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InvisibleCognitive_Shift
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Let's talk about Autism
    #14107632 - 03/12/11 06:01 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

I have always been confused by this disease?  Condition?  What ever it is technically, no disrespect i just don't know what it is.  I was watching television an apparently the odds of a child getting Autism is 1 in 110.  I have a bunch of questions about this including whether or not the children are born with it, or develop it?

With these odds there has to be somebody on these boards who has been effected by Autism in one way or another.


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L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs

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Invisiblelucas_southoz
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Re: Let's talk about Autism [Re: Cognitive_Shift]
    #14107638 - 03/12/11 06:08 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

One of my best mate has autism, it isn't severe though thank god...

He was born with it, he is also completely deaf.. (he has a hearing aid).

He is abit immature, well really immature for his age. I'm 99% sure its because of the autism, sometimes he just says.. weird things. Thinks that un funny stuff is funny kinda thing..

Hes a good bloke, hasn't stopped him from getting a job or anything, finished year 12 at high school with amazing grades..

I never let him drink, atleast not around me. He can't handle it, goes really stupid.

A quick question for anyone who has autism and that may read this thread, What are mushrooms like with autism? He is bugging me to try them but i don't think he is emotionally equipped to trip:shrug:

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InvisibleCognitive_Shift
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Re: Let's talk about Autism [Re: lucas_southoz]
    #14107641 - 03/12/11 06:14 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

I'm sure there are studies about the effects of psychedelic drugs on autistic people on the internet somewhere. 

Just a cultural question here.  Is a bloke a slang word for friend or something?  Synonymous with mate?


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L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs

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Invisiblelucas_southoz
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Re: Let's talk about Autism [Re: Cognitive_Shift]
    #14107652 - 03/12/11 06:25 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

haha yeah man, bloke means mate/guy over here:laugh2:

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InvisibleCognitive_Shift
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Re: Let's talk about Autism [Re: lucas_southoz]
    #14107660 - 03/12/11 06:31 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

That is what i thought based on the context but i didn't know.  I have never seen anyone IRL refer to another person as a bloke before.  I heard of mate which is kinda weird.  When someone says mate in my head i think of my female wife or someone that you would reproduce or have a child with as a mate.  Just like what biology text books call the person you have offspring with, a mate.

ANYWAYS!  BACK TO THE AUTISM THREAD!


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L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs

Edited by Cognitive_Shift (03/12/11 06:40 AM)

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Invisiblelucas_southoz
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Re: Let's talk about Autism [Re: Cognitive_Shift]
    #14107674 - 03/12/11 06:40 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

hahahaha you gotta come to Australia! Bloody hilarious..



Now you can be aussie:cool:

Do we actually sound like that? :laugh2:

Sorry man, i made the thread abit off topic

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InvisibleCognitive_Shift
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Re: Let's talk about Autism [Re: lucas_southoz]
    #14107677 - 03/12/11 06:43 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

It's okay, and YES that is what you aussies sounds like :lol:


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L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs

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Offlinemathias
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Re: Let's talk about Autism [Re: Cognitive_Shift]
    #14107922 - 03/12/11 08:47 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

My son is within "the autistic spectrum", as they say. Children are born with it, and it usually becomes noticeable at about 1yr or so. Later if it's not severe, earlier if it is.

My son was 3 when we realized he was not talking as much or as well as other kids. We later found out it's not that he "can't", but he just did not care to communicate as much. He has difficulty getting out of his own head, the internal world. Nowdays the xwife and I sometimes have trouble getting him to be quiet, but now and then silent stretches come about. This is by no means consistent or even that predictable.

He is 11 now, and in a "normal" 6th grade class with a special TA to help keep him on track. He can perform academically as well or in some areas better than his peers, but has trouble with focus and attention span sometimes. Once his focus is clear however, his ability to retain info, understand it and put it together with other info is astounding.

He can sing and mimic voices from songs and movies with perfect memory and recall something that happened once 3 years ago with movie-like clarity, quoting people, mimicking voices, the works. But sometimes he will do this in class, when it's time for math. It's like his life is a Monty Python's Flying Circus episode; it makes sense, but it is its' own kind of sense.

That's part of the problem when understanding and dealing with this disorder, or "different-order" as I call it; it's a wide range of symptoms, and each symptom has a wide range of severity. I forget who coined the phrase, but one common quote is "When you've met one autistic child, you've met ONE autistic child."


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intlslacker : "Why is it I always have the feeling that if RR weren't around it'd be like there were toddlers running around, bumping into walls and eating poisonous mushrooms?"

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OfflineFishOilTheKid
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Re: Let's talk about Autism [Re: Cognitive_Shift]
    #14108534 - 03/12/11 11:46 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

I'm sure there are studies about the effects of psychedelic drugs on autistic people on the internet somewhere.




http://www.psychedelic-library.org/autism.htm

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Re: Let's talk about Autism [Re: mathias]
    #14108635 - 03/12/11 12:03 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

I have really mixed feelings about autism and tripping. I really don't think it's a good idea in general, not with the usual "let's trip" mentality. But with just the right person, right time and place and with good guidance, it might open up that person and new ways.

Here is the scary potential I see: Panic and/or rage. We all have this within us, but autistic people often have different triggers, weakened or different filters for behavior, and can sometimes loose control at the drop of a hat under stress or some stimulation you and I deal with without thinking or hardly notice.

One somewhat common example is vacuum machines. Many autistic people can't stand the noise they make, even if it's very quiet and/or far away. Some autistic children hold their ears and get under the desk when a large truck goes by the building, or an airplane goes over head, often LONG before anyone else is even aware of it. Yet these same children can sing along loudly to music, show no particular sensitivity to sound in general, voices etc... It seems to be the extreme high or low frequency waves that give them the creeps.

On the other hand, in my experience with my son and some other autistic children whose behavior was more random and pronounced, once a connection is established, it is very strong. It can be an activity, song, game, book, toy, whathaveyou, something that another person is involved in, even if only in a passive role. Anything that gives a sense of comfort and predictability, even approaching repetition.

Despite the classic view that autistic people are detached and almost Vulcan in their lack of emotion and response to emotional cues from others (some don't make the connection that smile means happy and eyebrows down means mad, and so on) it's my honest opinion that these mechanisms are just different, not broken or absent.

If the person does not respond to facial expression, what about tone of voice? Usually one is heightened if another is diminished. This all has to be taken with a grain of salt, mind you, since my son has been very responsive to all manner of emotional cues from day one. Sometimes he's almost TOO entrained with others' emotions.

Arg. I've no time to write more, but there are more thoughts a-brewing. I'd like to see what others with exp have to say.


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intlslacker : "Why is it I always have the feeling that if RR weren't around it'd be like there were toddlers running around, bumping into walls and eating poisonous mushrooms?"

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Re: Let's talk about Autism [Re: mathias]
    #14108660 - 03/12/11 12:08 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Hm, I kinda got off the point a bit. This fellow you speak of does not seem like a classic or severe case at all. What makes him stand out? My son too has that "funny stuff that aint really funny" thing. More info on this please.


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intlslacker : "Why is it I always have the feeling that if RR weren't around it'd be like there were toddlers running around, bumping into walls and eating poisonous mushrooms?"

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Re: Let's talk about Autism [Re: mathias]
    #14109574 - 03/12/11 03:35 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

autistic people can communicate with animals

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InvisibleCognitive_Shift
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Re: Let's talk about Autism [Re: mushiepussy]
    #14109739 - 03/12/11 04:10 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

You should see me with my dog.  I can make her shake, roll over an play dead ect ect.  Actually my dog knows prolly 15-20 tricks and i taught them all to her.


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L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs

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InvisiblePoid
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Re: Let's talk about Autism [Re: mathias]
    #14110190 - 03/12/11 05:39 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

mathias said:
I have really mixed feelings about autism and tripping. I really don't think it's a good idea in general, not with the usual "let's trip" mentality. But with just the right person, right time and place and with good guidance, it might open up that person and new ways.

Here is the scary potential I see: Panic and/or rage.


:thumbup:

Autistic people are generally overwhelmed by their senses, I think tripping would not be a good idea for most of them.

How to Deal With Autistic Children
Quote:

Smells, sounds, colors, and bright lights can overwhelm their senses and cause an autistic child to get very upset and either withdraw or act out. Make the environment as calming as possible, by removing over-stimulating items.




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Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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Re: Let's talk about Autism [Re: mathias]
    #14110709 - 03/12/11 07:11 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

mathias said:
Hm, I kinda got off the point a bit. This fellow you speak of does not seem like a classic or severe case at all. What makes him stand out? My son too has that "funny stuff that aint really funny" thing. More info on this please.



Yeah he does not have a severe case but it is defiantly noticeable, he has got into abit of trouble with it, saying the wrong stuff to the wrong people.

To be honest i think the shit he says is him just trying to get attention, he loves it. Here's a few examples of what he says and thinks it is funny.

i just stuck my cock in a beehive... It tingles
March 8 at 9:10pm via Mobile Web

I love being racist because I am a fool like that
February 4 at 11:08pm via Mobile Web

That's just some of it, can't find the rest, its too hard to find..

Also what makes me really not want to let him trip is once he thought he was possessed. I have known this guy and his brother since i was about 10, They are both my best friends. His brother has no disabilities, he is what we call 'normal'.

His brothers name is Jimmy*, Jimmy called me up one night and said come around asap something is up with my bro, I jump in the car and gun it there and his brother is standing on the bed, making weird noises. He was like growling and he seemed evil, out of this world.

He started jumping up and down on the bed and the lamp started flickering (the bed was up against the lamp switch making it turn on and off:facepalm:)  He stills says to this day he was possessed, especially because of the light but no matter how many times we showed him he wouldn't believe us.

I'm not sure if he was drunk that night or what, but all i know is if he is drinking I will not be hanging around.

Now he is fine with weed, weed makes him chill, not say stupid shit and act immature.


Sorry about the long post, if you have any questions let me know, ill try to answer them the best i can.

So overall i highly doubt he will be tripping, atleast not for awhile. One day i will give him some mushrooms, a very low dose with just me and him in a place he is comfortable, maybe half a gram of psilocybe subaeruginosa, if he proves to me he will not go stupid, cause harm to me or himself.

Take care fellas, top thread this is. Also thank you very much for the link to the psychedelics & Autism.
* not using real names, both of them visit this site.

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InvisibleMufungo
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Re: Let's talk about Autism [Re: mathias]
    #14113316 - 03/13/11 08:53 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Cognitive_Shift said:
I have a bunch of questions about this including whether or not the children are born with it, or develop it?





As far as I'm aware it's contentious as to whether it is genetic or due to something happening during pre/neo/post-natal development or the resutl of some sort of environmental injury/pathogen or some combination of those. But more and more kids are being diagnosed with ASD earlier and earlier (probably due to parents and clinicians being more aware of it).

With the disorder being diagnosed within a spectrum, it can be surprising how much the presentation of ASD can vary between children, to the point that it's hard to believe a room full of kids with ASD all have the same condition. So I think more work, as usual, needs to be done in refining the diagnostic criteria. Maybe in twenty years ASD will be divided up into a number of other specific disorders, who knows.

What can be interesting are the number and variety of treatments out there for ASD. I recall one paper saying that on average parents might try about 11 therapies within the first 10 years. Youtube has some vids of really interesting treatments, not necessarily supported by research and perhaps a little dodgey, but still interesting. Here's one about a mum who started feeding her son weed...



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Offlinenatural medicine
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Re: Let's talk about Autism [Re: Cognitive_Shift]
    #14114367 - 03/13/11 02:01 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

I am on the mildest of the mild end of the autistic spectrum.  It's to the point that few people can tell that I'm anything but ordinary.  But it's there.  As a kid it was really obvious.  I was a weird kid, and would say awkward things all the time.  I've outgrown that and am ironically more mature than most people my age now.  Sometimes I still have issues thinking of stuff to say for smalltalk, not too too much though.  I'm thankful for that. 

I've never heard it described this way, but I find ASD to be similar to the effects of DXM.  DXM is dissociative, and makes people feel a bit removed from the world and more sensitive to stimuli.  In fact, the 2 times I tripped on DXM reminded me of my childhood to a rather eerie degree.  (as an adult I have no stimuli or emotional issues, in fact it is to the other extreme)

I also suspect that I have comorbid depression, of the amotivational type (not the "i wanna kill myself" type - very different).  When I feel depressed, mostly in the winter, I sleep a lot, don't socialize much, and slack on schoolwork like theres no tomorrow.  Cannabis indica and opiates(moderation here!) help that.  Unfortunately both are hard to come by - no one ever has indicas >.<  When I'm not depressed I'm very social, hardworking, brilliant to the 10th degree, and get myself absolutely ripped at the gym :grin:

As for drugs, It's hard to say.  They may be helpful.  They may be destructive.  I've learned the hard way stimulants make things worse.  Cannabis, especially indicas help a lot however.  It's also interesting that I don't build noticeable tolerance, and that I'm rather sensitive to begin with (a gram of headies last 1-2 weeks solid).  My opiate experience is limited to opium and hydrocodone, both of which I liked and have no addictive tendencies towards.  Opiates aren't just a coping mechanism for me, they literally normalize the way I act when dosed appropriately.  I would hesitate to suggest this to anyone with more pronounced ASD.  They may feel partial relief at the doses I use, and crave larger amounts because "normal" suddenly seems possible.  Or for them normal may not even be possible, and they will just use opies to cope.  Coping = the road to addiction. 

I'm very interested in shrooms.  I've read numerous reports of it being helpful to people with ASD.  I need to look into it more, as a bad trip might not be good, considering that I already have ASD so well under control.  I'm more interested in MDMA, as it gives strong feelings of empathy, something all people with ASD have in limited quantities. 

Also, stay away from video games with ASD (especially MMO's).  It's our heroin.  Seriously, I've had withdrawals.  Nasty ones.  I've got addicted to games the first day, in the first hour. After that it's all about making sure your source is secure (ie. your computer >.<)  It destroys any chance of a social life imo. 

I think I've given some insight.  I still can't imagine how bad life must be with anything close to full blown ASD.


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Re: Let's talk about Autism [Re: natural medicine]
    #14114400 - 03/13/11 02:07 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

B12 shots (Injections) apparently do wonders for autistic kids.
Returns them slowly to be able to navigate the world.

Keep your kids and yourself away from Vaccines!


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Now pick me up night and whirlwind and let me ride with you to peace of mind and nothing to rebel...

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Re: Let's talk about Autism [Re: Mufungo]
    #14114406 - 03/13/11 02:08 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

I have a degree in psychology from the seventies.  Autism is defined very differently now than it was then.  Back then autism was associated with hockey helmet crazy.  They have subsequently decided that it is what they call a spectrum of syndromes.  My very good friend has a son about 16 who is close to hockey helmet.  He does engage but pretty much floats in his own world except with people he sees often.  He's also 16, which has its own issues.  His mother was the producer of Temple Grandin, a truly great movie starring Clair Danes and which I strongly suggest anybody interested watch.  His father and the nanny are his caretakers.  The mother, who made the movie happen, is a self aggrandizing bitch but the movie is great.

I would not recommend any non-therapeutic hallucinogen use for spectrum kids since they are usually already on a stiff cocktail mix of psychotropic drugs.


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Re: Let's talk about Autism [Re: zappaisgod]
    #14118428 - 03/14/11 08:33 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

So you are saying that Autism did not have any sort of spectrum when you were studying it? I wonder if Aspergers' Syndrome(sp?) might have been a diagnosis at this point associated with Autism.

Bet the classes back then were a bit different then they would be today.



~Monk

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