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InvisiblePoid
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Do you believe other creatures possess consciousness like us?
    #14174445 - 03/24/11 07:23 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Why or why not?





















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OfflineI AM SWIM
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Re: Do you believe other creatures possess consciousness like us? [Re: Poid]
    #14174478 - 03/24/11 07:40 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

If by 'consciousness', you mean one being aware that one is conscious. Then I would say that dolphins most certainly do.

Dolphins are one of the smartest creatures on earth.
Dolphins also have to consciously take breaths in order to live.

I don't know about other animals.


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InvisiblePoid
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Re: Do you believe other creatures possess consciousness like us? [Re: I AM SWIM]
    #14174494 - 03/24/11 07:44 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

I AM SWIM said:
If by 'consciousness', you mean one being aware that one is conscious.


Well I said "possess consciousness like us", so you should know exactly what I mean. :shrug:


Quote:

I AM SWIM said:
Dolphins are one of the smartest creatures on earth.
Dolphins also have to consciously take breaths in order to live.

I don't know about other animals.


On what basis do you believe that it's more likely that consciousness exists in more intelligent animals (like dolphins) than other not-so-intelligent ones?


--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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InvisibleAIRDOG
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Re: Do you believe other creatures possess consciousness like us? [Re: Poid]
    #14174519 - 03/24/11 07:58 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

certainly this jaguar has

conciousness

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InvisiblePoid
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Re: Do you believe other creatures possess consciousness like us? [Re: AIRDOG]
    #14174539 - 03/24/11 08:04 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Aww, that was so cute! Thanks for posting. :mushroom2:

:nicekitty:


--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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OfflineI AM SWIM
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Re: Do you believe other creatures possess consciousness like us? [Re: Poid]
    #14174608 - 03/24/11 08:31 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Poid said:]Well I said "possess consciousness like us", so you should know exactly what I mean. :shrug:





All animals posses consciousness just like us..

Self-awareness is a different story.




Quote:

On what basis do you believe that it's more likely that consciousness exists in more intelligent animals (like dolphins) than other not-so-intelligent ones?




Based on scientific experiments, (dolphins and mirrors, and dolphin communication)

When it comes down to self-awareness, 'intelligence' plays a huge role IMO.



I also highly reccommend watching the movie The Cove if you're interested.


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InvisiblePoid
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Re: Do you believe other creatures possess consciousness like us? [Re: I AM SWIM]
    #14174640 - 03/24/11 08:42 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

I AM SWIM said:
Quote:

Poid said:]Well I said "possess consciousness like us", so you should know exactly what I mean. :shrug:





All animals posses consciousness just like us..

Self-awareness is a different story.


May you explain the distinction?


Quote:

I AM SWIM said:
I also highly reccommend watching the movie The Cove if you're interested.


I'll see wassup. :thumbup:


--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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OfflineI AM SWIM
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Re: Do you believe other creatures possess consciousness like us? [Re: Poid]
    #14174662 - 03/24/11 08:49 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Poid said:]May you explain the distinction?




Consciousness is basically "The state or condition of being conscious"

Which anything that is alive is conscious.

Self-awareness AKA Self-Consciousness is "Self-consciousness is an acute sense of self-awareness."


I would go in more depth about it, instead of grabbing definitions from the internet, but I have a bunch of thangs I gotta be doin'.

Peace 4 Now.


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InvisiblePoid
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Re: Do you believe other creatures possess consciousness like us? [Re: I AM SWIM]
    #14174679 - 03/24/11 08:53 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

I AM SWIM said:
Quote:

Poid said:]May you explain the distinction?




Consciousness is basically "The state or condition of being conscious"

Which anything that is alive is conscious.


Even sphincter cells?


Quote:

I AM SWIM said:
Self-awareness AKA Self-Consciousness is "Self-consciousness is an acute sense of self-awareness."


You're kind of confusing me here--first you're saying that self-awareness and self consciousness are the same thing (by saying that self-awareness is also known as self-consciousness), then you go on to say that self-consciousness is an acute form of self-awareness. This doesn't make sense, either they're both the same thing, or one of them is an acute form of the other; which is it?


Quote:

I AM SWIM said:
I would go in more depth about it, instead of grabbing definitions from the internet, but I have a bunch of thangs I gotta be doin'.

Peace 4 Now.


Goin' fishing again? :salmon:


--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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Offlinealcoholocaust
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Re: Do you believe other creatures possess consciousness like us? [Re: Poid]
    #14174709 - 03/24/11 09:02 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

My dog knows when hes fucked up. if i walk in from the smoking and he did something wrong, as soon as he sees me he runs and hides. he knows an ass whoopin is in the works :laugh:


--------------------


I dont like cocaine.... Just the smell of it

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OfflineI AM SWIM
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Re: Do you believe other creatures possess consciousness like us? [Re: Poid]
    #14174726 - 03/24/11 09:07 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

When I said: Self-Consciousness is "Self-consciousness is an acute sense of self-awareness."


the "Self-consciousness is an acute sense of self-awareness" was a definition I pulled from the internet.

IMO, Self-Consciousness and Self-Awareness are one and the same.



Quote:

Poid said:]Goin' fishing again? :salmon:





Naw, goin' schoolin'


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OfflineI AM SWIM
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Re: Do you believe other creatures possess consciousness like us? [Re: I AM SWIM]
    #14174740 - 03/24/11 09:11 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)



--------------------

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Offlinethe bizzle
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Re: Do you believe other creatures possess consciousness like us? [Re: I AM SWIM]
    #14174907 - 03/24/11 09:56 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Poid said:
Why or why not?






I often wonder about this.... especially when I catch a catfish. They start barking at you like they're really freaking out or having a very :feelsbadman: experience

and it makes me :feelsweirdman:



consciousness like us? :shrug: i dunno, sometimes even something that gets eaten by the millions every day like a shrimp seems to have a bit of a personality.

so I think they do, at least to some extent. You can look into their eyes and see that they are at least conscious.


i guess one of the main things I wonder about is to what extent do they perform self-reflection. Horses get stir crazy. Can't blame 'em.
I wonder if a fish in a livewell (small ice chest sized container) reflects on how he isn't happy living in containment
:shrug: ive got more questions than answers

Edited by the bizzle (03/24/11 09:58 AM)

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Re: Do you believe other creatures possess consciousness like us? [Re: Poid] * 1
    #14174913 - 03/24/11 09:58 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

I believe many creatures are conscious of much the same material as we are. Product of similar brains. And I also believe there are differences in depth. For instance a dog has an olfactory bulb to sift through smells, but it's much larger than our own and likely introduces a greater depth of conscious experience in terms of smells than our own. And I believe they are conscious of the material because they react to it in a way that indicates they are aware of it.


--------------------
Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction?
Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain

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InvisiblePoid
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Re: Do you believe other creatures possess consciousness like us? [Re: Kickle]
    #14174924 - 03/24/11 10:01 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

the bizzle said:
Quote:

Poid said:
Why or why not?






I often wonder about this.... especially when I catch a catfish. They start barking at you like they're really freaking out or having a very :feelsbadman: experience

and it makes me :feelsweirdman:



consciousness like us? :shrug: i dunno, sometimes even something that gets eaten by the millions every day like a shrimp seems to have a bit of a personality.

so I think they do, at least to some extent. You can look into their eyes and see that they are at least conscious.


i guess one of the main things I wonder about is to what extent do they perform self-reflection. Horses get stir crazy. Can't blame 'em.
I wonder if a fish in a livewell (small ice chest sized container) reflects on how he isn't happy living in containment
:shrug: ive got more questions than answers


I personally don't believe that most other animals are capable of self-reflection--I'm inclined to think that only animals that are capable of experiencing depressive mood states can reflect on themselves (but this is not to say that all animals that are capable of such mood states necessarily have the ability to reflect on themselves).

I don't know if fish have been observed to exhibit depressive behaviors, I kind of doubt it, though...:salmon:



Quote:

Kickle said:
I believe many creatures are conscious of much the same material as we are. Product of similar brains. And I also believe there are differences in depth. For instance a dog has an olfactory bulb to sift through smells, but it's much larger than our own and likely introduces a greater depth of conscious experience in terms of smells than our own.


This is basically my perspective on the issue. :thumbup:


--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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InvisibleDieCommie

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Re: Do you believe other creatures possess consciousness like us? [Re: Poid] * 1
    #14174939 - 03/24/11 10:05 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Yes I do.  'Like us' as in similar to us.  I presume that the closer their genetics and environment is to ours, the closer their consciousness is to ours.

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InvisiblePoid
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Re: Do you believe other creatures possess consciousness like us? [Re: DieCommie]
    #14174966 - 03/24/11 10:13 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

I agree. :thumbup:


I wonder why some people think animals don't possess human-like consciousness...


--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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InvisibleDieCommie

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Re: Do you believe other creatures possess consciousness like us? [Re: Poid] * 1
    #14175043 - 03/24/11 10:37 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

I suspect most people do.  Those that don't have the notion that humans are somehow special or separate from nature and the eco system.  Here in the states, they may not believe in evolution and think that god created us special, or they may be secular but still have that Christan style ideology of man being separate from nature buried deep within them (which often happens IME, people reject Christian myths but still believe in Christian style ideology).

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InvisiblePoid
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Re: Do you believe other creatures possess consciousness like us? [Re: DieCommie]
    #14175071 - 03/24/11 10:46 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

DieCommie said:
(which often happens IME, people reject Christian myths but still believe in Christian style ideology)


I've noticed this quite a bit, too; an example IMO would be non-Christians who hate homosexuals.


--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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Re: Do you believe other creatures possess consciousness like us? [Re: DieCommie]
    #14175117 - 03/24/11 10:59 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Bears.

Bears go into deep meditation.

I'm a Bear.

Bears are self-aware.

And their solitary.

Study Bears.


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