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Offlinemntlfngrs
The Art of Casterbation
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Registered: 07/18/02
Posts: 3,937
Last seen: 5 years, 9 months
Re: Hope war ends soon, can't wait to have our streets back. [Re: infidelGOD]
    #1440861 - 04/08/03 09:16 PM (21 years, 2 months ago)

SO you deny the premiss of my post? In the long run many times more lives will not be saved? Not shooting back at someone who shoots from a mosq is not restraint?

If you do see that there will be lives saved in the long run, how do you justify sitting on your hands?

Would you not stop a man who was beating his wife and kids every day?

I guess I'm one of the people who would be willing to lose one to save 1000.

If I was Iraqi I would be willing to die for this cause.

Give me liberty or give me death!


--------------------
Be all and you'll be to end all

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Offlinemntlfngrs
The Art of Casterbation
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Registered: 07/18/02
Posts: 3,937
Last seen: 5 years, 9 months
Re: Hope war ends soon, can't wait to have our streets back. [Re: mntlfngrs]
    #1440867 - 04/08/03 09:19 PM (21 years, 2 months ago)

I don't have the source on hand but did anyone else hear the interview with and wounded EPOW that said he had never received such good care or been given so much respect? Now he is providing intell.


--------------------
Be all and you'll be to end all

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InvisibleinfidelGOD
illusion

Registered: 04/18/02
Posts: 3,040
Loc: there
Re: Hope war ends soon, can't wait to have our streets back. [Re: mntlfngrs]
    #1441106 - 04/08/03 10:32 PM (21 years, 2 months ago)

Would you not stop a man who was beating his wife and kids every day?

yeah I would shoot him in front of his wife and kids
"it's for the children!"

please...


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OfflineMurex
Reality Hacker

Registered: 07/28/02
Posts: 3,599
Loc: Traped in a shell.
Last seen: 16 years, 9 months
Re: Hope war ends soon, can't wait to have our streets back. [Re: infidelGOD]
    #1441123 - 04/08/03 10:37 PM (21 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Would you not stop a man who was beating his wife and kids every day?

yeah I would shoot him in front of his wife and kids
"it's for the children!"




Now you are just being silly.  :blush:


--------------------
What if everything around you
Isn't quite as it seems?
What if all the world you think you know,
Is an elaborate dream?
And if you look at your reflection,
Is it all you want it to be?


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InvisibleinfidelGOD
illusion

Registered: 04/18/02
Posts: 3,040
Loc: there
Re: Hope war ends soon, can't wait to have our streets back. [Re: Murex]
    #1441144 - 04/08/03 10:42 PM (21 years, 2 months ago)

it was a silly response to a silly argument.

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OfflineMurex
Reality Hacker

Registered: 07/28/02
Posts: 3,599
Loc: Traped in a shell.
Last seen: 16 years, 9 months
Re: Hope war ends soon, can't wait to have our streets back. [Re: infidelGOD]
    #1441168 - 04/08/03 10:48 PM (21 years, 2 months ago)

The arguement wasn't silly. You just don't have a good counter-arguement.


--------------------
What if everything around you
Isn't quite as it seems?
What if all the world you think you know,
Is an elaborate dream?
And if you look at your reflection,
Is it all you want it to be?


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InvisibleinfidelGOD
illusion

Registered: 04/18/02
Posts: 3,040
Loc: there
Re: Hope war ends soon, can't wait to have our streets back. [Re: Murex]
    #1441194 - 04/08/03 10:53 PM (21 years, 2 months ago)

No it was a ridiculous argument

If we are going to war to "liberate" the Iraqis, why aren't we going after dictatorships in other countries, if we are so concerned for peoples lives?
shouldn't our foreign policy be consistent?

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Anonymous

Re: Hope war ends soon, can't wait to have our streets back. [Re: infidelGOD]
    #1441212 - 04/08/03 10:58 PM (21 years, 2 months ago)

Not every dictatorship is a threat to the US. Saddam, whether you believe it or not I don't care to get into that argument, is a threat because he supports terrorism. FACT: Saddam offers rewards and compensation to the families of suicide bombers.

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Invisiblesilversoul7
Chill the FuckOut!
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Registered: 10/10/02
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Re: Hope war ends soon, can't wait to have our streets back. [Re: TackleBerry]
    #1441219 - 04/08/03 11:00 PM (21 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Not every dictatorship is a threat to the US. Saddam, whether you believe it or not I don't care to get into that argument, is a threat because he supports terrorism. FACT: Saddam offers rewards and compensation to the families of suicide bombers.



None of whom attack the U.S. He didn't give rewards to the families of the people who perpetrated 9/11. He only gives money to the families of Palestinian suicide bombers who attack Israel, because he likes Palestine and hates Isreal. Al Queda is another matter entirely.


--------------------


"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

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Anonymous

Re: Hope war ends soon, can't wait to have our streets back. [Re: silversoul7]
    #1441232 - 04/08/03 11:04 PM (21 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Quote:

Not every dictatorship is a threat to the US. Saddam, whether you believe it or not I don't care to get into that argument, is a threat because he supports terrorism. FACT: Saddam offers rewards and compensation to the families of suicide bombers.



None of whom attack the U.S. He didn't give rewards to the families of the people who perpetrated 9/11. He only gives money to the families of Palestinian suicide bombers who attack Israel, because he likes Palestine and hates Isreal. Al Queda is another matter entirely.




Like I said, he supports terrorsism. If its against the US or not the fact is he supports terrorists.

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InvisibleinfidelGOD
illusion

Registered: 04/18/02
Posts: 3,040
Loc: there
Re: Hope war ends soon, can't wait to have our streets back. [Re: TackleBerry]
    #1441233 - 04/08/03 11:04 PM (21 years, 2 months ago)

Not every dictatorship is a threat to the US. Saddam, whether you believe it or not I don't care to get into that argument, is a threat because he supports terrorism. FACT: Saddam offers rewards and compensation to the families of suicide bombers.

Ok listen, I'm not opposed to this war, and everyone agrees that Saddam Hussein is a scumbag (you sound like I'm defending him or something) I'm just sick of all this "we're here to save the Iraqis" crap. It's dishonest.

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Anonymous

Re: Hope war ends soon, can't wait to have our streets back. [Re: infidelGOD]
    #1441245 - 04/08/03 11:07 PM (21 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Not every dictatorship is a threat to the US. Saddam, whether you believe it or not I don't care to get into that argument, is a threat because he supports terrorism. FACT: Saddam offers rewards and compensation to the families of suicide bombers.

Ok listen, I'm not opposed to this war, and everyone agrees that Saddam Hussein is a scumbag (you sound like I'm defending him or something) I'm just sick of all this "we're here to save the Iraqis" crap. It's dishonest.
 




No no no no no Im not trying to label you as anything.  I was just saying what was on my mind at the time.  Im not trying to be an asshole  I know where you stand I was just pointing some shit out  :smile: .

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InvisibleinfidelGOD
illusion

Registered: 04/18/02
Posts: 3,040
Loc: there
Re: Hope war ends soon, can't wait to have our streets back. [Re: TackleBerry]
    #1441271 - 04/08/03 11:14 PM (21 years, 2 months ago)

OK cool, well thanks for pointing that out. especially Saddam being a threat, because he's moslty a threat to US, not to his people, that's what we're worried about and that's why we're there, not to save the Iraqis.
but some people have bought into the propoganda about a war of liberation. :frown:

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InvisiblePsiloKitten
Ganja Goddess

Registered: 02/12/99
Posts: 1,617
Re: Hope war ends soon, can't wait to have our streets back. [Re: carbonhoots]
    #1441283 - 04/08/03 11:18 PM (21 years, 2 months ago)

The roads are public property, nobody owns them.. just like the parks--- I served my military time both directly and supported those who did, I pay my taxes and those streets are mine just as much as they are anyone elses.

Stop muddling things up for your gain.


--------------------

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OfflineMurex
Reality Hacker

Registered: 07/28/02
Posts: 3,599
Loc: Traped in a shell.
Last seen: 16 years, 9 months
Re: Hope war ends soon, can't wait to have our streets back. [Re: infidelGOD]
    #1441340 - 04/08/03 11:35 PM (21 years, 2 months ago)

Saddam being a threat, because he's moslty a threat to US, not to his people,

He is a BIG threat to his own people!


--------------------
What if everything around you
Isn't quite as it seems?
What if all the world you think you know,
Is an elaborate dream?
And if you look at your reflection,
Is it all you want it to be?


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InvisibleinfidelGOD
illusion

Registered: 04/18/02
Posts: 3,040
Loc: there
Re: Hope war ends soon, can't wait to have our streets back. [Re: Murex]
    #1441378 - 04/08/03 11:44 PM (21 years, 2 months ago)

yes he is. my point was that we're going to war because he's a threat to US, not because we care so much about the Iraqi people.

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Invisiblez@z.com
Libertarian
Registered: 10/13/02
Posts: 2,876
Loc: ATL
Re: Hope war ends soon, can't wait to have our streets back. [Re: infidelGOD]
    #1441439 - 04/09/03 12:07 AM (21 years, 2 months ago)

I would say it is a combination of the two.


--------------------
"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." - C.S. Lewis

"I would rather be exposed to the inconveniencies attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson

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Anonymous

Re: Hope war ends soon, can't wait to have our streets back. [Re: infidelGOD]
    #1441604 - 04/09/03 01:33 AM (21 years, 2 months ago)

What I have read in this thread by you I agree with.

And I want to congratulate everyone for a non-flaming thread!

See?  We CAN have dialogue without flames! :smile:

Cheers,

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OfflinePhred
Fred's son
Male

Registered: 10/18/00
Posts: 12,949
Loc: Dominican Republic
Last seen: 9 years, 4 months
Re: Hope war ends soon, can't wait to have our streets back. [Re: silversoul7]
    #1442235 - 04/09/03 08:21 AM (21 years, 2 months ago)

silversoul7 writes:

They didn't listen when public opinion was against them.

And that was when, precisely? I don't recall ever seeing a poll showing American public opinion opposed to taking military action against Iraq.

They just sent out a barrage of propaganda to mold it to their liking, because they know that the masses are fickle.

Ah. Once again, the standard "I am smarter than the masses" argument so beloved of Libbies.

My following remarks are addressed not solely to silversoul7, but to all those posting here who regularly use this same argument:

What the hell makes you think you are so special? Why are you so firmly convinced that you are too intelligent and aware and open-minded and skeptical to be sucked in by the advertising of corporations and government press releases, but that those who disagree with your point of view are in fact stupid and unaware and close-minded and credulous and can be convinced of anything Nike or Rumsfeld tells them in the blink of an eye?

I find this smug sense of superiority irritating and condescending. It shows what a dim view you hold of the average man, and the exalted view you hold of your own inherent wonderfulness. It is true that there are some people who can be easily sucked in by these methods, but they are a decidedly small minority.

"Boy, I sure am glad that I can think for myself. How fortunate I am not to be one of those dimwitted proles surrounding me on all sides. Why, 78% of those mouth-breathers actually support the war! The only possible explanation for this is that they are too stupid to think for themselves -- it can't possibly be that they have actually examined the pros and the cons and come to a different conclusion than I have, it must be because they are mentally defective and believe whatever the last thing they saw on the TV told them to believe!"

If you really believe you are surrounded by cretins and that you are so much brighter than the average boob in your neighborhood, you will have a bitter, bitter, life.

pinky


--------------------

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Invisiblesilversoul7
Chill the FuckOut!
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Registered: 10/10/02
Posts: 27,301
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Re: Hope war ends soon, can't wait to have our streets back. [Re: Phred]
    #1442288 - 04/09/03 08:52 AM (21 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

silversoul7 writes:

They didn't listen when public opinion was against them.

And that was when, precisely? I don't recall ever seeing a poll showing American public opinion opposed to taking military action against Iraq.



There was a time when the American public supported inspections, and there was a time when they said they would only support a war with U.N. approval.

Quote:

They just sent out a barrage of propaganda to mold it to their liking, because they know that the masses are fickle.

Ah. Once again, the standard "I am smarter than the masses" argument so beloved of Libbies.



I did not say I am smarter than the masses, and that argument is loved by people from all sides of the political spectrum.

Quote:

My following remarks are addressed not solely to silversoul7, but to all those posting here who regularly use this same argument:

What the hell makes you think you are so special? Why are you so firmly convinced that you are too intelligent and aware and open-minded and skeptical to be sucked in by the advertising of corporations and government press releases, but that those who disagree with your point of view are in fact stupid and unaware and close-minded and credulous and can be convinced of anything Nike or Rumsfeld tells them in the blink of an eye?

I find this smug sense of superiority irritating and condescending. It shows what a dim view you hold of the average man, and the exalted view you hold of your own inherent wonderfulness. It is true that there are some people who can be easily sucked in by these methods, but they are a decidedly small minority.

"Boy, I sure am glad that I can think for myself. How fortunate I am not to be one of those dimwitted proles surrounding me on all sides. Why, 78% of those mouth-breathers actually support the war! The only possible explanation for this is that they are too stupid to think for themselves -- it can't possibly be that they have actually examined the pros and the cons and come to a different conclusion than I have, it must be because they are mentally defective and believe whatever the last thing they saw on the TV told them to believe!"

If you really believe you are surrounded by cretins and that you are so much brighter than the average boob in your neighborhood, you will have a bitter, bitter, life.



I do not for a second believe that I am not vulnerable to propaganda just like everyone else. I just try my best to recognize the fact that what I'm being shown is often propaganda, and I try to think critically about its credibilty. I recognize that I am not the only one that does this, and that there are others who do the same and come to completely different conclusions. I recognize that I have a certain bias, and in recognizing that, I try not to let it get in the way. When I refer to "the masses," I don't necessarily mean the majority. What I mean is that groups behave differently than individuals.

I accept the idea that I could be wrong. That's why I enjoy debating on this forum. It allows me to test my convictions to see how sound they are.


--------------------


"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

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