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ManicMongrel
Paragorn of pointless comments


Registered: 03/14/11
Posts: 253
Loc: Across the Atlantic
Last seen: 5 months, 18 days
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Re: Panaeolus Q: Spores took 2 weeks to show signs of life on agar, won't grow on grain. ???? [Re: Javadog]
#14355856 - 04/26/11 03:33 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Sorry I was a little unclear, I place colonized pieces into the bulk substrate.
If you are dealing with energy rich substrates like grains, full of sugar and starch this wont work at all, obviously you just get a smelly pile of shit. Sterility is key with energy rich substrates.
I use substrates with a very high bacterial content, to mimic the conditions panaeolus has when they attack fresh crap cakes in nature. Pans are very common in south east asia where they usually grow on manure cakes, they obviously have to compete with other dung fungi so in that sense they are pretty agressive.
I pasteurize very thoroughly to kill all competing fungi and let the bacterias take complete control. Since the substrate doesn't have any light carbohydrates no bad bacterias or molds get a foothold, its quite similar to what pans are designed to germinate, which is why in worked well... So far anyway, I haven't used it long enough to claim its completely foolproof.
-------------------- Rules and laws are guidelines, to follow them by definition is equivalent to ignoring responsibility - Let me know if anything in my Trade List got your attention! New asian pan varieties up for trade [10.july.2013] "Familiarity breeds contempt"
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Javadog
Continuing along



Registered: 05/03/10
Posts: 7,385
Loc: USA
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Re: Panaeolus Q: Spores took 2 weeks to show signs of life on agar, won't grow on grain. ???? [Re: ManicMongrel]
#14357715 - 04/26/11 09:03 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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"So far anyway, I haven't used it long enough to claim its completely foolproof."
NO worries. Thank you for sharing!
Good luck,
JD
-------------------- Boyd Rice told my brother that life is a corny pack of freesakes Myco-tek.org
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eLShaMukO



Registered: 04/28/10
Posts: 1,686
Loc: far away
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Re: Panaeolus Q: Spores took 2 weeks to show signs of life on agar, won't grow on grain. ???? [Re: ManicMongrel]
#14358008 - 04/26/11 09:53 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
ManicMongrel said: Sorry I was a little unclear, I place colonized pieces into the bulk substrate.
If you are dealing with energy rich substrates like grains, full of sugar and starch this wont work at all, obviously you just get a smelly pile of shit. Sterility is key with energy rich substrates.
I use substrates with a very high bacterial content, to mimic the conditions panaeolus has when they attack fresh crap cakes in nature. Pans are very common in south east asia where they usually grow on manure cakes, they obviously have to compete with other dung fungi so in that sense they are pretty agressive.
I pasteurize very thoroughly to kill all competing fungi and let the bacterias take complete control. Since the substrate doesn't have any light carbohydrates no bad bacterias or molds get a foothold, its quite similar to what pans are designed to germinate, which is why in worked well... So far anyway, I haven't used it long enough to claim its completely foolproof.
Quote:
and let the bacterias take complete control
interested in knowing procedure
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Primal Call
Earth Mage



Registered: 09/05/10
Posts: 2,766
Loc: Here until here
Last seen: 4 years, 4 months
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Re: Panaeolus Q: Spores took 2 weeks to show signs of life on agar, won't grow on grain. ???? [Re: ManicMongrel]
#14358054 - 04/26/11 09:58 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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So am I understanding correctly that spawn bags or qt jars with properly pasteurized substrate is the best medium to inoculate if you know you have a clean culture? And from 100% colonization, we are to spread out this spawn/substrate directly to the fruiting chamber and apply a casing layer?
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ManicMongrel
Paragorn of pointless comments


Registered: 03/14/11
Posts: 253
Loc: Across the Atlantic
Last seen: 5 months, 18 days
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Re: Panaeolus Q: Spores took 2 weeks to show signs of life on agar, won't grow on grain. ???? [Re: Primal Call]
#14359434 - 04/27/11 03:04 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
Ryath said: So am I understanding correctly that spawn bags or qt jars with properly pasteurized substrate is the best medium to inoculate if you know you have a clean culture? And from 100% colonization, we are to spread out this spawn/substrate directly to the fruiting chamber and apply a casing layer?

It's very good medium to inoculate in my opinion, kind of hard to define whats best or perfect.
If it takes forever to go from 95% to reach 100%, you can just dig out the uncolonized parts and move on, I don't think you will risk anything.
-------------------- Rules and laws are guidelines, to follow them by definition is equivalent to ignoring responsibility - Let me know if anything in my Trade List got your attention! New asian pan varieties up for trade [10.july.2013] "Familiarity breeds contempt"
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Primal Call
Earth Mage



Registered: 09/05/10
Posts: 2,766
Loc: Here until here
Last seen: 4 years, 4 months
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Re: Panaeolus Q: Spores took 2 weeks to show signs of life on agar, won't grow on grain. ???? [Re: ManicMongrel]
#14360203 - 04/27/11 09:28 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
ManicMongrel said:
It's very good medium to inoculate in my opinion, kind of hard to define whats best or perfect.
apologies, I should have worded that differently. You are, of course, right.
as for the 2nd question in there? thoughts?
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ManicMongrel
Paragorn of pointless comments


Registered: 03/14/11
Posts: 253
Loc: Across the Atlantic
Last seen: 5 months, 18 days
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Re: Panaeolus Q: Spores took 2 weeks to show signs of life on agar, won't grow on grain. ???? [Re: Primal Call]
#14360476 - 04/27/11 10:37 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Yep make it ready for fruiting as soon as its colonized, pinning can start very quick.
I haven't used casing layer myself yet, seems more like a personal preference.
I've seen great results with it, suppose its good for more stable moisture, absorbing impacts from water droplets if thats a problem. I'll try to use a thin one with very loose soil next time.
-------------------- Rules and laws are guidelines, to follow them by definition is equivalent to ignoring responsibility - Let me know if anything in my Trade List got your attention! New asian pan varieties up for trade [10.july.2013] "Familiarity breeds contempt"
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Primal Call
Earth Mage



Registered: 09/05/10
Posts: 2,766
Loc: Here until here
Last seen: 4 years, 4 months
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Re: Panaeolus Q: Spores took 2 weeks to show signs of life on agar, won't grow on grain. ???? [Re: ManicMongrel]
#14360541 - 04/27/11 10:57 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Javadog
Continuing along



Registered: 05/03/10
Posts: 7,385
Loc: USA
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Re: Panaeolus Q: Spores took 2 weeks to show signs of life on agar, won't grow on grain. ???? [Re: Primal Call]
#14363257 - 04/27/11 08:00 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Hey Ryath,
I usually colonize in the same tub or tray that I intend to fruit in, but one can break up a fully colonized sub into a tub/tray to fruit. Usually a recovery period is observed. Casing is optional with cubes, as usual.
I like to case, but sometimes I do not want to deal with the pasteurization cycle.
Take care,
JD
-------------------- Boyd Rice told my brother that life is a corny pack of freesakes Myco-tek.org
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