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sajahand
just me

Registered: 03/16/11
Posts: 62
Loc: minnesota
Last seen: 12 years, 10 months
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should steroids be ok in professional sports....
#14135798 - 03/17/11 09:04 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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do you think that the pro-sports should allow the use of steroids for the amusement of the fans? do you think it would be more competitive and interesting to watch? i love hockey, and think it would give me a giggle if some players would just wig out on each other more. yes i understand that they (steroids) are dangerous, but so is driving a car drunk, and eating at mac & dons in my town.
-------------------- diggin life
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Poid
Shroomery's #1 Spellir




Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 40,372
Loc: SF Bay Area
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: sajahand]
#14135814 - 03/17/11 09:10 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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They should have Steroids Olympics.
-------------------- Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylan  fireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
Edited by Poid (03/17/11 09:30 AM)
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Eminence



Registered: 07/25/10
Posts: 16,623
Loc: Richmond, VA
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: sajahand]
#14135831 - 03/17/11 09:13 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Steroids aren't as dangerous as you might think. They can be used responsibly with little risk. And "roid rage" is a myth. People may get mood swings after they end a cycle if they do it wrong and fuck up their male/female hormone (testosterone/estrogen) balance. But on cycle, pumping in testosterone greatly improves your mood.
Anyway, I see no problem in it. If it was a matter of choice, it would be fair as long as anyone could have the choice to use them, and yeah fans will have a better show if they were allowed.
I'd like to see steroid use in UFC
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sajahand
just me

Registered: 03/16/11
Posts: 62
Loc: minnesota
Last seen: 12 years, 10 months
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Poid]
#14135835 - 03/17/11 09:14 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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not politically correct, but steroid special olympics?
-------------------- diggin life
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Poid
Shroomery's #1 Spellir




Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 40,372
Loc: SF Bay Area
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: sajahand]
#14135875 - 03/17/11 09:28 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Steroids Special Paralympics would be cooler.
-------------------- Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylan  fireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
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marbletulip
Stranger



Registered: 04/13/06
Posts: 162
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Poid]
#14135910 - 03/17/11 09:39 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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I've said for years they need an all steroid MLB. Do away with the pitcher and use a machine. Also use aluminum bats and play on golf courses because everyone is going to be hitting dingers.
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danlennon3
LivingIsEasyWithEyesClosed.....



Registered: 10/29/02
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Loc: usa
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: marbletulip]
#14135947 - 03/17/11 09:49 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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What would you guys think of mental steroids?
-------------------- "Psychedelics should be used not to escape reality, but to embrace it"
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Poid
Shroomery's #1 Spellir




Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 40,372
Loc: SF Bay Area
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: danlennon3]
#14135954 - 03/17/11 09:51 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Never heard of 'em.
-------------------- Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylan  fireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
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1EyeCries
Paper Weight



Registered: 07/21/10
Posts: 1,626
Loc: Earth
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Eminence]
#14135964 - 03/17/11 09:54 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
frylock91 said: Steroids aren't as dangerous as you might think. They can be used responsibly with little risk. And "roid rage" is a myth. People may get mood swings after they end a cycle if they do it wrong and fuck up their male/female hormone (testosterone/estrogen) balance. But on cycle, pumping in testosterone greatly improves your mood.
Anyway, I see no problem in it. If it was a matter of choice, it would be fair as long as anyone could have the choice to use them, and yeah fans will have a better show if they were allowed.
I'd like to see steroid use in UFC 
dude . . . steroids are very dangerous, i was on themto control a medical condition not predisone, but dexamethasone, for people with brain tumors and going through chemotherapy
the skin under my arms, across my stomach, and the insides of my thighs broke down and split because of drastic hormone changes and rapid weight gain (40 lbs in about a month and a half) i know have massive scars all over my body
i lost all the hair on my legs, and it destroyed my hips, steroids actually killed the bone in my joints by shrinking blood vessels and causing tissue to die, and now have to have both hips totally replaced
and roid rage is not a myth by anymeans, it messes with hormones and other gland secretions and makes some people very aggressive and violent
you are correct about enhancing mood, but just as much as they can bring it up, they can take you down just as far
though i was not on muscle building steroids, both medical and muscle building steroids sahre some same benefits and potentially dangerous side effects
AO
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Poid
Shroomery's #1 Spellir




Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 40,372
Loc: SF Bay Area
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: 1EyeCries] 1
#14135968 - 03/17/11 09:57 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
AgentOrange4120 said: and roid rage is not a myth by anymeans, it messes with hormones and other gland secretions and makes some people very aggressive and violent
-------------------- Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylan  fireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
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1EyeCries
Paper Weight



Registered: 07/21/10
Posts: 1,626
Loc: Earth
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: marbletulip] 1
#14135970 - 03/17/11 09:57 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
marbletulip said: I've said for years they need an all steroid MLB. Do away with the pitcher and use a machine. Also use aluminum bats and play on golf courses because everyone is going to be hitting dingers.
thats a fucking killer idea, id watch that over todays baseball any day, full contact on the bases though
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Eminence



Registered: 07/25/10
Posts: 16,623
Loc: Richmond, VA
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: 1EyeCries]
#14135992 - 03/17/11 10:08 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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I've done a few cycles. I've read extensively before trying them, and have never had any serious problems, I've gotten check ups after the cycles and I was fine. I agree they have potential to be unnhealthy, but they can be used with minimal side effects. Anabolic steroids actually increase bone density and strengthen tendons, some types can have negative effects on tendons though, but the majority of them can help them.
But I misworded I suppose..technically roid rage isn't myth, as in, steroids can have a negative impact on mood and cause anger spouts, but as I said, this is due to misuse of them, it isn't hard to use them correctly. But again, the mood swings really come from stopping the steroids in an improper fashion and leaving your hormones neglected once the cycle is over.
This isn't known to happen while on steroids though. I've known people who have made these mistakes and the closest thing they got to roid rage was being more irritable and maybe having an attitude with people, none went around smashing things and screaming at people.
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myco99
myconade



Registered: 09/24/09
Posts: 1,001
Loc: USS Eldridge
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: 1EyeCries] 1
#14135996 - 03/17/11 10:09 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Roid rage is certainly no myth, I've seen it myself multiple times from the novice user to true roidheads.
In any event, I think we need a division of leagues in all major sports: 1 for juicers and 1 for non juicers. This way, we can see both the natural limits of human athleticism and huge freaks crushing balls over fences, throwing 100 yard in air touchdowns, etc...
-------------------- 143/0x63/99...It's like watching the mycelium grow... WARNING: You must be 21 years of age to experience hallucinations.
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Eminence



Registered: 07/25/10
Posts: 16,623
Loc: Richmond, VA
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: myco99]
#14136004 - 03/17/11 10:12 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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I wonder why steroid experts and famous steroid users that have been using for many years also say that roid rage isn't a true happening then.
Idk what those guys were doing wrong for sure, but I felt great the whole time. Again, they must have fucked up their PCT and ruined their hormones in the end or something, because with that amount of testosterone going through them they should be in great moods.
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myco99
myconade



Registered: 09/24/09
Posts: 1,001
Loc: USS Eldridge
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Eminence] 1
#14136008 - 03/17/11 10:14 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
frylock91 said: I wonder why steroid experts and famous steroid users that have been using for many years also say that roid rage isn't a true happening then.
For the same reason Charlie Sheen is WINNING. Denial.
-------------------- 143/0x63/99...It's like watching the mycelium grow... WARNING: You must be 21 years of age to experience hallucinations.
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Eminence



Registered: 07/25/10
Posts: 16,623
Loc: Richmond, VA
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: myco99]
#14136015 - 03/17/11 10:15 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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No, those same people admit to all the other side effects they can have, most of which are more of a cause for concern than having a temper.
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Mello Kitty
Beautiful Burnout



Registered: 12/04/08
Posts: 8,556
Loc: Sanriotown, Harmonyland
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: sajahand]
#14136064 - 03/17/11 10:31 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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i do not like sports at all but steroids would make things way more interesting
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twighead
mͯó



Registered: 08/27/08
Posts: 29,562
Loc: Glenn Gould's Fuck Windmill
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Mello Kitty]
#14136155 - 03/17/11 10:53 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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DXMball league would be much more entertaining
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4runner


Registered: 07/16/10
Posts: 15,406
Loc: State of Jefferson
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: twighead]
#14136208 - 03/17/11 11:08 AM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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I say let em do it, they are just athletes that want to compete and make a buck while getting famous for are amusement.
for everyone.
I would think that if there is a split league, who would watch the naturals.
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Hakim0777
aka RACKBONE!!!




Registered: 08/25/06
Posts: 8,071
Loc: PNW
Last seen: 1 year, 3 months
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Poid]
#14136426 - 03/17/11 12:06 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
Poid said:
Quote:
AgentOrange4120 said: and roid rage is not a myth by anymeans, it messes with hormones and other gland secretions and makes some people very aggressive and violent

/thread
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Poid
Shroomery's #1 Spellir




Registered: 02/04/08
Posts: 40,372
Loc: SF Bay Area
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Hakim0777]
#14136444 - 03/17/11 12:09 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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, I actually just read that the murder/suicide was found to not be fueled by "roid-rage":
Chris Benoit - Wikipedia
Quote:
Benoit was found to have Xanax, hydrocodone, and an elevated level of testosterone, caused by a synthetic form of the hormone, in his system. The chief medical examiner attributed the testosterone level to Benoit possibly being treated for a deficiency caused by previous steroid abuse or testicular insufficiency. There was no indication that anything in Benoit's body contributed to his violent behavior that led to the murder-suicide, concluding that there was no "roid-rage" involved.
-------------------- Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylan  fireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
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sajahand
just me

Registered: 03/16/11
Posts: 62
Loc: minnesota
Last seen: 12 years, 10 months
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Eminence]
#14137650 - 03/17/11 04:31 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
frylock91 said: I wonder why steroid experts and famous steroid users that have been using for many years also say that roid rage isn't a true happening then.
Idk what those guys were doing wrong for sure, but I felt great the whole time. Again, they must have fucked up their PCT and ruined their hormones in the end or something, because with that amount of testosterone going through them they should be in great moods.
i have MS and the infusions they gave me were a cocktail of steroids. it fucked me up. i gained 30 lbs in 6 weeks of treatment and felt horrible, moon faced and hypersensitivity to everything. muscles sore, and tired all the time. it sucked huge donkey dork. but regulated is sorta more what i was thinkin.
-------------------- diggin life
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Frost
Inside a locked room


Registered: 02/24/07
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: sajahand]
#14137666 - 03/17/11 04:34 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Yes, especially mixed martial arts. I want to see fucking giant freaks go to war in the cage. Fill em up with all kinds of good shit, whatever entertains me.
-------------------- “I have lived on the lip of insanity, wanting to know reasons, knocking on a door. It opens. I've been knocking from the inside.” - Rumi “The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.” - Carl Sagan
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joshstins420
Youre pretty good


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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Frost]
#14137735 - 03/17/11 04:45 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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fuck roids the only reason people use roids is because they are insecure about themselves so they cheat fuck roids
"steroids are for faggots" -bas rutten
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Eminence



Registered: 07/25/10
Posts: 16,623
Loc: Richmond, VA
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: joshstins420]
#14137990 - 03/17/11 05:21 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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No, if that were the case that would mean people who simply exercise are insecure, but that's not how it is.
Steroids are for people who want badly to get to their goals but are impatient about it, or people who have hit their genetic plateau and want something to push them further than they can get naturally, nothing more.
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Eminence



Registered: 07/25/10
Posts: 16,623
Loc: Richmond, VA
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: sajahand]
#14138043 - 03/17/11 05:27 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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I'm sorry about that man. But you weren't given them in the same fashion as an athlete would use them..Someone using them for athletic gains don't gain that much weight without busting their asses in the gym, you were clearly given more than an athlete would use and/or you weren't being given the necessary ancillaries to keep you hormones and other bodily functions in check.
Your lethargy came from a decrease in testosterone and/or a spike in estrogen. I'm sure you weren't given HCG every day or every other day while taking them correct? That would have kept your hormones stable after you finished taking them.
I'm not saying they have no danger potential, just that with responsible and well informed use, you can use them in many cycles while staying healthy, although you do need other drugs to help out with your body though.
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sajahand
just me


Registered: 03/16/11
Posts: 62
Loc: minnesota
Last seen: 12 years, 10 months
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Eminence]
#14138170 - 03/17/11 05:46 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
frylock91 said: I'm sorry about that man. But you weren't given them in the same fashion as an athlete would use them..Someone using them for athletic gains don't gain that much weight without busting their asses in the gym, you were clearly given more than an athlete would use and/or you weren't being given the necessary ancillaries to keep you hormones and other bodily functions in check.
Your lethargy came from a decrease in testosterone and/or a spike in estrogen. I'm sure you weren't given HCG every day or every other day while taking them correct? That would have kept your hormones stable after you finished taking them.
I'm not saying they have no danger potential, just that with responsible and well informed use, you can use them in many cycles while staying healthy, although you do need other drugs to help out with your body though.
not sure if not having any female hormones any more would have made it worse or not. i had an infusion every week for 6 weeks, then every2 weeks for 2 months and once a month for 3 months. not sure what they had put me all on. you ever see that fruit-cake that had his biceps burst? prob still on utube some place, had a huge blood sack filled nasty thing, goofy bastard.
-------------------- diggin life
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Anthony917
why dont we do it in the road



Registered: 05/14/09
Posts: 3,243
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: sajahand]
#14138183 - 03/17/11 05:49 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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No.
Not everyone wants to do steroids. If they allowed them in professional sports, then the only people who would have a chance would be all the roid-heads. That would completely destroy the integrity of the game. Sports are a natural competition between human beings. Steroids are cheating.
/thread
-------------------- Prisoner#1 said: I got my ass kicked by a 9yo when I was 17 Trippin? Click Me
What is life? I'm tired of life...
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Rumblefishtwist
Cyber Bully



Registered: 09/27/09
Posts: 1,040
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: sajahand]
#14138192 - 03/17/11 05:51 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
sajahand said: not sure if not having any female hormones any more would have made it worse or not. i had an infusion every week for 6 weeks, then every2 weeks for 2 months and once a month for 3 months. not sure what they had put me all on. you ever see that fruit-cake that had his biceps burst? prob still on utube some place, had a huge blood sack filled nasty thing, goofy bastard.
That guy was injecting massive amounts of synthol into his biceps which isn't an anabolic steroid, its just an oil that fills up whatever muscle you inject it into like a water balloon.
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Anthony917
why dont we do it in the road



Registered: 05/14/09
Posts: 3,243
Loc: Earth
Last seen: 12 years, 2 months
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: 1EyeCries]
#14138195 - 03/17/11 05:51 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
AgentOrange4120 said:
Quote:
marbletulip said: I've said for years they need an all steroid MLB. Do away with the pitcher and use a machine. Also use aluminum bats and play on golf courses because everyone is going to be hitting dingers.
thats a fucking killer idea, id watch that over todays baseball any day, full contact on the bases though
that's retarded. It would be home run after home run after home run. Baseball is an amazing game BECAUSE of the pitcher. The deception, the trickyness of the pitches, the mind-fuck that occurs between batter & pitcher doesn't exist anywhere else in sports. Baseball is the best.
-------------------- Prisoner#1 said: I got my ass kicked by a 9yo when I was 17 Trippin? Click Me
What is life? I'm tired of life...
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Beanhead
IS IRONIC PARADOX


Registered: 10/11/08
Posts: 17,257
Loc: Geospatial inversion.
Last seen: 3 years, 5 months
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: sajahand]
#14138225 - 03/17/11 05:55 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
sajahand said: do you think that the pro-sports should allow the use of steroids for the amusement of the fans? do you think it would be more competitive and interesting to watch? i love hockey, and think it would give me a giggle if some players would just wig out on each other more. yes i understand that they (steroids) are dangerous, but so is driving a car drunk, and eating at mac & dons in my town.
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sajahand
just me


Registered: 03/16/11
Posts: 62
Loc: minnesota
Last seen: 12 years, 10 months
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Rumblefishtwist]
#14138253 - 03/17/11 05:59 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
Rumblefishtwist said:
Quote:
sajahand said: not sure if not having any female hormones any more would have made it worse or not. i had an infusion every week for 6 weeks, then every2 weeks for 2 months and once a month for 3 months. not sure what they had put me all on. you ever see that fruit-cake that had his biceps burst? prob still on utube some place, had a huge blood sack filled nasty thing, goofy bastard.
That guy was injecting massive amounts of synthol into his biceps which isn't an anabolic steroid, its just an oil that fills up whatever muscle you inject it into like a water balloon.
Quote:
Rumblefishtwist said:
Quote:
sajahand said: not sure if not having any female hormones any more would have made it worse or not. i had an infusion every week for 6 weeks, then every2 weeks for 2 months and once a month for 3 months. not sure what they had put me all on. you ever see that fruit-cake that had his biceps burst? prob still on utube some place, had a huge blood sack filled nasty thing, goofy bastard.
That guy was injecting massive amounts of synthol into his biceps which isn't an anabolic steroid, its just an oil that fills up whatever muscle you inject it into like a water balloon.
i should have watched closer. i have no idea about steroids, just thought it would be interesting to see what other people say. but the bicep guy IS a goofy bastard tho
-------------------- diggin life
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Eminence



Registered: 07/25/10
Posts: 16,623
Loc: Richmond, VA
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: sajahand] 1
#14138282 - 03/17/11 06:05 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Hormone imbalances can cause all sorts of shit. None that I know of are serious though. But yeah lethargy is definitely a side effect of imbalances. But I remember that guy, I think his name is Thomas Galvin. He did use roids, but what cuased that to happen was excessive use of something called synthol.
It's basically this oil with some ingredient that you inject into your muscle and it stretches your muscle fascia. It's not anabolic, it just loosens up the protective layer of tissue around your muscle so it can grow easier and have more room to grow outwards. But it often ends up in weird looking muscles.
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Beanhead
IS IRONIC PARADOX


Registered: 10/11/08
Posts: 17,257
Loc: Geospatial inversion.
Last seen: 3 years, 5 months
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Mello Kitty]
#14138292 - 03/17/11 06:06 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
ellenallien said: i do not like sports at all but steroids would make things way more interesting
Why is that? Multiple options suddenly pop up in my head ... care to elaborate in a PM?
Cheers
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sajahand
just me


Registered: 03/16/11
Posts: 62
Loc: minnesota
Last seen: 12 years, 10 months
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Eminence]
#14138366 - 03/17/11 06:17 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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thanks, understand more. i been on prednisone off and on for years, just as anti- inflammatory, asthma, and MS. it works wonders, but really hate comin off of them. if someone is on steroids for muscle mass, if they stop, will the muscles go back to 'normal' even with exercise?
-------------------- diggin life
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Rumblefishtwist
Cyber Bully



Registered: 09/27/09
Posts: 1,040
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: sajahand]
#14138499 - 03/17/11 06:37 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
sajahand said: thanks, understand more. i been on prednisone off and on for years, just as anti- inflammatory, asthma, and MS. it works wonders, but really hate comin off of them. if someone is on steroids for muscle mass, if they stop, will the muscles go back to 'normal' even with exercise?
There are many different types of anabolic steroids that build muscle mass, each having a different effect on the body(how much muscle they can build, toxicity, side effects etc..)
Generally when someone finishes a cycle some of the acquired muscle while on the steroid cycle is lost, but if said person follows proper PCT(post cycle therapy) a great diet, and continues quality exercise a great portion or in some cases maybe all of muscle acquired on the cycle can be kept, genetics also play a role in this.
Steroids also affect different people differently, some people you know may be on steroids and you would never even be able to tell, not all people get huge on them. Many bodybuilders I know typically gain around 8-12 lb per cycle, and a cycle of standard testosterone typically lasts 4-5 weeks if I remember correctly. its not just an instant get huge overnight shot like most people think, discipline, diet and training all play equally important roles in steroid usage.
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Eminence



Registered: 07/25/10
Posts: 16,623
Loc: Richmond, VA
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: sajahand]
#14138554 - 03/17/11 06:45 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Yes they can, but if proper actions are made then it can be avoided. The reason you hear of people losing muscle mass after stopping their use is because of a rebound in catabolic hormones like estrogen and cortisone.
Cortisol is a stress hormone that is released during strenuous and excessive activities like running long distances and heavy long duration weight training sessions.
A lot of cortisol is built up during cycles because when you're on steroids, you're more aggressive with the weights, you lift harder, lift longer, and that causes a lot of stress. The steroids counter the muscle wasting effects of cortisol because testosterone increases nitrogen retention and that's what holds protein.
So once you go off cycle, the hormones leave you, while all the catabolic hormones remain, so in order to retain your gains, you need to jump start you natural testosterone production to counter the elevated estrogen and get rid of the cortisol.
(PCT)
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Eminence



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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Rumblefishtwist]
#14138577 - 03/17/11 06:47 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Good info. But testosterone cycles typically last between 8 and 12 weeks. Harsher roids like trenbolone acetate are usually run for shorter durations.
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Kamoopstinoops
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: joshstins420]
#14294851 - 04/15/11 10:12 AM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Look at
Quote:
joshstins420 said:"steroids are for faggots" - bas rutten
Says a man whos been known to have MUCH above the normal testosterone range of your average man lol.
The point is, its NEVER a level playing field regardless of the sport. In fighting you have things like reach advantage. Look at Usain Bolt and and the sheer length of his stride. Some people are genetically superior, doesn't exactly guarantee they'll win unless they can capitalise on their advantage... but they do have the advantage. Fuck, Tiger Woods went and got eye surgery to improve his eyesight, thats performance enhancement right there. Look at endurance athletes sleeping in hypoxic chambers to increase their red blood cell count...
When it comes to pro sports and elite competition, there's a lot of money, reputation, futures and glory at stake. What would YOU do to win if your lifestyle depended on it? You sure as fuck aint goin in there to lose.
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: sajahand]
#14294888 - 04/15/11 10:24 AM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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There should be a performance enhancement league for all sports, not just for steroids but cyberneticx implants and whatever will be devised to have athletes perform well beyond their natural limits.
But, there should always remain a "Naturals" league because sports is also something spiritual, about being the best man you can be with the tools nature traditionally gave you.
In the first three hours you let the Naturals run the New York Marathon, then an hour and 45 minutes for the Roidmonkeys then reserve the last 15 minutes to have the Cyborgs run it
the Perfect sporting event.
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Kamoopstinoops
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Asante]
#14294914 - 04/15/11 10:31 AM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Wiccan_Seeker said:because sports is also something spiritual, about being the best man you can be with the tools nature traditionally gave you.
Yeah, but ELITE competition has nothing to do with being spiritual and shit. You compete at an elite level to motherfuckin win. Thats the difference between professional and amateur competition.
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Anthony917
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Kamoopstinoops]
#14295163 - 04/15/11 11:40 AM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Kamoopstinoops said:
Quote:
Wiccan_Seeker said:because sports is also something spiritual, about being the best man you can be with the tools nature traditionally gave you.
Yeah, but ELITE competition has nothing to do with being spiritual and shit. You compete at an elite level to motherfuckin win. Thats the difference between professional and amateur competition.
yes but that means that if you can't naturally compete, then you aren't good enough! If you need steroids to compete, then you aren't a superstar.
Steroids give an unfair advantage to those taking them, and also put everyone else around them at a disadvantage. You can't compete with a batter like barry bonds who hits 70+hrs in a season and has a slugging % over .750. It's cheating, plain and simple.
I don't care how ELITE the competition is. You use what mother nature gave you and if you can't compete at that elite level then you just aren't good enough. You don't need to juice to play.
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Anthony917]
#14295769 - 04/15/11 01:58 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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What if mother nature gave you three vials of nandrolone decanoate?
I agree that roid monkeys shouldnt pretend to be naturals, that WOULD be cheating. But they should have their own class of competition.
By your logic, the Shroomerites who use Adderal to study up for a big exam should be kicked out of college for "cheating". I disagree. Steroids are used as a tool to train harder not a magic cure all that makesw your muscles pop out like airbags just by shooting up.
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Edited by Asante (04/15/11 02:02 PM)
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Eminence



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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Asante]
#14295785 - 04/15/11 02:02 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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I'd say fuck this gimme some tren.
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Asante
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Eminence]
#14295790 - 04/15/11 02:04 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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You must be pretty far down the road if you consider trenbolone.
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propensity
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Eminence]
#14295797 - 04/15/11 02:05 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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I'm not gonna read through the thread, but my personal opinion is that they should not be allowed because it forces all athletes to use them just to compete.
The steroid/non-steroid leagues seems like a fantastic idea
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Asante]
#14295800 - 04/15/11 02:05 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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I've done 5 cycles. But I got carried away and used it on my first
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uber_aj
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: sajahand]
#14295811 - 04/15/11 02:08 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
sajahand said: do you think that the pro-sports should allow the use of steroids for the amusement of the fans? do you think it would be more competitive and interesting to watch? i love hockey, and think it would give me a giggle if some players would just wig out on each other more. yes i understand that they (steroids) are dangerous, but so is driving a car drunk, and eating at mac & dons in my town.
Yes, 'roids should be allowed. In MMA especially. "But what about the children?" they ask. The children would agree with me that athletes should have to compete against steroid users for the amount of $ they're paid. Fans need to start demanding the best show possible, one pumped up with syringes of hormones.
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Eminence



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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: uber_aj]
#14295814 - 04/15/11 02:09 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Fuck yeah.
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Asante
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Eminence]
#14295822 - 04/15/11 02:11 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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*eyes your avatar*
Are you that bear? 
trenbolone is so androgenic, it'd turn you in a furry animal with a voice like Satan. Its for cattle, not men.
At your fifth cycle testosterone could still be all you really "need" (mind your PCT), its only much later that the big boys need to be whipped out as auxiliaries.
When that day comes, look into that nandrolone, its safe to say thats the king of hardcore steroids, trem may give bigger initial gains but its so unbalanced.
I myself very occasionally use steroids, minute doses of stanozolol, not for athletic performance but to increase bone density, tissue quality etc and to recover from things like lower back pain that come with my physically demanding "sport" (being obese)
In very low, non performance enhancing doses steroids are AMAZING in recovering from sprained ankles, lower back pain etc. Theres NOTHING like it because at those doses (that correspond with more robust but still somewhat normal testicular testosterone output) you actually heal from such injuries faster and with better quality tissues.
Its only when you use higher doses that tissue quality gets sloppy, tiny doses actually benefit health.
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Edited by Asante (04/15/11 02:19 PM)
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fissionchips


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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Eminence]
#14295823 - 04/15/11 02:11 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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I say let the mongoloid retards of Major League Baseball juice up and crack 550 ft dingers over the gawk-eyed, dim witted heads of american baseball fans. Thats what they want to see. Nobody wants to see a fucking bunt-off.
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Eminence



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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Asante]
#14295828 - 04/15/11 02:11 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Yeah exactly. So many people think people on steroids are pussies in the gym, when really, most of them train like animals and go forever in there.
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eloC
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: sajahand]
#14295836 - 04/15/11 02:12 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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In all honesty, I think that it's your body. Nobody should be able to tell you what to do with it. But the reason their banned, is because atheletes that do, use performance enhancers, excel beyond expectations. (Don't get me wrong, I don't use them, it just taking it from out side the box.) The normal "regular" athletes wouldn't be able to keep up with a person who uses an enhancer. I think that it should be your choice. Not the league, or the organization to tell you what you can and can't do with your body. Some people might actually need some extra boost. Because they have a dissability, other than that, if your fucking Berry Bonds, and are hitting 20 home runs ever 5 games, then you shouldn't be using fucking performance enhancers, because then your just a lazy douche.. In my opinion.
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Eminence



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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Asante]
#14295848 - 04/15/11 02:15 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Haha yeah I know. But they have made pharmaceutical grade trenbolone. But yeah I grew some hair and my voice did get pretty deep.
I do love test though that is the main thing I would use if I went again. But tren had the best gains of them all so far, I have tried deca but at a lower dose, it was good but too much bloat.
And a couple of my cycles were cutters. Tren is amazing in cutting cycles. Oh and yeah I know everything about PCT. I looked into it so much before I started.
Definitely, I've used winny for the same reason. I've pushed myself a little too hard even with them and had some minor injuries, then just threw in a low dose of it to help. Winstrol's another one of my favorites.
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Edited by Eminence (04/15/11 02:28 PM)
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Eminence



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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Asante]
#14295894 - 04/15/11 02:21 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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I just prefer shorter esters. Quicker gains, and if you're not reacting nicely to them there's less time to deal with sides if you want to quit that particular drug.
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Eminence]
#14295954 - 04/15/11 02:34 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Any ADULT MALE who talks down on steroids and who should have the misfortune of really busting their knee or their back should try adding 1-2mg stanozolol (Winstrol) once or twice daily to however they choose to recover for 1-3 weeks.
They'd be instant believers.
Its a few dozen times less of the steroid load an athlete like you takes on, so you'd perhaps think it won't do anything at all (its still almost like having a third nut for a few weeks though) but for the recovery of a regular joe the results are compelling. You recover faster and more complete, AND get a bit of analgesia AND you feel better.
This drug, in this dosage, in this duration, is completely benign in most adult males and depending on your physical robustness and how you treat your injury it may cut a quarter or one half off your recovery time if you aren't an athlete.
For an athlete it wont do much at that dosage because their androgenic turnover is higher but for a regular or somewhat elderly but otherwise healthy adult its AMAZING.
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Edited by Asante (04/15/11 02:37 PM)
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uber_aj
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: eloC]
#14295964 - 04/15/11 02:36 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
eloC said: if your fucking Berry Bonds, and are hitting 20 home runs ever 5 games, then you shouldn't be using fucking performance enhancers, because then your just a lazy douche. In my opinion.
I think that's just reefer madness projected on steroids. You don't inject steroids and suddenly become strong and a precise batter. You spend your whole day eating and working out, having to do recovery cycles and shit.
Athletes should be allowed to do what is best for them, so they can perform their best and earn that grossly inflated paycheck. I don't think any drugs should be tested for. Nick Diaz got high and out boxed one of the best lightweight boxers in MMA a few years back, so they reversed the win, despite it being a one-sided fight. Prohibition ruins sports, too.
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: uber_aj]
#14296052 - 04/15/11 02:50 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
I think that's just reefer madness projected on steroids.
The shroomery is an amazing community...
We have people with no pain whatsoever using painkillers, and thats cool. We have healthy people with no need for surgery going halfway under anesthesia and returning with the answers to life and death, and thats cool. We have college students who are lazy stoners all year suddenly going on adderal binges to make sure they pass exams on the the last minute, and thats cool.
But!
If you use a drug to enhance your body, all of a sudden you're a douche.
Strange logic here.
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Eminence



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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Asante]
#14296071 - 04/15/11 02:54 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Anthony917
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: fissionchips]
#14296077 - 04/15/11 02:55 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Wiccan_Seeker said: What if mother nature gave you three vials of nandrolone decanoate?
I agree that roid monkeys shouldnt pretend to be naturals, that WOULD be cheating. But they should have their own class of competition.
By your logic, the Shroomerites who use Adderal to study up for a big exam should be kicked out of college for "cheating". I disagree. Steroids are used as a tool to train harder not a magic cure all that makesw your muscles pop out like airbags just by shooting up.
No because college isn't a competition.
Quote:
fissionchips said: I say let the mongoloid retards of Major League Baseball juice up and crack 550 ft dingers over the gawk-eyed, dim witted heads of american baseball fans. Thats what they want to see. Nobody wants to see a fucking bunt-off.
This is retarded. You obviously don't understand baseball, but I love the game. There are so many aspects to baseball that you probably don't even understand. The mental game that occurs every at bat between batter & pitcher. Working a count, stealing bases, using outs and BUNTS productively to advance runners...sometimes the the pitches get called from the dugout! Not to mention hitting a fastball is the hardest thing to do in all of sports, the game is incredible.
People do not simply watch to see HR's get hit. They are exciting, but some people actually love the game. Steroids RUIN the game. Listen to what Bob Costas said in response to the bonds verdict http://mlb.mlb.com/video/play.jsp?content_id=13752981
he says some very intelligent things
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Eminence



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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Anthony917]
#14296088 - 04/15/11 02:58 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Maybe college isn't a competition, but the work force is. And if you take drugs to help your grades to land you a job later on, it should be considered cheating too.
Plus I hear about steroid users being called cheaters if they aren't even in sports and just wanting to challenge their limits on their own.
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Anthony917
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Eminence]
#14296120 - 04/15/11 03:06 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
frylock91 said: Maybe college isn't a competition, but the work force is. And if you take drugs to help your grades to land you a job later on, it should be considered cheating too.
Plus I hear about steroid users being called cheaters if they aren't even in sports and just wanting to challenge their limits on their own.
You could call them cheaters, but there is no rule against it, and it isn't a competition.
steroid users would be referred to as cheaters, but that's because all of their personal accomplishments would be inauthentic. There is no need for steroids. They excel you past natural levels and they have absolutely no place in sports.
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Eminence



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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Anthony917]
#14296210 - 04/15/11 03:25 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Anthony917 said:
You could call them cheaters, but there is no rule against it, and it isn't a competition.
The rules against using drugs to accomplish work without a prescription is called the law. Using some form of enhancement for work is the same concept as some enhancement for sports.
Quote:
steroid users would be referred to as cheaters, but that's because all of their personal accomplishments would be inauthentic. There is no need for steroids.
Like I said above..If you fill a room with a bunch of students taking a test, and one student takes some amphetamines to help him focus and get the job done faster, you don't think anyone would feel like he's a cheater?
Quote:
They excel you past natural levels and they have absolutely no place in sports.
Just like taking drugs to accomplish tasks, they excel you past natural limits. And I don't think people should take steroids if they're competing against naturals, but like others have said, there should be no problem with them having their own league.
People would pay good money to see a bunch of meat heads in a ring.
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Anthony917]
#14296223 - 04/15/11 03:29 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
No because college isn't a competition.
if you want a Major League professional career I assure you it is. If you want to be a doctor or an engineer etc you are directly competing against all others with the same inclination, and mostly the best of you will make it. Using nootropics, stimulants and anxiolytics strategically in service of your education is COMPLETELY comparable to steroids use in sports.
Drug users of the world, unite. Let the smokers and the tokers and the pill poppers and snorters, the roid monkeys, the guys who want their cock up 24/7, the ones who want to get the most out of vitamins and whatnot all just forget about the DIFFERENCES in why we use drugs and all unite in our RIGHT TO USE DRUGS AS WE SEE FIT. Our bodies, our minds, our lives. Lets help each other with our goals but never, never, compete, and let's get rid of this awful war on drugs and personal freedom thats being waged upon us by the powers that be. Let's get high!
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Anthony917
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Eminence]
#14296224 - 04/15/11 03:29 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
frylock91 said:
Quote:
Anthony917 said:
You could call them cheaters, but there is no rule against it, and it isn't a competition.
The rules against using drugs to accomplish work without a prescription is called the law. Using some form of enhancement for work is the same concept as some enhancement for sports.
Quote:
steroid users would be referred to as cheaters, but that's because all of their personal accomplishments would be inauthentic. There is no need for steroids.
Like I said above..If you fill a room with a bunch of students taking a test, and one student takes some amphetamines to help him focus and get the job done faster, you don't think anyone would feel like he's a cheater?
Quote:
They excel you past natural levels and they have absolutely no place in sports.
Just like taking drugs to accomplish tasks, they excel you past natural limits. And I don't think people should take steroids if they're competing against naturals, but like others have said, there should be no problem with them having their own league.
People would pay good money to see a bunch of meat heads in a ring.
Ok that's true. Then they are cheaters. The difference is nobody really gives a shit.
Sports are in a whole nother league. I honestly don't think that a steroid league would gain much following. Perhaps a steroid MMA, but I don't think there are that many people who want to get THAT juiced. Also, the juice isn't going to make you a great athlete unless you were already a great athlete, and I have to believe that all the great athletes would rather play in the legit league than a steroid one.
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Anthony917
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Asante]
#14296238 - 04/15/11 03:33 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Wiccan_Seeker said:
Quote:
No because college isn't a competition.
if you want a Major League professional career I assure you it is. If you want to be a doctor or an engineer etc you are directly competing against all others with the same inclination, and mostly the best of you will make it. Using nootropics, stimulants and anxiolytics strategically in service of your education is COMPLETELY comparable to steroids use in sports.
Drug users of the world, unite. Let the smokers and the tokers and the pill poppers and snorters, the roid monkeys, the guys who want their cock up 24/7, the ones who want to get the most out of vitamins and whatnot all just forget about the DIFFERENCES in why we use drugs and all unite in our RIGHT TO USE DRUGS AS WE SEE FIT. Our bodies, our minds, our lives. Lets help each other with our goals but never, never, compete, and let's get rid of this awful war on drugs and personal freedom thats beibg waged upon us by the powers that be. Let's get high!
Okay yes, you are trying to do better than your peers, but if you don't it's not like you lose. If you can get a 3.8GPA throughout college without taking speed, and someone else gets a 4.0 because they took speed then chances are you're going to be just fine.
In sports the logic behind not using steroids is to preserve the integrity of the game. In college if you use drugs then who gives a fuck?
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Anthony917]
#14296253 - 04/15/11 03:37 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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I just think nobody should give a shit if people want to use steroids though either, I still admit using steroids when you compete with naturals isn't fair, but if you're using them for your own gain I don't think it should be considered cheating like so many people say.
People who use steroids are either impatient, hard gainers, or have already reached their genetic limitations, and there's nothing wrong with wanting to push yourself beyond what you're originally capable of.
Who knows, maybe a league for steroid users wouldn't catch on, but I personally think it would be popular, probably not as popular as natural leagues. But it all depends on the sports, like you said, steroids in MMA would probably draw more of a crowd than steroids in baseball.
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Anthony917]
#14296255 - 04/15/11 03:38 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
In college if you use drugs then who gives a fuck?
For some people, making the choice between getting a vaporizer or an espresso machine during their collage years makes the difference between a life of flipping burgers and being some executive taking four paid vacations all over to world each year.
Which drugs you use in college and how you use them makes ALL the difference for some people, a prime reason why sites like the Shroomery are important: "enabling people to make informed decisions about the substances they choose to put in their bodies".
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Anthony917
why dont we do it in the road



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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Asante]
#14296271 - 04/15/11 03:41 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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frylock91 said: I just think nobody should give a shit if people want to use steroids though either, I still admit using steroids when you compete with naturals isn't fair, but if you're using them for your own gain I don't think it should be considered cheating like so many people say.
People who use steroids are either impatient, hard gainers, or have already reached their genetic limitations, and there's nothing wrong with wanting to push yourself beyond what you're originally capable of.
Who knows, maybe a league for steroid users wouldn't catch on, but I personally think it would be popular, probably not as popular as natural leagues. But it all depends on the sports, like you said, steroids in MMA would probably draw more of a crowd than steroids in baseball.
dude I agree. I don't care what someone wants to do in their personal life, but when they ruin a game and cheat by using steroids, that's the issue.
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Wiccan_Seeker said:
For some people, making the choice between getting a vaporizer or an espresso machine during their collage years makes the difference between a life of flipping burgers and being some executive taking four paid vacations all over to world each year.
Which drugs you use in college and how you use them makes ALL the difference for some people, a prime reason why sites like the Shroomery are important: "enabling people to make informed decisions about the substances they choose to put in their bodies".
Haha that's a bad stereotype to make about weed! I know lots of very successful potheads. Again, I just don't think it even matters about taking drugs in college
-------------------- Prisoner#1 said: I got my ass kicked by a 9yo when I was 17 Trippin? Click Me
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uber_aj
Goodbye Shroomery!


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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Asante]
#14296281 - 04/15/11 03:43 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Wiccan_Seeker said: Drug users of the world, unite. Let the smokers and the tokers and the pill poppers and snorters, the roid monkeys, the guys who want their cock up 24/7, the ones who want to get the most out of vitamins and whatnot all just forget about the DIFFERENCES in why we use drugs and all unite in our RIGHT TO USE DRUGS AS WE SEE FIT. Our bodies, our minds, our lives. Lets help each other with our goals but never, never, compete, and let's get rid of this awful war on drugs and personal freedom thats being waged upon us by the powers that be. Let's get high!
Here here!
All levels of prohibition are the same thing; none of them work. Drunk NASCAR here I come!
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Eminence



Registered: 07/25/10
Posts: 16,623
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Anthony917]
#14296299 - 04/15/11 03:45 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Yeah I'm just saying if steroid users had their own league, they wouldn't be considered cheaters.
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Rumblefishtwist
Cyber Bully



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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Asante]
#14307230 - 04/17/11 03:55 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Wiccan_Seeker said: Any ADULT MALE who talks down on steroids and who should have the misfortune of really busting their knee or their back should try adding 1-2mg stanozolol (Winstrol) once or twice daily to however they choose to recover for 1-3 weeks.
They'd be instant believers.
Its a few dozen times less of the steroid load an athlete like you takes on, so you'd perhaps think it won't do anything at all (its still almost like having a third nut for a few weeks though) but for the recovery of a regular joe the results are compelling. You recover faster and more complete, AND get a bit of analgesia AND you feel better.
This drug, in this dosage, in this duration, is completely benign in most adult males and depending on your physical robustness and how you treat your injury it may cut a quarter or one half off your recovery time if you aren't an athlete.
For an athlete it wont do much at that dosage because their androgenic turnover is higher but for a regular or somewhat elderly but otherwise healthy adult its AMAZING.
This is interesting, never heard of this before. The other day a regular at one of the gyms I go to was talking about how he would never do Winstrol again(due to the drawbacks). He was most likely on a way bigger dose than this "therapeutic" style cycle you recommend. He claimed he gained something like 30 pounds in 2 months, that his bench sky rocketed and all that sort of stuff. But he then said it wasn't worth it from all the drawbacks, the only one I really caught was very achy joints. So Wiccan, you are saying at lower doses Winstrol actually can repairs joints?
I am 22 with shot knees, my moms family also has a history of knee problems (a couple have had knee replacement surgery). All the heavey squatting and heavy leg presses over the years have definitely made it worse. My knees constantly feel inflamed/"old man" these days, some days are worse than others, all the fish oil and glucosamine may not even be helping. I can't even do big leg workouts anymore, and have to cut back on the frequency(probably shouldn't be doing them at all). I would do anything do make my joints/tendons feel good again.. but am a little afraid of taking steroids because I still have some gyno from puberty(not major, just some puffy nips) and dont want that to flare up, because I know what steroids can do.
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Patlal
You ask too many questions



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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: sajahand]
#14307383 - 04/17/11 04:23 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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sajahand said: do you think that the pro-sports should allow the use of steroids for the amusement of the fans? do you think it would be more competitive and interesting to watch? i love hockey, and think it would give me a giggle if some players would just wig out on each other more. yes i understand that they (steroids) are dangerous, but so is driving a car drunk, and eating at mac & dons in my town.
If you mix steroids and hockey, you will either get heart attacks on the ice or death by boarding
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demon66
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Patlal]
#14307514 - 04/17/11 04:43 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Performance enhancing drugs are a technology to engineer a better athlete. I thought the whole point of sports was to push the envelope. Not really sure how I feel about drugs in sports.
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Asante
Mage


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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Rumblefishtwist]
#14308021 - 04/17/11 06:15 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Now were bordering on medical advice, and its best not to take that from someone on the internet but from medial professionals and your own research.
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The other day a regular at one of the gyms I go to was talking about how he would never do Winstrol again(due to the drawbacks). He was most likely on a way bigger dose than this "therapeutic" style cycle you recommend.
Yup he was likely taking 2x25 or 2x50mg a day. Now thats fine and dandy with Thai and other anabolic steroids because those come in those dosages. But pharmaceutical Winstrol..

Yeah these babies right here, the ones doctors prescribe for medical indications, they only come in the strength of 2mg, with the direction 1/2-1 pill 1-2x a day. And your buddy was basically taking something like 25 pills once or twice a day. Does that sound like use or abuse of a drug to you, 25 pills in one go?
The fact that British Dragon puts 50mg in a tab means nothing, thats a sports steroid brand, not a serious medical pharmaceutical brand like Zambon, and they only put 2mg in.
Who gets these pills?
AIDS patients. Cancer patients. People who quite literally lack testicular fortitude.
Now thats a GOOD thing believe it or not because it shows that even when you dont work out, even when you are nowhere fit, and use minute doses in comparison to sports, you can still derive very real medical benefit from steroids. That dispels the myth that you need to work out and need high doses.
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I am 22 with shot knees, my moms family also has a history of knee problems (a couple have had knee replacement surgery). All the heavey squatting and heavy leg presses over the years have definitely made it worse. My knees constantly feel inflamed/"old man" these days, some days are worse than others, all the fish oil and glucosamine may not even be helping. I can't even do big leg workouts anymore, and have to cut back on the frequency(probably shouldn't be doing them at all). I would do anything do make my joints/tendons feel good again..
This is an actual medical problem so you need to see an actual doctor. Problem is, almost all doctors, especially in the US, are anti-steroid as the war on drugs is waged also against prescribers.
What I would do in your case...
1..DO NOT OVERTRAIN
Thats no. 1 right here and it seems you may be doing that. Dont wreck yourself man, your knees are shot, accept that. If you overtrain and stop doing that, that alone will improve your quality of life and level of functionality to a higher level, without ANY drugs or side effects.
2..Exhaust all treatment options
See what can be done. Assume your doctor is NOT up to speed about what ails you, and to quote Oprah, "Use the internet". Become an expert in what ails you and what state of the art treatments are. Costs you nothing and could tell you exactly what ails you.
Would steroids only offer symptomatic relief (like an aspirin) in your case, or is there healing that can be improved with intelligent steroid use?
In the former case, better not go there. If there is healing to be done, look into steroids, low medical dose ones. They can positively affect growth and recovery of almost all tissues if used right but again - if it cant be healed, steroids have nothing to promote. But if it can be healed somewhat theres likely room for improvement if your AAS levels are somewhat increased.
If AAS can help, you have to look which one is right for you. You mentioned gyno, you definitely do NOT want one that can aromatize into an estrogen (female hormone analog) cause those cause those things and fluid retention, which also sucks if your joints are bad.
In the case of Winstrol, it doesnt aromatize at all, so no estrogens to fear. If its right for you, I wont make that call, but it could be. Fact is that Winstrol is one of the few steroids that in low doses is given continuously, not in cycles, to people with lack of testosterone production for decades on end, often with no real problems if the dosage is low enough. So that may be useful, if the shoe fits of course.
It is a FACT that TOO MUCH winstrol is actually bad for joints and tendons, but that may be a case of overdoing something that could be a good thing in a proper low dose, just like some painkillers actually CAUSE pain if used in too high of a dosage.
You may have a lead here, but research it well.
I hope this helps!
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Poid
Shroomery's #1 Spellir




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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Asante]
#14308182 - 04/17/11 06:48 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Wiccan_Seeker said: Now were bordering on medical advice, and its best not to take that from someone on the internet but from medial professionals and your own research.
*we're *it's
-------------------- Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. -- Bob Dylan  fireworks_god said:It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.
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Kamoopstinoops
Reality is my BITCH!!!


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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Rumblefishtwist]
#14310632 - 04/18/11 06:55 AM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Rumblefishtwist said:
Quote:
Wiccan_Seeker said: Any ADULT MALE who talks down on steroids and who should have the misfortune of really busting their knee or their back should try adding 1-2mg stanozolol (Winstrol) once or twice daily to however they choose to recover for 1-3 weeks.
They'd be instant believers.
Its a few dozen times less of the steroid load an athlete like you takes on, so you'd perhaps think it won't do anything at all (its still almost like having a third nut for a few weeks though) but for the recovery of a regular joe the results are compelling. You recover faster and more complete, AND get a bit of analgesia AND you feel better.
This drug, in this dosage, in this duration, is completely benign in most adult males and depending on your physical robustness and how you treat your injury it may cut a quarter or one half off your recovery time if you aren't an athlete.
For an athlete it wont do much at that dosage because their androgenic turnover is higher but for a regular or somewhat elderly but otherwise healthy adult its AMAZING.
This is interesting, never heard of this before. The other day a regular at one of the gyms I go to was talking about how he would never do Winstrol again(due to the drawbacks). He was most likely on a way bigger dose than this "therapeutic" style cycle you recommend. He claimed he gained something like 30 pounds in 2 months, that his bench sky rocketed and all that sort of stuff. But he then said it wasn't worth it from all the drawbacks, the only one I really caught was very achy joints. So Wiccan, you are saying at lower doses Winstrol actually can repairs joints?
I am 22 with shot knees, my moms family also has a history of knee problems (a couple have had knee replacement surgery). All the heavey squatting and heavy leg presses over the years have definitely made it worse. My knees constantly feel inflamed/"old man" these days, some days are worse than others, all the fish oil and glucosamine may not even be helping. I can't even do big leg workouts anymore, and have to cut back on the frequency(probably shouldn't be doing them at all). I would do anything do make my joints/tendons feel good again.. but am a little afraid of taking steroids because I still have some gyno from puberty(not major, just some puffy nips) and dont want that to flare up, because I know what steroids can do.
Try switching to using LIGHT weights for your leg training for a bit. Focus on contraction of the quads and maintaining the tension. This will teach you to work the muscles deeply without stressing the tendons and ligaments. Trust me if building muscle is your goal, you don't exclusively need heavy weights. Your muscles don't know what weight they are lifting, only what stress they are being put under. However I find that training this way does strengthen your tendons and ligaments over time as well as building muscle. I do a bit of powerlifting so I'm often subjected to some heavy ass weight, but even I don't train heavy all the time. You have to respect your body and your joints and know when to train light. Remember, tendons and ligaments take much longer to heal than muscles.
Sometimes joint pain can come from imbalances. Many people train their quads yet often neglect their hamstrings and don't give them as much love. Does this apply to you?
-------------------- Through the Spintrinfinty of the all Tremongstanooloop, we realise that infinity may after all amount to nothing... space merely being an illusion.
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Asante
Mage


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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Kamoopstinoops]
#14310656 - 04/18/11 07:07 AM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Great athletic advice, but bear this in mind:
Quote:
I am 22 with shot knees, my moms family also has a history of knee problems (a couple have had knee replacement surgery).
Hehas shot knees and is probably genetically predisposed to them, and probably overtraining.
Sound advice you gave but I felt the need to highlight.
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Kamoopstinoops
Reality is my BITCH!!!


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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Asante]
#14310711 - 04/18/11 07:33 AM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Wiccan_Seeker said: Great athletic advice, but bear this in mind:
Quote:
I am 22 with shot knees, my moms family also has a history of knee problems (a couple have had knee replacement surgery).
Hehas shot knees and is probably genetically predisposed to them, and probably overtraining.
Sound advice you gave but I felt the need to highlight.
You're right to point that out, and even moreso shows the need to pay extra attention to how he trains. To me, overtraining is a very loose term and can relate to many things, but mostly to CNS overload. Personally from experience, I find its not so much a matter of "over-training" but one of "under-recovering". In this guys case, he mentions plenty of HEAVY squatting and leg pressing. Now although these are awesome in moderation but if tendons/ligaments are not allowed to fully recover, there's gonna be problems and can be detrimental in the long run, ESPECIALLY when you're genetically pre-disposed to knee problems. So of course you'd wanna take extra care as to the stress you're inflicting on your joints.
I admit that I'm no medical professional so don't take my advice as such. I will however point out that the chance of injury is absolutely minimal with the style of training I mention, yet its very effective despite going against the grain of the usual "lift more and more to get bigger" approach. It will allow you to focus on working the muscles while being under COMPLETE control of the movement, effectively canceling out unwanted load on the joints (in most circumstances anyway). When you're going for high weight, you lose this control as you become solely focused on "getting the weight up".
Still it would be best to see a doctor and assess what state your knees are actually in. It could be something more serious, in which case I'd advise working closely with a physiotherapist.
But all in all, I see using a little winny being beside the point and isn't really addressing the problem... Maybe as a last ditch experiment if all else fails (under docs supervision), but don't want him picking up some winny from a gym dealer for this reason lol.
-------------------- Through the Spintrinfinty of the all Tremongstanooloop, we realise that infinity may after all amount to nothing... space merely being an illusion.
Edited by Kamoopstinoops (04/18/11 07:39 AM)
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Asante
Mage


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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Kamoopstinoops]
#14310804 - 04/18/11 08:01 AM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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I accept your expertise and am glad you took the time to help him out by typing all that. In a way your Step 1 matches mine, but in more detail. Drugs definitely arent the first thing he should look at, its what hes doing right now.
Even IF Winstrol or another steroid can be of use to him, it will actually backfire on him badly if he uses the recovery & confidence boost to get even more gung ho about his training.
Not unlike peoiple taking a bunch of aspirin and abusing the pain relief to overexert themszelves evn further.
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Kamoopstinoops
Reality is my BITCH!!!


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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Asante]
#14310954 - 04/18/11 08:47 AM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Wiccan_Seeker said:Not unlike peoiple taking a bunch of aspirin and abusing the pain relief to overexert themszelves evn further.
Lol, on that note I knew a bloke who used to lift after having his shot of heroin. My god he used to train his ass off lol. Didn't help him in the long run though, as its hard to be consistent in training with that lifestyle. But it was a performace enhancer for him lol, not me though I'd get too queasy.
Haha, also imagine MMA fighters taking a (small) dose of LSD before a fight. Back when I was young and stupid I won a street fight against a bigger guy while tripping. I felt invincible and so goddamn animalistic. Was in such a heightened state of consciousness, I reckon it would have been quite hard to get "knocked out". The only way to stop me would have been to kill me. So there's another potential performance enhancing drug for ya lol. Would that be frowned upon if you found your favourite fighter was trippin when he won?
PS - I do not advocate getting into violent situations while tripping. Be responsible, be safe, trip happy. Last thing we want is for tripper's reputations to be further tarnished. I can see the news articles now... "LSD turns local man into raging psychopath, police warn of the dangers of consuming this poison..." lol.
-------------------- Through the Spintrinfinty of the all Tremongstanooloop, we realise that infinity may after all amount to nothing... space merely being an illusion.
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Rumblefishtwist
Cyber Bully



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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Kamoopstinoops]
#14311969 - 04/18/11 01:15 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Thanks for the replies guys. I don't think it is overtraining as much as my knee joints just cant genetically handle the load I had been putting on them for the past 6 months. I train bodybuilding style hitting each muscle group different days and make sure to get rest days after every 2 consistent days in the gym, sometimes 2 rest days in a row etc. Eat plenty of protein healthy carbs(bulking diet currently, so calorie excess), log long hours of sleep etc. Trying to gain 15lb and get to 220lb by end of summer/fall.
There is definitly an imbalance in my legs, but not intentional. As weird as this may sound my hamstrings are 2-3x stronger than my quads, keep in mind no extra attention was ever paid to them while training (they just grew and got way stronger much quicker than my quads ever have).
I have definitly been taking it light on the legs, yesterday was my first day hitting legs in 3 weeks to a month( I used to do them once a week) not so much lately. I took it light and will probobly continue to do so because like you said joints/tendons take longer than muscle. Yesterday sucked, a pulled a muscle on my back while doing free weight squats(looked up on my last rep and felt "that shooting pain" if you workout a lot and have pulled muscles you know what I mean) and woke up today feeling 200 years old. Just got back from the doc with muscle relaxers and anti-inflamitory pills, so I guess im just gonna take it easy for awhile and eat big until my back is ready.
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Kamoopstinoops
Reality is my BITCH!!!


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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Rumblefishtwist]
#14313761 - 04/18/11 08:39 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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Ah, the ol back spasm... Often happens as a result of the posterior chain being super tight. In particular, make sure to take time to really stretch and loosen the glutes because they get really tight over time and this really hinders performance. Or get your girlfriend to really dig her elbow in there and massage them, but if not, use a tennis ball. Of course, hamstrings, lats and lower back should always be stretched and kept nice and loose.
Oh well, back spasms are painful but they're no biggie. One word of advice is to walk! You may not feel like it and it may feel hard but try plenty of walking as well as stretching. Will do you better than sitting it out. Last time I had a back spasm (from work) it was excruciating and I couldn't sleep that night, but after seeing my doc he got me to walk the shit out of it... I was back squatting heavy weight 3 days later.
-------------------- Through the Spintrinfinty of the all Tremongstanooloop, we realise that infinity may after all amount to nothing... space merely being an illusion.
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demon66
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Re: should steroids be ok in professional sports.... [Re: Kamoopstinoops]
#14327909 - 04/21/11 02:10 PM (12 years, 9 months ago) |
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I occasionally get muscle spasms in my calfs after some heavy training. Only if I tense them hard though. Hurts like a bitch for a few seconds.
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