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Offlinegodplayssims
Outwordsin Inwordsout
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Registered: 03/12/11
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Does the concept of now exist in the universe independent of language?
    #14109902 - 03/12/11 04:51 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

If now is only relative to the past and present, can it exist if events aren't perceived and expressed through words? Even if measurements of time are infinitely short?
Or is this a pointless question to ask?
A bit stumped.


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InvisiblePenelope_Tree
Shamanic Panic
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Registered: 07/31/09
Posts: 8,535
Loc: magic sugarcastle
Re: Does the concept of now exist in the universe independent of language? [Re: godplayssims]
    #14109971 - 03/12/11 05:02 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

hmm, i mean, i couldn't tell ya buddy, since i am very much integrated into the language system.

But, I guess one could look at animals. They probably have a sense of "now" since they're able to plan and learn. I'm assuming that the concept of "now" is essential in those tasks in order to know when to execute a motion.


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full blown human

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Offlinegodplayssims
Outwordsin Inwordsout
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Registered: 03/12/11
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Loc: Los Angeles, CA Flag
Last seen: 12 years, 11 months
Re: Does the concept of now exist in the universe independent of language? [Re: Penelope_Tree]
    #14109987 - 03/12/11 05:05 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

penelope_tree said:
hmm, i mean, i couldn't tell ya buddy, since i am very much integrated into the language system.

But, I guess one could look at animals. They probably have a sense of "now" since they're able to plan and learn. I'm assuming that the concept of "now" is essential in those tasks in order to know when to execute a motion.




Hmmmm
I don't think animals are self-conscious and so I don't know how they would be aware of a concept of a now since that would deal with being aware of a past, present, and their upcoming death


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InvisibleTropism
ChasingTail


Registered: 09/12/09
Posts: 2,039
Re: Does the concept of now exist in the universe independent of language? [Re: godplayssims] * 1
    #14110135 - 03/12/11 05:29 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Does the concept of now exist in the universe independent of language?

Does any concept exist independent of language?

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InvisibleTropism
ChasingTail


Registered: 09/12/09
Posts: 2,039
Re: Does the concept of now exist in the universe independent of language? [Re: Tropism]
    #14110156 - 03/12/11 05:32 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

I don't think animals are self-conscious and so I don't know how they would be aware of a concept of a now since that would deal with being aware of a past, present,

Does one need to be self-conscious to have a perception of the present moment?
To conceptualize it, sure, one needs a brain that functions using concepts.
But I see animals nesting all the time; squirrels prepare most of the year for the inevitable cold.
They observe and learn the patterns all the same whether or not they can cognitively think about it in relationship to themselves.

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Offlinetyler_0_durden
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Registered: 10/28/07
Posts: 1,861
Last seen: 12 years, 3 months
Re: Does the concept of now exist in the universe independent of language? [Re: Tropism]
    #14110314 - 03/12/11 06:05 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

One would have to figure out if this does span over to animal communication.

However, time seems to be incorporated and programmed at lower levels in living things. Animals definitely show this and this gets more and more obvious the smaller we go (cells divide at a certain rate). If that isn't the case, then they are aware of the time, as per examples above by Tropism.


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"As a man who has devoted his whole life to the most clear headed science, to the study of matter, I can tell you as a result of my research about atoms this much: There is no matter as such. All matter originates and exists only by virtue of a force which brings the particle of an atom to vibration and holds this most minute solar system of the atom together. We must assume behind this force the existence of a conscious and intelligent mind. This mind is the matrix of all matter."  --Max Planck

Edited by tyler_0_durden (03/12/11 06:06 PM)

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InvisibleRahz
Alive Again
Male

Registered: 11/10/05
Posts: 9,260
Re: Does the concept of now exist in the universe independent of language? [Re: tyler_0_durden]
    #14111472 - 03/12/11 09:16 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

I used to think most animals weren't self aware, but I'm no longer sure what the difference between simple awareness, and self awareness is. This is due to the fact that I'm not sure there is a self.


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rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


"You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi

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InvisibleTropism
ChasingTail


Registered: 09/12/09
Posts: 2,039
Re: Does the concept of now exist in the universe independent of language? [Re: Rahz]
    #14111759 - 03/12/11 10:12 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

I used to think most animals weren't self aware, but I'm no longer sure what the difference between simple awareness, and self awareness is.

Hubris. :smirk:

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InvisibleRahz
Alive Again
Male

Registered: 11/10/05
Posts: 9,260
Re: Does the concept of now exist in the universe independent of language? [Re: Tropism]
    #14111793 - 03/12/11 10:21 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

How so?


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rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


"You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi

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InvisibleTropism
ChasingTail


Registered: 09/12/09
Posts: 2,039
Re: Does the concept of now exist in the universe independent of language? [Re: Rahz]
    #14113367 - 03/13/11 09:20 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Oh I was just making a joke.

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Offline4896744
Small Town Girl
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Registered: 03/06/10
Posts: 5,128
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Re: Does the concept of now exist in the universe independent of language? [Re: Rahz] * 1
    #14113575 - 03/13/11 10:39 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Rahz said:
I used to think most animals weren't self aware, but I'm no longer sure what the difference between simple awareness, and self awareness is. This is due to the fact that I'm not sure there is a self.




Humans are animals.


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Live your Life! :heart:

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InvisibleRahz
Alive Again
Male

Registered: 11/10/05
Posts: 9,260
Re: Does the concept of now exist in the universe independent of language? [Re: Tropism]
    #14113727 - 03/13/11 11:15 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Doh! Any chimp coulda figured that out.


--------------------
rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


"You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi

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InvisibleTropism
ChasingTail


Registered: 09/12/09
Posts: 2,039
Re: Does the concept of now exist in the universe independent of language? [Re: Rahz]
    #14113761 - 03/13/11 11:21 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

It's alright, most of us are stoned here anyways. :mushroom2:

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InvisibleRahz
Alive Again
Male

Registered: 11/10/05
Posts: 9,260
Re: Does the concept of now exist in the universe independent of language? [Re: 4896744]
    #14113765 - 03/13/11 11:21 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Yes, humans are animals, but all animals are different. It's not necessary to believe humans are wholly removed from other animals to think there are certain qualities that make us alien/angelic/superior/whatever.

I think the "Now" is perhaps just a convincing amount of feedback. Push a sleepy man in the water and self awareness blossoms.


--------------------
rahz

comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace


"You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi

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