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Offlinevisionstream
Psychonaught


Registered: 03/03/11
Posts: 118
Last seen: 9 years, 2 months
When is going overboard of psychedelics?
    #14153101 - 03/20/11 10:41 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Sup guys. Love this site.
My psychedelic experiences started when I was about 16, doing Salvia (as my first mind altering experience ((even before drinking)) ). I did salvia about 15 times over the years but eventually quit because of a terrible trip on a high dose.
My return to psychedelics would happen early this year, 2011, with mushrooms. Took some with a friend, saw pretty colors and felt nice...thats about it.
I wanted to try it again so I did and still the visuals weren't more than colors but I did feel extremely at peace with the world and got the sense of one-ness. I was intrigued by this and my next trip was a high dose...3.2gs (it may be worth mentioning that I was in a park around nature the whole time).
This is one of the top experiences of my life (having all of the typical effects like breathing plants, seeming like plants and all life was 'aware' and seeing the universe behind my eyes) but I felt weird the following days. I guess I could say I didn't feel as part of reality as I used to. A lot of friends of mine caught me staring at the ground in deep thought with a disturbed look on my face quite frequently after this asking "are you ok man?". I'm talking weeks afterword. During this time though I didn't feel disturbed. It was more like a meditative experience for me.
Since then I have done a moderate dose (2.5gs) twice, looking for more answers as I have been truly spiritually intrigued. I have been researching shamanism...etc.
I have yet to be scared for more than a few minutes on shrooms but the idea of a bad trip keeps lingering in my mind, making me wonder if I am going overboard having done shrooms 5 times in only 3 months. I am, however having seemingly other worldly thoughts often, especially after consuming cannabis. Maybe its a leap to say but I feel like I have flashbacks nearly every day. Not visual distortions but the view of seeing earth's life as an alien life form that doesn't quite make sense any more. Humans look weird to me now. I can't understand why trees look the way they do. I feel that this may just be over analysis. But seeing as I consume cannabis daily there always seems to be some kind of shroom-feeling that arises sometime in the high, sometimes causing anxiety and pressure on my chest.
Is looking forward to the next trip a sign of something bad? Is this normal? Should I take a break for a while? What are your guys' thoughts on this?
Thanks so much.


--------------------
I believe in art and creation. I live for captivating mystical moments throughout my own journeys and sharing them with you.


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Invisiblejoemolloy
DMT is Bullshit


Registered: 04/12/09
Posts: 6,525
Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: visionstream]
    #14153168 - 03/20/11 11:01 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I can give you my experience with psychedelics.  When I first started tripping, I believed these drugs gave me access to alternate realities such as the subatomic world, the lives of plants, cosmic consciousness, the experience of infinity, glimpses of life after death, life before death, life beyond life and Buddhist type enlightenment.  I was convinced that these drugs were vital to understanding the universe and my place in it.  I couldn't understand how governments weren't actively studying these drugs, why scientists generally ignored them, and why DMT wasn't a monetary currency in the world market.  I'd spend much of my sober time trying to unravel the mysteries of the experience, studying my notes, listening to my audio-recordings of my trips, reading psychedelic literature, and participating in forums with like-minded thinkers.

Finally I arrived at an epiphany, probably the most powerful idea I'd ever encountered.  The experience is bullshit.  There is nothing substantive there, nothing that can deepen any understanding of anything.  This shit just confuses and obscures and points in random directions.  None of the existential questions that I have can ever be answered, have ever been answered, nor will be answered during my stay on earth.

These drugs are jerking off and masturbation.  Treating them as anything more than that was bad for my mental health.

Of course, your experience and interpretation may differ dramatically from mine and I hope you find peace.


--------------------
Don't PM me with bullshit.  I don't sell or trade cactus and I don't know where you can get any, other than your mother's ass.


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OfflineValafar
Striking for the gentle
Male


Registered: 02/20/10
Posts: 155
Loc: Vermont/Maine
Last seen: 10 years, 4 months
Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: visionstream]
    #14153227 - 03/20/11 11:10 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Sound pretty normal to me, after using psychedelics a good amount I get little flash backs like that in day to day life, things just looking sort of weird and I stare at them for a bit lol. I enjoy them but if they ever get overwhelming or annoying just take a break for a month or 2, seems to get rid of them completely. I tend to trip 3 or 4 times a month and I find that smoking weed always freaks me out a bit if I have been tripping hard multiple times in the recent few months so I would not call that un-normal either.
Just gauge it by how you feel dude, a friend of mine was tripping very large amounts of lsd every week for a few months and the little flashback like your getting turned into him stopping and staring at things for 10-20 minuets and he was starting to get a bit freaked out so he stop and after about a month of not tripping he was completely fine again.
All seem to be good dude :smile: Just remember to trip responsibly in a good setting with good people and your trips should continue to be good, you may have a bad trip at some point but instead of being scared of it or taking it as a bad thing take it as a learning experience.
Peace and good vibes my friend,
-Lewis


--------------------
"Tolling for the searching ones, on their speechless, seeking trail
For the lonesome-hearted lovers with too personal a tale
And for each unharmful, gentle soul misplaced inside a jail
And we gazed upon the chimes of freedom flashing"


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OfflineR2-D2
horseradish
Male User Gallery

Registered: 12/14/10
Posts: 945
Last seen: 4 years, 29 days
Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: Valafar]
    #14153259 - 03/20/11 11:17 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Humans only look as "weird" as you make them look.
Trees look like growth to me, as you can see them reaching ever upwards, always stretching up and out.
Chill out on the thinking, maybe.


--------------------


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Offlinevisionstream
Psychonaught


Registered: 03/03/11
Posts: 118
Last seen: 9 years, 2 months
Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: joemolloy]
    #14153280 - 03/20/11 11:21 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

joemolloy said:
I can give you my experience with psychedelics.  When I first started tripping, I believed these drugs gave me access to alternate realities such as the subatomic world, the lives of plants, cosmic consciousness, the experience of infinity, glimpses of life after death, life before death, life beyond life and Buddhist type enlightenment.  I was convinced that these drugs were vital to understanding the universe and my place in it.  I couldn't understand how governments weren't actively studying these drugs, why scientists generally ignored them, and why DMT wasn't a monetary currency in the world market.  I'd spend much of my sober time trying to unravel the mysteries of the experience, studying my notes, listening to my audio-recordings of my trips, reading psychedelic literature, and participating in forums with like-minded thinkers.

Finally I arrived at an epiphany, probably the most powerful idea I'd ever encountered.  The experience is bullshit.  There is nothing substantive there, nothing that can deepen any understanding of anything.  This shit just confuses and obscures and points in random directions.  None of the existential questions that I have can ever be answered, have ever been answered, nor will be answered during my stay on earth.

These drugs are jerking off and masturbation.  Treating them as anything more than that was bad for my mental health.

Of course, your experience and interpretation may differ dramatically from mine and I hope you find peace.




I see your point of view, but beg to differ at the same time.
Each person creates their own reality and everyone reality differs from one another even if its only about 1 opinion on a small subject.
If these chemicals can show me that the human-culture and greed oriented perception is not the only one then I think there is more to learn. I don't think I will find all the answers either. The mind is as vast or more vast and just as in-understandable as the external universe. I see what your saying but I don't think that the typical human celebrity worshiping, money driven culture is what humans truly want. I think love is a powerful force and psychedelics offer a few things we can learn from, no?


--------------------
I believe in art and creation. I live for captivating mystical moments throughout my own journeys and sharing them with you.


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OfflineShroomerited
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Registered: 06/12/10
Posts: 1,974
Last seen: 7 years, 9 months
Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: joemolloy]
    #14153285 - 03/20/11 11:22 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

joemolloy said:
I can give you my experience with psychedelics.  When I first started tripping, I believed these drugs gave me access to alternate realities such as the subatomic world, the lives of plants, cosmic consciousness, the experience of infinity, glimpses of life after death, life before death, life beyond life and Buddhist type enlightenment.  I was convinced that these drugs were vital to understanding the universe and my place in it.  I couldn't understand how governments weren't actively studying these drugs, why scientists generally ignored them, and why DMT wasn't a monetary currency in the world market.  I'd spend much of my sober time trying to unravel the mysteries of the experience, studying my notes, listening to my audio-recordings of my trips, reading psychedelic literature, and participating in forums with like-minded thinkers.

Finally I arrived at an epiphany, probably the most powerful idea I'd ever encountered.  The experience is bullshit.  There is nothing substantive there, nothing that can deepen any understanding of anything.  This shit just confuses and obscures and points in random directions.  None of the existential questions that I have can ever be answered, have ever been answered, nor will be answered during my stay on earth.

These drugs are jerking off and masturbation.  Treating them as anything more than that was bad for my mental health.

Of course, your experience and interpretation may differ dramatically from mine and I hope you find peace.




I HAVE learned a lot from the use of psychedelics. None of the bullshit you were talking about, though.

Plus they're just fun.

You gotta use your brain AFTER the trip to figure out "was that bullshit?".

One thing I learned after my first trip. On the comedown of my first trip (on 5 grams), I was on the ground looking up at this tree. I was having a great time. I was looking up and I started to feel like I was a baby in a crib and the whole world was looking down on me. Everything was bigger than me. I didn't feel scared, it just was what it was.

It took me AWHILE to figure what the fuck that was about. I figured it out. I had a VERY weird childhood. Pretty much I never had any interaction with anyone my own age until I was 11 years old; which permanently altered how I saw the world. I am so used to seeing everyone as a superior/older/wiser/smarter. I automatically surrender dominance as a result. I have a hard time seeing anyone as a peer.

I've been trying to change that, which I think I have.


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Offlinevisionstream
Psychonaught


Registered: 03/03/11
Posts: 118
Last seen: 9 years, 2 months
Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: Valafar]
    #14153292 - 03/20/11 11:23 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Valafar said:
Sound pretty normal to me, after using psychedelics a good amount I get little flash backs like that in day to day life, things just looking sort of weird and I stare at them for a bit lol. I enjoy them but if they ever get overwhelming or annoying just take a break for a month or 2, seems to get rid of them completely. I tend to trip 3 or 4 times a month and I find that smoking weed always freaks me out a bit if I have been tripping hard multiple times in the recent few months so I would not call that un-normal either.
Just gauge it by how you feel dude, a friend of mine was tripping very large amounts of lsd every week for a few months and the little flashback like your getting turned into him stopping and staring at things for 10-20 minuets and he was starting to get a bit freaked out so he stop and after about a month of not tripping he was completely fine again.
All seem to be good dude :smile: Just remember to trip responsibly in a good setting with good people and your trips should continue to be good, you may have a bad trip at some point but instead of being scared of it or taking it as a bad thing take it as a learning experience.
Peace and good vibes my friend,
-Lewis



Thanks man, this makes me feel better. I am also thinking of taking a small break from cannabis to start to get a little back to normal and to be able to appreciate cannabis again as I did the first time I used it.


--------------------
I believe in art and creation. I live for captivating mystical moments throughout my own journeys and sharing them with you.


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Offlinevisionstream
Psychonaught


Registered: 03/03/11
Posts: 118
Last seen: 9 years, 2 months
Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: Shroomerited]
    #14153303 - 03/20/11 11:26 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Shroomerited said:
Quote:

joemolloy said:
I can give you my experience with psychedelics.  When I first started tripping, I believed these drugs gave me access to alternate realities such as the subatomic world, the lives of plants, cosmic consciousness, the experience of infinity, glimpses of life after death, life before death, life beyond life and Buddhist type enlightenment.  I was convinced that these drugs were vital to understanding the universe and my place in it.  I couldn't understand how governments weren't actively studying these drugs, why scientists generally ignored them, and why DMT wasn't a monetary currency in the world market.  I'd spend much of my sober time trying to unravel the mysteries of the experience, studying my notes, listening to my audio-recordings of my trips, reading psychedelic literature, and participating in forums with like-minded thinkers.

Finally I arrived at an epiphany, probably the most powerful idea I'd ever encountered.  The experience is bullshit.  There is nothing substantive there, nothing that can deepen any understanding of anything.  This shit just confuses and obscures and points in random directions.  None of the existential questions that I have can ever be answered, have ever been answered, nor will be answered during my stay on earth.

These drugs are jerking off and masturbation.  Treating them as anything more than that was bad for my mental health.

Of course, your experience and interpretation may differ dramatically from mine and I hope you find peace.




I HAVE learned a lot from the use of psychedelics. None of the bullshit you were talking about, though.

Plus they're just fun.

You gotta use your brain AFTER the trip to figure out "was that bullshit?".

One thing I learned after my first trip. On the comedown of my first trip (on 5 grams), I was on the ground looking up at this tree. I was having a great time. I was looking up and I started to feel like I was a baby in a crib and the whole world was looking down on me. Everything was bigger than me. I didn't feel scared, it just was what it was.

It took me AWHILE to figure what the fuck that was about. I figured it out. I had a VERY weird childhood. Pretty much I never had any interaction with anyone my own age until I was 11 years old; which permanently altered how I saw the world. I am so used to seeing everyone as a superior/older/wiser/smarter. I automatically surrender dominance as a result. I have a hard time seeing anyone as a peer.

I've been trying to change that, which I think I have.




Aha! So you seem to think that shrooms work in symbolic ways and that everything experienced was already part of your memories and thus not showing you anything new, as perhaps I feel I have seen?
They do work differently for everyone. I would like to see other people's comments on this.

Do psychedelics offer anything of their own or do they merely connect memories in your head to show you what you already know, in a new light?


--------------------
I believe in art and creation. I live for captivating mystical moments throughout my own journeys and sharing them with you.


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Invisiblejoemolloy
DMT is Bullshit


Registered: 04/12/09
Posts: 6,525
Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: visionstream]
    #14153325 - 03/20/11 11:31 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:


I see your point of view, but beg to differ at the same time.
Each person creates their own reality and everyone reality differs from one another even if its only about 1 opinion on a small subject.
If these chemicals can show me that the human-culture and greed oriented perception is not the only one then I think there is more to learn. I don't think I will find all the answers either. The mind is as vast or more vast and just as in-understandable as the external universe. I see what your saying but I don't think that the typical human celebrity worshiping, money driven culture is what humans truly want. I think love is a powerful force and psychedelics offer a few things we can learn from, no?




Yes, but you are forgetting something very important.  All of those criticisms you have about modern, western, capitalist culture can be articulated and understood without psychedelics.  Do you really need shrooms to realize how fucked up this culture is? I don't.  These drugs have never shown me anything that I did not already know.

@Shroomerited - Have confidence in yourself.  Your psychedelic "psychoanalytic" moment was already part of you.  You didn't need to trip to realize that aspect of yourself.  It's like people thanking Jesus and giving credit to God when they achieve something.  Fuck that.  I will never credit to God or a mushroom for something I am responsible for.  It's disempowering to do so.

Take these drugs off the pedestal and put yourself on that pedestal.  Empower yourself, don't become a slave to it.


--------------------
Don't PM me with bullshit.  I don't sell or trade cactus and I don't know where you can get any, other than your mother's ass.


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OfflineShroomerited
Male User Gallery

Registered: 06/12/10
Posts: 1,974
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: joemolloy]
    #14153359 - 03/20/11 11:39 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:



@Shroomerited - Have confidence in yourself.  Your psychedelic "psychoanalytic" moment was already part of you.  You didn't need to trip to realize that aspect of yourself.  It's like people thanking Jesus and giving credit to God when they achieve something.  Fuck that.  I will never credit to God or a mushroom for something I am responsible for.  It's disempowering to do so.

Take these drugs off the pedestal and put yourself on that pedestal.  Empower yourself, don't become a slave to it.




I actually don't trip anymore. I don't care if I could have learned it another way, I learned it through the trip. Also I rolled around, laughing my ass off in euphoria.

I just had a good time.


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OfflineAnthony917
why dont we do it in the road
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Registered: 05/14/09
Posts: 3,243
Loc: Earth
Last seen: 12 years, 2 months
Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: joemolloy]
    #14153379 - 03/20/11 11:43 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

joemolloy said:

I see your point of view, but beg to differ at the same time.
Each person creates their own reality and everyone reality differs from one another even if its only about 1 opinion on a small subject.
If these chemicals can show me that the human-culture and greed oriented perception is not the only one then I think there is more to learn. I don't think I will find all the answers either. The mind is as vast or more vast and just as in-understandable as the external universe. I see what your saying but I don't think that the typical human celebrity worshiping, money driven culture is what humans truly want. I think love is a powerful force and psychedelics offer a few things we can learn from, no?




Yes, but you are forgetting something very important.  All of those criticisms you have about modern, western, capitalist culture can be articulated and understood without psychedelics.  Do you really need shrooms to realize how fucked up this culture is? I don't.  These drugs have never shown me anything that I did not already know.

@Shroomerited - Have confidence in yourself.  Your psychedelic "psychoanalytic" moment was already part of you.  You didn't need to trip to realize that aspect of yourself.  It's like people thanking Jesus and giving credit to God when they achieve something.  Fuck that.  I will never credit to God or a mushroom for something I am responsible for.  It's disempowering to do so.

Take these drugs off the pedestal and put yourself on that pedestal.  Empower yourself, don't become a slave to it.




OP listen to joemolly...this is all truth.
Everything that you hope to "discover" while on psychedelics isn't really discovery at all.
All the "epiphany" type moments that occur whilst tripping only seem amazing because you're completely fucked up. Even when analyzing trips after the fact, there's nothing useful I have EVER gained.
In terms of the long-lasting effects of shrooms, they have made me question our general existence WAY more. I've never reached a conclusion, sober or tripping, and I don't think I ever will.

"All of those criticisms you have about modern, western, capitalist culture can be articulated and understood without psychedelics" <---- This x12903821

Seriously, the answers you're looking for are already in your head. Psychs are incredible fun, and they DO have value. They can be great for bonding with close friends, they can be very relaxing, and the days following my trips I always seem to be in a better mood. You'll never reach "enlightenment" through psychs, and if you do...it's more likely just drug induced psychosis lool


--------------------
Prisoner#1 said: I got my ass kicked by a 9yo when I was 17
Trippin? Click Me




What is life? I'm tired of life...


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OfflineAnthony917
why dont we do it in the road
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Registered: 05/14/09
Posts: 3,243
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Last seen: 12 years, 2 months
Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: Anthony917]
    #14153387 - 03/20/11 11:44 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)


Quote:

joemolloy said:
Quote:


I see your point of view, but beg to differ at the same time.
Each person creates their own reality and everyone reality differs from one another even if its only about 1 opinion on a small subject.
If these chemicals can show me that the human-culture and greed oriented perception is not the only one then I think there is more to learn. I don't think I will find all the answers either. The mind is as vast or more vast and just as in-understandable as the external universe. I see what your saying but I don't think that the typical human celebrity worshiping, money driven culture is what humans truly want. I think love is a powerful force and psychedelics offer a few things we can learn from, no?




Yes, but you are forgetting something very important.  All of those criticisms you have about modern, western, capitalist culture can be articulated and understood without psychedelics.  Do you really need shrooms to realize how fucked up this culture is? I don't.  These drugs have never shown me anything that I did not already know.

@Shroomerited - Have confidence in yourself.  Your psychedelic "psychoanalytic" moment was already part of you.  You didn't need to trip to realize that aspect of yourself.  It's like people thanking Jesus and giving credit to God when they achieve something.  Fuck that.  I will never credit to God or a mushroom for something I am responsible for.  It's disempowering to do so.

Take these drugs off the pedestal and put yourself on that pedestal.  Empower yourself, don't become a slave to it.




OP listen to joemolly...this is all truth.
Everything that you hope to "discover" while on psychedelics isn't really discovery at all.
All the "epiphany" type moments that occur whilst tripping only seem amazing because you're completely fucked up. Even when analyzing trips after the fact, there's nothing useful I have EVER gained.
In terms of the long-lasting effects of shrooms, they have made me question our general existence WAY more. I've never reached a conclusion, sober or tripping, and I don't think I ever will.

"All of those criticisms you have about modern, western, capitalist culture can be articulated and understood without psychedelics" <---- This x12903821

Seriously, the answers you're looking for are already in your head. Psychs are incredible fun, and they DO have value. They can be great for bonding with close friends, they can be very relaxing, and the days following my trips I always seem to be in a better mood. You'll never reach "enlightenment" through psychs, and if you do...it's more likely just drug induced psychosis lool




--------------------
Prisoner#1 said: I got my ass kicked by a 9yo when I was 17
Trippin? Click Me




What is life? I'm tired of life...


Edited by Anthony917 (03/20/11 11:44 AM)


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OfflineR2-D2
horseradish
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Registered: 12/14/10
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: Anthony917]
    #14153401 - 03/20/11 11:47 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Hey joemolloy, if psychedelics are bullshit, then what is the meaning of life?


--------------------


Edited by R2-D2 (03/20/11 11:47 AM)


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Offlinevisionstream
Psychonaught


Registered: 03/03/11
Posts: 118
Last seen: 9 years, 2 months
Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: visionstream]
    #14153432 - 03/20/11 11:54 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I understand Joemolley and thanks Anthony. I am open minded so I can see some truth in your theory. I did already have the knowledge about corrupt society, I just was never shown it in plain sight, which psychedelics allowed me to do. So are you saying then that all I was seeing was what I already thought, just amplified because I was fucked up?
Because I seem to think now that what I saw, and indeed what I knew before I saw it...has even more truth than before. Is that an illusion?
What could explain this?

And Anthony, about "enlightenment"...are you familiar with Terrance McKenna, or Alex Grey. What do you think goes on in their minds? Are they psycho? They seem to have taken great, timeless lessons away from their trips and understand life on a new level than most of us.


--------------------
I believe in art and creation. I live for captivating mystical moments throughout my own journeys and sharing them with you.


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Invisiblejoemolloy
DMT is Bullshit


Registered: 04/12/09
Posts: 6,525
Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: R2-D2]
    #14153439 - 03/20/11 11:57 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

R2-D2 said:
Hey joemolloy, if psychedelics are bullshit, then what is the meaning of life?




No one can answer any question like that, there might not even be an answer.  If someone claims to have the answer, hold your wallet close to you, cover your asshole up, and get away.  If you think drugs can help you with that question, then I wish you luck.


--------------------
Don't PM me with bullshit.  I don't sell or trade cactus and I don't know where you can get any, other than your mother's ass.


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Invisiblejoemolloy
DMT is Bullshit


Registered: 04/12/09
Posts: 6,525
Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: visionstream]
    #14153452 - 03/20/11 11:59 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:


And Anthony, about "enlightenment"...are you familiar with Terrance McKenna, or Alex Grey. What do you think goes on in their minds? Are they psycho? They seem to have taken great, timeless lessons away from their trips and understand life on a new level than most of us.




I've spent countless hours listening to Mckenna and I love him.  He is batshit insane.  Replace "mushroom" with "Jesus" in his lectures and see if it still has the same relevance.  He was a disciple of the psychedelic religion.


--------------------
Don't PM me with bullshit.  I don't sell or trade cactus and I don't know where you can get any, other than your mother's ass.


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OfflineAnthony917
why dont we do it in the road
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Registered: 05/14/09
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Last seen: 12 years, 2 months
Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: visionstream]
    #14153472 - 03/20/11 12:08 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

visionstream said:
I understand Joemolley and thanks Anthony. I am open minded so I can see some truth in your theory. I did already have the knowledge about corrupt society, I just was never shown it in plain sight, which psychedelics allowed me to do. So are you saying then that all I was seeing was what I already thought, just amplified because I was fucked up?
Because I seem to think now that what I saw, and indeed what I knew before I saw it...has even more truth than before. Is that an illusion?
What could explain this?

And Anthony, about "enlightenment"...are you familiar with Terrance McKenna, or Alex Grey. What do you think goes on in their minds? Are they psycho? They seem to have taken great, timeless lessons away from their trips and understand life on a new level than most of us.




Yes, I think every conclusion you've come to while on psychedelics was already in your mind. I think psychs help break down barriers in your mind, allowing you to "realize" things you may have otherwise buried. Although, what conclusions have you reached while on psychedelics that you couldn't have figured out while sober? I think when people start doing psychedelics hoping to find answers, they are going about it the wrong way. I use psychedelics because I like the state of mind it puts me in. I like the visual distortion, the colors, the intense closed eye visuals on high doses...even ego death can be an enjoyable experience.

I am somewhat familiar with McKenna and I will agree that he had an amazing outlook on life. I don't think they "understand" life any better than I do, though. Don't let drugs shape your view of the world.


--------------------
Prisoner#1 said: I got my ass kicked by a 9yo when I was 17
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Offlinevisionstream
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: joemolloy]
    #14153478 - 03/20/11 12:09 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

joemolloy said:
Quote:


And Anthony, about "enlightenment"...are you familiar with Terrance McKenna, or Alex Grey. What do you think goes on in their minds? Are they psycho? They seem to have taken great, timeless lessons away from their trips and understand life on a new level than most of us.




I've spent countless hours listening to Mckenna and I love him.  He is batshit insane.  Replace "mushroom" with "Jesus" in his lectures and see if it still has the same relevance.  He was a disciple of the psychedelic religion.



Interesting...he seems to have so much to offer though on so many subjects. And he treats all drugs with respect and properly, not just getting fucked up every day...I don't know how he's insane. He seems to just be a philosophical mind that just so happened to get sucked into the world of psychedelics. I mean to me at least what he says "rings truth". It seems to have a great message...more so than any religion. It seems to be an advance in humans that may be on the horizon. I am not religious so I don't take any one persons beliefs and make them my own...but i mean it does resonate with me.
How did you come upon the realization that its all BS? Do you, yourself have any sources that have lead you to start thinking in that way?
Thanks.


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OfflineR2-D2
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: joemolloy]
    #14153485 - 03/20/11 12:11 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

joemolloy said:
Quote:

R2-D2 said:
Hey joemolloy, if psychedelics are bullshit, then what is the meaning of life?




No one can answer any question like that, there might not even be an answer.  If someone claims to have the answer, hold your wallet close to you, cover your asshole up, and get away.  If you think drugs can help you with that question, then I wish you luck.



Well then how could you possibly say that DMT is bullshit? I'm not even saying I disagree with it, I just think you should further examine this belief.
McKenna is a goofy dude whose brain literally exploded. In one interview, he talked about never finding simplification in the universe, like "white light" type stuff, only an ever-increasing complexification. "Sane" or not, he has irrevocably inspired many many people and I love him.
Psychedelics have encouraged me to live my "normal" sober life to the best of my ability, and though I often find myself wanting to trip, I believe my desire to "chase" the psychedelic experience is a fault of my own, not of the psychedelics themselves.


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Offlinevisionstream
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: Anthony917]
    #14153489 - 03/20/11 12:11 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Anthony917 said:
Quote:

visionstream said:
I understand Joemolley and thanks Anthony. I am open minded so I can see some truth in your theory. I did already have the knowledge about corrupt society, I just was never shown it in plain sight, which psychedelics allowed me to do. So are you saying then that all I was seeing was what I already thought, just amplified because I was fucked up?
Because I seem to think now that what I saw, and indeed what I knew before I saw it...has even more truth than before. Is that an illusion?
What could explain this?

And Anthony, about "enlightenment"...are you familiar with Terrance McKenna, or Alex Grey. What do you think goes on in their minds? Are they psycho? They seem to have taken great, timeless lessons away from their trips and understand life on a new level than most of us.




Yes, I think every conclusion you've come to while on psychedelics was already in your mind. I think psychs help break down barriers in your mind, allowing you to "realize" things you may have otherwise buried. Although, what conclusions have you reached while on psychedelics that you couldn't have figured out while sober? I think when people start doing psychedelics hoping to find answers, they are going about it the wrong way. I use psychedelics because I like the state of mind it puts me in. I like the visual distortion, the colors, the intense closed eye visuals on high doses...even ego death can be an enjoyable experience.

I am somewhat familiar with McKenna and I will agree that he had an amazing outlook on life. I don't think they "understand" life any better than I do, though. Don't let drugs shape your view of the world.





I guess the thing that is different to me is...I didnt start them in search for answers. Answers were given to me and I was intrigued so the next trip was more for answers that were left lingering from the previous. Of course since every trip is different, I didnt get any more answers...just more questions. LOL!


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OfflineCynosure
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: joemolloy]
    #14153495 - 03/20/11 12:12 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

joemolloy said:I've spent countless hours listening to Mckenna and I love him.  He is batshit insane.  Replace "mushroom" with "Jesus" in his lectures and see if it still has the same relevance.  He was a disciple of the psychedelic religion.




Not sure I buy this one!

It's always funny to watch McKenna because he does say the "mushrooms" tell him things, or are responsible for this and that.. but after watching enough and reading some of his material, I saw that when he uses the mushroom in the sense OF a psychedelic trip he is usually referring to his own mind intoxicated by the mushrooms.  He clearly gives credit to the mushrooms for the state that he's in, and the level of consciousness they promote, but I believe he is aware (as well is the audience in most cases) that it is in fact his mind.

He never says that the mushrooms are going to save the world.  He clearly states that the psychedelic experience brought on by them is one that boosts creativity and relieves us from culture; and this, in turn, could result in some fantastic new ideas and the relief of a male/ego dominant society.  He praises most psychedelic substances for this, mushrooms just happen to be his favourite and most studied.


Edited by Cynosure (03/20/11 12:19 PM)


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OfflineAnthony917
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: R2-D2]
    #14153500 - 03/20/11 12:14 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

R2-D2 said:
Quote:

joemolloy said:
Quote:

R2-D2 said:
Hey joemolloy, if psychedelics are bullshit, then what is the meaning of life?




No one can answer any question like that, there might not even be an answer.  If someone claims to have the answer, hold your wallet close to you, cover your asshole up, and get away.  If you think drugs can help you with that question, then I wish you luck.



Well then how could you possibly say that DMT is bullshit? I'm not even saying I disagree with it, I just think you should further examine this belief.
McKenna is a goofy dude whose brain literally exploded. In one interview, he talked about never finding simplification in the universe, like "white light" type stuff, only an ever-increasing complexification. "Sane" or not, he has irrevocably inspired many many people and I love him.
Psychedelics have encouraged me to live my "normal" sober life to the best of my ability, and though I often find myself wanting to trip, I believe my desire to "chase" the psychedelic experience is a fault of my own, not of the psychedelics themselves.




Why did you need to do psychedelics in order to live your life to the best of your ability? That is a very, very sober thought.


--------------------
Prisoner#1 said: I got my ass kicked by a 9yo when I was 17
Trippin? Click Me




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Invisiblejoemolloy
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: visionstream]
    #14153582 - 03/20/11 12:31 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Terence Mckenna liberally sprinkles his speculations and ideas with snippets of truth and clever insights.  However, in that mish mosh of ideas is a supremely superstitious man who became consumed with his experience.  I believe the more intelligent and intellectual a person is, the more susceptible they are into falling into never-ending hole that is the quest for psychedelic enlightenment.  Terence Mckenna, in my opinion, was casualty of his own insane mushroom and DMT webs. 


Quote:


How did you come upon the realization that its all BS? Do you, yourself have any sources that have lead you to start thinking in that way?
Thanks.




Unfortunately almost all of the psychedelic literature extols the experience as mystical, tranformitive, and important.  Websites like shroomery are dedicated to the lifestyle and then there is the anti-drug information.  Do you see the two extremes?

I started speaking with my mom about my experiences and what they meant.  Initially she was fascinated by what I told her.  Sometimes I'd call her at the peak of my deepest trips and she'd talk with me.  She started questioning my enlightenment trips, my grand connections, my cosmic speculations and so on.  She spoke sensibly to me, suggested logical and rational explanations for my thoughts, suggested I critically think about these ideas sober and pointed out flaws in my psychedelic logic.  She was a voice of reason to bridge two extremes of bullshit.  She's not anti-drugs, she's an old woman who is a genius and who made more sense to me than Mckenna, Strassman, et al.

I apply rational, critical, and logical thought to my psychedelic experiences now and I no longer have magical or mysterious trips.  I just have fun, euphoric trips.  Strange, huh?

These drugs just amplify.  When I was a kid and my friends and I would trip, NONE of us ever experienced any mystical or spiritual moments.  We never had any notion of that stuff because it was before the internet.  After the internet and the explosion of psychedelic lore, my trips "magically" and profoundly changed.  Hmmm, I wonder why.  It's just an amplifier of whatever bullshit is kicking around your head.


--------------------
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Offlinevisionstream
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: joemolloy]
    #14153637 - 03/20/11 12:41 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

joemolloy said:
Terence Mckenna liberally sprinkles his speculations and ideas with snippets of truth and clever insights.  However, in that mish mosh of ideas is a supremely superstitious man who became consumed with his experience.  I believe the more intelligent and intellectual a person is, the more susceptible they are into falling into never-ending hole that is the quest for psychedelic enlightenment.  Terence Mckenna, in my opinion, was casualty of his own insane mushroom and DMT webs. 


Quote:


How did you come upon the realization that its all BS? Do you, yourself have any sources that have lead you to start thinking in that way?
Thanks.




Unfortunately almost all of the psychedelic literature extols the experience as mystical, tranformitive, and important.  Websites like shroomery are dedicated to the lifestyle and then there is the anti-drug information.  Do you see the two extremes?

I started speaking with my mom about my experiences and what they meant.  Initially she was fascinated by what I told her.  Sometimes I'd call her at the peak of my deepest trips and she'd talk with me.  She started questioning my enlightenment trips, my grand connections, my cosmic speculations and so on.  She spoke sensibly to me, suggested logical and rational explanations for my thoughts, suggested I critically think about these ideas sober and pointed out flaws in my psychedelic logic.  She was a voice of reason to bridge two extremes of bullshit.  She's not anti-drugs, she's an old woman who is a genius and who made more sense to me than Mckenna, Strassman, et al.

I apply rational, critical, and logical thought to my psychedelic experiences now and I no longer have magical or mysterious trips.  I just have fun, euphoric trips.  Strange, huh?

These drugs just amplify.  When I was a kid and my friends and I would trip, NONE of us ever experienced any mystical or spiritual moments.  We never had any notion of that stuff because it was before the internet.  After the internet and the explosion of psychedelic lore, my trips "magically" and profoundly changed.  Hmmm, I wonder why.  It's just an amplifier of whatever bullshit is kicking around your head.




I love your knowledge and will def take some values away from it but of couse I have my own suspicions.
So would you argue that anyone who's lives or world views, daily perceptions or thought patterns have changed due to a psychedelic trip have some form of mental illness?


--------------------
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OfflineR2-D2
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: Anthony917]
    #14153686 - 03/20/11 12:49 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Anthony917 said:
Why did you need to do psychedelics in order to live your life to the best of your ability? That is a very, very sober thought.



I did not say this nor do I feel this way at all.

But what is logical thought? Srsly?
IME, the vast majority of any psychedelic experience is silly nonsense but there's always stuff to learn, both esoteric and very practical.
The psychedelic experience has changed how "I" interacts with "belief", which I judge to be a very good thing. hahahahaha

But yeah, it's definitely an amplification of whatever bullshit's in your head


--------------------


Edited by R2-D2 (03/20/11 12:51 PM)


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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: joemolloy]
    #14153722 - 03/20/11 12:56 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

to joemolloy:


The left hemisphere of my brain agrees, but my experiences of the last years strongly point in a different direction.
You seem to disregard the several healing effects these compounds have on the brain. I often had access to early childhood memories which i simply cannot access when sober. Not to mention the power to dissolve traumas and phobias. I had an strong arachnophobia when i was younger, after an trip where i would literally become an spider myself, i lost this phobia.

Also i am an creative person who draws alot and creates 3D stuff and animation. I often have creative blockades where i want to, but cannot push myself to actually be creative. When administer any psychedelic in this state it dissolves immediately and forces me into an state where i would go on until i break down due to tiredness. It completely changes into the opposite.
It gave me the strangest and greatest pictures i ve ever painted, brought forth from my deepest subconscious level, these images are completely different than the stuff i made when sober.

IMHO psychedelics can bring the best out of you, exactly like they can bring out the worst in an human being. If you don not bring something to the table, nothing special will happen, and if you strife for enlightenment, there should be something to be illuminated.


Edited by Ryusaki (03/20/11 12:57 PM)


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Invisiblejoemolloy
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: visionstream]
    #14153733 - 03/20/11 12:57 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:


I love your knowledge and will def take some values away from it but of couse I have my own suspicions.
So would you argue that anyone who's lives or world views, daily perceptions or thought patterns have changed due to a psychedelic trip have some form of mental illness?




That's a tough question.  I think that if someone falls into the trap that I did, it isn't healthy.


--------------------
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: joemolloy]
    #14153751 - 03/20/11 01:02 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

joemolloy said:
Terence Mckenna liberally sprinkles his speculations and ideas with snippets of truth and clever insights.  However, in that mish mosh of ideas is a supremely superstitious man who became consumed with his experience.  I believe the more intelligent and intellectual a person is, the more susceptible they are into falling into never-ending hole that is the quest for psychedelic enlightenment.  Terence Mckenna, in my opinion, was casualty of his own insane mushroom and DMT webs. 


Quote:


How did you come upon the realization that its all BS? Do you, yourself have any sources that have lead you to start thinking in that way?
Thanks.




Unfortunately almost all of the psychedelic literature extols the experience as mystical, tranformitive, and important.  Websites like shroomery are dedicated to the lifestyle and then there is the anti-drug information.  Do you see the two extremes?

I started speaking with my mom about my experiences and what they meant.  Initially she was fascinated by what I told her.  Sometimes I'd call her at the peak of my deepest trips and she'd talk with me.  She started questioning my enlightenment trips, my grand connections, my cosmic speculations and so on.  She spoke sensibly to me, suggested logical and rational explanations for my thoughts, suggested I critically think about these ideas sober and pointed out flaws in my psychedelic logic.  She was a voice of reason to bridge two extremes of bullshit.  She's not anti-drugs, she's an old woman who is a genius and who made more sense to me than Mckenna, Strassman, et al.

I apply rational, critical, and logical thought to my psychedelic experiences now and I no longer have magical or mysterious trips.  I just have fun, euphoric trips.  Strange, huh?

These drugs just amplify.  When I was a kid and my friends and I would trip, NONE of us ever experienced any mystical or spiritual moments.  We never had any notion of that stuff because it was before the internet.  After the internet and the explosion of psychedelic lore, my trips "magically" and profoundly changed.  Hmmm, I wonder why.  It's just an amplifier of whatever bullshit is kicking around your head.




Reality truly doesn't make any sense, at least from a human's perspective. Hence the reason for science, religion, philosophy and love. All is subjective. Just because one thing is unreal to one person, does not make it unreal for all people.

For example, I have seen an Italian man in Italy, and actually met him. Now, you can say that he doesn't exist because you've never see/heard of/met him or you can remind yourself that even though you've only heard of the concept of this guy, he very well could exist in the subjective experience of my consciousness.


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Invisiblejoemolloy
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: Ryusaki]
    #14153753 - 03/20/11 01:02 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Ryusaki said:
to joemolloy:


The left hemisphere of my brain agrees, but my experiences of the last years strongly point in a different direction.
You seem to disregard the several healing effects these compounds have on the brain. I often had access to early childhood memories which i simply cannot access when sober. Not to mention the power to dissolve traumas and phobias. I had an strong arachnophobia when i was younger, after an trip where i would literally become an spider myself, i lost this phobia.

Also i am an creative person who draws alot and creates 3D stuff and animation. I often have creative blockades where i want to, but cannot push myself to actually be creative. When administer any psychedelic in this state it dissolves immediately and forces me into an state where i would go on until i break down due to tiredness. It completely changes into the opposite.
It gave me the strangest and greatest pictures i ve ever painted, brought forth from my deepest subconscious level, these images are completely different than the stuff i made when sober.

IMHO psychedelics can bring the best out of you, exactly like they can bring out the worst in an human being. If you don not bring something to the table, nothing special will happen, and if you strife for enlightenment, there should be something to be illuminated.





Your post resonates with me.  It's a powerful argument that you make.  I had similar feelings and drew the same conclusions as you before I called bullshit.  I now think I was lying to myself the whole time to justify taking these drugs.  I'm not saying you are, but I was.  I still think you can be just as creative, access the same memories, and conquer the same fears without psychedelics.  It's becoming a circular argument though and if you don't see any negative effects, then I hope you continue to grow as a person.  Good luck to you.


--------------------
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Offlinevisionstream
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: joemolloy]
    #14153762 - 03/20/11 01:03 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

joemolloy said:
Quote:


I love your knowledge and will def take some values away from it but of couse I have my own suspicions.
So would you argue that anyone who's lives or world views, daily perceptions or thought patterns have changed due to a psychedelic trip have some form of mental illness?




That's a tough question.  I think that if someone falls into the trap that I did, it isn't healthy.



Hmmm. An even tougher question then would be...what about meditation?
Meditation is done soberly (usually) and is linked with that of a psychedelic trip. Visuals even appear (CEVs). So one may argue that it is indeed normal, natural...or of our own chemistry to do psychedelics and if that is so...might there be a reason? And that its all not just BS.


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Invisiblejoemolloy
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: visionstream]
    #14153824 - 03/20/11 01:17 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I have no experience with meditation, so I hesitate to venture a guess as to its effects.


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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: joemolloy] * 1
    #14154312 - 03/20/11 02:48 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Psychedelics can only reveal to you what your subconscious knows. That's why they aren't going to reveal you the mystery's of the universe or anything for that matter. In the same way a dream can remind you of something you haven't put too much conscious thought into, a psychedelic can expose those feelings and ideas. To me, Terrance McKenna seems like someone who couldn't integrate their trips. If I have a dream that my grandma is all alone being attacked by aliens maybe I'd wake up and realize damn, I don't visit her often enough, she's all alone. McKenna would be like "jesus christ there's aliens".


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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: jellyfish]
    #14154323 - 03/20/11 02:52 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

EDIT: Fuck it, I'm not even gonna touch that.


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Offlinetokinman21
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: jellyfish]
    #14154345 - 03/20/11 02:56 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

People underestimate their abilities to fuck with themselves.  So much of your experience as a human being is what you perceive it to be.  If you freak out and think about it constantly you are going to trick yourself into thinking you are seeing things you aren't, or you will just put yourself into a pattern of "trippy" thoughts.  Do your best to take your mind off it and it will go away with a little bit of time, I don't think five trips in 3 months should be enough to be permanently detrimental to your health, by any means.


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OfflineAzure Essence
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: tokinman21]
    #14154359 - 03/20/11 02:58 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Yeah I was gonna target that too.

If you are obsessed with not having any meaning in your trip, and it's all bullshit, then you will have a bullshit trip.

I cant possibly concieve why anyone would want something so utterly pointless(of you own choosing no less)


Edited by Azure Essence (03/20/11 04:29 PM)


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OfflineMoxyOx
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: joemolloy]
    #14154363 - 03/20/11 02:59 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Meditation, drugs, exercise, different diets and most importantly different people will bring about altered states of consciousness. Everything you "consume" through your senses will affect you one way or another. Psychedelics themselves are not an end all be all to the grand mysteries of life. That quest we're all on starts at birth.

If anything, all psychedelics do is tear you up and bit and create a torrent for new energies and thoughts to be established. I personally don't like doing the old method of tripping and sitting around doing nothing but taking more drugs... that's so utterly bland. Exercising on psychedelics or doing anything physical is a great way to get in touch with your body, and you become so much more attuned to the sensations flowing through you.


--------------------
No one behind, no one ahead.
The path the ancients cleared has closed.
And the other path, everyone's path,
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OfflineComradez
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: MoxyOx]
    #14154482 - 03/20/11 03:24 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I had one of those trips just the other day where I think to myself during the trip, "What utter bullshit this all is!  The only useful things I'm learning are only things that are applicable within the tripping state itself.  It is a closed, self-justifying loop!"  I reflected on how my hopes for psychedelics as transformative agents of our culture and society had been disillusioned by the fact that the trip really didn't change me or my brother at all.  The next day, we were the same exact people, with the same exact hangups. 

Now, I have indeed had transformative trips, where I've changed my outlook for the better or come to peace with something in life, where I will be glowing with happiness and contentment and confidence and motivation for weeks afterwards, but I've realized that you need to already want to transform in order for it to work.  Psychedelics are great and sometimes magnificent, but they really only unleash the potential that is already within you. 

In any case, the fact that psychedelic trips sometimes produce profound skepticism about themselves as I am experiencing them actually makes me respect them even more, in hindsight.  If one were to "personify" drugs with human personalities, then psychedelics would not be like a needy, insecure girlfriend whom you always have to talk to on the phone and reassure that she is pretty and good and whatnot.  Psychedelics don't say, "We are nothing but truth and light.  Take us!  More!  More!  More!"  Psychedelics could care less what we mortals do with them.  They, as it were, have their own mysterious, disinterested agenda.  We are just along for the ride.  (Now, I'm not saying that they are sentient or anything.  I'm just being metaphorical).  Whereas something like cocaine will lie and say, "I am nothing but good, c'mon, c'mon!  Take more of me!  Take more of me!  Totally buy into what I have to offer more and more and more!"

Joemolloy, the fact that you were able to come to such a conclusion should be partly to the credit of psychedelics that they allow the thoughtful mind the freedom to do so.  What's less than optimal is when they encounter unthoughtful minds.  There lies the way to stuff like 2012 bullshit (of which Mckenna was also somewhat guilty, although I am willing to overlook that stuff for the sake of considering his other, much more skeptical and thoughtful stuff).


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Offlinelovinlife88
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: Anthony917]
    #14154792 - 03/20/11 04:39 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Anthony917 said:
I use psychedelics because I like the state of mind it puts me in. I like the visual distortion, the colors, the intense closed eye visuals on high doses...even ego death can be an enjoyable experience.





Amen


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OfflineThePsyche
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: visionstream]
    #14154840 - 03/20/11 04:51 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Sounds pretty trippy, bro.

As first, I must say, your "terrible" trip with salvia probably wasn't terrible. Salvia trips at it's highest will peak only for around 10 minutes... the whole high less than 30.

Try having a bad trip on Acid, that's eight hours of goblins and skeletons.

Let things come natural for you. Don't do too much thinking about your next trips.


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Invisiblejoemolloy
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: Azure Essence]
    #14155286 - 03/20/11 06:26 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Azure Essence said:
Yeah I was gonna target that too.

If you are obsessed with not having any meaning in your trip, and it's all bullshit, then you will have a bullshit trip.

I cant possibly concieve why anyone would want something so utterly pointless(of you own choosing no less)




When I was deep into psychedelic magic and lore, my trips would bring on delusional states.  One time I was convinced that a MHRB vendor created this whole forum with the intent of getting me to buy large quantities of root bark from him.  I believed he made every post on the boards to entice and fool me.  It was just an elaborate two way conversation to get my money.  I was convinced.  Another time I thought a rock star and my girl friend from high school had sex with each other and I was their child.  Another time I was sure that God crashed my trip in my living room and was speaking with me through the music on my laptop.  Another time I morphed from a slave crawling in the Egyptian desert into the sphinx. 

Care to tell me any of these were less than pure, unadulterated bullshit?  To treat them as anything more than nonsense would be like jerking off to internet porn and convincing myself that I really fucked her.


--------------------
Don't PM me with bullshit.  I don't sell or trade cactus and I don't know where you can get any, other than your mother's ass.


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OfflineR2-D2
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: joemolloy]
    #14155588 - 03/20/11 07:22 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Do you think there might be things to learn within all those extravagant happenings?


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Invisiblejoemolloy
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: R2-D2]
    #14156006 - 03/20/11 08:38 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

In the past I have stretched my imagination to find tenuous connections, created metaphorical interpretations, and utilized dream analysis strategies to learn something about my trips, to integrate.  Unfortunately, I find the results of such a process counterproductive, un-enlightening, and leading me around in nonsensical Terence Mckenna type circles.  I don't think my trips have any substantive value to them other than a WTF rollercoaster ride.


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Offlinevisionstream
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: joemolloy]
    #14156148 - 03/20/11 08:58 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

joemolloy said:
Quote:

Azure Essence said:
Yeah I was gonna target that too.

If you are obsessed with not having any meaning in your trip, and it's all bullshit, then you will have a bullshit trip.

I cant possibly concieve why anyone would want something so utterly pointless(of you own choosing no less)




When I was deep into psychedelic magic and lore, my trips would bring on delusional states.  One time I was convinced that a MHRB vendor created this whole forum with the intent of getting me to buy large quantities of root bark from him.  I believed he made every post on the boards to entice and fool me.  It was just an elaborate two way conversation to get my money.  I was convinced.  Another time I thought a rock star and my girl friend from high school had sex with each other and I was their child.  Another time I was sure that God crashed my trip in my living room and was speaking with me through the music on my laptop.  Another time I morphed from a slave crawling in the Egyptian desert into the sphinx. 

Care to tell me any of these were less than pure, unadulterated bullshit?  To treat them as anything more than nonsense would be like jerking off to internet porn and convincing myself that I really fucked her.



Hmm...well first off it sounds like most, if not all of your trips were fairly high doses. I have never been delusional on shrooms, only salvia. Secondly, it seems that you trip most of the time in the comfort of your home, on the computer perhaps...All of my trips have been in nature and thus, i am surrounded by life...when I notice this the trips always take spiritual turns and i start to gain knowledge that seems of significance. I take small lessons away from each shroom trip but most of the amazing one-consciousness feeling will fade as I come down. Giving the differences in our circumstances I think that we view trips very differently and therefore may not agree on whether or not anything is learned or that it is all BS. I would need to talk with someone that could relate to me.
I have always been a human on shrooms. I just felt part of something much bigger.


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OfflineSubconscious
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: joemolloy]
    #14156184 - 03/20/11 09:02 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I think a lot of the psychedelic experience is "bullshit" in the end as well, but it still can be somewhat useful.

The one thing I've really "learned" by experiencing first hand is how fragile the human mind can be. I find it amazing that adding a few chemicals to your brain chemistry can completely change your perception of reality.

There are a lot of ideas and concepts that you can discover without psychedelics... but psychedelics actually make you "feel" the ideas. For example, I always felt my life and this entire planet were insignificant in the grand scheme of the universe... but staring into the night sky under the influence of psychedelics really makes you "feel" that thought in a way that's hard to put into words. I think for some people these feelings help make them more disillusioned, but I've found it to be useful personally.


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OfflineSmokedShroom
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: Ryusaki]
    #14156818 - 03/20/11 10:33 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:



I use psychedelics because I like the state of mind it puts me in. I like the visual distortion, the colors, the intense closed eye visuals on high doses...even ego death can be an enjoyable experience.




:awesomenod:
Quote:

Ryusaki said:
to joemolloy:


I often had access to early childhood memories which i simply cannot access when sober. Not to mention the power to dissolve traumas and phobias. I had a strong phobia when i was younger, after a trip , i lost this phobia.
I often have creative blockades where i want to, but cannot push myself to actually be creative. When administer any psychedelic in this state it dissolves immediately and forces me into an state where i would go on until i break down due to tiredness. It completely changes into the opposite.
It gave me the strangest and greatest pictures i ve ever painted, brought forth from my deepest subconscious level, these images are completely different than the stuff i made when sober.

IMHO psychedelics can bring the best out of you,




Same here, no drawing blockages on shrooms whatsoever, except when I'm too fucked up to move the pencil ofcourse. I think phycs are very useful as a part of living and enjoying life and breaking down mental barriers. But thats where it ends.


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OfflinePrimalSoup
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: visionstream]
    #14156989 - 03/20/11 11:04 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

There is no "meaning", there are no "epiphanies", and there is no "enlightenment" either - until you finally see it.  And then the rest is all simply laughable, so enjoy the journey. :grin:

Useful drugs?  Absolutely.  Scary?  Sometimes.  Incredible?  Often.  Irreplaceable? Yes. They can show you things you never would have imagined without tripping. But what happens afterwards is that your ego comes along and takes credit for everything that happened, like usual. :zombie6:  Sad fact until you get past it.

OP, don't worry about the frequency.  First, it's self limiting, and second, it can't hurt you.  However, you do have to go through the crap to get to get to the good stuff.

@joemolloy:
Quote:

When I was deep into psychedelic magic and lore, my trips would bring on delusional states.  One time I was convinced that a MHRB vendor created this whole forum with the intent of getting me to buy large quantities of root bark from him.  I believed he made every post on the boards to entice and fool me.  It was just an elaborate two way conversation to get my money.  I was convinced.  Another time I thought a rock star and my girl friend from high school had sex with each other and I was their child.  Another time I was sure that God crashed my trip in my living room and was speaking with me through the music on my laptop.  Another time I morphed from a slave crawling in the Egyptian desert into the sphinx.




:ilold:  Dude, sometimes a trip is just a trip!  Those were choice!

Don't want to say more, so :peace:PS


--------------------

if you stand too close to the machine it'll start to eat you
Primal's simple tested teks and projects: :awesomenod: Wheat Prep 2.0  Acidic Tea Tek  Potency Project! 


Edited by PrimalSoup (03/20/11 11:09 PM)


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Offlinesamhandwich
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: PrimalSoup]
    #14157249 - 03/21/11 12:12 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I sometimes get worried that I did go batshit crazy from psychedelics, especially when I'm high.  In reality, I always thought I was an awkward kid throughout high school, but sometimes I fear psychedelics further alienated me from the rest of society.


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OfflineOuija
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: samhandwich]
    #14157257 - 03/21/11 12:15 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)





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Invisiblefarmer88
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: joemolloy]
    #14157580 - 03/21/11 01:48 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Enjoyed the debate Joe.  Why do you now visit this site?


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InvisibleCakk
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: farmer88]
    #14157590 - 03/21/11 01:51 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

When you run out of money.

But really if it starts becoming something you do for a fun activity only instead of using them to find(explore) more about yourself and the world around you.


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InvisibleLuman
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: Subconscious]
    #14157630 - 03/21/11 02:00 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Subconscious said:
I think a lot of the psychedelic experience is "bullshit" in the end as well, but it still can be somewhat useful.





I think it depends on what your looking for/expect.  I have also found it to be more than "somewhat useful", but that's just me.


--------------------
"The soul?  Here we have no use for such frivolities."


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OfflineJoolz
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: Luman]
    #14157861 - 03/21/11 03:29 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I live in the now, therefore I will do what pleases me now, and psychedelics please me now. If or when they do not in the future, I will then change my situation, be that as it may.

Now, health concerns? There's plenty of time to stop and say "wow, this is overboard." Generally, I don't approve of anything over a normal dosage, with very steady increase or maybe one hit of acid more at a concert just because its a concert. I understand people take more than just one or two hits of acid at a time (I'm one of them). I really feel like you should just know when overboard is :shrug:, but maybe that's just me. I also think you should know your substance, use moderation, and take tolerance breaks if need be.


--------------------
Prohibition didn't work for God; Eve ate the fruit.


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OfflineComradez
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: Joolz]
    #14158107 - 03/21/11 06:29 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

A while ago my friend and I were tripping on 3.5 grams.  We had been looking into all this mystical psychedelic shit beforehand, but when we got into the trip (at least, that one) it turned out to be the most delirious, manic, ridiculous affair ever--that, for about an hour, consisted of the most ridiculous quasi-telepathic word-salad conversation ever.  At one point I was, perhaps in not so many coherent words, thinking to myself while laughing hysterically, "THIS is supposed to be a religious experience?  Yeah right!  What kind of a religion is THIS?!"  But all that came out was, "RELIGION????!!!!"  And my friend knew exactly what I was talking about.  A conversation like this, with single words communicating complete thoughts, uttered hysterically in between gasps for breath while laughing our asses of, went on for like an hour.  It was awesome.

By the same token, I have had very gentle and introspective and quasi-mystical, almost very "feminine" trips with my guy friends...like, if you can imagine what the "Lifetime channel" version of tripping would be like.  It all depends.

A lesson I came to a while ago was that psychedelics are oftentimes actually the ultimate ego-booster, in a sense.  Sure, during the experience itself they might destroy your ego, but afterwards you think to yourself, "Damn, I just experienced ego-death and lived to tell the tale."  And one feels a certain validation of one's strength from this and a certain sense of confidence.  At least I do.  And, moreover, I don't necessarily think that this is a bad thing.  I feel like it is a basis for self-esteem that doesn't require putting others down or being defensive, which is better than a lot of possible bases for self-esteem.  If adults who made themselves feel better about themselves by gloating over their high status or material wealth compared to others could successfully trip on psychedelics, they could affirm their strength and self-confidence without playing the harmful zero-sum games that society has for self-esteem.  What I like about the ego-boosting of psychedelics is that it is not a zero-sum game.  When you trip, you feel a certain achievement about yourself afterwards, but you also have a solemn respect for others who have also taken the quest.


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Invisiblejoemolloy
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: farmer88]
    #14158236 - 03/21/11 07:49 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

farmer88 said:
Enjoyed the debate Joe.  Why do you now visit this site?





I trip mostly on cactus now and I'll smoke changa on occasion. I still love these drugs, just in a different way.  It's strange when smoking DMT, no matter how deep the trip I get an overwhelming feeling that its a cheap rollercoaster ride, a self indulgent empty thrill.  Its interesting how even DMT, the most powerful psychedelic, is so drastically altered by mindset.  When I compare my recent trips with previous ones, it feels like I am taking a different drug altogether because I am no longer open to its mysticism.  I rarely do DMT anymore. 

This site is important to me because I don't know any drug users in real life and this place provides me with an important outlet to share my thoughts, bullshit with other like minded individuals, and read how others live this lifestyle.


--------------------
Don't PM me with bullshit.  I don't sell or trade cactus and I don't know where you can get any, other than your mother's ass.


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OfflineRugged Obscure
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: visionstream]
    #14316321 - 04/19/11 09:47 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

visionstream said:
Quote:

joemolloy said:
I can give you my experience with psychedelics.  When I first started tripping, I believed these drugs gave me access to alternate realities such as the subatomic world, the lives of plants, cosmic consciousness, the experience of infinity, glimpses of life after death, life before death, life beyond life and Buddhist type enlightenment.  I was convinced that these drugs were vital to understanding the universe and my place in it.  I couldn't understand how governments weren't actively studying these drugs, why scientists generally ignored them, and why DMT wasn't a monetary currency in the world market.  I'd spend much of my sober time trying to unravel the mysteries of the experience, studying my notes, listening to my audio-recordings of my trips, reading psychedelic literature, and participating in forums with like-minded thinkers.

Finally I arrived at an epiphany, probably the most powerful idea I'd ever encountered.  The experience is bullshit.  There is nothing substantive there, nothing that can deepen any understanding of anything.  This shit just confuses and obscures and points in random directions.  None of the existential questions that I have can ever be answered, have ever been answered, nor will be answered during my stay on earth.

These drugs are jerking off and masturbation.  Treating them as anything more than that was bad for my mental health.

Of course, your experience and interpretation may differ dramatically from mine and I hope you find peace.




I see your point of view, but beg to differ at the same time.
Each person creates their own reality and everyone reality differs from one another even if its only about 1 opinion on a small subject.
If these chemicals can show me that the human-culture and greed oriented perception is not the only one then I think there is more to learn. I don't think I will find all the answers either. The mind is as vast or more vast and just as in-understandable as the external universe. I see what your saying but I don't think that the typical human celebrity worshiping, money driven culture is what humans truly want. I think love is a powerful force and psychedelics offer a few things we can learn from, no?




No, not really. I think you're getting way ahead of yourself. I mean if psychedelics are the only way you think you can see life differently from a commercial viewpoint, then you need to do a lot of learning and forget about psychedelics. Drugs are about having fun.
And 3.5gs (1/8 ounce) is a normal dose on shrooms.
And you really can't expect to go on the internet and have people figure out your life for you. You have to watch yourself. If you feel drugs are changing your life for the worse, then stop. It shouldn't be hard to tell.
Especially if your eyes have been opened up so wide:tongue::tongue2:


--------------------
It wouldn't be hell if we could burn there. :stoned:


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Offlinezgbzgb1
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: visionstream]
    #14316355 - 04/19/11 09:56 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Nothing wrong as long as you arent hurting yourself or anyone else.


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OfflineRugged Obscure
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: Comradez]
    #14316385 - 04/19/11 10:03 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Comradez said:
A while ago my friend and I were tripping on 3.5 grams.  We had been looking into all this mystical psychedelic shit beforehand, but when we got into the trip (at least, that one) it turned out to be the most delirious, manic, ridiculous affair ever--that, for about an hour, consisted of the most ridiculous quasi-telepathic word-salad conversation ever.  At one point I was, perhaps in not so many coherent words, thinking to myself while laughing hysterically, "THIS is supposed to be a religious experience?  Yeah right!  What kind of a religion is THIS?!"  But all that came out was, "RELIGION????!!!!"  And my friend knew exactly what I was talking about.  A conversation like this, with single words communicating complete thoughts, uttered hysterically in between gasps for breath while laughing our asses of, went on for like an hour.  It was awesome.




lmao. Let's trip. Lucy, on me.
Btw I totally agree. Each time I did sid it was like this
pseudo-desire to be reflective was trying to force itself on me, and all I could think was "Get away from me you corny fuck"


--------------------
It wouldn't be hell if we could burn there. :stoned:


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OfflineRugged Obscure
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: jellyfish]
    #14316442 - 04/19/11 10:17 AM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

jellyfish said:
Psychedelics can only reveal to you what your subconscious knows. That's why they aren't going to reveal you the mystery's of the universe or anything for that matter. In the same way a dream can remind you of something you haven't put too much conscious thought into, a psychedelic can expose those feelings and ideas. To me, Terrance McKenna seems like someone who couldn't integrate their trips. If I have a dream that my grandma is all alone being attacked by aliens maybe I'd wake up and realize damn, I don't visit her often enough, she's all alone. McKenna would be like "jesus christ there's aliens".



Rofl
Again, totally agree with this. If anything, psychedelics do what most people are too lazy to do, or just are too distracted to do. That doesn't mean they should be used for this


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It wouldn't be hell if we could burn there. :stoned:


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OfflinePrimalSoup
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: visionstream]
    #14317267 - 04/19/11 12:54 PM (12 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

When is going overboard of psychedelics?




I'll let you know when I get there. :laugh2:

:peace:PS


--------------------

if you stand too close to the machine it'll start to eat you
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OfflineLittleDaddy
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: visionstream]
    #19200293 - 11/28/13 11:12 AM (10 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

visionstream said:
Each person creates their own reality and everyone reality differs from one another even if its only about 1 opinion on a small subject.
If these chemicals can show me that the human-culture and greed oriented perception is not the only one then I think there is more to learn. I don't think I will find all the answers either. The mind is as vast or more vast and just as in-understandable as the external universe. I see what your saying but I don't think that the typical human celebrity worshiping, money driven culture is what humans truly want. I think love is a powerful force and psychedelics offer a few things we can learn from, no?




I wouldn't say each person has their own "reality" per say, but that people have their individual perspectives of reality. These substances can really show you a different view, but at the same time, you have to be conscious to find what is right and what is not from these chemicals. They aren't enlightenment packed into a mushroom or a blotter, to my dismay. Your mind craves enlightenment and you can fulfill that without these substances just through getting to know yourself and meditation is one of the best ways to do so.


--------------------
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Put the heathen's back upon the wall.


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OfflineDirtyTomFlint
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Re: When is going overboard of psychedelics? [Re: LittleDaddy]
    #19200580 - 11/28/13 12:25 PM (10 years, 2 months ago)

The thing about mushrooms is, is that it shows you LIFE. In life there is good, bad, and very bad things. It's a spiritual learning experience!

You don't seem to be taking particularly high doses and you just seem very eager about the subject. That's a good start.


--------------------




Know Your Body, Know Your Mind, Know Your Substance, Know Your Source


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