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Offlinedeadhor5
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Is there any proof?
    #14185320 - 03/26/11 02:51 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

I was reading DMT: The Spirit Molecule recently and i noticed that Strassman frequently uses the fact that DMT is neutralized so quickly in the brain proves that it must be endogenous. However, i always hear people saying that DMT is endogenous as i it's a proven fact. Is Strassman's work the only evidence for this idea? If so, wouldn't that imply that the active chemicals in salvia are endogenous as well?


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Invisiblemonkeyheaven
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Re: Is there any proof? [Re: deadhor5]
    #14185470 - 03/26/11 04:39 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

My understanding is that it's endogenous, has been detected, but hasn't been measured at levels that would be considered 'active.'

The Spirit Molecule
is kind of old. 

My source is a more recent collaborative Strassman book which proposes all sorts of wacky possibilities and came off as hastily edited, but I still came away with the impression that DMT has indeed been detected, and that this is a mainstream view among scientists. Inner Paths to Outer Space was the name of it.

I didn't answer the salvia question, because I don't agree with the logic about quick neutralization etc.

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OfflineNunbuh_Chrubble
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Re: Is there any proof? [Re: monkeyheaven]
    #14185505 - 03/26/11 05:03 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)



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OfflineNature Boy
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Re: Is there any proof? [Re: deadhor5]
    #14185561 - 03/26/11 05:48 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

DMT has been detected in humans and other mammals, however, its unknown if it is ever present in concentrations sufficient to have ANY effect whatsoever.  Any theory espousing a role in sleep, dreaming, birth, or death, are purely speculative and not grounded in scientific fact in the least.

Its obviously also found in plants.  No one understands its role there, either.  Sure doesn't seem to be needed for any of the reasons proposed for its presence in humans!  In short, no one knows anything regarding the in-vitro role DMT plays in humans.

N.B.


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OfflineJacksonMetaller
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Re: Is there any proof? [Re: Nature Boy]
    #14185631 - 03/26/11 06:39 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

seems likely though with all the similarities in trip experiences to those who say they "went to heaven" or were "abducted by aliens"

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Invisiblemonkeyheaven
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Re: Is there any proof? [Re: JacksonMetaller]
    #14185737 - 03/26/11 07:40 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

JacksonMetaller said:
seems likely though with all the similarities in trip experiences to those who say they "went to heaven" or were "abducted by aliens"




Inner Paths to Outer Space touched on these themes, but I still don't think it has been argued convincingly yet.

As I mentioned, and was echoed, active endogenous levels have yet to be measured. That may not mean that they don't exist for short periods of time.  Perhaps time dilation can explain why it's so hard to catch it when these levels peak.   

I think DMT's endogenous prescence in man is significant, and we must venture into the realm of speculation in order to figure out what's going on.

  Unusual ideas often come before the hard science.
Quantum entanglement and nanostructures of the brain are interesting places to start from a scientific perspective.  The book I mention above threw these ideas out there for us to work on; if you know of any other recent work in this field, let me know.  It's all very interesting! 

Personally, I'm at the point where I don't think alien abduction stories, dreaming, near death experiences, etc. are the result of spikes in endogenous DMT levels.  It would certainly simplify our understanding of the human mind, and I really think these experiences are the result of more complex processes than just DMT being released.

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OfflineNature Boy
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Re: Is there any proof? [Re: monkeyheaven]
    #14185782 - 03/26/11 08:03 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

monkeyheaven said:
Inner Paths to Outer Space touched on these themes, but I still don't think it has been argued convincingly yet.




Well, further argument and discussion aren't going to yield any scientific FACT or result in a fuller understanding of the role of DMT in humans.  Argument and discussion are just more supposition.  What is needed is some further scientific investigation, human trials, and modern nMRI evaluation which is NOT likely to be forthcoming.

N.B.


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All submitted posts under this user name are works of pure fiction or outright lies.  Any information, statement, or assertion contained therein should be considered pure unadulterated bullshit.  Note well:  Sorry, but I do not answer PM's unless you are a long-time trusted friend.  If you have a question, ask it in the appropriate thread.

                                                                               

Edited by Nature Boy (03/26/11 08:04 AM)

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Invisiblejellyfish


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Re: Is there any proof? [Re: Nature Boy]
    #14186176 - 03/26/11 10:43 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Only study I've seen showed that rat lung tissue exposed to N-methyltryptamine had the N-methyltransferase enzyme nessecary to methylate the NMT into DMT. Everyone then jumped to the conclusion that since a rabbits lung cells could do it our brains must be doing it too, in the pineal gland. Please link me to an actual journal article that says otherwise. There are millions of enzymes that could do unique things in a petri dish.

edit: I know that DMT and alien abduction experiences seem unusually similar but I think most of us have had a heavily spiritual experience on mushrooms. Nobodys arguing that Mose's or Jesus's or any one else who's had a religious experiences brain made psilocybin. There's no drug that exists that promotes a function that the brain wasn't already capable of.

Edited by jellyfish (03/26/11 10:47 AM)

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Offlinetokinman21
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Re: Is there any proof? [Re: jellyfish]
    #14186200 - 03/26/11 10:53 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

What if, given the intensity of the time dilation (even moreso than salvia), DMT's purpose is how well we keep track of time, and then when the brain gets too slowed down it just loops and makes images and goes crazy?  I wouldn't mind seeing what would happen if you gave someone a heavily time dilating drug (not DMT) such as salvia and track internal DMT levels.

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Offlinedeadhor5
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Re: Is there any proof? [Re: tokinman21]
    #14186786 - 03/26/11 01:16 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Does anyone have a link or a source for any of these studies being discussed?


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Please :pm: me if you have any interesting cacti seeds for trade/sale/giveaway :laugh: U.S only..


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All posts i make are merely fictional rants that i transcribe for the schizophrenic goldfish people in my mind.

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