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OfflineSatyapriya
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A very powerful animal rights video (WARNING: do not watch if squeemish!)
    #14347006 - 04/25/11 12:57 AM (13 years, 27 days ago)

http://www.earthlings.com/

I just realized I violated rule 3 by posting this video without a conversation starter, so... What do you guys think of this documentary?  Do you agree with the method of persuasion and content included in the video? 

I for one have a problem with the method of persuasion used.  For instance, when I read the slogan, "make the connection," after watching the video I see, "make the connection, idiots."  IMO if someone wants to change the would with a documentary, they should let the footage speak for itself, and keep any condescending attitudes, and emotional commentary out of it.  This is what gives animal rights activists such a bad rap.  Otherwise, I thought it was an excellent film, and revealed the truth about animal cruelty throughout the world in a righteous and tasteful manner.


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www.collectivelyconscious.net - Hive mind for the awakened. ॐ Collectively Conscious ॐ is a community-powered, community-verified, alternative news/multimedia aggregation service for global citizens.

Edited by Satyapriya (04/25/11 02:11 AM)

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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: A very powerful animal rights video (WARNING: do not watch if squeemish!) [Re: Satyapriya] * 1
    #14348194 - 04/25/11 09:40 AM (13 years, 27 days ago)

That's a fine piece of propaganda.  Ever seen video of a wildebeest eaten alive by lions, still lowing while it is eviscerated by the pack?  I have.  Almost every animal death in the natural world is horribly painful.  That we kill any animals humanely is a credit.  I do not condone animal torture on that basis but facts are facts.  We are a predatory species.  Top of the food chain.  We are much more respectful than any other species in how we harvest our animal food.


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OfflineLed Zeppelin
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Re: A very powerful animal rights video (WARNING: do not watch if squeemish!) [Re: zappaisgod]
    #14356969 - 04/26/11 06:37 PM (13 years, 26 days ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
That's a fine piece of propaganda.  Ever seen video of a wildebeest eaten alive by lions, still lowing while it is eviscerated by the pack?  I have.  Almost every animal death in the natural world is horribly painful.  That we kill any animals humanely is a credit.  I do not condone animal torture on that basis but facts are facts.  We are a predatory species.  Top of the food chain.  We are much more respectful than any other species in how we harvest our animal food.




i hate to say it but i agree...

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InvisibleEntheogenicPeace
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Re: A very powerful animal rights video (WARNING: do not watch if squeemish!) [Re: zappaisgod]
    #14357414 - 04/26/11 08:10 PM (13 years, 25 days ago)

---

Edited by EntheogenicPeace (01/05/22 07:29 PM)

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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: A very powerful animal rights video (WARNING: do not watch if squeemish!) [Re: EntheogenicPeace]
    #14357789 - 04/26/11 09:18 PM (13 years, 25 days ago)

Quote:

EntheogenicPeace said:
Whether breeding sows, their piglets, dairy cows, veal calves, egg-laying hens, broiler chickens... they all endure continuous misery their entire life on factory farms.




veal cattle are slaughtered within the 4 months, not a long lifespan at all,
sows and their piglets in farrowing crates happens coso the sow doesnt crush
the piglets, typically when they arent crated 6-8 out of 10 piglets will die
before they're weaned and cattle, dairy and otherwise are grazed on pasture
most of the time because it's too cost prohibitive to feed a cow 50lbs of
food per day, especially grains

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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: A very powerful animal rights video (WARNING: do not watch if squeemish!) [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #14359970 - 04/27/11 08:17 AM (13 years, 25 days ago)

EP doesn't understand that not only is death horrible in the natural world but so is life.  Animals are in constant fear of predation and under constant pressure to get enough food.  There is nothing romantic about it.


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InvisibleEntheogenicPeace
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Re: A very powerful animal rights video (WARNING: do not watch if squeemish!) [Re: zappaisgod]
    #14360670 - 04/27/11 11:30 AM (13 years, 25 days ago)

---

Edited by EntheogenicPeace (01/05/22 07:31 PM)

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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: A very powerful animal rights video (WARNING: do not watch if squeemish!) [Re: EntheogenicPeace]
    #14360805 - 04/27/11 12:08 PM (13 years, 25 days ago)

Yes well run farms are far superior to the wild.  Factory farms probably are as well.  The wild is vicious.


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Offlineimachavel
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Re: A very powerful animal rights video (WARNING: do not watch if squeemish!) [Re: zappaisgod]
    #14360896 - 04/27/11 12:38 PM (13 years, 25 days ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
That's a fine piece of propaganda.  Ever seen video of a wildebeest eaten alive by lions, still lowing while it is eviscerated by the pack?  I have.  Almost every animal death in the natural world is horribly painful.  That we kill any animals humanely is a credit.  I do not condone animal torture on that basis but facts are facts.  We are a predatory species.  Top of the food chain.  We are much more respectful than any other species in how we harvest our animal food.





this is the biggest bunch of bullshit i've ever read. I'm not even going to post the videos of animal torture i've seen because they are disgusting and i don't want to watch them again to make sure they have to correct content to disprove you.


animals don't skin animals alive and leave the animal to die bleeding to death or of instant infection they get when their epidermis is cut off.

the fact is people take pleasure in torture, there is no benefit from skinning an animal alive, it moves around and is likely to rip the fur you are trying to sell. people do things for pointless reasons.


if a wildebeest is eating an animal alive, it is doing so for a reason, for a nutritional value you somehow get from doing this. it's genetic and predetermined instinctively.


a lion has no disregard for what it kills, you can tame a lion in a zoo, make it super friendly, but turn around and face your back to it, and trip and fall over, and watch out, they'll attack you. it's in their brain and can't control it. it's what prey looked like before they attack, and they can't decide the difference between that and a friend when they see this.


how in the world can you say animals are as fucked up as people? and not just people towards animals, not just animal vivisections, but towards each other also. show me the animal equivalent of josef menegele or shiro ishii, and i will disregard my opinion and cease my argument immediately and stand down from ever disagreeing with you ever again.


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:kingcrankey: I did not say to edit my signature soulidarity! Now forever I will never remember what I said about understanding the secrets of the universe by paying attention to subtleties!

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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: A very powerful animal rights video (WARNING: do not watch if squeemish!) [Re: imachavel]
    #14361045 - 04/27/11 01:16 PM (13 years, 25 days ago)

Maybe you should try reading what I wrote again.  And then drop all your noble animal nonsense.  They sure as shit do skin their prey alive and leave it flopping.  Ever see a grizzly eat a salmon?  Do you know how Komodo dragons kill?  They bite their prey and follow it for days as it slowly dies from infection.  The vast majority of animals harvested for human consumption are do so reasonably humanely.  Far more so than Nature.  That's why they call it humane.


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Offlineimachavel
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Re: A very powerful animal rights video (WARNING: do not watch if squeemish!) [Re: zappaisgod]
    #14361263 - 04/27/11 01:57 PM (13 years, 25 days ago)

yeah....... right

:lol:




if you continue to disagree with me, without video evidence of what you are ignorantly saying that other animals do that is crueler, i'll be forced to put you on ignore, that video literally made me sick to my stomach. i hope the guy that did that gets shot.

i can't even believe the thing was still blinking


please don't just post crap over and over because you have an opinion and can never be wrong. i'm pretty sure i won this argument with that horrific video


--------------------
:kingcrankey: I did not say to edit my signature soulidarity! Now forever I will never remember what I said about understanding the secrets of the universe by paying attention to subtleties!

:facepalm: I'm never giving you the password again. Jerk

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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: A very powerful animal rights video (WARNING: do not watch if squeemish!) [Re: imachavel]
    #14361512 - 04/27/11 02:46 PM (13 years, 25 days ago)

You still, apparently, have not read my post.  I do not condone animal torture.  The people in those videos are assholes.  Their behavior does not reflect on mine or even a sizable population of humans.  And there is never a question of what other animals doing being cruel.  Animals cannot be cruel.  But they most certainly can and do inflict far more painful deaths in the natural world than almost anything any humans do.

Are you seriously gong to say you have never seen any nature footage of grizzlies stripping salmon or a pride of lions gathered around a still lowing wildebeest or about how Komodo dragons kill.  Then we can get to bugs, where we find several parasitic wasp species that lay their eggs in other bugs so their larva will have live fresh food.  Do you live in a petting zoo?  Are you really that ignorant?


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InvisibleEntheogenicPeace
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Re: A very powerful animal rights video (WARNING: do not watch if squeemish!) [Re: zappaisgod]
    #14362776 - 04/27/11 06:19 PM (13 years, 25 days ago)

---

Edited by EntheogenicPeace (01/05/22 07:33 PM)

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Offlineimachavel
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Re: A very powerful animal rights video (WARNING: do not watch if squeemish!) [Re: zappaisgod]
    #14364900 - 04/28/11 01:44 AM (13 years, 24 days ago)

yes of course i know wasps lay their eggs in paralyzed prey so their larvae will eat fresh food. i almost thought of getting a cockroach wasp to get rid of my cockroach problem, but then realized that i'd have a major wasp problem, which would be worst :lol:


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:kingcrankey: I did not say to edit my signature soulidarity! Now forever I will never remember what I said about understanding the secrets of the universe by paying attention to subtleties!

:facepalm: I'm never giving you the password again. Jerk

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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: A very powerful animal rights video (WARNING: do not watch if squeemish!) [Re: EntheogenicPeace]
    #14379203 - 04/30/11 07:41 PM (13 years, 21 days ago)

Quote:

EntheogenicPeace said:
To pris, you are wrong. The high mortality you speak of w/o farrowing crates (which are only slightly more spacious than gestation crates where the sows spend most of their lives & can’t every turn around) is a result of their terrible conditions they live in & their obesity.





wow, for someone so knowledgeable you know nothing, unless they're
slaughtered right after their first litter is weaned then they certainly
arent spending their lives in gestation and farrowing crates, over
breeding of any animals leads to birth defects

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gestation_crate#Farrowing_crates
A few days before giving birth, sows are moved to farrowing crates, which are slightly wider so they can lie down to nurse. Crates have 1'6" "troughs" on each side where the piglets can safely lie without being in danger of sow overlay (when the sow lays down on top of a pig).


Quote:

Naturally sows take good care of their piglets

I grow up on a farm & will (hopefully) be doing a good deal of that once I’m done w/my education




I live on a farm, I've grown up around farms, it's the reason I've bought
this one, seems that even if you win the rat race you're still a rat, the
simple fact of the matter is that there's a heavy loss in pig breeding due
to accidental suffocation, selection pressure, etc... seen it a hundred times, half a litter or less survives when farmed 'traditionally'






Quote:

P.S. Most dairy CAFOs do not graze their animals; they are kept confined all year.




prove it, try doing so without the use of the animal rights lies and
propaganda sites, I've see dairy operations many times throughout my life
and the cattle were pastured, brought in for milking where they were
allowed to eat feed grains and after milking were sent back out again,
brought back in for a second milking and sent back out for the night,
these are herds of 500-1000 head for milking, it's cost prohibitive to
confine cattle of any kind for any extended period. for a single cow to be
confined for 24 hours requires 50lbs of feed, considering a bag of feed
cost around $12 that's going to be expensive when you have 500 head to
feed, to the tune of $6000/day but lets say they get a break and only
spend $4000/day on feed, they still have the other overhead like rampant
disease in confined cattle, resistance to antibiotics if they're using
medicated feeds, veterinary bills, labor, etc... with a cow giving about 2
gallons of milk per day, that's $8/head per day totaling the low end of
the food bill at a mere $4000/day for 500 head of cattle, how's the labor
going to get paid, what of the other expenses like maintenance

I beg you, please tell me how wrong I am, that feed doesnt cost what it
does, that they use hormones to make cows produce double the quantity of
milk so I can smack you down some more with facts as opposed to emotional
masturbation



Quote:

P.P.S. Veal calves in crates have it as bad as any animal for the 1-4 months they live in misery. They require far more preventative antibiotics than other animals on factory farms bc they are in such poor health (and can't move or socialize, or even experience sunlight), including being intentionally anemic by withholding iron.




http://www.fsis.usda.gov/PDF/Veal_from_Farm_to_Table.pdf
Antibiotics may be given to prevent or treat disease in the veal calf. Penicillin is not used in calf raising: tetracycline has been approved but is not widely used. For more information, see our publication Veal from Farm to the Table.


hutches are used more often that crating because it prevents the spread of
disease, I think it's time you seriously question where your information
is coming from

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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: A very powerful animal rights video (WARNING: do not watch if squeemish!) [Re: imachavel]
    #14379218 - 04/30/11 07:47 PM (13 years, 21 days ago)

Quote:

imachavel said:

animals don't skin animals alive and leave the animal to die bleeding to death or of instant infection they get when their epidermis is cut off.

the fact is people take pleasure in torture, there is no benefit from skinning an animal alive, it moves around and is likely to rip the fur you are trying to sell. people do things for pointless reasons.





and this is common place where?

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InvisibleEntheogenicPeace
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Re: A very powerful animal rights video (WARNING: do not watch if squeemish!) [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #14382195 - 05/01/11 11:43 AM (13 years, 21 days ago)

---

Edited by EntheogenicPeace (01/05/22 07:34 PM)

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InvisiblePrisoner#1
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Re: A very powerful animal rights video (WARNING: do not watch if squeemish!) [Re: EntheogenicPeace]
    #14382398 - 05/01/11 12:33 PM (13 years, 21 days ago)

Quote:

EntheogenicPeace said:
You didn't refute that mortality rates can be kept down w/proper care & spacing w/o using farrowing crates, as those who raise them w/o doing so can attest.

You also didn't refute that most sows stil lspend a majority of their lives unable to move in gestation stalls.




well you're misinformed on so much and your reading comprehension level is
so low I didnt want to destroy everything you believed you knew in one
shot because I certainly did touch on one of these subjects but you must
have just overlooked it in your desire to pump out a emotive response on
the cruelty of everything around you

Quote:

Use of BGH (courtesy of Monsanto) is widespread in U.S. despite being banned in virtually all other developed nations. There's no point debating grazing vs. confinement of dairy cattle is you refuse to acknowledge the obvious, what even industry admits. Note: I didn't say double, you made that up bc you are on such flimsy ground.




BHG is a naturally occurring hormone in cattle, it's called Bovine
Somatotropin and it wasnt created by great evil Monsanto unless they
traveled back in time and genetically engineered the prebovine cows to
produce it naturally and as you cant seem to actually provide this proof
of what the dairy industry admits to regarding confinement I guess you're
conceding defeat

so tell us, how does this Monsanto® Brand BGH work, hell why not tell us
how the actual Recombinant Bovine Growth Hormone (rBGH/rBST) works, you
know, the stuff developed by Monsanto and marketed under the name Posilac



Quote:

Veal crates are still the fate of several hundred thousands males dairy calves per year. To the extent which this has decreased, it has been due to public awareness campaigns that led to pressure form bulk purchasers wanting to curtail bad publicity. Yes, 25 million lbs. of mostly preventative antibiotics are used on facotry farms, as last year for the first time the industry had to report this to the FDA.




again, where's the evidence

Quote:

You have facts? Yeah, the just like you had "facts" about chicken manure no longer being allowed to be fed to beef cattle bc you found a site from several years back that said what you wanted it to say, even though the proposed ban was never actually enacted, which if you bothered to do objective research you would've known about.





I've never met a cattleman that fed the crap to his herd, why, because
chicken feed contains beef as part of it's protein and calcium sources
and because of this the USDA doesnt allow the practice, maybe if you had
done a little research you'd know this... remember, bovine spongiform
encephalopathy... show u a farmer that admits to feeding chicken shit to
his cows... it should be as easy as you claim it is

Quote:

P.S. I decided to waste my time to dig up the obvious on dairy CAFOs (btw, the name should give it away... next thing you are going to tell me is that hog confinemtns let their pigs out to soil & pasture.)

http://cdp.wisc.edu/pdf/glgnfactsheet5_yr1.pdf

http://prairiefarmer.com/story.aspx/printversion/grazing/dairies/profit/142/over/confinements/8287





how do either of these prove anything other than what I've stated and the industry already knew, simply because they suggested that some cows are kept in confinement and the simple math is easy to do, it's as easy as buy feed vs. dont buy feed



Quote:

Btw, a think a published study from Temple Grandin et al from a few years ago surveying dairies/dairy practices across the Midwest & Northeast says as much.




the autistic says what, that grazing is more profitable? well shit, I've
already pointed out that fact, your links above mention rotational
grazing, something that many have been catching onto the last decade and
just because they dont rotate doesnt mean the cattle are kept indoors all
the time. you've still not shown where the industry admits that there's
thousands of cows locked away in a dark room harnessed to machines for
their entire lives


why not just prove these claims of cruelty instead of running on with the
emotional drivel that's supposed to tug at my heartstrings

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InvisibleEntheogenicPeace
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Re: A very powerful animal rights video (WARNING: do not watch if squeemish!) [Re: Prisoner#1]
    #14383091 - 05/01/11 02:55 PM (13 years, 21 days ago)

---

Edited by EntheogenicPeace (01/05/22 07:35 PM)

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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: A very powerful animal rights video (WARNING: do not watch if squeemish!) [Re: zappaisgod]
    #14383151 - 05/01/11 03:10 PM (13 years, 21 days ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
That's a fine piece of propaganda.  Ever seen video of a wildebeest eaten alive by lions, still lowing while it is eviscerated by the pack?  I have.  Almost every animal death in the natural world is horribly painful.  That we kill any animals humanely is a credit.  I do not condone animal torture on that basis but facts are facts.  We are a predatory species.  Top of the food chain.  We are much more respectful than any other species in how we harvest our animal food.



Wow, so if there's an animal species out there more cruel to other animals than humans, then humans shouldn't strive to do better?

That's the same argument conservatives seem to take on torture (there is worse torture than what the Americans dished out, so American torture is ok), about human rights violations, and about so many other issues related to inhumane treatment.

I'll respectfully disagree on this, and say inhumane treatment is bad whether or not there are worst examples.  :peace:


--------------------
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