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OfflineCapMeh
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Panaeolus foenisecii & Panaeolus Subbalteatus growing patterns
    #14173674 - 03/24/11 12:34 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Well, It's that time of year again folks! I decided to go for a walk today around the local Pan Subb spots, but only to find prolific fruitings of Foes. I started thinking back to last year and the year before that, and how I had found Foes in these same spots right before the Subbs started popping up, which is why I am creating this thread. Has anyone noticed a relationship between the growing patters of Pan Subbs and Pan Foes?

I notice the Pan Foes starting to pop up during the spring rains or slighty after, then when it gets a little hotter, the Subbs start to fruit along side the Foes. As summer continues to creep in, the Foes stop fruiting and leave the hot days to the Subbs, then when Fall starts to creep in, the Foes start to fruit again, the Subbs gradually stop, and the Foes once again fruit alone for a short time. This pattern could very possibly be confined to my area, and I only have 2 seasons of observation to go on. I just felt compelled to ask if anyone has thought the same thing? Or perhaps this is even common knowledge to an expert?

Thanks for your time! Let this be a fantastic season for everyone :mushroom2:


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InvisibleAIRDOG
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Re: Panaeolus foenisecii & Panaeolus Subbalteatus growing patterns [Re: CapMeh]
    #14174534 - 03/24/11 08:03 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

not only this is true for your mushrooms... it happens all the times with all varieties of mushrooms... you know mushies are very seasonal, here for example...

in the pastures after the first rains come the agaricus and the clavatias, then come the p. mexicana, then pan cyans, then cubensis, in that order..... there is ocassionaly some of the species fruiting at the same time... but always one fruits in more abundance, in certain periods of time...

:smile:


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Offlinecrokms
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Re: Panaeolus foenisecii & Panaeolus Subbalteatus growing patterns [Re: CapMeh]
    #14174650 - 03/24/11 08:45 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

wow u learn something new everyday. i was hoping to do some spring hunting for subbs. i have alot of good spots picked out as well as a good knowledge or their features and this is really helpful. so is it safe to say that if i dont begin to see pan foes pop up in my hunting grounds, them subbs probably wont sprout either??:shrug:


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Offlineirbaa
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Re: Panaeolus foenisecii & Panaeolus Subbalteatus growing patterns [Re: crokms]
    #14174675 - 03/24/11 08:51 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I have been finding grass Subbs for the last month or so in Fl, started when temps went above 65 in the day and 50's at night, they pop for about a week after rain, heat, and humidity


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Offlinecrokms
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Re: Panaeolus foenisecii & Panaeolus Subbalteatus growing patterns [Re: irbaa]
    #14174973 - 03/24/11 10:15 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

irbaa said:
I have been finding grass Subbs for the last month or so in Fl, started when temps went above 65 in the day and 50's at night, they pop for about a week after rain, heat, and humidity



did pan foes come up b4 the subbs??


--------------------
Its not always about the harvest
Sometimes, the hunt is just as good
:shroompick:


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OfflineKaiser
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Re: Panaeolus foenisecii & Panaeolus Subbalteatus growing patterns [Re: crokms]
    #14175064 - 03/24/11 10:43 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Last summer I managed to get some subbs to fruit in my back yard. They were growing around the time that the temprature peaks(July, early August).
By the end of August the subbs were all but gone and the foes fruited all the way through September.
My conclusion is that Panaeolus cinctulus prefer warmer conditions than Panaeolina foenisecii.


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Offlineirbaa
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Re: Panaeolus foenisecii & Panaeolus Subbalteatus growing patterns [Re: crokms]
    #14175128 - 03/24/11 11:01 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

the subbs I found grew in two separate about week long events after frontal rains, first time found almost exclusively subbs second time mixed subbs and foes


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OfflineCapMeh
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Re: Panaeolus foenisecii & Panaeolus Subbalteatus growing patterns [Re: crokms]
    #14175809 - 03/24/11 01:22 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

crokms said:
wow u learn something new everyday. i was hoping to do some spring hunting for subbs. i have alot of good spots picked out as well as a good knowledge or their features and this is really helpful. so is it safe to say that if i dont begin to see pan foes pop up in my hunting grounds, them subbs probably wont sprout either??:shrug:




Im hesitant to say that if you dont see foes, there wont be any subbs. Im just saying that i always see foes pop up right before the subbs take over, then they pop up after the subbs go dormant. For example, a few lawns are fruiting foes right now, and in no more than a month, that lawn will stop fruiting, and the one next to it will start fruiting subbs. I water my grass with subb spore water, and they start popping up in april, but there are never foes on my lawn. So if there arent foes in your patch, it doesnt necessarily mean that there wont be subbs. I guess what im trying to theorize is that if I check a bunch of spots, and find a few foes, it an indicator that conditions are on their way to becoming correct for the subbs to fruit, not necessarily in that exact spot, just the general area.


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OfflineCapMeh
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Re: Panaeolus foenisecii & Panaeolus Subbalteatus growing patterns [Re: CapMeh]
    #14175819 - 03/24/11 01:25 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

P.s. I am referring to turf subbs (subbs that grow in grass, ex: lawns, parks, sports fields) that get their water from sprinkler systems, and not to dung subbs, which rely on the rain to become and stay moist.


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Offlineapplesmasher420
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Re: Panaeolus foenisecii & Panaeolus Subbalteatus growing patterns [Re: CapMeh]
    #14176612 - 03/24/11 03:35 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

i noticed near the end of summer their were only foes to be found everywhere


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OfflineCapMeh
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Re: Panaeolus foenisecii & Panaeolus Subbalteatus growing patterns [Re: applesmasher420]
    #14176715 - 03/24/11 03:53 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Applesmasher, youre a damn good etchasketcher! :stoned:


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Offlineapplesmasher420
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Re: Panaeolus foenisecii & Panaeolus Subbalteatus growing patterns [Re: CapMeh]
    #14176751 - 03/24/11 03:59 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

lol thanks :heart:


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OfflineOreganic
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Re: Panaeolus foenisecii & Panaeolus Subbalteatus growing patterns [Re: CapMeh]
    #14176762 - 03/24/11 04:01 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Very interesting thread CapMeh, and something I have wondered about quite often as well. I can't say I have a whole lot to add, because as far as I know I have only found Foes. However, there's been something in the back of my mind that has wondered how many actual Subbs I found and had just passed off as Foes... It gets so tedious spore printing all these damn Pans and than trying to decipher which ones are the subbs, And I mean, I don't usually mind spore printing either. But last spring I think I printed 100 foes... lol..

Anyway, I have basically always wondered how interrelated their growth patterns get; do they grow together quite often? Is it common to find them fruiting in the same area? Do Subbs in fact fruit after the Foes in a consistent manner? These are all questions that interest me..


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Offlineapplesmasher420
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Re: Panaeolus foenisecii & Panaeolus Subbalteatus growing patterns [Re: Oreganic]
    #14176789 - 03/24/11 04:07 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

depending on the time of year wherever i find foes i find cincts near by sometimes they even grow right next to eachother

and yeah i hate printing them >:[
i just get a big sheet of aluminum foil and lay out all the caps on it for printing and check each print one at a time -_-


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Offlineorison
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Re: Panaeolus foenisecii & Panaeolus Subbalteatus growing patterns [Re: applesmasher420]
    #14176804 - 03/24/11 04:09 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

where Im from Sub and Foes almost always grow together.


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OfflineCapMeh
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Re: Panaeolus foenisecii & Panaeolus Subbalteatus growing patterns [Re: Oreganic]
    #14176815 - 03/24/11 04:10 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Thank you for adding Oreganic :} The same questions I ask myself too! I remember my first season printing hundreds of pans, most of which turned out to be foes, so i know how tedious it can get! I just quit printing them and toss any pans that have close to brown gills. Subbs have obvious grayish black gills when they are fully mature, when foes have obvious dark brown gills when fully mature. Its when the subbs are very young that it gets tough weeding them out of the foes. In my experience subbs have browish gills before they sporulate or when they are beginning to sporulate.

I notice them growing together sometimes, but thats exactly my point, only at brief periods do i see them fruiting together. It's either lots of subbs, or lots of foes in my experience.


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Offlineapplesmasher420
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Re: Panaeolus foenisecii & Panaeolus Subbalteatus growing patterns [Re: CapMeh]
    #14177033 - 03/24/11 04:44 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

idk its the stem that helps me the most diferentiating (excuse me if thats not a word) them :shrug:


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OfflineCapMeh
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Re: Panaeolus foenisecii & Panaeolus Subbalteatus growing patterns [Re: applesmasher420]
    #14177160 - 03/24/11 05:00 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Really? the stem over the gills? I guess you have to create the best identification tool that soots your area. I find Foes around here with hearty reddish stems that look virtually identical to the stems of the Subbs. Also, all that talk about subbs having stems with lines spiraling up, and foes having straight lines that go up the stems, hasnt done me any good, i find subbs and foes with both of those features.


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Re: Panaeolus foenisecii & Panaeolus Subbalteatus growing patterns [Re: CapMeh]
    #14177184 - 03/24/11 05:04 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

CapMeh said:
I find Foes around here with hearty reddish stems that look virtually identical to the stems of the Subbs.




How about the color of the interior of the stem?


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Offlineapplesmasher420
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Re: Panaeolus foenisecii & Panaeolus Subbalteatus growing patterns [Re: Byrain]
    #14177424 - 03/24/11 05:40 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

hmmm i know what you mean but i noticed most of the times they folow that guidline but i print them all anyway because as you said alot of foes have this feature


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Offlinecrokms
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Re: Panaeolus foenisecii & Panaeolus Subbalteatus growing patterns [Re: CapMeh]
    #14177442 - 03/24/11 05:43 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

CapMeh said:
P.s. I am referring to turf subbs (subbs that grow in grass, ex: lawns, parks, sports fields) that get their water from sprinkler systems, and not to dung subbs, which rely on the rain to become and stay moist.



ya thats where im hunting im a little hesatint to go through a farm around her. alot of shhot first ask questions later but thank you for clarifying this. im new to spring hunts i usually hunt for gyms and i just want info from all perspectives before i hunt subbs love tha thread guys:awethumb:


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Its not always about the harvest
Sometimes, the hunt is just as good
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Offlineblazedhobo
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Re: Panaeolus foenisecii & Panaeolus Subbalteatus growing patterns [Re: CapMeh]
    #18480727 - 06/27/13 05:50 PM (10 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

CapMeh said:In my experience subbs have browish gills before they sporulate or when they are beginning to sporulate.




sry for reviving an old thread, but has any one else observed this? i've been searching around to see if there was a noticeable difference in this mushroom's gills based on it's age.

also, the gills of subbs are supposed to drop down slightly lower than the edge of the cap right? again, would younger mushrooms not have that feature yet?


sry if it's a dumb question, but believe me i've looked around quite a bit for this info.


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OfflineCapMeh
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Re: Panaeolus foenisecii & Panaeolus Subbalteatus growing patterns [Re: blazedhobo]
    #18490590 - 06/30/13 12:03 AM (10 years, 6 months ago)

No worries blaze! Welcome to the shroomery. I have found this mushroom to have a large range of varying macroscopic features resulting from where its growing, how old it is, etc. I have found subbs with gills that drop low beneath the cap, and some that don't. My advice would be just to pick all the suspected subbs and spore print them all. The print will be jet black if they are subbs, or dark dark brown if they are pan foes (harmless).


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