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InvisibleCups
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Registered: 12/24/09
Posts: 1,925
Re: Vegetarians and death anxiety [Re: awakendone]
    #14185973 - 03/26/11 09:27 AM (13 years, 6 days ago)

Quote:

awakendone said:
c'mon now! look at that pic. ya know, i thought you were possibly being sarcastic in your first comment, but apparently not. idk, id imagine even pigs would like to have more than 2 inces to more around and shit. :shrug:




Of course they would.  Every life form acts in self interest.  Every life form also seeks to avoid injury...and at least animals seek to avoid pain.

That doesn't stop a lion from disemboweling a gazelle.  Or a gazelle from squishing bugs with it's hooves when it runs.  Or those bugs from killing other bugs.

Like I said- self interest.

Quote:

awakendone said:whats the correlation with death anxiety? :shrug:




The animal farming process is a great showcase for death anxiety because it puts life such harsh perspective.  It cuts through the bullshit of human defined meaning and concepts and gets to the heart of the matter.

You're born, you suffer, you die.

Those pigs entire lives are spent in a warehouse.  How cruel you say, how inhumane. 

I got news for you, your entire life is spent in a warehouse.  A bigger one sure, but beyond all the illusions of meaning and purpose the human life process is an conveyor belt taking us from birth to death just like the pigs.  All of it guaranteed to happen and all of it beyond our control.

The difference is with the pigs you have someone to blame...so you do, and this is a comfort. 

By doing so you have taken action against death anxiety, even if you aren't consciously aware of it.

Like I said earlier, not all vegans are vegans for this reason.  But the clip you posted above points it out quite nicely.  Instead of focusing on the health benefits or the environmental benefits...they show animals screaming and bleeding and being hurt.

All of which is specifically intended to pull the heart strings of your death anxiety emotional response.


--------------------
What's up everybody?!

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InvisibleTropism
ChasingTail


Registered: 09/12/09
Posts: 2,039
Re: Vegetarians and death anxiety [Re: SlashOZ]
    #14186118 - 03/26/11 10:25 AM (13 years, 6 days ago)

Quote:

Does anyone else think that vegetarians / vegans are afraid to eat animals because they are reminded of their own mortality when they see a dead animal being served as food?




Yeah, in some cases I'd say you're right. But I think Grapefruit hit the nail in that most vegetarians are probably just trend followers, leaving the smaller percentage being the ones making educated decisions about their health.

And then someone will post a picture of a meat farm or pigs all in cages, and say that this is why they don't eat meat.
They've got respect for animals or something, but that's not really addressing the decision to eat meat and has more to do with animal cruelty.
Not eating meat because of the circumstances the animals are living in is a boycott to the producers and a fist in the air for animal rights, but dead things don't have rights, they are just energy sources.
Some things die naturally, and the few who decide not to eat it based not on dietary reasons but ethicals ones would hold those who's prime motivation is a flare of death anxiety.
I've felt that grossness to eating meat before sober and otherwise, but ultimately it was pushed past.
Sure it's kinda freaky to eat what was another living thing and consider how one will end, but life is for the living and I've often thought it would be pretty sweet to be eaten instead of wasted.
Circle of life and all that.

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Invisiblegiza
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Registered: 08/25/09
Posts: 2,089
Re: Vegetarians and death anxiety [Re: SlashOZ]
    #14186125 - 03/26/11 10:28 AM (13 years, 6 days ago)

Quote:

SlashOZ said:
Quote:

giza said:
When I was vegetarian it was more for respecting other living beings.




Do unto others as you would have them do unto you kind of a thing, eh? You don't want to kill them in hopes that you too will not meat that fate? :vaped:




Nope.

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InvisiblePoid
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Re: Vegetarians and death anxiety [Re: Poid]
    #14186171 - 03/26/11 10:43 AM (13 years, 6 days ago)

Quote:

Poid said:
Quote:

Nymphaea said:
I'm a vegietarian, but I'll eat meat...


LOL




--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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OfflineGrapefruit
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Re: Vegetarians and death anxiety [Re: Tropism]
    #14186197 - 03/26/11 10:51 AM (13 years, 6 days ago)

Quote:

Tropism said:
Quote:

Circle of life and all that.




In the words of UG Krishnamurti "I will rot like a garden slug!".


--------------------
Little left in the way of energy; or the way of love, yet happy to entertain myself playing mental games with the rest of you freaks until the rivers run backwards. 

"Chat your fraff
Chat your fraff
Just chat your fraff
Chat your fraff"

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InvisibleTropism
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Re: Vegetarians and death anxiety [Re: Grapefruit]
    #14186234 - 03/26/11 11:01 AM (13 years, 6 days ago)

:lol: Nice

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InvisibleSlashOZ
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Re: Vegetarians and death anxiety [Re: meatcakeman]
    #14186535 - 03/26/11 12:15 PM (13 years, 6 days ago)

Quote:

meatcakeman said:
Quote:

SlashOZ said:

Quote:

meatcakeman said:
Quote:

SlashOZ said:
Does anyone else think that vegetarians / vegans are afraid to eat animals because they are reminded of their own mortality when they see a dead animal being served as food?

By moving away from eating meat and being confronted with death they think they can preserve their own life. Eating vegetables, fruits, and breads seem safe because they do not involve the death of an animal such as themselves. They say, 'being a vegetarian is healthier than eating meat' etc to prove to themselves that they are further away from death than those that eat meat.





this is sound logic. you should be a college philosophy professor. you just won the game.




This is more psychological than anything but whatever...

I see that death anxiety is mentioned quite a bit on this forum and I was wondering if death anxiety might have to do with some people choosing to be vegetarians/vegans.

I also see a lot of dismissive, worthless, and rude posts here so I guess I expected to much! :picard:





surprisingly, psychology is a science. and unbeknownst to you, science requires quantitative evidence. what you are proposing is a completely and obviously irrational correlation between two things that are inherently different. you were probably high when you thought of it. if not, you should have been. hence, you are a philosopher.




i didn't say this was psychology i said it was more psychological.

vegetarianism is a type of philosophy but i was talking about the psychological process behind the choice to be a vegetarian and how it might be linked to death anxiety.

also, since you seem to know the answer can you explain how death anxiety and being a vegetarian are 100% mutually exclusive??????

oh and as far as quantitative evidence, i know vegetarians that don't eat meat because they don't like the thought of killing animals. empathizing with another animal means you can see yourself in their place. how is the leap from empathizing with animals that are killed for food to death anxiety of humans so hard to make for you?


--------------------
"Life sucks but in this really beautiful way" - Axl Rose
"Life's a bitch and then you die that's why we get high cuz you never know when you're gonna go." - NAS
"When people don't know what you're about they put you down and shut you out" - Black Sabbath
"An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind" - Gandhi
"Look up at me I am God, look down on me and I am evil, look at me I am you." - Charles Manson.
"Don't question my reality." - Me (as far as I know)

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OfflineGrapefruit
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Re: Vegetarians and death anxiety [Re: SlashOZ]
    #14186595 - 03/26/11 12:27 PM (13 years, 6 days ago)

Edit: Misinterpretation of which poster was which.


--------------------
Little left in the way of energy; or the way of love, yet happy to entertain myself playing mental games with the rest of you freaks until the rivers run backwards. 

"Chat your fraff
Chat your fraff
Just chat your fraff
Chat your fraff"

Edited by Grapefruit (03/26/11 12:44 PM)

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InvisiblePoid
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Re: Vegetarians and death anxiety [Re: SlashOZ] * 2
    #14186617 - 03/26/11 12:33 PM (13 years, 6 days ago)

Quote:

SlashOZ said:
how is the leap from empathizing with animals that are killed for food to death anxiety of humans so hard to make for you?


If he's a vegetarian, it would make sense why he's not willing, or otherwise able to make that leap because he doesn't believe he has death anxiety.


--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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InvisibledeCypher
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Posts: 56,232
Re: Vegetarians and death anxiety [Re: Poid]
    #14187233 - 03/26/11 02:49 PM (13 years, 6 days ago)

Quote:

Samurai Drifter said:
I recognize that deciding to eat meat is more than just a preference of choice- it's a choice between life and death for some living being out there.




If I decide to buy a steak, the animal that was killed to provide the steak is already dead and I feel no moral responsibility for it.  Sure, if everyone boycotted meat then we would no longer kill animals for food but my personal choice to consume a salad over a steak will not save a single animal.


--------------------
We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.

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OfflineKickleM
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Re: Vegetarians and death anxiety [Re: deCypher] * 1
    #14187279 - 03/26/11 03:02 PM (13 years, 6 days ago)

Not to mention that the salad was once alive as well.


--------------------
Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction?
Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain

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InvisibledeCypher
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Re: Vegetarians and death anxiety [Re: Kickle]
    #14187290 - 03/26/11 03:05 PM (13 years, 6 days ago)

Everytime I eat a salad with carrots I visualize them screaming in silent agony as they were cruelly ripped from the ground.  :evil:


--------------------
We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.

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OfflineKickleM
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Re: Vegetarians and death anxiety [Re: deCypher]
    #14187299 - 03/26/11 03:07 PM (13 years, 6 days ago)

I picture them as Jews being put onto a train destined for a death camp.
Their leafy tops frantically trying to wave goodbye to Mom and Dad.


--------------------
Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction?
Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain

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Offlinedrawde
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Re: Vegetarians and death anxiety [Re: deCypher]
    #14188171 - 03/26/11 06:18 PM (13 years, 6 days ago)

Quote:

deCypher said:
Quote:

Samurai Drifter said:
I recognize that deciding to eat meat is more than just a preference of choice- it's a choice between life and death for some living being out there.




If I decide to buy a steak, the animal that was killed to provide the steak is already dead and I feel no moral responsibility for it.  Sure, if everyone boycotted meat then we would no longer kill animals for food but my personal choice to consume a salad over a steak will not save a single animal.




This is rather misleading you have to admit. Sure one meal does not mean anything but...

Approximations
10,000,000,000 – land animals factory farmed per year in U.S.
280,000,000 – people in U.S.

Calculation
35.7 – factory-farmed land animals eaten per person per year in U.S.
2,714 – land animals eaten per person during their lifetime
1,786 – land animals still to be eaten by a 26-year-old


--------------------

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InvisibledeCypher
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Re: Vegetarians and death anxiety [Re: drawde] * 2
    #14188177 - 03/26/11 06:20 PM (13 years, 6 days ago)

And your point is?


--------------------
We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.

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Offlinedrawde
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Re: Vegetarians and death anxiety [Re: drawde]
    #14188196 - 03/26/11 06:26 PM (13 years, 6 days ago)

As for the main discussion, yes perhaps the ones who are vegetarians for strictly moral reasons do so because of death anxiety, that seems to be a reasonable hypothesis.
However, there are also many people who choose to be vegetarians for health reasons. I am one of them, and personally am a lot better off on a vegetarian diet. My body has a very hard time digesting almost all animal products, and when I finally tried vegetarianism it was a huge transformation in my health. I get sick much less often, have better stamina, more energy, less gastrointestinal problems, and yes I even have great skin (and this is years since the change). However I do not think it is for everyone. We are all different and you have to find out what works for your body, regardless of how someone may psychoanalyze you for whatever choice you may make.


--------------------

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Offlinejustin340
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Re: Vegetarians and death anxiety [Re: SlashOZ]
    #14188207 - 03/26/11 06:30 PM (13 years, 6 days ago)

death anxiety is a form of rape .two of the same efferemos. con dual es s

call to a riddler a excapist and illousionest a mad hadder

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OfflineNymphaea
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Re: Vegetarians and death anxiety [Re: deCypher]
    #14188493 - 03/26/11 07:21 PM (13 years, 6 days ago)

Quote:

Poid said:
Quote:

Nymphaea said:
I'm a vegietarian, but I'll eat meat...


LOL




I do not currently eat meat so I call myself a vegetarian right now.
Quote:

deCypher said:

Quote:

Samurai Drifter said:
I recognize that deciding to eat meat is more than just a preference of choice- it's a choice between life and death for some living being out there.




If I decide to buy a steak, the animal that was killed to provide the steak is already dead and I feel no moral responsibility for it.  Sure, if everyone boycotted meat then we would no longer kill animals for food but my personal choice to consume a salad over a steak will not save a single animal.



Quote:

drawde said:
Quote:

deCypher said:
Quote:

Samurai Drifter said:
I recognize that deciding to eat meat is more than just a preference of choice- it's a choice between life and death for some living being out there.




If I decide to buy a steak, the animal that was killed to provide the steak is already dead and I feel no moral responsibility for it.  Sure, if everyone boycotted meat then we would no longer kill animals for food but my personal choice to consume a salad over a steak will not save a single animal.




This is rather misleading you have to admit. Sure one meal does not mean anything but...

Approximations
10,000,000,000 – land animals factory farmed per year in U.S.
280,000,000 – people in U.S.

Calculation
35.7 – factory-farmed land animals eaten per person per year in U.S.
2,714 – land animals eaten per person during their lifetime
1,786 – land animals still to be eaten by a 26-year-old






Quote:

deCypher said:
And your point is?




His point is that your argument is clearly erroneous.


--------------------
:huxleyfacepalm:


Plant Trees

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InvisibledeCypher
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Re: Vegetarians and death anxiety [Re: Nymphaea]
    #14188875 - 03/26/11 08:23 PM (13 years, 5 days ago)

I see no refutation of my argument, just a bunch of statistics.


--------------------
We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.

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InvisiblePoid
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Re: Vegetarians and death anxiety [Re: deCypher] * 1
    #14189472 - 03/26/11 10:48 PM (13 years, 5 days ago)

Quote:

deCypher said:
I see no refutation of my argument, just a bunch of statistics.




--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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