people who transcend the mainstream (hate politics, embrace non-heirarchical scenes, etc.)

What about all those folks hiding out in Montana and North Dakota who don't pay taxes and horde weapons?


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