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Offlinemeatcakeman
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Re: The Definitive Chi Test [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #14297242 - 04/15/11 06:33 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

OC, your ignorance is exceptionally brash. you're really dancing around the boundary of skepticism and stupidity.


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Invisibleteknix
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Re: The Definitive Chi Test [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #14297264 - 04/15/11 06:38 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

The video shows that the Master is not overly concerned with money. It seems more important for him to help people than make a profit.

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InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
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Re: The Definitive Chi Test [Re: teknix]
    #14297313 - 04/15/11 06:44 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Fake medicine is truly helpful.


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OfflineFronnis
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Re: The Definitive Chi Test [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #14297411 - 04/15/11 07:02 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

OrgoneConclusion said:
Quote:

starting up a university for people to study the supposed effect of psi on inanimate objects and elements.




How do you 'study' an inanimate object affected by imagination?




The only course guideline they offer so far seems to be for "telepathic studies." It seems to be quite in depth if it were some sort of scam http://qpsychics.com/university/curriculum/Telepathic-Studies-PDF.pdf.


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Edited by Fronnis (04/15/11 07:06 PM)

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Invisibleteknix
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Re: The Definitive Chi Test [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #14297413 - 04/15/11 07:02 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

How much do you pay your doctor?

How much would an acupuncture cost you, I'm sure they have some in your area, since they are everywhere!

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InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
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Re: The Definitive Chi Test [Re: teknix]
    #14297421 - 04/15/11 07:04 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

We have only refuted acupuncture some 15 times on here in the last 10 years. Do a search.


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Invisibleteknix
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Re: The Definitive Chi Test [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #14297424 - 04/15/11 07:05 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

That is besides the point, people are willing to pay way greater sums than $1 for it. He could make a fortune of it if that was his desire, which it is obviously not.

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OfflineNetDiver
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Re: The Definitive Chi Test [Re: johnm214]
    #14297755 - 04/15/11 08:24 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

johnm214 said:
Seems just an arbitrary demand with high entry barriers rather than anything logically required to comment on the evidence we see: which shows no evidence of any supernatural 'chi' effects despite a consistant claim of supernatural/mystical m3echanisms of chi's actions.



Ding ding ding! It's a logical fallacy called "moving the goalposts."


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Offlinethe bizzle
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Re: The Definitive Chi Test [Re: NetDiver]
    #14300653 - 04/16/11 12:30 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:


Really, though, what does it take to demonstrate telekentic ability?  Put someone in a room, have them move something, done.





that still is, like diploid, misconstruing the topic entirely

"chi" is like energy flow, yin/yang balance, etc. An abstraction of something we already observe at least somewhat. If you want to demonstrate it, eat only meat for a few months and you will have a blocked up colon (blocked energy flow)


telekinesis and moving objects from afar are something different, despite diploid's stubborn insistence on defining "chi" through one man on youtube.  This is ridiculous. I get his point, a thousand times over, but it is far from a definitive chi anything



The definitive chi test: eat ONLY meat for several months, and tell me how you feel


not to mention, QIGONG and CHI/QI are two different things. Just as there is tai chi. Maybe if Diploid retitled it the definitive Qigong test. it might not be so horribly out of context. But I don't really know much about QiGong, I just know that what Diploid is criticizing is not "chi"

Edited by the bizzle (04/16/11 12:31 PM)

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InvisibleDiploidM
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Re: The Definitive Chi Test [Re: the bizzle]
    #14301430 - 04/16/11 02:33 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

that still is, like diploid, misconstruing the topic entirely

/sigh

It's the chi master in the video I linked who's "misconstruing" the topic.

And it's good to know that you're qualified to lecture what chi is to a recognized master. I'm impressed.


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1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.

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Invisibleteknix
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Re: The Definitive Chi Test [Re: Diploid]
    #14301497 - 04/16/11 02:45 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Common knowledge, you're missing out. :wink:

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InvisiblePoid
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Re: The Definitive Chi Test [Re: meatcakeman]
    #14302313 - 04/16/11 05:43 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

meatcakeman said:
OC, your ignorance is exceptionally brash. you're really dancing around the boundary of skepticism and stupidity.


I like how you're leaving the people you're debating with out of the debate. :thumbup:


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Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
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Re: The Definitive Chi Test [Re: Poid]
    #14302341 - 04/16/11 05:47 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

To date, I count 284,000 posts of people explaining why something they claim can be demonstrated cannot be demonstrated. :cuckoo:


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InvisiblePoid
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Re: The Definitive Chi Test [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #14302358 - 04/16/11 05:51 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Damn, that's a lot of stoopid. :imslow:


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Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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InvisibleOrgoneConclusion
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Re: The Definitive Chi Test [Re: Poid] * 1
    #14302485 - 04/16/11 06:14 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)



If those posters were androids they would self-terminate as the illogic would be too much to bear.


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InvisiblePoid
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Re: The Definitive Chi Test [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #14302517 - 04/16/11 06:22 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

:spock:


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Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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Invisibleteknix
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Re: The Definitive Chi Test [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #14302650 - 04/16/11 06:50 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Yeah I could say the same thing about labeling and even miss-labeling.

Some people assume more than they actually know.

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InvisiblePoid
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Re: The Definitive Chi Test [Re: teknix]
    #14302657 - 04/16/11 06:51 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

"miss" labeling, LOL.


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Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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Offlineg00ru
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Re: The Definitive Chi Test [Re: Poid]
    #14304129 - 04/17/11 12:20 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

chi is real, if you don't know about it you're probably bored a lot


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Invisiblejohnm214
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Re: The Definitive Chi Test [Re: meatcakeman]
    #14304255 - 04/17/11 01:01 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

the bizzle said:
Quote:


Really, though, what does it take to demonstrate telekentic ability?  Put someone in a room, have them move something, done.





that still is, like diploid, misconstruing the topic entirely

"chi" is like energy flow, yin/yang balance, etc. An abstraction of something we already observe at least somewhat. If you want to demonstrate it, eat only meat for a few months and you will have a blocked up colon (blocked energy flow)


telekinesis and moving objects from afar are something different, despite diploid's stubborn insistence on defining "chi" through one man on youtube.  This is ridiculous. I get his point, a thousand times over, but it is far from a definitive chi anything



The definitive chi test: eat ONLY meat for several months, and tell me how you feel


not to mention, QIGONG and CHI/QI are two different things. Just as there is tai chi. Maybe if Diploid retitled it the definitive Qigong test. it might not be so horribly out of context. But I don't really know much about QiGong, I just know that what Diploid is criticizing is not "chi"





Wow, and after ALL that, like other posters, you fail to clearly state what chi is, only claiming that Diploid did not refer to Chi in his example test.  Of course, you fail to provide any argument or cited facts, you just declare it to be so.  I suspect this is like Samauri Drifter observed, simply because you wish to continue to equivocate, move the goalposts.  These are basically seeming to be no true scotsman claims.  You won't say what Chi is and demonstrate such, but you will make baseless claims that it isn't what Diploid thinks it is. 


Quote:

meatcakeman said:
Quote:

johnm214 said:

Why?  I hear you say it, but I don't hear you explain it.  What does location have to do with anything?  This seems a pretty common viewpoint amongst westerners- seems like nothing more than ethnocentric bias: "the east is somehow different and more spiritual because their culture is different than the one I'm familiar with"

His attitude has nothing to do with the veracity of his conclusions- nothing. 

Its pretty strange that you would suggest Samauri Drivter become a disciple of something he doesn't believe exists, let alone move to another country to persue such.  Seems just an arbitrary demand with high entry barriers rather than anything logically required to comment on the evidence we see: which shows no evidence of any supernatural 'chi' effects despite a consistant claim of supernatural/mystical m3echanisms of chi's actions.

Maybe there's some top-secret people who use the word chi to refer to something else.  This has been suggested several times.  What hasn't been clarified, however, is what that has to do with anything.  It seems plain its just an equivocation: if someone else refers to the toilet as chi, we obviously are not disproving the toilet or casting doubt on it despite the similarity of the terms.  Diploid, for example, has expressly defined what he's criticizing and people still are having a fit- though I've seen no clear problems with his definition claimed other than 'its deeper than that' and similar vagaries.




now you're just making a fuss.

I'm simply stating the excruciatingly obvious: Qi is mystical. If you ask for evidence, then denounce said evidence on the premise that it isn't sufficient, why don't you just go dig it up yourself?




What does the answer to that question have to do with anything?  To the extent its not really a question but a comment on the fact that I haven't done so, so you assume, it is clearly an attempt to shift the burden of proof.  To the extent it isn't such, its an irrelevant question- you've not even alleged the answer to have anything to do with the topic.

I'll answer anyways: because I don't think it exists and feel my time would be wasted looking through garbage that middle schooler coudl correctly dismiss as baseless claims and atecdotes: which seems to be the core of that kinda literature, documentation.  Seems to be either some guy just writing all these supposed truths, either as a master or a tertiary source combining knowledge from various masters, or a more investiagtive style piece that just relays antecdotes.  I fail to see how either would be helpful, and since I don't think Chi is real to the extent it is any of the supernatural/mystical things and not just focus of an ordinary sort, I certainly wouldn't set out to look for something.

So now its me as well that should move to China and study this stuff?  You suggested that to another, and now it seems you want me to spend all this time and effort looking into something I've allready concluded is a bunch of balooney and that even its believers can produce no impressive displays or evidence.  No thanks.  Besides, not by burden and irrelevant.



Quote:

Tons of videos were posted supporting and denouncing the existence of Qi. And, now, all of a sudden, videos aren't valid enough.




What are you talking about?  Unless your trying to hold me responsible for the actions and arguments of others I really have no idea what your talking about.  What videos? 

I generally find youtube videos on conspiracies and mystical stuff to be crap: just conclusory claims or antecdotes, at best mundane demonstrations, but I don't ever recall claiming youtube videos can't prove anything, nor do I recall posting youtube videos claiming to discredit chi.  Hell, those convinced everyone is not speaking about chi won't even say what it is, so I'm not at all sure how I would try to disprove it if were to attempt to: given these are post hoc equivocations, there's no way to do so. (certainly if there is a definition, nobody's put it forward, simply making baseless unsupported declarations that what Diploid, Orgone, et cet speak of is not Chi


Quote:

Well, quit the bitching and do something about it. Assuming something doesn't exist because you won't accept the evidence is fine, but acting as if you are out to prove something is rather ignorant.




Why?  What does this have to do with anything anyways?  I fail to see how my behavior indicates I'm "out to prove something" or why that matters.  Once again: you've simply declared this to be so and offered no justification for your claim.  Seems to be a common theme throughout this thread: baseless claims.

Quote:

So, if the evidence isn't sufficient, why denounce the possibility of it? Why not assume the possibility instead of choosing a side? Wouldn't that be a far more impartial take on this whole skepticism?


EDIT: i'm just saying... this debate is like trying to convince a Christian that God isn't real. it's fucking pointless.




What does any of this matter?  I denounce any mystical chi phenomena because that stuff is frequently claimed by many people and never demonstrated.  Additionally, people are illogical and believe all sorts of things that they are wrong about.  I believe this is the case here, and the evidence shows nothing to reject the null hypothesis, so I'm certainly comfortable presuming the phenomena is nonsense to the extent its anything mystical and not simply garden-variety concentration.

I don't see what my disposition has to do with anything though.  The only position I'm advancing has to do with the merits of the claims, unsupported, and the merits of the rebuttals made: equivocations post hoc that fail to clearly state the operative terms definition despite claiming several posters have gotten it wrong in figuring out what this concept is.

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