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godplayssims
Outwordsin Inwordsout


Registered: 03/12/11
Posts: 6
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
Last seen: 12 years, 11 months
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Does the concept of now exist in the universe independent of language?
#14109902 - 03/12/11 04:51 PM (12 years, 11 months ago) |
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If now is only relative to the past and present, can it exist if events aren't perceived and expressed through words? Even if measurements of time are infinitely short? Or is this a pointless question to ask? A bit stumped.
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Penelope_Tree
Shamanic Panic



Registered: 07/31/09
Posts: 8,535
Loc: magic sugarcastle
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Re: Does the concept of now exist in the universe independent of language? [Re: godplayssims]
#14109971 - 03/12/11 05:02 PM (12 years, 11 months ago) |
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hmm, i mean, i couldn't tell ya buddy, since i am very much integrated into the language system.
But, I guess one could look at animals. They probably have a sense of "now" since they're able to plan and learn. I'm assuming that the concept of "now" is essential in those tasks in order to know when to execute a motion.
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full blown human
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godplayssims
Outwordsin Inwordsout


Registered: 03/12/11
Posts: 6
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
Last seen: 12 years, 11 months
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Re: Does the concept of now exist in the universe independent of language? [Re: Penelope_Tree]
#14109987 - 03/12/11 05:05 PM (12 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
penelope_tree said: hmm, i mean, i couldn't tell ya buddy, since i am very much integrated into the language system.
But, I guess one could look at animals. They probably have a sense of "now" since they're able to plan and learn. I'm assuming that the concept of "now" is essential in those tasks in order to know when to execute a motion.
Hmmmm I don't think animals are self-conscious and so I don't know how they would be aware of a concept of a now since that would deal with being aware of a past, present, and their upcoming death
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Tropism
ChasingTail


Registered: 09/12/09
Posts: 2,039
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Re: Does the concept of now exist in the universe independent of language? [Re: godplayssims] 1
#14110135 - 03/12/11 05:29 PM (12 years, 11 months ago) |
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Does the concept of now exist in the universe independent of language?
Does any concept exist independent of language?
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Tropism
ChasingTail


Registered: 09/12/09
Posts: 2,039
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Re: Does the concept of now exist in the universe independent of language? [Re: Tropism]
#14110156 - 03/12/11 05:32 PM (12 years, 11 months ago) |
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I don't think animals are self-conscious and so I don't know how they would be aware of a concept of a now since that would deal with being aware of a past, present,
Does one need to be self-conscious to have a perception of the present moment? To conceptualize it, sure, one needs a brain that functions using concepts. But I see animals nesting all the time; squirrels prepare most of the year for the inevitable cold. They observe and learn the patterns all the same whether or not they can cognitively think about it in relationship to themselves.
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tyler_0_durden
Stranger


Registered: 10/28/07
Posts: 1,861
Last seen: 12 years, 3 months
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Re: Does the concept of now exist in the universe independent of language? [Re: Tropism]
#14110314 - 03/12/11 06:05 PM (12 years, 11 months ago) |
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One would have to figure out if this does span over to animal communication.
However, time seems to be incorporated and programmed at lower levels in living things. Animals definitely show this and this gets more and more obvious the smaller we go (cells divide at a certain rate). If that isn't the case, then they are aware of the time, as per examples above by Tropism.
-------------------- "As a man who has devoted his whole life to the most clear headed science, to the study of matter, I can tell you as a result of my research about atoms this much: There is no matter as such. All matter originates and exists only by virtue of a force which brings the particle of an atom to vibration and holds this most minute solar system of the atom together. We must assume behind this force the existence of a conscious and intelligent mind. This mind is the matrix of all matter." --Max Planck
Edited by tyler_0_durden (03/12/11 06:06 PM)
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Rahz
Alive Again


Registered: 11/10/05
Posts: 9,260
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Re: Does the concept of now exist in the universe independent of language? [Re: tyler_0_durden]
#14111472 - 03/12/11 09:16 PM (12 years, 11 months ago) |
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I used to think most animals weren't self aware, but I'm no longer sure what the difference between simple awareness, and self awareness is. This is due to the fact that I'm not sure there is a self.
-------------------- rahz comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace "You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi
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Tropism
ChasingTail


Registered: 09/12/09
Posts: 2,039
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Re: Does the concept of now exist in the universe independent of language? [Re: Rahz]
#14111759 - 03/12/11 10:12 PM (12 years, 11 months ago) |
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I used to think most animals weren't self aware, but I'm no longer sure what the difference between simple awareness, and self awareness is.
Hubris.
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Rahz
Alive Again


Registered: 11/10/05
Posts: 9,260
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Re: Does the concept of now exist in the universe independent of language? [Re: Tropism]
#14111793 - 03/12/11 10:21 PM (12 years, 11 months ago) |
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How so?
-------------------- rahz comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace "You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi
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Tropism
ChasingTail


Registered: 09/12/09
Posts: 2,039
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Re: Does the concept of now exist in the universe independent of language? [Re: Rahz]
#14113367 - 03/13/11 09:20 AM (12 years, 11 months ago) |
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Oh I was just making a joke.
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4896744
Small Town Girl


Registered: 03/06/10
Posts: 5,128
Loc: United States
Last seen: 11 years, 9 months
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Re: Does the concept of now exist in the universe independent of language? [Re: Rahz] 1
#14113575 - 03/13/11 10:39 AM (12 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
Rahz said: I used to think most animals weren't self aware, but I'm no longer sure what the difference between simple awareness, and self awareness is. This is due to the fact that I'm not sure there is a self.
Humans are animals.
-------------------- Live your Life!
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Rahz
Alive Again


Registered: 11/10/05
Posts: 9,260
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Re: Does the concept of now exist in the universe independent of language? [Re: Tropism]
#14113727 - 03/13/11 11:15 AM (12 years, 11 months ago) |
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Doh! Any chimp coulda figured that out.
-------------------- rahz comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace "You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi
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Tropism
ChasingTail


Registered: 09/12/09
Posts: 2,039
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Re: Does the concept of now exist in the universe independent of language? [Re: Rahz]
#14113761 - 03/13/11 11:21 AM (12 years, 11 months ago) |
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It's alright, most of us are stoned here anyways.
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Rahz
Alive Again


Registered: 11/10/05
Posts: 9,260
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Re: Does the concept of now exist in the universe independent of language? [Re: 4896744]
#14113765 - 03/13/11 11:21 AM (12 years, 11 months ago) |
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Yes, humans are animals, but all animals are different. It's not necessary to believe humans are wholly removed from other animals to think there are certain qualities that make us alien/angelic/superior/whatever.
I think the "Now" is perhaps just a convincing amount of feedback. Push a sleepy man in the water and self awareness blossoms.
-------------------- rahz comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace "You’re not looking close enough if you can only see yourself in people who look like you." —Ayishat Akanbi
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