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yogabunny
fancy cat



Registered: 11/01/09
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Re: Writing a paper on combatting inner-city drug problems [Re: blazenn]
#14360198 - 04/27/11 09:25 AM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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blazenn said:
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yogabunny said:
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blazenn said: you've gotta remember though that legalization and decriminalization WILL open the door to further and longer-lasting drug problems IF we don't have proper education and treatment on drugs in the first place.
we can't HAVE proper education and better treatment until these drugs are unscheduled and we can continue with thorough clinical and scientific research.
also, OP, i think this website may be of some help to you: http://www.countthecosts.org/
im just curious why you think we have to have all drugs legalized before we can have proper education regarding them. care to elaborate?
Do you understand the concept of scheduling? Schedule 1 substances "have a high potential for abuse" and "o currently accepted medical use in treatment in the United States" and "a lack of accepted safety for use of the drug or other substance under medical supervision."
Erowid is a great source but we need more research and clinical testing (IMO) in order to provide solid, sound education with regard to long term effects and dosage advice.
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Remix
grammer natze



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Re: Writing a paper on combatting inner-city drug problems [Re: blazenn] 1
#14360215 - 04/27/11 09:30 AM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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blazenn said:
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Remix said:
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blazenn said: im just curious why you think we have to have all drugs legalized before we can have proper education regarding them. care to elaborate?
I'm not sure exactly what yogabunny's reasoning is but, AFAIK, most scheduled drugs (especially schedule 1) have severe or total restrictions regarding proper testing and experiments that would make comprehensive eduction about said illegal drugs a possibility.
wtf kind of experiments or testing do you need to do to learn the negative effects of drugs???? millions of americans are already guinea pigs for that kind of experiment every day...
I agree. Plus, when drugs are illegal the funds to find things wrong with them are more than adequately covered. T. Mckenna once said that more money has been put forward trying to find something wrong with marijuana than any other drug and IMO he's more than right.
However, finding the positive effects of drug use are just as important, if not, moreso than the negative effects with regards to "drug education". Many of these positive effects are completely ignored and elude study because of current scheduling/prohibition.
Also, mind you, under prohibition, which would still be the case even if drugs were decriminalized (remember: all "decriminalization" means is users don't get arrested for a specified amount of drugs; anything defined as trafficking or "intent to sell" will still be quite illegal), there's still a stigma against the illegal drugs that will allow rhetoric and misinformation to be justified. You can try and educate people all you want but until these drugs are out in the open, and people who use them are given the sense that their actions are culturally sanctioned, the correct information will still be suppressed and open discussion will be considered dissident.
When a culture still has a "good drugs - bad drugs" (IE: Legal and Illegal drugs) stance then proper education regarding ALL drugs and their use can never really be achieved because there is still support for the notion that a society can be "drug free" (or, in reality, free of drugs the government doesn't particularly approve of).
I don't really understand what you think decriminalization achieves. From my observation it's just a way to show that society won't collapse if you let people use/posses drugs without being imprisoned (they are still fined, though). But, it isn't much of a solution to "the drug war" and the problems facilitated by prohibition.
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pouihi
Mary Jane Doe



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Re: Writing a paper on combatting inner-city drug problems [Re: Mad_Larkin]
#14360468 - 04/27/11 10:34 AM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Mad_Larkin said: Isn't decriminalisation good enough for you?
It's not enough when in practice it works as prohibition. Try being caught in Portugal with 10 gr of cocaine and see what happens. It's bullshit because it only works on paper. It's also stupid because the same substances that you're allegedly allowed to carry have active principles that are prohibited. It doesn't work that way, in order to buy drugs you need someone to sell (since growing is prohibited) them and sale is only possible through drug dealers since there isn't one single legal place that sells them, so... no, not enough...
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"If the doors of perception were cleansed everything would appear to man as it is, infinite."
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bigmike7104
Stranger

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Re: Writing a paper on combatting inner-city drug problems [Re: pouihi]
#14360528 - 04/27/11 10:52 AM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Try being caught in Portugal with 10 gr of cocaine and see what happens
but it isn't under a certain amount and you don't get charged with anything?
-------------------- Over thinking, over analyzing separates the body from the mind Withering my intuition, missing opportunities and I must Feed my will to feel my moment drawing way outside the lines
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pouihi
Mary Jane Doe



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Re: Writing a paper on combatting inner-city drug problems [Re: bigmike7104]
#14360568 - 04/27/11 11:05 AM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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bigmike7104 said:
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Try being caught in Portugal with 10 gr of cocaine and see what happens
but it isn't under a certain amount and you don't get charged with anything?
Supposedly the amount decriminalized is the equivalent to a medium personal dose enough for 10 days (which in itself is stupid being that some doses can vary so much depending on the user).
Basically this legislation was made to distinguish personal use from traffic. If you're caught with the stipulated decriminalized amount you will not be charged of traffic, but you will have to pay a fee and your drugs will be apprehended
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"If the doors of perception were cleansed everything would appear to man as it is, infinite."
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yogabunny
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Re: Writing a paper on combatting inner-city drug problems [Re: TTT]
#14360586 - 04/27/11 11:09 AM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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TTT said: All drugs should be legalized because humans will always seek any drugs.
There is really no good reason, in my eyes, to keep anything illegal. Even amphetamines, crack and opiates. It should come down to treating drug abuse as a symptom of greater problems in that persons life, not the sole problem. We also need to take responsibility for what we do as individuals. Calling drug addiction a disease and treating its users like criminals doesn't help a struggling person on any level, especially psychologically.
Op, I am jealous you get to write on this. This is one of the few topics I could write PAGES and pages on.
this
decriminlization is like a small step in the right direction, but look at how long the war on drugs has lasted...do we really want to commit to another policy that's not going to do all too much to change all the many issues that plague our society due to drug prohibition?
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bigmike7104
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Re: Writing a paper on combatting inner-city drug problems [Re: yogabunny]
#14360637 - 04/27/11 11:22 AM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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^yup, even some animals regularly do drugs
-------------------- Over thinking, over analyzing separates the body from the mind Withering my intuition, missing opportunities and I must Feed my will to feel my moment drawing way outside the lines
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Halsfield

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Re: Writing a paper on combatting inner-city drug problems [Re: bigmike7104]
#14360790 - 04/27/11 12:05 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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We teach our kids about sex, educate them on all the nasty details of STDs, pregnancy, using protection, etc. Not in the hopes that young teens will be having sex all over the place, but in the hopes that IF they do encounter it they will know everything they need to do to stay safe or at least be able to make the choice to stay safe.
Then when it comes to drugs which are even more dangerous we go with an abstinence approach instead of a harm reduction approach. Completely stupid.
The war on drugs has done nothing but made things 100x more violent and dangerous and funneled billions overseas to drug warlords. End it just like we did alcohol prohibition and for the same reasons.
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I AM SWIM
doin' thangs



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Re: Writing a paper on combatting inner-city drug problems [Re: bigmike7104]
#14360819 - 04/27/11 12:16 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
bigmike7104 said: ^yup, even some animals regularly do drugs
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bigmike7104
Stranger

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Re: Writing a paper on combatting inner-city drug problems [Re: I AM SWIM]
#14360827 - 04/27/11 12:17 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Jaguar tripping i love the still frame when you hit play. he's on his back staring up at the sky 
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I AM SWIM
doin' thangs



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Re: Writing a paper on combatting inner-city drug problems [Re: bigmike7104]
#14360834 - 04/27/11 12:21 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Mad_Larkin

Registered: 11/29/07
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Re: Writing a paper on combatting inner-city drug problems [Re: I AM SWIM]
#14360845 - 04/27/11 12:24 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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zappaisgod
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Re: Writing a paper on combatting inner-city drug problems [Re: shadowplay]
#14360926 - 04/27/11 12:45 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Perhaps you might want to consider the idea of eliminating inner city housing projects entirely. By putting all members of a failed class together in one large segregated group you create a Crime Petri dish in which the infection never gets a chance to die off.
It's not that they use drugs but how they use drugs.
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shadowplay


Registered: 05/15/10
Posts: 1,337
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Re: Writing a paper on combatting inner-city drug problems [Re: zappaisgod]
#14361750 - 04/27/11 03:35 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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As much as I support full legalization, I think that topic is really beyond the scope of this class, and I really need a decent grade on this paper.
Zappa, you have a good point, but do you have any viable alternatives in mind?
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zappaisgod
horrid asshole


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Re: Writing a paper on combatting inner-city drug problems [Re: shadowplay]
#14361789 - 04/27/11 03:41 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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No more housing projects. Vouchers. Spread 'em around into small buildings not all in the same neighborhood. Racial and class homogeneity just ensures that nothing will change.
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shadowplay


Registered: 05/15/10
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Re: Writing a paper on combatting inner-city drug problems [Re: zappaisgod]
#14361933 - 04/27/11 04:02 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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That's a good idea  I'll look into that.
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