|
OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
|
My niece graduated from Bible College
#14403962 - 05/05/11 07:23 AM (12 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
and graduated near the top of her class. She was shocked to find that those four years of 'studying' fantasy opened no employment doors for her except to brainwash the next generation of soldiers for Christ - preferably at her church or at the same college.
Now she must start all over and go to nursing school (aka science) to get a 'real' job.
Bible college is like getting a degree in Star Warsology.
--------------------
|
shroomzi8
king of the wild fronteer



Registered: 10/04/10
Posts: 1,764
Loc: Valencia, Spain
Last seen: 7 years, 3 months
|
|
that sucks. was she not informed of the outcome before she enrolled?
|
Sleepwalker
Overshoes


Registered: 05/07/08
Posts: 5,503
|
Re: My niece graduated from Bible College [Re: shroomzi8]
#14404028 - 05/05/11 07:42 AM (12 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
How well informed could she be? It's Bible College.  The religious don't tend to base themselves in reality.
|
OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
|
Re: My niece graduated from Bible College [Re: shroomzi8]
#14404055 - 05/05/11 07:52 AM (12 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
Her dad/my brother had her preaching to me and others since she was a wee lass. She never had a chance.
And seeing as how she never dated, she married the first good Christian boy from the same college to come along.
Now that they are having their first child, he is also going back to another four year college after the first useless four years and are getting welfare and food stamps in the interim.
--------------------
|
deCypher



Registered: 02/10/08
Posts: 56,232
|
|
Did you ever try to instill doubts or healthy skepticism in her?
-------------------- We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.
 
|
OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
|
Re: My niece graduated from Bible College [Re: deCypher] 2
#14404083 - 05/05/11 08:06 AM (12 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
It is near-impossible to overcome early programming like that. It is like communicating with a tape recorder.
Dear Niece,
Everything your Mom and Dad believe is total nonsense. If they were to hold such beliefs outside of an accepted religion they would be deemed delusional at best and mentally ill at worst.
Love,
Uncle OC 
To answer your question more directly, yes I did and very gently by asking simple, direct questions, much like I do here, but without the attitude. Much like here, getting a direct responses to a simple yes/no question is an amazingly difficult task.
I believe the respondent's logic must be functioning on some subconscious level, else why the avoidance?
--------------------
Edited by OrgoneConclusion (05/05/11 08:27 AM)
|
NetDiver
Wandering Mindfuck


Registered: 08/24/09
Posts: 6,024
Loc: Everywhere and Nowhere
Last seen: 1 year, 6 months
|
|
Yeah, that's also why I at theological debates in philosophy. And philosophers like Aquinas who base entire systems of thought on the Bible.
"Does God judge goodness by an external standard? Does his omniscience allow for free will?"
Who gives a shit? The entire premise of the debate is based on fantasy. Might as well argue "Who's stronger, Gandalf or Darth Vader?"
|
OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
|
Re: My niece graduated from Bible College [Re: NetDiver]
#14404141 - 05/05/11 08:24 AM (12 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
After 23 years of intense mathematical and theological study and using the latest super-computers, I have come to the conclusion that 1,238 angels can dance on the head of a pin.
Mankind owes me a debt of gratitude for solving that conundrum. Now I can work on the mysteries of The Ark...
--------------------
|
Doc_T
Random Dude




Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 42,395
Loc: Colorado
|
Re: My niece graduated from Bible College [Re: NetDiver]
#14404156 - 05/05/11 08:29 AM (12 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Samurai Drifter said: The entire premise of the debate is based on fantasy.
Just to play devil's advocate, the same thing can be said for mathematics.
Quote:
Samurai Drifter said: Might as well argue "Who's stronger, Gandalf or Darth Vader?"
Gandalf. No question.
-------------------- You make it all possible. Doesn't it feel good?
|
Cups
technically "here"


Registered: 12/24/09
Posts: 1,925
|
Re: My niece graduated from Bible College [Re: Doc_T]
#14404178 - 05/05/11 08:33 AM (12 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Doc_T said: Gandalf. No question.
Shiiiiiiiiiit.
Well maybe.
-------------------- What's up everybody?!
|
NetDiver
Wandering Mindfuck


Registered: 08/24/09
Posts: 6,024
Loc: Everywhere and Nowhere
Last seen: 1 year, 6 months
|
Re: My niece graduated from Bible College [Re: Doc_T]
#14404191 - 05/05/11 08:36 AM (12 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Doc_T said: Just to play devil's advocate, the same thing can be said for mathematics.
Wow. You're kidding, right?
|
Doc_T
Random Dude




Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 42,395
Loc: Colorado
|
Re: My niece graduated from Bible College [Re: NetDiver]
#14404202 - 05/05/11 08:38 AM (12 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
Wow. No, math is almost entirely content-free. Mental masturbation at it's finest.
-------------------- You make it all possible. Doesn't it feel good?
|
NetDiver
Wandering Mindfuck


Registered: 08/24/09
Posts: 6,024
Loc: Everywhere and Nowhere
Last seen: 1 year, 6 months
|
Re: My niece graduated from Bible College [Re: Doc_T]
#14404218 - 05/05/11 08:42 AM (12 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
Math was used to design the computer you're using right now. In fact, it's essentially a glorified calculator. 
And the laws of physics, that have been used in essentially every technological development of the last century? Entirely mathematical. It is a system of related symbols, but they aren't just symbols - they can be used to relate to objects, experience, and nature.
Math is logic. It's a tool with multitudes of uses, unlike the Bible, whose main usage is filling peoples' minds with moralistic, self-righteous garbage.
|
Sleepwalker
Overshoes


Registered: 05/07/08
Posts: 5,503
|
Re: My niece graduated from Bible College [Re: NetDiver]
#14404225 - 05/05/11 08:44 AM (12 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Samurai Drifter said: they aren't just symbols - they can be used to relate to objects, experience, and nature.
Religious concepts can do this too
|
NetDiver
Wandering Mindfuck


Registered: 08/24/09
Posts: 6,024
Loc: Everywhere and Nowhere
Last seen: 1 year, 6 months
|
Re: My niece graduated from Bible College [Re: Sleepwalker]
#14404228 - 05/05/11 08:45 AM (12 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
Yes, as metaphors - but if you're using religious texts metaphorically, they have left the realm of religion and entered the realm of fantasy.
|
OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
|
Re: My niece graduated from Bible College [Re: Sleepwalker] 2
#14404229 - 05/05/11 08:46 AM (12 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
In my car, I have both airbags AND a statue of the Virgin Mary to protect me.
--------------------
|
Diploid
Cuban



Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
|
|
I still can't quite wrap my mind around a PhD in Theology. If some university offered a PhD in Flying Spaghetti Monster, they'd be laughed at even though it's the same thing.
Humans are doomed.
-------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
|
OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
|
Re: My niece graduated from Bible College [Re: Diploid]
#14404338 - 05/05/11 09:15 AM (12 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
If some university offered a PhD in Flying Spaghetti Monster
Cordon Bleu?
--------------------
|
Diploid
Cuban



Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
|
|

I've always wanted to go to culinary school.
-------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
|
desert father
Stranger
Registered: 07/17/10
Posts: 1,102
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
|
|
heh, i could've used some of that money to go to school....
but i guess i'm no better than her, i wasted four years developing an opiate addiction and a severe hatred for everyone other than myself.
wish i had food stamps though...
-------------------- vi veri veniversum vivus vici What she said : "I smoke 'cos I'm hoping for an Early death AND I NEED TO CLING TO SOMETHING !"
|
DieCommie

Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
|
Re: My niece graduated from Bible College [Re: Doc_T]
#14404711 - 05/05/11 11:02 AM (12 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Doc_T said: Wow. No, math is almost entirely content-free. Mental masturbation at it's finest.
That is not the same as being based on fantasy.
|
deCypher



Registered: 02/10/08
Posts: 56,232
|
|
Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said: It is near-impossible to overcome early programming like that. It is like communicating with a tape recorder.
Dear Niece,
Everything your Mom and Dad believe is total nonsense. If they were to hold such beliefs outside of an accepted religion they would be deemed delusional at best and mentally ill at worst.
Love,
Uncle OC 
To answer your question more directly, yes I did and very gently by asking simple, direct questions, much like I do here, but without the attitude. Much like here, getting a direct responses to a simple yes/no question is an amazingly difficult task.
I believe the respondent's logic must be functioning on some subconscious level, else why the avoidance?
I know what you mean. When I babysat a seven year old kid who lived down the street with extremely hardcore Fundamentalist parents I occasionally tried to get him to see at least ONE contradiction with his beliefs. When it got to the point when he said dinosaur bones were put on the Earth to test our faith I simply gave up.
-------------------- We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.
 
|
Cups
technically "here"


Registered: 12/24/09
Posts: 1,925
|
Re: My niece graduated from Bible College [Re: deCypher]
#14405210 - 05/05/11 01:15 PM (12 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
deCypher said: When it got to the point when he said dinosaur bones were put on the Earth to test our faith I simply gave up. 
Don't you mean Jesus Horses? 
I've used the speed of light several time to stump people who tell me the earth is 7000 years old or whatever.
If we know how fast light travels...and we know how far away the stars are...and we can see them...
After silence I usually here something like "Well maybe the universe was complete and God made the Earth later." or God made the whole thing at once and backdated the light speeding across the cosmos. Or something like that.
To this I usually reply if we're going down that road then maybe God made the universe this morning and your life is just an implanted memory.
Then they go-
-------------------- What's up everybody?!
|
OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
|
Re: My niece graduated from Bible College [Re: Cups]
#14405557 - 05/05/11 02:25 PM (12 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
I've used the speed of light several time to stump people who tell me the earth is 7000 years old or whatever.
You totally lost me with this half-formed argument. Care to elaborate?
--------------------
|
NetDiver
Wandering Mindfuck


Registered: 08/24/09
Posts: 6,024
Loc: Everywhere and Nowhere
Last seen: 1 year, 6 months
|
|
If the Earth is only 7000 years old, then light from the stars that are further than 7000 light-years away should not be reaching us.
|
OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
|
Re: My niece graduated from Bible College [Re: NetDiver]
#14405692 - 05/05/11 02:50 PM (12 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
That makes no sense.
--------------------
|
NetDiver
Wandering Mindfuck


Registered: 08/24/09
Posts: 6,024
Loc: Everywhere and Nowhere
Last seen: 1 year, 6 months
|
|

You understand math right?
|
DieCommie

Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
|
Re: My niece graduated from Bible College [Re: NetDiver]
#14405809 - 05/05/11 03:24 PM (12 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
hmmm, so if the universe is 13.6 billion years old and the visible universe spans 100 billion light-years - how do you account for that?
|
OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
|
Re: My niece graduated from Bible College [Re: NetDiver]
#14405822 - 05/05/11 03:26 PM (12 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
That is your detailed explanation?
--------------------
|
OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
|
Re: My niece graduated from Bible College [Re: DieCommie]
#14405832 - 05/05/11 03:27 PM (12 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
Don't distract him from the original premise. This should be good.
--------------------
|
NetDiver
Wandering Mindfuck


Registered: 08/24/09
Posts: 6,024
Loc: Everywhere and Nowhere
Last seen: 1 year, 6 months
|
|
I'm not the original one who made the argument.
But suffice it to say, if the Earth is X years old, the light coming from a star X + 1 light years away should not yet be visible. What do you see wrong with that?
|
OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
|
Re: My niece graduated from Bible College [Re: NetDiver]
#14405891 - 05/05/11 03:40 PM (12 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
Still makes no sense. I was born a half century ago, so I am unable to see stars farther than 50 light years away?
--------------------
|
DieCommie

Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
|
Re: My niece graduated from Bible College [Re: NetDiver]
#14405906 - 05/05/11 03:43 PM (12 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
And yet, the earth is 5 billion years old and we see light coming from a star over 5 billion years away.
Furthermore, the universe is 13 billion years old and we see light coming from a star over 13 billion years away.
Something wrong with that?
|
NetDiver
Wandering Mindfuck


Registered: 08/24/09
Posts: 6,024
Loc: Everywhere and Nowhere
Last seen: 1 year, 6 months
|
|
Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said: Still makes no sense. I was born a half century ago, so I am unable to see stars farther than 50 light years away?

They also believe the stars are less than 7000 years old.
|
OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
|
Re: My niece graduated from Bible College [Re: NetDiver]
#14406126 - 05/05/11 04:27 PM (12 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
I don't care about 'they'. You asked if I understood math as if I was incapable of doing the calculations. Are you now admitting you made a boo boo?
--------------------
|
Cups
technically "here"


Registered: 12/24/09
Posts: 1,925
|
|
Quote:
DieCommie said:
Furthermore, the universe is 13 billion years old and we see light coming from a star over 13 billion years away.
This would be from expansion correct?
Even if a star is 100 billion light years away today when the light originally left the star was <13B light years away.
Quote:
Samurai Drifter said: If the Earth is only 7000 years old, then light from the stars that are further than 7000 light-years away should not be reaching us.
Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said: That makes no sense.
OK When fundies talk about the earth being 7000 years old they are referencing not just earth, but the universe. God made the "heavens" and the earth etc etc etc.
So while my argument might not be "technically" correct and account for expansion and stuff like I referenced above...it is sufficient to sow that small seed of doubt in a literalistic interpretation of the bible.
-------------------- What's up everybody?!
|
Diploid
Cuban



Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
|
|
If the religious nutjob thinks the *universe* is 7,000 years old, then the argument makes sense, which I think they do because they base this number on Genesis (where the universe and even light is created) plus Jesus' pedigree.
-------------------- Republican Values: 1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you. 2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child. 3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer. 4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
|
4896744
Small Town Girl


Registered: 03/06/10
Posts: 5,128
Loc: United States
Last seen: 11 years, 8 months
|
|
Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said: and graduated near the top of her class. She was shocked to find that those four years of 'studying' fantasy opened no employment doors for her except to brainwash the next generation of soldiers for Christ - preferably at her church or at the same college.
Now she must start all over and go to nursing school (aka science) to get a 'real' job.
Bible college is like getting a degree in Star Warsology.

She would probably be able to find a job at my high school too. If you have a bible degree or you were in the army they seem to think you are qualified to be a teacher.
This along with the incessant brainwashing that goes on are probably what accounts for how generally low their SAT scores are.
-------------------- Live your Life!
|
NetDiver
Wandering Mindfuck


Registered: 08/24/09
Posts: 6,024
Loc: Everywhere and Nowhere
Last seen: 1 year, 6 months
|
|
Quote:
OrgoneConclusion said: I don't care about 'they'. You asked if I understood math as if I was incapable of doing the calculations. Are you now admitting you made a boo boo?
Yes. I should have specified that it wasn't just the Earth that's supposedly 7,000 years old, but everything.
|
OrgoneConclusion
Blue Fish Group



Registered: 04/01/07
Posts: 45,414
Loc: Under the C
|
Re: My niece graduated from Bible College [Re: NetDiver]
#14406830 - 05/05/11 06:56 PM (12 years, 8 months ago) |
|
|
OK then, you are forgiven - this ONE time.
--------------------
|
|