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Microppose
Things Maker



Registered: 11/30/10
Posts: 849
Loc: Amongst you...
Last seen: 21 hours, 24 minutes
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Senesense and MS spawn?
#14114228 - 03/13/11 01:25 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Does multispore spawn also succumb to senesense after multiple generations of GTG transfers, like isolates?
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k00laid
NEMO


Registered: 05/03/10
Posts: 19,636
Last seen: 6 months, 5 days
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Re: Senesense and MS spawn? [Re: Microppose]
#14114380 - 03/13/11 02:03 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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multiple as in thousands maybe
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Microppose
Things Maker



Registered: 11/30/10
Posts: 849
Loc: Amongst you...
Last seen: 21 hours, 24 minutes
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Re: Senesense and MS spawn? [Re: k00laid]
#14114445 - 03/13/11 02:17 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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It happens MUCH faster with isolated spawn. Are you sure it takes that long? Senesence happens (from my understanding) because of the lack of biodiversity, which causes singular genetic mycelium to stretch to the point of losing its fruiting ability. Or at least reducing it's fruiting ability. If it takes thousands of generations for the same to happen in a multispore spawn, well I have a long time to go before it's necessary to worry...
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Primal Call
Earth Mage



Registered: 09/05/10
Posts: 2,766
Loc: Here until here
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Re: Senesense and MS spawn? [Re: Microppose]
#14114761 - 03/13/11 03:40 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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stamets recommends no more than 10 generations if you want that to be your guide... or you can try thousands like koolaid says and see what happens just for kicks 
we can probably stretch it longer than 10x, but each generation leads, ultimately, to replicate fading/senescence if I'm not mistaken
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Doc_T
Random Dude




Registered: 03/06/09
Posts: 42,395
Loc: Colorado
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Re: Senesense and MS spawn? [Re: Primal Call]
#14114778 - 03/13/11 03:43 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Senescence happens in all organisms. Wikisearch: Hayflick Limit.
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LurkingWizards
WurkingLizards



Registered: 01/19/11
Posts: 219
Loc: hear and now, woof
Last seen: 10 years, 11 months
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Re: Senesense and MS spawn? [Re: Microppose]
#14114815 - 03/13/11 03:54 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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I usually only keep MS-grain-spawn in expansion for about 3 months, performing g2g x-fers every 2 weeks. The fruiting potential started to decrease for me after 15 weeks of g2g-expansion, fewer flushes were also observed, as well as slower colonization in general. This is just what I have experienced/noticed while trying to 'perpetuate' the MS-spawn using g2g...
1 colonized pint jar -> 7 qt jars and 1 pint jar (via g2g) 10-14 days later, the 7 qts are expanded to coir/verm (via mono-tub), while the other single pint is 're-expanded' to another 7 qts jars and 1 pint jars... wait 10-14 days, repeat cycle

utilizing this method, I enjoy starting from 'new spawn' every 3 months or so to keep things colonizing on schedule... whether that is in the form of MS, LC, clone, slant/isolate, whatever... but most of my experience is with MS, so far.
But in answer to your question, I have never had spawn that didn't fruit... just old spawn, genetically, that fruited poorly when compared to the 'younger' spawn (PE has been a slight exception for me in some cases though) 
hope this helps and isn't too confusing, because I confuse myself sometimes when trying to explain things... 
LurkingWizards WurkingLizards
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Microppose
Things Maker



Registered: 11/30/10
Posts: 849
Loc: Amongst you...
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Thanks guys. I'll keep it under 10 gen to be safe. I have fun messing around with stuff anyways, so it's not really a chore...
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mabachko
Just Strange



Registered: 02/11/11
Posts: 702
Last seen: 8 years, 6 months
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Re: Senesense and MS spawn? [Re: Microppose]
#14116148 - 03/13/11 08:10 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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If after 3 months you made a spore print, would the print be like staring over or would be cosidered going over the 10X?
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Primal Call
Earth Mage



Registered: 09/05/10
Posts: 2,766
Loc: Here until here
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Re: Senesense and MS spawn? [Re: mabachko]
#14116162 - 03/13/11 08:14 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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a spore print is the baseline of genetic diversity. it is the beginning
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mabachko
Just Strange



Registered: 02/11/11
Posts: 702
Last seen: 8 years, 6 months
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Re: Senesense and MS spawn? [Re: Primal Call]
#14116278 - 03/13/11 08:36 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Thanx Rath. If u hadn't put the last part in I'd still b wondering, Ha
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LurkingWizards
WurkingLizards



Registered: 01/19/11
Posts: 219
Loc: hear and now, woof
Last seen: 10 years, 11 months
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Re: Senesense and MS spawn? [Re: mabachko]
#14116538 - 03/13/11 09:22 PM (12 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
LurkingWizards said: utilizing this method, I enjoy starting from 'new spawn' every 3 months or so to keep things colonizing on schedule... whether that is in the form of MS, LC, clone, slant/isolate, whatever... but most of my experience is with MS, so far.
Quote:
mabachko said: If after 3 months you made a spore print, would the print be like staring over or would be cosidered going over the 10X?
you got it.  'new spawn' was my way of saying starting over with 'fresh-genetics' (younger)... MS is multi-spore inoculation, the very beginning... spore print or syringe, or even MS-LC... all good starting points for 'fresh-genetics' 
I just enjoy being able to depend on the timing of g2g transfers taking 10-14 days, while LC inoculations take up to 3 weeks and colonize in a more inconsistent manner for me, personally. Which is why I like to start over every 3 months or so with master jars from LC to get back to 'fresh-genetics'. Then 'perpetuate' that spawn from the master jars for the next 3 or 4 months.
yeah, what he said too (thanks Ryath)
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