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OfflineiAmDifferent
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Registered: 03/01/11
Posts: 7
Last seen: 12 years, 10 months
lack of actual studies/research papers on acid/shrooms effect on the spinal cord and fluid
    #14238650 - 04/04/11 09:16 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

hey guys, i was lookin everywhere for and actual documented studies/ scientific research papers on the effects of shrooms, acid, or anything commonly sold as acid that isnt, the effects they may have in spinal fluid regulation and effects on the spinal cords structure itself.

all ive ever found is some sites saying it does cause these problems, and others that say the contrary. never have i seen either side back thier claims with proof, not even on erowid

it is especially important to me to have some clarity in these matters, because i have some special circumstances that are not commonly heard of for the average tripper

i was born with some birth defects that fit under the blanket diagnoses known as vaters syndrome,
most of these are irrelevant to the topic at hand

but i do have hydrocephilis(sp?) which is regulated by a device called a vp shunt (pumps excess fluid from my skull and carrys it to my stomach where it digests safely)
the other concern is my spinal cord has a hemivertabre, a pair of vertabre fused together, and another vertebre that is missing

compared to other cases of vaters mine is considered pretty mild, and i know the most obvise response is "why risk it if u may end up in a wheelchair for the rest of ur life, paralized, or possibly dead?" well, i dunno about u, but i value psychedelics very highly for spiritual growth and conciousness expansion, and if it really has no physical interactions, then ill have peace of mind, and if it really has a significant amount of risk for damage, then of course ill have the sense to stop

ive done shrooms 5 times, and once on a fairly heavy dose the body load got pretty unpleasant, not spefically to the spine tho, and another time on an eighth i would get this sharp stomach pain with a strange head rush

ive only done acid once, one hit, and only negative effect was slight muscle/bone stiffness, but who knows what is actually on blotter anyway

also if it makes a difference, recently when i smoke weed ive noticed that area of my spine gets pretty uncomfertable, not unbearable or anything tho, its kinda like that sober too.

damn....i wrote ALOT, if you read though that, im grateful, if anyone has links to studies or other nonbiased fact based proof, it would really help me out, id really appericate all the info i can get
thanks. peace.

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InvisibleMe_Roy
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Registered: 07/30/02
Posts: 3,230
Re: lack of actual studies/research papers on acid/shrooms effect on the spinal cord and fluid [Re: iAmDifferent] * 1
    #14238694 - 04/04/11 09:22 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

The burden of proof would be on those claiming that it DOES have an effect on the spinal column.  Otherwise, we might as well begin fretting that drinking water makes your elbows fall off.

Not a flame -- if you have a spinal condition, I can definitely understand that you'd want to inform yourself after hearing a rumor.  But you're probably not going to find any scientistical papers proving that reefer DOES NOT turn you into a sex-crazed murderer.

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OfflineGreenvalley
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Re: lack of actual studies/research papers on acid/shrooms effect on the spinal cord and fluid [Re: iAmDifferent]
    #14238705 - 04/04/11 09:23 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I have not seen any of the proof either, and this makes me concerned. I see it as a myth like marijuana makes you skitsofrantic. Marijuana has been used for thoushands of years and no deaths, same with Psilocybin mushrooms. But if someone does have health issues there should always be caution with use.
Its amazing how much info is on the side of a bottle of advil but very little about scientific research mushrooms. I have seen some studies, but its still very little.

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OfflineiAmDifferent
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Registered: 03/01/11
Posts: 7
Last seen: 12 years, 10 months
Re: lack of actual studies/research papers on acid/shrooms effect on the spinal cord and fluid [Re: Greenvalley]
    #14238854 - 04/04/11 09:46 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

yea fuck government banning research into psychedelics, that is such a blatent abuse of power, and specifically spreading myths to scare people

i was pretty sure mushrooms were safe in this regard, but those difficult expirences made me doubt. and the thing that nags at me with acid is my bro who is one of the only people i really truely trust, said he knows people who took to much acid and there spines now are curved like question marks, sounds like that only happens to those who abuse acid, i didnt intend to do it regularally or often, but where is the line drawn

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OfflineGreenvalley
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Re: lack of actual studies/research papers on acid/shrooms effect on the spinal cord and fluid [Re: iAmDifferent]
    #14239243 - 04/04/11 10:55 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

My rule is twice a month max for psychadelics

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Invisiblewaves

Registered: 04/03/10
Posts: 2,213
Re: lack of actual studies/research papers on acid/shrooms effect on the spinal cord and fluid [Re: Greenvalley]
    #14239297 - 04/04/11 11:03 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

.

Edited by waves (04/22/11 12:19 AM)

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Invisiblewaves

Registered: 04/03/10
Posts: 2,213
Re: lack of actual studies/research papers on acid/shrooms effect on the spinal cord and fluid [Re: waves]
    #14239477 - 04/04/11 11:37 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

.

Edited by waves (04/22/11 12:19 AM)

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OfflineLSDXM
What Doth Life?
I'm a teapot User Gallery


Registered: 08/20/08
Posts: 2,505
Loc: The 518
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Re: lack of actual studies/research papers on acid/shrooms effect on the spinal cord and fluid [Re: waves]
    #14239493 - 04/04/11 11:40 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Neither drug does anything to your spinal chord.

The rumors you heard were completely false, no matter who told you them.


--------------------

The number of times I edit my post is directly related to the number of times I've hit the bong :bonghit2:

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OfflineGreenvalley
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Re: lack of actual studies/research papers on acid/shrooms effect on the spinal cord and fluid [Re: waves]
    #14239513 - 04/04/11 11:43 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

TheDukeofLizards said:
Quote:

Greenvalley said:
I have not seen any of the proof either, and this makes me concerned. I see it as a myth like marijuana makes you skitsofrantic. Marijuana has been used for thoushands of years and no deaths, same with Psilocybin mushrooms. But if someone does have health issues there should always be caution with use.
Its amazing how much info is on the side of a bottle of advil but very little about scientific research mushrooms. I have seen some studies, but its still very little.




Ok, not trying to sound like a smart ass. I just want to inform-the word you are looking for is schizophrenic.

Quote:

Greenvalley said:
My rule is twice a month max for psychadelics




Again, not trying to sound like a smart ass, but FYI it is spelled 'psychedelics'.


Both psilocybin and LSD breakdown EXTREMELY quickly in your body. Therefore I would imagine the possibility of them staying in your spinal cord is HIGHLY unlikely.




Seriously thanks for the correction, Ive been slacking with checking lately. :thumbup:

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Offlinepyl91

Registered: 07/21/10
Posts: 384
Loc: Flag
Last seen: 12 years, 7 months
Re: lack of actual studies/research papers on acid/shrooms effect on the spinal cord and fluid [Re: LSDXM]
    #14240496 - 04/05/11 07:08 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Krash Kharma said:
Neither drug does anything to your spinal chord.

The rumors you heard were completely false, no matter who told you them.




Apparently the rumor started because of an old study where the researchers drew spinal fluid from the subjects. I can't remember where I read this though.

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InvisibleGerman Kahuna
Facepalmer of Stoopid
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Re: lack of actual studies/research papers on acid/shrooms effect on the spinal cord and fluid [Re: iAmDifferent] * 1
    #14240676 - 04/05/11 08:19 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

It's actually all true!
Fortunately my skeleton consists of an undestructible polymimetic alloy of crystalline MDMA and LSD that can withstand even doses of psychedelics that would otherwise kill an elephant without any harm to my organism. You can mail your LSD to me, I will absorb it into my spinal fluid which is made of liquid LSD thus eliminating any potential health risk it poses to you. No need to thank me.
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Are people still bringing up this spinal chord bullshit? Really? :lmafo:


--------------------
"Vegetarian" [ /ˌvedʒəˈteəriən/] - Ancient slang meaning "village idiot who can't hunt, fish or ride".

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OfflineI AM SWIM
doin' thangs
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Re: lack of actual studies/research papers on acid/shrooms effect on the spinal cord and fluid [Re: German Kahuna]
    #14240769 - 04/05/11 08:49 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

maybe the way you sit while at a computer fuks up yo spine


--------------------

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Invisibledwpineal
Psychedelic Artist
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Registered: 07/20/06
Posts: 4,667
Re: lack of actual studies/research papers on acid/shrooms effect on the spinal cord and fluid [Re: German Kahuna]
    #14240774 - 04/05/11 08:49 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I couldn't find much, but here is a study some-what related.

Kudos to you for doing your research on this topic as you're in a unique position...


http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1239033
Plasma creatine phosphokinase levels in rats following lysergic acid diethylamide.

Abstract

Lysergic acid diethylamide (LSD) injected intraperitoneally or intramuscularly did not increase rat plasma creatine phosphokinase (CPK) activity. LSD did not produce an increase in serum CPK activity in rats kept in a 2 degrees C environment for 2 hrs. LSD also did not potentiate, in rats, the increase in plasma CPK activity produced by restraint at 2 degrees C or 24 degrees C. It is likely that the increases in serum CPK activity previously reported to occur in people who became psychotic following LSD ingestion are a consequence of the psychotic state itself rather than a direct effect of LSD.

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InvisibleCyclohexylamine
Turn on, Tune in, Drop out
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Registered: 09/08/10
Posts: 14,327
Re: lack of actual studies/research papers on acid/shrooms effect on the spinal cord and fluid [Re: dwpineal]
    #14241079 - 04/05/11 10:33 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

We all know shrooms make you gay and acid stays in your spine forever


--------------------
Yes this is tymo - I just changed my name

Have you ever had a dream that you were so sure was real? What if you were unable to awake from that dream? How would you know the difference between that dream world and the real world?


There is NOTHING better than feeling that warm dissociative fuzz creeping up your body from IM K
Something abut that anaesthetic rush... :inlove:

Qualitative Research Chemical Effects and Experiences
The Wonderful World of Methoxetamine
The 3-Meo-PCP Chapters, Part One

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OfflineLSDXM
What Doth Life?
I'm a teapot User Gallery


Registered: 08/20/08
Posts: 2,505
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Re: lack of actual studies/research papers on acid/shrooms effect on the spinal cord and fluid [Re: Cyclohexylamine]
    #14241512 - 04/05/11 11:59 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Dude no shrooms really do make you gay for real.


--------------------

The number of times I edit my post is directly related to the number of times I've hit the bong :bonghit2:

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OfflineMOPE
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Registered: 10/07/08
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Re: lack of actual studies/research papers on acid/shrooms effect on the spinal cord and fluid [Re: LSDXM]
    #14242015 - 04/05/11 01:48 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

There has never been a study that supports this claim, and there probably never will be since LSD is almost entirely metabolized within a day after ingestion. Since the half-life of LSD is only a few hours, only a very small amount of LSD remains even at the end of the trip, and this is excreted in the urine.

Heres some info about LSD presence in the rest of your body though, everything seems to suggest that LSD is completely out of your system pretty quickly:

From "Notes on the Persistence of LSD in Humans" by Jim Ketchum MD
    Half-life found to be around 160 minutes mean across 40 subjects. "It seems logical to conclude that in man also, its duration in the brain is finite -- almost certainly less than 24 hours."

From Pharmacotheon :
    The drug is almost completely eliminated from the body before the peak effects begin, suggesting that it acts as a sort of catalyst, inducing neurochemical changes which subsequently result in the entheogenic experience. Only about 1-10% of injected LSD is excreted unaltered, the remainder as a variety of degradation products.

From Psychedelic Drugs Reconsidered :
    The half-life of LSD in blood plasma is about two hours

From Erowid:
There is an often circulated myth that once you have taken LSD, it remains in your body forever. One thing that keeps these rumors circulating the is fact that some people (though very few) experience "flashbacks" (generally within a few months after a hallucinogenic experience). It is universally accepted, however, that these flashbacks are not the result of LSD remaining in the system.

LSD is almost entirely metabolized within a day after ingestion. Since the half-life of LSD is only a few hours, only a very small amount of LSD remains even at the end of the trip, and this is excreted in the urine. All traces are undetectable after several days and are certainly gone entirely within a couple of weeks. As detection technology improves and thresholds drop (it is now possible to detect picograms reliably), the time that incredibly small amounts of it could be detected will extend.

It has long been reported that LSD is fully metabolized almost immediately after ingestion. This was based on research done in the 50's and 60s which used instruments not sensitive enough to detect the extremely small amounts of the chemical.

Occasionally, people claim that LSD has been found in spinal fluid years after the last time LSD was taken. There is no support for this claim. If anyone knows of a research article that has looked at spinal fluid of LSD users for LSD, please let us know.

Although research in the 1960s found the half-life of LSD was around 3 hours, more recent research shows that LSD's metabolism takes several hours and its peak plasma levels occur at around 3-5 hours after ingestion. It is important to note that such research is highly dependent on the individuals who were used for the research, with metabolism of many drugs varying by up to 2-3 times, larger numbers of research subjects reduces the likelihood of having a skewed range.


--------------------
Got used to the feeling of falling
But you'll never see me following
Bouncing back and forth between the healing and the hollering
Riding the outer ring of my own private saturn
Thoughts scattered all across the grey matter

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InvisibleCyclohexylamine
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Re: lack of actual studies/research papers on acid/shrooms effect on the spinal cord and fluid [Re: MOPE]
    #14242039 - 04/05/11 01:51 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

MOPE said:
There has never been a study that supports this claim, and there probably never will be since LSD is almost entirely metabolized within a day after ingestion. Since the half-life of LSD is only a few hours, only a very small amount of LSD remains even at the end of the trip, and this is excreted in the urine.

Heres some info about LSD presence in the rest of your body though, everything seems to suggest that LSD is completely out of your system pretty quickly:

From "Notes on the Persistence of LSD in Humans" by Jim Ketchum MD
    Half-life found to be around 160 minutes mean across 40 subjects. "It seems logical to conclude that in man also, its duration in the brain is finite -- almost certainly less than 24 hours."

From Pharmacotheon :
    The drug is almost completely eliminated from the body before the peak effects begin, suggesting that it acts as a sort of catalyst, inducing neurochemical changes which subsequently result in the entheogenic experience. Only about 1-10% of injected LSD is excreted unaltered, the remainder as a variety of degradation products.

From Psychedelic Drugs Reconsidered :
    The half-life of LSD in blood plasma is about two hours

From Erowid:
There is an often circulated myth that once you have taken LSD, it remains in your body forever. One thing that keeps these rumors circulating the is fact that some people (though very few) experience "flashbacks" (generally within a few months after a hallucinogenic experience). It is universally accepted, however, that these flashbacks are not the result of LSD remaining in the system.

LSD is almost entirely metabolized within a day after ingestion. Since the half-life of LSD is only a few hours, only a very small amount of LSD remains even at the end of the trip, and this is excreted in the urine. All traces are undetectable after several days and are certainly gone entirely within a couple of weeks. As detection technology improves and thresholds drop (it is now possible to detect picograms reliably), the time that incredibly small amounts of it could be detected will extend.

It has long been reported that LSD is fully metabolized almost immediately after ingestion. This was based on research done in the 50's and 60s which used instruments not sensitive enough to detect the extremely small amounts of the chemical.

Occasionally, people claim that LSD has been found in spinal fluid years after the last time LSD was taken. There is no support for this claim. If anyone knows of a research article that has looked at spinal fluid of LSD users for LSD, please let us know.

Although research in the 1960s found the half-life of LSD was around 3 hours, more recent research shows that LSD's metabolism takes several hours and its peak plasma levels occur at around 3-5 hours after ingestion. It is important to note that such research is highly dependent on the individuals who were used for the research, with metabolism of many drugs varying by up to 2-3 times, larger numbers of research subjects reduces the likelihood of having a skewed range.



Lmao I told my friend I did acid the other day and he was like "Oh you cannot be a pilot now, cause they test your spinal fluid for LSD".
I was like :facepalm:


--------------------
Yes this is tymo - I just changed my name

Have you ever had a dream that you were so sure was real? What if you were unable to awake from that dream? How would you know the difference between that dream world and the real world?


There is NOTHING better than feeling that warm dissociative fuzz creeping up your body from IM K
Something abut that anaesthetic rush... :inlove:

Qualitative Research Chemical Effects and Experiences
The Wonderful World of Methoxetamine
The 3-Meo-PCP Chapters, Part One

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OfflineMOPE
Walking Chemical Reaction


Registered: 10/07/08
Posts: 831
Last seen: 10 years, 5 months
Re: lack of actual studies/research papers on acid/shrooms effect on the spinal cord and fluid [Re: Cyclohexylamine]
    #14242098 - 04/05/11 02:01 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

tymoteusz3 said:
Lmao I told my friend I did acid the other day and he was like "Oh you cannot be a pilot now, cause they test your spinal fluid for LSD".
I was like :facepalm:




Yeah they're probably gonna perform a potentially dangerous medical procedure to look for something that wont be there :laugh2: some people will believe anything they hear


--------------------
Got used to the feeling of falling
But you'll never see me following
Bouncing back and forth between the healing and the hollering
Riding the outer ring of my own private saturn
Thoughts scattered all across the grey matter

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Offlinehealing
Strangest
Female


Registered: 02/22/11
Posts: 6,565
Loc: the universe, the milky w...
Last seen: 6 years, 7 months
Re: lack of actual studies/research papers on acid/shrooms effect on the spinal cord and fluid [Re: Greenvalley]
    #14242226 - 04/05/11 02:29 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Greenvalley said:
Seriously thanks for the correction, Ive been slacking with checking lately. :thumbup:



Gave you 5 for this :smile:

I've been hearing people say that, "If you take LSD you can't be an astronaut because it will seep back out of your spine and into your brain, making you trip again." a lot lately.

Luckily, everyone I know thinks I'm an encyclopedia (especially when it comes to drugs.)


--------------------
Open mind, open heart, open book.


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Offlinefunguy psilocybe
Stranger
Registered: 11/08/10
Posts: 7
Last seen: 12 years, 10 months
Re: lack of actual studies/research papers on acid/shrooms effect on the spinal cord and fluid [Re: healing]
    #14242978 - 04/05/11 05:00 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

hahaha iv read here that continued lsd use has led to peoples backs being question mark shaped hahaha maybe the people who think they have observed this were on a pile of lsd? i neary fell of my seat apon reading someones comm relating to that when they said - if we believe this then we may as well believe alchohol makes your elbows fall off!!! man thats original,i would like to trip with the guy who wrote that,if people believe that tripe about lsd iv the solution for them-dont take it,take psily,lsd is 1 dimensional in comparison and lasts too long and psily gives far better visuals.period

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